Hello,
At-spi should not get killed. It'll be killed when lightdm exits. On my arch linux machine I'm using gdm to start gnome. When doing ps aux grep at-spi when logged into gnome I can also see at-spi processes running by the gdm user.
To troubleshoot this you can configure presession script in /etc/lightdm/lightdm.conf and add a line like
pkill at-spi
Into that script.
This way you will kill at-spi before the session is created.
Greetings
Peter
Hello,
some progress,
I just needed to make the lightdm user member of the audio group...
Now it speaks.
However the graphical environment that it starts don't.
I think that I know why: when starting the session lightdm says:
"screen reader off" and kills orca, but don't kill at-spi2.
As it still owns it this prevents a regular user to start orca.
I realized that trying to start orca in lxterminal, see below:
cut here
didier[~]$ orca
** (orca:1671): WARNING **: Couldn't register with accessibility bus: Did not receive a reply. Possible causes include: the remote application did not send a reply, the message bus security policy blocked the reply, the reply timeout expired, or the network connection was broken.
** (orca:1671): WARNING **: Couldn't register with accessibility bus: Did not receive a reply. Possible causes include: the remote application did not send a reply, the message bus security policy blocked the reply, the reply timeout expired, or the network connection was broken.
** (orca:1671): ERROR **: AT-SPI: Couldn't connect to accessibility bus. Is at-spi-bus-launcher running?
Trappe pour point d'arrêt et de trace
didier[~]$ ps -ef|grep at-spi
lightdm 1259 1 0 23:13 ? 00:00:00 /usr/libexec/at-spi-bus-launcher
lightdm 1277 1259 0 23:13 ? 00:00:00 /usr/bin/dbus-daemon --config-file=/usr/share/defaults/at-spi2/ accessibility.conf --nofork --print-address 3
lightdm 1279 1 0 23:13 ? 00:00:00 /usr/libexec/at-spi2-registryd --use-gnome-session
didier 1676 1661 0 23:16 pts/1 00:00:00 grep at-spi
didier[~]$
cut here
How can I solve this?
I think that I have a similar issue with gdm: even if it doesn't speak
(although it be also member of the audio group) it does start at-aspi2,
preventing orca to start for a regular user.
Oh, and the --disable-at-spi-command flag when configuring
lightdm-gtk-greeter just remove the reader accessibility feature.
Greetings,
Didier
Le 27/10/2017 à 19:56, Peter Vágner a écrit :
> Hello,
>
> I am still not sure what might be wrong but looking at lightdm-gtk-greeter
> configure script I can see it has --enable-at-spi-command and
> --disable-at-spi-command flags. I would say we should keep orca spawning it
> via python-at-spi. Haven't you build light-dm-gtk-greeter with that?
> Another thing which I don't understand really but I am just thinking
> loudly. When using xinit you are launching console kit. Should that be also
> used when lightdm greeter session starts?
>
> Greetings
>
> Peter
>
> 2017-10-27 18:13 GMT+02:00 Didier Spaier <didier slint fr>:
>
>> Hello,
>> Well, I assume that Ali Ahmadi to whom I borrowed the scripts
>> don't need a screen reader, and I built the packages in a
>> hurry not paying attention to that so the different paths is not
>> what worries me the most.
>>
>> But as I can't get gdm to speak either and also with an issue about
>> the accessibility bus I'd look there first. As I am not acquainted
>> with that, could you provide instructions on how to investigate and
>> where to look?
>>
>> And oh yes, all packages built on the same system, but gdm. Of
>> course I can rebuilt it on the same system if need be.
>>
>> Greetings,
>>
>> Didier
>>
>> Le 27/10/2017 à 17:08, Peter Vágner a écrit :
>>> Hello,
>>> Well have all the packages been built on the same slint system?
>>> What appears strange is that when running lightdm path to the
>>> at-spi2-registryd is different. Perhaps the buss address is also wrong.
>>> Unfortunately I don't fully understand this so we need to experiment a
>> lot
>>> if no one has a better hint.
>>>
>>> Greetings
>>>
>>> Peter
>>>
>>> Dňa 27. 10. 2017 4:51 PM používateľ "Didier Spaier" <didier slint fr>
>>> napísal:
>>>
>>>> Hello,
>>>>
>>>> Le 26/10/2017 à 21:56, Peter Vágner a écrit :> Hello,
>>>>>
>>>>> Yes lightdm is awesome. You can build gtk greeter against gtk+2 and it
>>>>> should work fine.
>>>>> However if you are going to package lightdm-gtk-greeter 2.x or any
>>>>> revision after r312 but earlier than light-dmlight-dm-gtk-greeter
>>>>> 2.0.3re comes my fail-gtk-greeter 2.0.3 then please do look at thi
>>>>> bug report possibly applying a patch...
>>>>> https://bugs.launchpad.net/lightdm-gtk-greeter/+bug/ 1483864
>>>>
>>>> I have installed the greeter 2.O.3 so I didn't need the patch.
>>>>
>>>> Nevertheless, I am sorry to say that here come my failure report.
>>>>
>>>> I have built and installed lightdm, the gtk greeter and its setting gui.
>>>> Dependencies also built installed as not shipped in Slint:
>>>> pam, dep of lightdm
>>>> python3-distutils-extra, dep of lightdm-gtk-greeter,
>>>>
>>>> All packages are in the directories below, with their names ending in
>>>> slint.txz and can be installed with installpkg or spkg.
>>>>
>>>> http://slackware.uk/slint/x86_64/slint-testing/source/pam/
>>>> http://slackware.uk/slint/x86_64/slint-testing/source/ lightdm/
>>>> http://slackware.uk/slint/x86_64/slint-testing/source/
>> lightdm-gtk-greeter/
>>>> http://slackware.uk/slint/x86_64/slint-testing/source/python
>>>> 3-distutils-extra/
>>>> http://slackware.uk/slint/x86_64/slint-testing/source/lightd
>>>> m-gtk-greeter-settings/
>>>>
>>>> I have cloned the repo below not to reinvent the wheel and made a few
>>>> modifications:
>>>> https://github.com/idnux/idnux_slackbuilds
>>>> I was leaded there by this blog post frm an Indonesian Slackware user:
>>>> https://catatanidnux.wordpress.com/2017/05/26/ memasang-
>>>> lightdm-di-slackware-linux/
>>>>
>>>> I start lightdm, the greeer configures using the GUI, set accessibility
>>>> from reader with orca and lightdm works but... No sound!
>>>> In the greeters' log I saw /usr/lib/at-spi2-core/at-spi-bus-launcher
>> not
>>>> found, so I copied it there from /usr/libexec/at-spi-bus-launcher, then
>>>> restarted lightdm. It still complained about upstart missing but I guess
>>>> that's not our problem.
>>>>
>>>> Rather, there seems to be an issue with starting at-spi2, as I also
>>>> noticed that from the graphical environment I couldn't start orca
>>>> either, with an error message about at-spi-2 not started.
>>>>
>>>> Then instead I installed gdm-2.20.11 with slapt-get coming from a Salix
>>>> repo. I think that Salix maintainer built this old version as any newer
>>>> would need too many gnome deps and gnome is shipped neither in Salix nor
>>>> in Slint. This one needs only libgnomecanvas-2.30.3, also installed by
>>>> slapt-get as a dep.
>>>>
>>>> gdm works as well as lightdm but... Still no sound.
>>>>
>>>> And no sound in a graphical environment started with gdm either. I get
>>>> error messages very similar as when using lightdm when I try to start
>>>> orca manually in the graphical environment, so that can't be an issue
>>>> with pam (that I had removed before installing gdm):
>>>> cut here
>>>> didier[~]$ orca
>>>>
>>>> ** (orca:1623): WARNING **: Couldn't register with accessibility bus:
>> Did
>>>> not receive a reply. Possible causes include: the remote application did
>>>> not send a reply, the message bus security policy blocked the reply, the
>>>> reply timeout expired, or the network connection was broken.
>>>>
>>>> ** (orca:1623): WARNING **: Couldn't register with accessibility bus:
>> Did
>>>> not receive a reply. Possible causes include: the remote application did
>>>> not send a reply, the message bus security policy blocked the reply, the
>>>> reply timeout expired, or the network connection was broken.
>>>>
>>>> ** (orca:1623): ERROR **: AT-SPI: Couldn't connect to accessibility bus.
>>>> Is at-spi-bus-launcher running?
>>>> Trappe pour point d'arrêt et de trace
>>>> didier[~]$ /usr/libexec/at-spi2-registryd --use-gnome-session
>>>>
>>>> ** (at-spi2-registryd:1627): WARNING **: Couldn't register with
>>>> accessibility bus: Did not receive a reply. Possible causes include: the
>>>> remote application did not send a reply, the message bus security policy
>>>> blocked the reply, the reply timeout expired, or the network connection
>> was
>>>> broken.
>>>> didier[~]$
>>>> cut here
>>>>
>>>> I assume that if I can get lightdm to speak I can also get gdm to speak;
>>>> and on second thought I would prefer that as a last minute addition of
>>>> pam to slint could be risky.
>>>>
>>>> If someone wants to try either gdm or ligtdm, in addition to installing
>>>> the packages it is necessary to edit the top /etc/rc.d/rc.4 to include
>>>> a code snippet starting it, as is done with its siblings.
>>>>
>>>> But I have no idea how a blind person can test a non accessible display
>>>> manager...
>>>>
>>>> Of course any clue, including how to investigate further, is warmly
>>>> welcome, knowing that the a11y environment parameters are now set in
>>>> /etc/profile.d/orca.sh instead as in ~/.profile, so there are set in
>>>> root's environment when starting gdm or lightdm as well as in regular
>>>> users' environments.
>>>>
>>>> Greetings,
>>>>
>>>> Didier
>>>>
>>>>> 2017-10-26 21:41 GMT+02:00 Didier Spaier <didier slint fr>:
>>>>>
>>>>>> Hello,
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Le 26/10/2017 à 19:14, Peter Vágner a écrit :
>>>>>>> Yes arch linux also includes all the accessibility stuff in the
>>>>>>> /etc/profile.d. I was thinking about it but I have never suggested it
>>>>>>> as I was not sure it's appropriate for slint too.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> It's up to us all to decide what's appropriate for Slint ;)
>>>>>>
>>>>>> If that doesn't hurt we could set these parameters in
>>>>>> /etc/profile.d/orca.sh
>>>>>> as this won't hurt users who don't want speech as long as orca is
>>>>>> not started, right?
>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Also I like an approach where you will use
>>>>>>> ~/.config/autostart/startorca.desktop as a check instead of
>>>>>>> ~/.config/startorca.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Actually we won't have to check anything, if orca is started by
>>>>>> ~/.config/startorca.desktop and the parameters are already set in
>>>>>> /etc/profile.d/orca.sh
>>>>>>
>>>>>>> However I am not sure on the
>>>>>>> Hidden=true
>>>>>>> desktop entry line. I think this won't disable the app from starting.
>>>> It
>>>>>>> will only hide it from the menus won't it?
>>>>>>
>>>>>> This is the main effect, but it also prevents autostart
>>>>>> as stated by the Desktop Application Autostart Specification:
>>>>>> cut here
>>>>>>> When the .desktop file has the Hidden key set to true, the .desktop
>>>>>>> file MUST be ignored. When multiple .desktop files with the same name
>>>>>>> exists in multiple directories then only the Hidden key in the most
>>>>>>> important .desktop file must be considered: If it is set to true all
>>>>>>> .desktop files with the same name in the other directories MUST be
>>>>>>> ignored as well.
>>>>>> cut here
>>>>>>
>>>>>> If we end up putting startorca.desktop only in ~/.config/autostart/
>>>>>> not in /etc/xdg/autostart, this will still be useful, e.g; if the user
>>>>>> wanats to disable speech for som reason but alos easily get it back.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Also I think xdg stuff should be configured the same way no mather if
>>>>>>> accessibility is requested or not.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Yes if that has no adverse effect for users who do not want speech
>>>>>> which I assume. i will make some tests to be sure.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Also, as if I understand well lightdm is accessible with orca, lighter
>>>>>> and with less dependencies than recent versions of gdm, I will try it
>>>>>> with a gtk greeter.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Of course I'll let you know the outcome.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Greetings,
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Didier
>>>>>>
>>>>>>> 2017-10-26 18:41 GMT+02:00 Didier Spaier <didier slint fr>:
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Hello Jude,
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Le 26/10/2017 à 17:55, Jude DaShiell a écrit :
>>>>>>>>> I like your second possible solution. Sighted users on the
>>>>>>>>> debian-users list complained loudly when a single beep was included
>>>> to
>>>>>>>>> let everyone know when it was time to enter boot parameters in a
>>>>>>>>> debian boot so that got removed. This will accommodate them and
>> us.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Yes. And maybe even better....
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Do put startorca.desktop in ~/.config/autostart but also put the
>> a11y
>>>>>>>> parameters settings in ~/.profile like this:
>>>>>>>> cut here
>>>>>>>> export PAGER=/usr/bin/most
>>>>>>>> export GROFF_ENCODING=UTF-8
>>>>>>>> export XDG_CACHE_HOME=/dev/shm/$(whoami)
>>>>>>>> mkdir -p /dev/shm/$(whoami)
>>>>>>>> chmod 700 /dev/shm/$(whoami)
>>>>>>>> export XDG_RUNTIME_DIR=$XDG_CACHE_HOME
>>>>>>>> export LOGNAME="GDM"
>>>>>>>> export SAL_USE_VCLPLUGIN="gtk"
>>>>>>>> export GTK_MODULES="gail:atk-bridge" # for GTK2
>>>>>>>> export GNOME_ACCESSIBILITY=1
>>>>>>>> export QT_ACCESSIBILITY=1 # for QT4
>>>>>>>> export QT_LINUX_ACCESSIBILITY_ALWAYS_ON=1 # for QT5
>>>>>>>> cut here
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> This way we wouldn't have to modify any xinitrc.*, so an user
>> adding a
>>>>>>>> third party graphical environment would get speech and or braille
>>>>>>>> without having to do a post install configuration.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> I have made a few tests, that seems to work.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Other benefit, this makes graphical environments also accessible in
>>>> run
>>>>>>>> level 4, i.e. using a display manager.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> This is an incentive for me to get gdm to be accessible in Slint.
>> If I
>>>>>>>> can succeed, maybe we could pretend that Slint is as much
>>>>>>>> accessible as a Linux distribution can be...
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Greetings,
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Didier
>>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>
>>
>