Re: Proposal: DNS change irc.gnome.org becomes A record and irc.gimpnet.org starts getting phased out.

[Bryen M Yunashko <suserocks bryen com>]

I'm just jumping into this conversation as I only just now spotted it.
So I'm not responding directly to any one particular post, but making a
general statement.

As an accessibility user, and noting that GNOME is known for being a
world leader in open source accessibility and has often made
accessibility its selling point for adoption in large environments, it
has always been a really really odd experience for me to then tell a new
user who might be using accessibility software  "Come visit us on IRC
and log into gimpnet."  

I'm always following that with an immediate apology, disclaimer, and
explanation of its roots.   And while some here might thing its just a
"U.S. thing" I've encountered people being offended or puzzled by the
use of "gimp" even in other countries.  This is certainly not a local
issue.

And I'm always puzzled why it is often those who slam
"political-correctness" when it is not THEM who are directly affected or
alienated by an issue.

I have no problems with keeping gimpnet in the background but publicly
advertising gnome.org.  It is a fair compromise between social and
technical issues.  And I commend Sriram for starting this conversation
which has popped up far too often in many circles over the years.  It is
time to address it and demonstrate that GNOME is a leader in
accessibility not just technologically but also socially.

Bryen M Yunashko


On Fri, 2013-05-10 at 11:24 -0400, Sumana Harihareswara wrote:
> On 05/10/2013 10:17 AM, Rui Tiago Cação Matos wrote:
> > Seriously, can everyone relax and not take every little detail so
> > seriously? I'm all for advertising irc.gnome.org in our websites etc.
> > But there's really no need to take down DNS entries and whatnot.
>
> It's sort of odd for a member of a software organization to advocate
> being less serious about details.  We have a bug tracker because details
> matter.
>
> Asking others to "relax" implies that other people are working too hard
> or caring too much about an issue, as though it is unimportant.
> Different issues are important to different people and it's a bit
> annoying to be told to "relax" about what matters to you.
>
> > On 10 May 2013 15:55, meg ford <meg387 gmail com> wrote:
> > > I'm saying that it's an I18n issue. I recently read that the GNOME foot is
> > > insulting in Thailand so we are trying not to use it there.
> >
> > And this why you can't ever win. There will always be something that's
> > offensive for someone in this planet so yeah just don't bother too
> > much.
>
> If by "win" you mean "get a special permanent I AM NOT OFFENSIVE
> designation from the United Nations," no, you can't "win".  However, as
> a person deciding where to spend my time and what organizations to take
> seriously, I will say that organizations that make some efforts to act
> sensitively "win" my time and attention.  And communities that act as
> though one person complaining deserves exactly the same amount of effort
> as lots of people backing a reasonable proposal -- that is, zero effort
> -- do lose my willingness to help out.
>
> > If someone you're speaking to takes it offensively you can certainly
> > explain why the name is how it is. People aren't stupid and will
> > understand.
>
> You are presuming that the only time "the GIMP" comes up is in
> one-on-one conversations where the other person feels totally
> comfortable saying "I don't like that name" to one of us, who will take
> all the time necessary to help the other person feel comfortable.
> That's a pretty rare use case.  Usually it's in signage, the IRC network
> name, and other places where the other person may just make the very
> understandable choice to just walk away.  Or it's in a group, or a
> conference, or something like that where - instead of making a fuss -
> some of our potential users and community members just make a mental
> note not to bother even trying to use our software or help out.
>
> Does that help you see why it's not enough to just be willing to explain
> "this is why our software and IRC network seem to be named after the
> slur bullies call your brother in school, on the street, and while
> rejecting him for jobs"?
>
> > And btw, if you have to speak about the GIMP you can also pronounce it
> > as /ʒɪmp/ instead of /gɪmp/ or just spell it out G I M P.
>
> I will probably use that pronunciation when possible.  Thanks for the idea.
>
> > Cheers,
> > Rui
>
> best,
> Sumana