Re: [Evolution] Reply for list messages should go back to the list

[David Woodhouse <dwmw2 infradead org>]

On Wed, 2010-07-14 at 13:36 +0100, Pete Biggs wrote:
> > >    [ ] Reply button invokes mailing list reply
> >
> > This doesn't make a lot of sense to me. The user can *already* express a
> > preference, by moving their hand an inch or two to the left or right and
> > hitting a different (key|menu item|button).
>
> But there isn't a "Reply to List" button - so instead of hitting the
> reply button, you have to press ctrl-L or Message -> Reply to list.  And
> no, I do not consider "Reply to All" to be suitable substitute for
> "Reply to List".

Providing a 'Reply to List' button so that you don't have to use the
keyboard is a perfectly sane feature request.

But I would consider it to be a separate request.

> > This strikes me being a "DWIM" feature so that the user only has to bash
> > their head on the keyboard to get what they want.... as long as they've
> > preconfigured it.
> >
> > In general, those who are sophisticated enough to preconfigure anything
> > are perfectly capable of hitting the right buttons in the first place.
> > There doesn't seem to be a lot of point in such a context-dependent
> > action, for someone who knows what they're doing.
>
> I disagree. I have to consciously think "I'm dealing with a mailing list
> post, so I don't want to click reply, I need to take my hand of the
> mouse before I start typing the reply and then do Ctrl-L, then put my
> hand back on the mouse to EDIT the message before starting to type."  If
> I happen to be typing a quick reply to something on a list there is a
> distinct (and high) possibility that I will automatically click Reply.

You want a Reply to List button.

Alternatively, I already posted a patch which allows you to configure
the existing 'Reply to All' button so that where possible it acts as
'Reply to List' instead -- falling back to 'Reply to All'.

I'm still slightly dubious about that -- I think the actions should each
do what they say they'll do. But at least it's still a *public* action,
when you press the *public* reply button.

> > Which brings us to...
> >
> > > Then we can debate an appropriate default for the preference.
> >
> > If we're exposing it in the UI *instead* of the existing 'Reply' action,
> > then it really *has* to be private by default. The existing UI action
> > sends private mail, and we can't sensibly change that. Least
> > catastrophic failure mode and all that. So again it would only benefit
> > those who are paying sufficient attention to configure it in the first
> > place, which makes it rather pointless.
>
> Virtually all of the direct replies I get from posts on this list (and
> others) are from novice users - they do not realise they sent it
> directly to me, they thought they were sending to the list. 

And if I push the nag popup I've already implemented and tested in
git.infradead.org/users/dwmw2/evolution.git, those users will get a
pop-up warning saying "You are replying in private to a list which came
from a mailing list.". They'll have to *explicitly* choose "reply
privately" or "reply to all" to continue. 

>  All of the direct replies from experienced users are usually followed
> within a few minutes by another email saying something like "Sorry, I
> replied directly to you in my haste, that should have gone to the
> list".

Experienced users do make mistakes, and may well have disabled the nag
pop-up which saves the novice users. But still this is a *much* better
failure mode than accidentally sending stuff to the list which should
have been public.

Users will *always* get things wrong; even experienced users. The
question is what failure mode do we want to encourage -- do we want to
err on the side of sending private information out to the mailing list,
which cannot be retracted and can lead to *very* bad things, or do we
want to err on the side of sending responses to too few people, which is
easily remedied?

I think that any "DWIM" option which automatically chooses between
*public* and *private* on behalf of the user is asking for trouble.

But it's perfectly reasonable for you to want a "Public DWIM" option,
which chooses only between reply-to-list and reply-to-all for you (and
means you don't have to use the keyboard for that). That's what I did in
http://bugzilla-attachments.gnome.org/attachment.cgi?id=165799

-- 
dwmw2