Re: [orca-list] F123 available for download - easy switch to

["B. Henry" <burt1iband gmail com>]

It seems that the fact that gnome shell packages are pulled in is  a non issue, i.e. just have a single 
installer that will have both mate and gnome 
packages on it. 
This way the DM issue goes away. 
What other issue is there? 
I never meant to imply that the lack of a talking login screen was a minor issue for novice users, and 
honestly, for many more advanced users it's 
disturbing. Something about typing "blind" or "deaf" is scarey to many people, and even though over the years 
I've gotten relatively comfortable with a 
bit of this, I'd never want to send a supposedly accessible distro to market with out speech on log-in screen.
It's bad enough that we do not have a talking boot menu, and must have sighted help to deal with bios issues. 
If you wanted to have two separate F123 spins, then of course the issue is there, but even so, while 
certainly not elegant, having extra packages is not 
the major issue that it was a few years ago, i.e. a 1.9GB .iso is really not much different to a 2.1GB .iso. 
I am aware of bandwidth issues and download caps or per byte charging in much of the world, so am in favor of 
having a minimal image of distros that let 
the user get something up and running from a relatively small image.
No more cd sized images, but I like the idea of bring in images under 1GB for those who have very limited or 
slow connections, want to customize and not 
have to remove packages they never use,and also, there are a lot of old 1GB usb-sticks around that can be put 
to good use as rescue devices and 
installers.
Just my two and a half cents.
--
B.H.


On Mon, Sep 29, 2014 at 04:28:43PM -0300, Fernando Botelho wrote:
> I understand and share the interest in using Mate, and as long as these
> issues get resolved, I will include it in F123.
>
> My only disagreement with what was said is that I consider these major
> issues for non-technical users rather than minor ones.
>
> Fernando
>
> On 09/29/2014 04:17 PM, Kyle wrote:
> > MATE 1.8.1 is definitely good, and there is a Sonar panel layout that
> > can be added in the same way it has been integrated into Sonar. The main
> > problem is the lack of a talking display manager that doesn't a. cause
> > the kernel to trap Orca and keep it from running when the desktop
> > starts, b. pull in more than half of GNOME 3 along with it, including
> > gnome-shell itself, or c. pull in a ton of AUR packages including Unity.
> > This is exactly the reason why a MATE spin of Sonar hasn't gone past
> > alpha at this point. We need to be able to figure out what exactly a
> > kernel trap is, and why it keeps Orca from running beyond the
> > lightdm-gtk-greeter and mdm, which is a fork of an older gdm that
> > doesn't pull in gnome-shell, or we need to be able to give another
> > display manager such as lxdm or slim the ability to start Orca and talk
> > to it in order to use MATE in the same way we currently use GNOME, both
> > in F123 and in Sonar. Until then, we're fairly limited in what we can
> > do, although if you can get GNOME running, it is possible to install
> > MATE and switch to it in the default login, although this is certainly
> > not ideal.
> > ~Kyle
> > http://kyle.tk/
>
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