Re: [orca-list] Math on Orca

[Michael Whapples <mwhapples aim com>]

Have you looked at http://latex-access.sf.net? Orca scripting is 
something I haven't gone into at all, so I don't know how easy or 
difficult it would be to add the support.

Michael Whapples
On -10/01/37 20:59, Ignasi Cambra wrote:
> I agree. LateX is the way to go. It would be nice to implement some 
> kind of "scripts" in orca that actually pronounce LateX expressions as 
> if they were actual mathematical equations. I started working on 
> something similar under Windows using JFW, but never got done with it 
> because the LateX language is pretty extensive. The idea was to get 
> both voice and braille output from LateX expressions, and it was 
> actually working well enough. Sorry for being off topic here...
>
> Ignasi
> On Jun 28, 2009, at 9:06 AM, Michael Whapples wrote:
>
> > Hello,
> > Firstly good to hear that some one else who uses maths is contacting 
> > developers of their screen reader about gaining access to maths. 
> > There's a few points to cover here:
> >
> > Orca isn't great with maths. One feature it could do with is mathml 
> > support for maths in webpages as those on windows can gain some 
> > access to mathml in internet explorer. However this needs more than 
> > orca fixes, firefox I believe doesn't reveal the information orca 
> > needs. Side note: have you considered using the firevox plugin to 
> > make firefox self voicing, it seems to have some mathml support 
> > (although I found it wasn't as good as mathplayer and internet 
> > explorer on windows).
> >
> > You specifically mentioned PDF containing maths, these are 
> > particularly bad for any screen reader. For PDF to work alot of work 
> > needs to be done and when maths is involved you are best advised to 
> > try and contact the author for an alternative format. Should you have 
> > no success, then there are some commercial offerings on windows which 
> > may be able to help (I won't go into detail on list here as windows 
> > stuff is off topic, either contact me off list or look at some of the 
> > links I will provide below).
> >
> > If your used to using linux this suggestion for writing maths may 
> > suit you well, have you considered the LaTeX typesetting language? 
> > Most linux distributions either come with LaTeX installed or have it 
> > available in their package manager system, so getting a working LaTeX 
> > environment should be easy. Why is LaTeX so good? Its plain text 
> > based, so use whatever editor you like and so you can gain perfect 
> > access to the source document. You use commands in the text to insert 
> > more complicated notation/structures and there are many packages for 
> > many different types of documents. When you want to print your 
> > document, you use the LaTeX software to compile it into a format like 
> > PDF, and providing you used the LaTeX correctly you will have a 
> > professional looking document. The only problem with the last bit is, 
> > if you are really concerned about perfection, it can be hard to 
> > confirm the precise output being produced, but when you are familiar 
> > with LaTeX and read errors and warnings when compiling these 
> > situations should be few and far between.
> >
> > OK, so as not to bore others on the list who don't want to do maths, 
> > here is a link to the NFB's blindmath mailing list where hopefully 
> > more detail won't be off topic 
> > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/blindmath_nfbnet.org. Also 
> > there is the NFB's science and engineering list (much quieter) 
> > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nfb-science_nfbnet.org.
> >
> > Michael Whapples
> > On -10/01/37 20:59, Timothy Taves wrote:
> > > Hey there, I have noticed that Orca isn't great at reading out 
> > > mathematical equations, which makes life very difficult us 
> > > physicists and mathematicians.
> > >
> > > Are there plans to fix this problem?  It would be most useful if 
> > > Orca could read out mathematical equations from pdf documents.
> > >
> > > Thanks, Tim
> >
> > _______________________________________________
> > Orca-list mailing list
> > Orca-list gnome org
> > http://mail.gnome.org/mailman/listinfo/orca-list
> > Visit http://live.gnome.org/Orca for more information on Orca.
> > The manual is at 
> > http://library.gnome.org/users/gnome-access-guide/nightly/ats-2.html
> > The FAQ is at http://live.gnome.org/Orca/FrequentlyAskedQuestions
> > Netiquette Guidelines are at 
> > http://live.gnome.org/Orca/FrequentlyAskedQuestions/NetiquetteGuidelines
>
> On Jun 28, 2009, at 9:06 AM, Michael Whapples wrote:
>
> > Hello,
> > Firstly good to hear that some one else who uses maths is contacting 
> > developers of their screen reader about gaining access to maths. 
> > There's a few points to cover here:
> >
> > Orca isn't great with maths. One feature it could do with is mathml 
> > support for maths in webpages as those on windows can gain some 
> > access to mathml in internet explorer. However this needs more than 
> > orca fixes, firefox I believe doesn't reveal the information orca 
> > needs. Side note: have you considered using the firevox plugin to 
> > make firefox self voicing, it seems to have some mathml support 
> > (although I found it wasn't as good as mathplayer and internet 
> > explorer on windows).
> >
> > You specifically mentioned PDF containing maths, these are 
> > particularly bad for any screen reader. For PDF to work alot of work 
> > needs to be done and when maths is involved you are best advised to 
> > try and contact the author for an alternative format. Should you have 
> > no success, then there are some commercial offerings on windows which 
> > may be able to help (I won't go into detail on list here as windows 
> > stuff is off topic, either contact me off list or look at some of the 
> > links I will provide below).
> >
> > If your used to using linux this suggestion for writing maths may 
> > suit you well, have you considered the LaTeX typesetting language? 
> > Most linux distributions either come with LaTeX installed or have it 
> > available in their package manager system, so getting a working LaTeX 
> > environment should be easy. Why is LaTeX so good? Its plain text 
> > based, so use whatever editor you like and so you can gain perfect 
> > access to the source document. You use commands in the text to insert 
> > more complicated notation/structures and there are many packages for 
> > many different types of documents. When you want to print your 
> > document, you use the LaTeX software to compile it into a format like 
> > PDF, and providing you used the LaTeX correctly you will have a 
> > professional looking document. The only problem with the last bit is, 
> > if you are really concerned about perfection, it can be hard to 
> > confirm the precise output being produced, but when you are familiar 
> > with LaTeX and read errors and warnings when compiling these 
> > situations should be few and far between.
> >
> > OK, so as not to bore others on the list who don't want to do maths, 
> > here is a link to the NFB's blindmath mailing list where hopefully 
> > more detail won't be off topic 
> > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/blindmath_nfbnet.org. Also 
> > there is the NFB's science and engineering list (much quieter) 
> > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nfb-science_nfbnet.org.
> >
> > Michael Whapples
> > On -10/01/37 20:59, Timothy Taves wrote:
> > > Hey there, I have noticed that Orca isn't great at reading out 
> > > mathematical equations, which makes life very difficult us 
> > > physicists and mathematicians.
> > >
> > > Are there plans to fix this problem?  It would be most useful if 
> > > Orca could read out mathematical equations from pdf documents.
> > >
> > > Thanks, Tim
> >
> > _______________________________________________
> > Orca-list mailing list
> > Orca-list gnome org
> > http://mail.gnome.org/mailman/listinfo/orca-list
> > Visit http://live.gnome.org/Orca for more information on Orca.
> > The manual is at 
> > http://library.gnome.org/users/gnome-access-guide/nightly/ats-2.html
> > The FAQ is at http://live.gnome.org/Orca/FrequentlyAskedQuestions
> > Netiquette Guidelines are at 
> > http://live.gnome.org/Orca/FrequentlyAskedQuestions/NetiquetteGuidelines