Re: [orca-list] Math on Orca

[Ignasi Cambra <ignasicambra gmail com>]

I agree. LateX is the way to go. It would be nice to implement some  
kind of "scripts" in orca that actually pronounce LateX expressions as  
if they were actual mathematical equations. I started working on  
something similar under Windows using JFW, but never got done with it  
because the LateX language is pretty extensive. The idea was to get  
both voice and braille output from LateX expressions, and it was  
actually working well enough. Sorry for being off topic here...

Ignasi
On Jun 28, 2009, at 9:06 AM, Michael Whapples wrote:

> Hello,
> Firstly good to hear that some one else who uses maths is contacting  
> developers of their screen reader about gaining access to maths.  
> There's a few points to cover here:
>
> Orca isn't great with maths. One feature it could do with is mathml  
> support for maths in webpages as those on windows can gain some  
> access to mathml in internet explorer. However this needs more than  
> orca fixes, firefox I believe doesn't reveal the information orca  
> needs. Side note: have you considered using the firevox plugin to  
> make firefox self voicing, it seems to have some mathml support  
> (although I found it wasn't as good as mathplayer and internet  
> explorer on windows).
>
> You specifically mentioned PDF containing maths, these are  
> particularly bad for any screen reader. For PDF to work alot of work  
> needs to be done and when maths is involved you are best advised to  
> try and contact the author for an alternative format. Should you  
> have no success, then there are some commercial offerings on windows  
> which may be able to help (I won't go into detail on list here as  
> windows stuff is off topic, either contact me off list or look at  
> some of the links I will provide below).
>
> If your used to using linux this suggestion for writing maths may  
> suit you well, have you considered the LaTeX typesetting language?  
> Most linux distributions either come with LaTeX installed or have it  
> available in their package manager system, so getting a working  
> LaTeX environment should be easy. Why is LaTeX so good? Its plain  
> text based, so use whatever editor you like and so you can gain  
> perfect access to the source document. You use commands in the text  
> to insert more complicated notation/structures and there are many  
> packages for many different types of documents. When you want to  
> print your document, you use the LaTeX software to compile it into a  
> format like PDF, and providing you used the LaTeX correctly you will  
> have a professional looking document. The only problem with the last  
> bit is, if you are really concerned about perfection, it can be hard  
> to confirm the precise output being produced, but when you are  
> familiar with LaTeX and read errors and warnings when compiling  
> these situations should be few and far between.
>
> OK, so as not to bore others on the list who don't want to do maths,  
> here is a link to the NFB's blindmath mailing list where hopefully  
> more detail won't be off topic http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/blindmath_nfbnet.org 
> . Also there is the NFB's science and engineering list (much  
> quieter) http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nfb- 
> science_nfbnet.org.
>
> Michael Whapples
> On -10/01/37 20:59, Timothy Taves wrote:
> > Hey there, I have noticed that Orca isn't great at reading out  
> > mathematical equations, which makes life very difficult us  
> > physicists and mathematicians.
> >
> > Are there plans to fix this problem?  It would be most useful if  
> > Orca could read out mathematical equations from pdf documents.
> >
> > Thanks, Tim
>
> _______________________________________________
> Orca-list mailing list
> Orca-list gnome org
> http://mail.gnome.org/mailman/listinfo/orca-list
> Visit http://live.gnome.org/Orca for more information on Orca.
> The manual is at http://library.gnome.org/users/gnome-access-guide/nightly/ats-2.html
> The FAQ is at http://live.gnome.org/Orca/FrequentlyAskedQuestions
> Netiquette Guidelines are at http://live.gnome.org/Orca/FrequentlyAskedQuestions/NetiquetteGuidelines

On Jun 28, 2009, at 9:06 AM, Michael Whapples wrote:

> Hello,
> Firstly good to hear that some one else who uses maths is contacting  
> developers of their screen reader about gaining access to maths.  
> There's a few points to cover here:
>
> Orca isn't great with maths. One feature it could do with is mathml  
> support for maths in webpages as those on windows can gain some  
> access to mathml in internet explorer. However this needs more than  
> orca fixes, firefox I believe doesn't reveal the information orca  
> needs. Side note: have you considered using the firevox plugin to  
> make firefox self voicing, it seems to have some mathml support  
> (although I found it wasn't as good as mathplayer and internet  
> explorer on windows).
>
> You specifically mentioned PDF containing maths, these are  
> particularly bad for any screen reader. For PDF to work alot of work  
> needs to be done and when maths is involved you are best advised to  
> try and contact the author for an alternative format. Should you  
> have no success, then there are some commercial offerings on windows  
> which may be able to help (I won't go into detail on list here as  
> windows stuff is off topic, either contact me off list or look at  
> some of the links I will provide below).
>
> If your used to using linux this suggestion for writing maths may  
> suit you well, have you considered the LaTeX typesetting language?  
> Most linux distributions either come with LaTeX installed or have it  
> available in their package manager system, so getting a working  
> LaTeX environment should be easy. Why is LaTeX so good? Its plain  
> text based, so use whatever editor you like and so you can gain  
> perfect access to the source document. You use commands in the text  
> to insert more complicated notation/structures and there are many  
> packages for many different types of documents. When you want to  
> print your document, you use the LaTeX software to compile it into a  
> format like PDF, and providing you used the LaTeX correctly you will  
> have a professional looking document. The only problem with the last  
> bit is, if you are really concerned about perfection, it can be hard  
> to confirm the precise output being produced, but when you are  
> familiar with LaTeX and read errors and warnings when compiling  
> these situations should be few and far between.
>
> OK, so as not to bore others on the list who don't want to do maths,  
> here is a link to the NFB's blindmath mailing list where hopefully  
> more detail won't be off topic http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/blindmath_nfbnet.org 
> . Also there is the NFB's science and engineering list (much  
> quieter) http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nfb- 
> science_nfbnet.org.
>
> Michael Whapples
> On -10/01/37 20:59, Timothy Taves wrote:
> > Hey there, I have noticed that Orca isn't great at reading out  
> > mathematical equations, which makes life very difficult us  
> > physicists and mathematicians.
> >
> > Are there plans to fix this problem?  It would be most useful if  
> > Orca could read out mathematical equations from pdf documents.
> >
> > Thanks, Tim
>
> _______________________________________________
> Orca-list mailing list
> Orca-list gnome org
> http://mail.gnome.org/mailman/listinfo/orca-list
> Visit http://live.gnome.org/Orca for more information on Orca.
> The manual is at http://library.gnome.org/users/gnome-access-guide/nightly/ats-2.html
> The FAQ is at http://live.gnome.org/Orca/FrequentlyAskedQuestions
> Netiquette Guidelines are at http://live.gnome.org/Orca/FrequentlyAskedQuestions/NetiquetteGuidelines