Thoughts about Kde, Gnome, and Staying Neutral (Was gtk-term widget?)

[Matthew <matthew mattshouse com>]

> However, we are sure to get flamed anyway because the objection Adrian
> and others seem to have to libgnomeui is that it's too hard to install
> due to dependencies, and guess what, GTK 1.4 wants a half-dozen
> image-loader libraries plus Pango as dependencies because it has the
> libgnomeui features. Just goes to show that you can't please everyone!

That's more of a distribution problem.  I would imagine that the vast majority
of Gtk USERS rely on the distros to get the dependencies right.  It's the
hackers that stay on the bleeding edge (and, oddly enough, generate the least
amount of traffic to my Help list).

> Anyway, no conspiracy here folks, look at the facts of the code in the
> development version of GTK, read your gtk-devel-list archives...

Now, you have to admit something here.  You've stated that Gtk1.4 requires 
"a half-dozen image-loader libraries plus Pango".  Does that sound familiar to
anyone else?  I'm not bitching anymore, as my problem was with a weak Gtk and
not with a strong Gnome.  I can now stay politically centered and have my cool
widgets.  BUT!  It would appear that Gtk and Gnome are merging.

<Stop Reading If Your Not Interested In My Ranting>

To clarify.  I'm not a Gnome basher, or a Kde basher.  It's about my users.  If
a User is running Redhat then I can pretty much assume that Gnome is there. 
Suse, TL, Slack?  Maybe not.  I can't assume that Kde is there either. 
The Linux market is small enough without my alienating a significant portion of
the community.

I say "alienating" because it's accurate.  The Kde folks say "Hey, gnome apps
run on Kde", just as the Gnome folks say "Kde apps run on Gnome".  Let's face
it, people feel strongly about their desktops.  I did when I was a Kde user.  I
still am now that I'm a Gnome user.  When I was on the Kde side I would use a
Kde app over a gnome app.  Now it's the other way.  In August I may switch
again.

The Point (tm):
The perfect example of my point is a project near and dear to my heart: The
Gnome-db project.  I'm a database developer, and the Gnome-db project is all
about database access.  They had the opportunity to make the world a better
place.  They didn't.  They're making it worse.  They are GNOME-db, which means
that the Kde people will not embrace them.  Quite the contrary, Kde will now
have to unleash kde-db, a similar yet incompatible API.  Gnome-db would have
been much better off being Gtk-db, or even X-db and leaving Gnome to provide the
environment.  There is absolutely no reason why their custom widgets
and APIs have to tie into Gnome.  

Oh Yeah, Well Here's Another Point:
Writing a spec, or an app, or an API because the current one sucks is
honorable.  Merely duplicating efforts for political reasons is a monsterous
waste of time.  I do realize that choice and competition make the apps better. 
Absolutely.  Examples:  Gnome/Kde, OSS/Alsa, Redhat/Suse, etc.  Making a carbon
copy of a program and exchanging the "k" for a "g" in the name is not
competition, folks.  Case in point Evogellan (Evolution and Magellan).  Why not
just name them Goutlook and Koutlook?  These guys could kick some serious
proprietary ass if they would cooperate on "LinOutlook".  

Whoo, man, I feel a ton better.  In case you're wondering I'm starting the
ObjectManager beta tomorrow.  That caps two months of stressfull, hard-core,
nose-to-the-notebook coding.  I've got a lot of built up anxiety. :)  Don't get
me started on the Blues losing to San Jose in the first round!

Matthew

> Havoc

That's like the coolest name ever.