Re: [orca-list] The LibreOffice's low accessibility

[Jean-Philippe MENGUAL <jpmengual hypra fr>]

Le 14/01/2022 à 22:33, Vojtech šmiro via orca-list a écrit :
> Hello,
>
> and how is Libreoffice accessible in other platforms? I don't want to go 
> away from linux, but I would like to know, is it accessible in others? 

No, it is worse. I think on Windows, the accessibility is less or equal 
as Linux, but rather less globally. NVDA does a good job, Jaws is 
terrible on this program.

> If yes, it wouldn't be impossible to make it more accessible on linux too.

The technical infrastructure is quite different, anyway. The basic thing 
to be done is to implement a high non-regression test structure, so that 
any further dev is not broken by future beginner devs without control, 
QA and review enough related to accessibility. Hence the TDF's tender. 
Once done, I think it will be reasonable to invest on improving the code 
itself, in order to fix the accessibility breaks in the technical tree, 
etc. I would say the topic is in progress in this community, but as for 
any accessibility topic, it is needed to go step to step, all the more 
as most users (this thread is a good example), instead of being verbose 
against libreoffice, choose alternatives which are not necessarily 
maintream for non free software users. I am not saying this as a 
critical, but this fact decreases the knowledge by the community of who 
may be the target of such proejcts. Because let's be honest: 
implementing non-reg test and fixing the current situation will be very 
expensive. So it is needed for TDF or companies working with this to 
know if it is really for a certain number of persons.

> Thanks and take care, Vojta.

> Dne 14. 01. 22 v 21:44 Devin Prater via orca-list napsal(a):
> > Yep, at my job, we wanted to make a form in LibreOffice, and I could 
> > not figure out how to do this. It's really frustrating.
> > Devin Prater
> > r d t prater gmail com <mailto:r d t prater gmail com>
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > On Fri, Jan 14, 2022 at 1:57 PM Jean-Philippe MENGUAL via orca-list 
> > <orca-list gnome org <mailto:orca-list gnome org>> wrote:
> >
> >     Hi,
> >     Le 14/01/2022 à 20:11, Vsevolod Popov via orca-list a écrit :
> >      > Hello everyone.
> >      > Recently, Jean-Philippe Mengual mentioned that LibreOffice has low
> >      > accessibility.
> >      > Could you please explain what software from it's collection has
> >      > accessibility issues and what are they?
> >
> >     To sum up, I would say that the graphical interfae is globally
> >     accessible, even if things could be improved in programs such as
> >     Impress
> >     and Calc. However some features are now difficult to use, LO
> >     experiences
> >     some crashes due probably to its interaction with accessibility 
> > layer,
> >     and some advanced features are not quite accessible. Finally, and
> >     probably the most difficult, in the documents in Writer, while you 
> > have
> >     an access to text, head and fotpage, you don't have an easy access to
> >     footnote except via the flat review. Access to comments is terrible.
> >     Access to the collaborative marks is hard. Access to the objects
> >     such as
> >     images or insertion of objects is not there. Accessibility in a 
> > complex
> >     document with frames and sections is difficult too. But tables work
> >     fine. Spell checking works more or less, even if the mispelling is 
> > only
> >     announced if you have the caret on the mispelled word. The dialog has
> >     improved but still improvements to be done.
> >
> >
> >      > The reason why I am asking is that I want to switch as 
> > completely as
> >      > possible from Windows to Linux and use LibreOffice Writer for
> >     working
> >      > with documents.
> >
> >     You can, I do everyday.
> >
> >      > Are these things like formatting the documents with styles
> >     accessible
> >      > like we do in MS Word?
> >
> >     Styles is the most frustrating feature I know in LO. Because it has
> >     been
> >     accessible until 4.2 and experienced a big regression since then.
> >     Today,
> >     for basic styles title 1 to 3, a submenu in Format makes this 
> > possible.
> >     But to tweak styles in details, I consider it is a pain. The 
> > dialog to
> >     handle numbering of chaptiers is hard too. The same for the 
> > Charachters
> >     dialog.
> >
> >     The problem comes if you havae advanced needs. However, flat 
> > review and
> >     some experience enables you to workaround many accessibility 
> > problems,
> >     but it is not always straightford.
> >
> >      > Creating contents, headings all that things with documents?
> >
> >     It is easy until level 3, but after it, it requires a lot of 
> > additional
> >     things to do
> >
> >     Regards
> >
> >      > What accessibility issues can be found?
> >      > Thank you for any help.
> >      > --
> >      > regards,
> >      > Vsevolod
> >      > https://github.com/sevapopov2/ <https://github.com/sevapopov2/>
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