Re: [orca-list] If you are using Mate with Braille please contact me.

[Tom Masterson <kd7cyu gmail com>]

I am using Mate 1.24 from a PPA repository.  I would have too look to tell 
you which repository for sure.

Tom


On Mon, 4 May 2020, Alex ARNAUD wrote:

> Hello Tom,
>
> Which Mate version are you using? Are you sure do you have the default Mate? I know Ubuntu Mate does a lot of 
> customization on Mate
>
> Best regards.
>
> Le 30/04/2020 à 21:50, Tom Masterson via orca-list a écrit :
>       My desktop has plenty of files and orca does not respond to any keys so I would surmise that nothing 
> has focus.  I know alt-tab does nothing in my case at
>       least as far as orca is concerned.
>
>       Tom
>
>
>       On Thu, 30 Apr 2020, Joanmarie Diggs wrote:
>
>             + Orca-list for MATE folks.
>
>             Hey Tom.
>
>             Thanks! Here's the relevant part of your debug.out (with timestamps and "INFO:" trimmed for 
> readability and extra space added to group the
>             checks together):
>
>             Looking at [window | ] from [application | marco] marco
>             [window | ] lacks state active
>             [window | ] is not active and showing, or is iconified
>
>             Looking at [frame | Top Panel] from [application | mate-panel] mate-panel
>             [frame | Top Panel] lacks state active
>             [frame | Top Panel] is not active and showing, or is iconified
>
>             Looking at [frame | Bottom Panel] from [application | mate-panel] mate-panel
>             [frame | Bottom Panel] lacks state active
>             [frame | Bottom Panel] is not active and showing, or is iconified
>
>             Looking at [frame | Desktop] from [application | caja] /usr/bin/caja
>             [frame | Desktop] lacks state active
>             [frame | Desktop] is not active and showing, or is iconified
>
>             Unable to find active window from [list of all applications, even those which don't have any 
> windows, e.g. Orca, mate-settings-daemon, etc.]
>
>             So... The question is what -- if anything -- are you in or has focus? My guess is that it's safe 
> to eliminate the top and bottom panels. And
>             if memory serves me the window from Marco is what you wind up in when you use Alt+Tab. So you're 
> not in that. The only candidate is the
>             Desktop.
>
>             You can do a functional test to see if the Desktop is active by putting some files in 
> $HOME/Desktop. Then, when you start up and Orca just
>             says "Screen reader on," press navigation keys which should work on the Desktop like Home, End, 
> Left, Right, Up, Down. If one of those keys
>             causes the selected/focused item to change, then that's where focus is. In which case, the MATE folks 
> should see about adding the "active"
>             state to accessible state set of the Desktop frame. Then Orca should tell you you're on the 
> Desktop and if it finds a focused icon, present
>             that as well.
>
>             On the other hand, if pressing those keys doesn't work without your having first explicitly given 
> focus to the Desktop, then I suspect that
>             when you start up your session, absolutely nothing has focus and you are not physically in any 
> window. Thus Orca has nothing to present as the
>             active window or focused item. If this is indeed the case, perhaps the MATE folks could consider 
> putting focus *somewhere*, like the Desktop,
>             for all users.
>
>             Related aside: Orca used to say "no focus" to indicate that condition, but doing so reliably was 
> problematic: There are often very brief
>             moments where one is in limbo between a window becoming inactive and a window becoming active. If 
> Orca doesn't wait a sufficiently long enough
>             time, Orca would be regularly spamming you with "no focus" messages. On the flip side, if Orca 
> waits too long to tell you nothing has focus,
>             you've probably already reached this conclusion due to the silence and caused something to gain focus 
> rendering the eventual "no focus"
>             message pointless. I had tried to strike a balance in between these two extremes, but "no focus" 
> messages still crept through on occasion and
>             users complained. So the "no focus" message got removed.
>
>             I'm dealing with some Chromium issues at the moment, but I'm hoping the MATE users -- and in some 
> cases MATE contributors, like Hypra -- will
>             read the above and either fix the missing state (if the Desktop really is active) or see about 
> causing the Desktop to gain focus or clue me in
>             to something I'm not aware of. :)
>
>             Thanks!!
>             --joanie
>
>             On 4/30/20 14:44, Tom Masterson wrote:
>                   Hi Joanie
>
>                   Here is a debug with orca starting.  Not a high priority as I can easily work around it but 
> might be interesting to know why orca
>                   says nothing but "screenreader on" until I go to the menu.
>
>                   Tom
>
>                   On Thu, 30 Apr 2020, Joanmarie Diggs wrote:
>
>                         Hey Tom.
>
>                         When Orca is first started, it tries to find the active application window. If it 
> finds it, it should present it. Also
>                         if it finds it, it then searches for the focused object in that window. So my guess 
> is that Orca is not finding an
>                         active window. If you care as to why, capturing a full debug.out would be helpful. 
> I'm happy to take a look.
>
>                         If the scenario is that Orca is being started automatically along with the desktop, 
> the approach of relaunching Orca
>                         and cycling through levels presumably won't work. But on 
> https://wiki.gnome.org/Projects/Orca/Debugging, under item 2,
>                         you'll find something which should work, namely using orca-customizations.py to set 
> up the file and debug level
>                         ahead of time.
>
>                         HTH.
>                         --joanie
>
>
>
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