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Re: [orca-list] [Fwd: Default button of Orca]

Hi,
I agree, it's fine the way it is now. Also, it's pretty common knowledge that you press tab to move between buttons in pretty much any OS. If the user in question isn't aware of this then they need more help than the Orca tutorial is likely to provide. I am not saying this in a bad way, I just mean that a person who doesn't know this is likely not familiar with computers at all and will need a general usage class/tutorial to get them started on the right path. After that, they will then know to press tab to move between buttons in an application.
Thanks
Storm
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On Wed, 2011-04-20 at 11:16 -0400, Albert Sten-Clanton wrote: 
Just to be another vote, I agree with Michael.  

Al 

-----Original Message-----
From: orca-list-bounces gnome org [mailto:orca-list-bounces gnome org] On
Behalf Of Michael Whapples
Sent: Wednesday, April 20, 2011 7:35 AM
To: Jacob Schmude
Cc: orca-list gnome org
Subject: Re: [orca-list] [Fwd: Default button of Orca]

Hello,
Comments to different people on this.

I agree with Jacob that turning the main window off is usually one of the
first things I do. I suppose I therefore would argue the preferences button
is the best default option for me as it speeds that up (first time I use
orca on a machine I just get on and customise it). Other things in this
early steps would include customising the speech settings so it is
comfortable for me to listen to the speech (eg. getting the correct speech
rate). Changing it may just prove annoying to people like me as we would
have to forget what we are used to, so I would say there should be a good
case for changing it if the change is made.

I would dispute Jacob's analysis about what a default button is, there may
be a slight conflict of terms here. Even if there is no default action in
the main window, there must be a default position for focus when the window
initially appears. Therefore what button should get this default focus?

Now to Alan's comments/request. I dispute how much use the orca help is in
the context of what he describes the user needing. If the user needs
information on how to navigate between controls and windows, what is there
chance of being able to use the help system if they need that information?
It sounds like they would need more of an interactive tutorial if they want
to do that exploration on a Linux system. I possibly would argue basic
things like that the user may have done better to read a resource covering
those topics on a system they are familiar with before trying Linux.

Another point I will make is, if a user wants help, then they are a bit...
for just pressing enter on a preferences button. As navigation of controls
is done by tab/shift+tab which is the same as on windows and Mac then this
seems a reasonable thing to try to explore available buttons should you be
uncertain of keyboard commands.

Michael Whapples
On -10/01/37 20:59, Jacob Schmude wrote:
> Hi
> Quite honestly, I don't see the reason to have a default button here. 
> There are only three controls in this window, and they are all 
> buttons. A default button is typically applied in a situation where 
> there are multiple control types relating to a specific task.
> Personally, I don't use the orca main window and it's the first thing 
> I turn off, but if having the default button be preferences is too 
> confusing for some (though I don't see why it would be), why not just 
> get rid of the default altogether and require the user to specifically 
> activate the button they want?
>
>
> On 4/20/2011 03:03, Joanmarie Diggs wrote:
>> Hey all.
>>
>> Sorry to be a noodge, but I have a downstream request for us to 
>> change the default button in Orca's main window. As I stated there, I 
>> personally think that the default button in Orca's main window should 
>> remain Preferences and not Help. But I'm willing to change that if 
>> everyone thinks I should. The one thing I'd really like to avoid, 
>> however, is different downstreams making different customizations. 
>> The Orca user experience should be predictable and consistent. For 
>> both of these reasons, feedback on this request -- either here or 
>> downstream -- would be appreciated. The downstream bug is here:
>> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/gnome-orca/+bug/749700
>>
>> -------- Forwarded Message --------
>>> From: Alan Bell<alanbell ubuntu com>
>>> To: orca-list gnome org
>>> Subject: [orca-list] Default button of Orca
>>> Date: Thu, 07 Apr 2011 17:19:44 +0100
>>>
>>> Hi all,
>>>
>>> When orca gets focus it reads out "orca screen reader slash 
>>> magnifier frame preferences button" and pressing return leads you to 
>>> a complicated screen of options. My proposal would be to make the 
>>> default button the help button so that pressing space or return 
>>> might actually take you to some kind of information on how to use 
>>> it, and would tell you about using the tab key to find other buttons 
>>> and widgets and how to navigate between windows. etc.
>>>
>>> What do you think? Would changing the default button be disruptive 
>>> for those who already know how to use Orca?
>>>
>>> Alan.
>> Thanks guys! Take care.
>> --joanie
>>
>> _______________________________________________
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>> orca-list gnome org
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>> Visit http://live.gnome.org/Orca for more information on Orca.
>> The manual is at
>> http://library.gnome.org/users/gnome-access-guide/nightly/ats-2.html
>> The FAQ is at http://live.gnome.org/Orca/FrequentlyAskedQuestions
>> Netiquette Guidelines are at
>> http://live.gnome.org/Orca/FrequentlyAskedQuestions/NetiquetteGuideli
>> nes Log bugs and feature requests at http://bugzilla.gnome.org Find 
>> out how to help at http://live.gnome.org/Orca/HowCanIHelp
>

_______________________________________________
orca-list mailing list
orca-list gnome org
http://mail.gnome.org/mailman/listinfo/orca-list
Visit http://live.gnome.org/Orca for more information on Orca.
The manual is at
http://library.gnome.org/users/gnome-access-guide/nightly/ats-2.html
The FAQ is at http://live.gnome.org/Orca/FrequentlyAskedQuestions
Netiquette Guidelines are at
http://live.gnome.org/Orca/FrequentlyAskedQuestions/NetiquetteGuidelines
Log bugs and feature requests at http://bugzilla.gnome.org Find out how to
help at http://live.gnome.org/Orca/HowCanIHelp

_______________________________________________
orca-list mailing list
orca-list gnome org
http://mail.gnome.org/mailman/listinfo/orca-list
Visit http://live.gnome.org/Orca for more information on Orca.
The manual is at http://library.gnome.org/users/gnome-access-guide/nightly/ats-2.html
The FAQ is at http://live.gnome.org/Orca/FrequentlyAskedQuestions
Netiquette Guidelines are at http://live.gnome.org/Orca/FrequentlyAskedQuestions/NetiquetteGuidelines
Log bugs and feature requests at http://bugzilla.gnome.org
Find out how to help at http://live.gnome.org/Orca/HowCanIHelp
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