Re: Space, Times and projects

[Kao Chen <kaochen2 gmail com>]

I understand your critics, your comments is very enriching to me.

At the idea beginning, I proposed to use links on a widget and not files in several desktop-folders.

It's seems that Zeitgeist can easily add a project tag to a file.
According to the discussion here on Ayatana mailing list.
https://lists.launchpad.net/ayatana/msg01629.html

If we can tag, we can manage files like a database, it's more powerful.
But it can be more disturbing for the user: I erase a file from my widget and he doesn't disappear from my computer?
So it's important in the design that we make a real difference between a link and a file.
I first took the idea to add a widget with tab to make a real difference.
Kde already use a plasma widget to display your preferred file, but with that, you hide the desktop. If a file is behind, you can't see it.

For this different reasons, I decided to explore the possibility of a mutli-desktop issue. However, with links and tag files, it's can be very disturbing.
Futhermore, how can I move or save my project if they are only links. I also need a real folder, if I created a file I need to put him somewhere.
So I pushed the idea futher and I added a desktop hierarchy.

But like I said, I totally understand you critics, so I made an other  mockup that goes in your way.
Two is better than one ;)

We keep one desktop folder.
We use a Projects tree. 
We manage projects from the overview like the older mockup.
We split the screen, one half for the desktop the other for a project widget.
We add a widget which is displaying the contents of a specific project folder. (eg. /home/angela/Projects/My new book)
We seen tab from the others projects loaded.
and We can display file by type.

The file is here:
http://nsa14.casimages.com/img/2010/05/13/100513081238328205.jpg
Do you like it?

Thanks for listening
Kao

2010/5/13 Giovanni Campagna <scampa giovanni gmail com>

On Thu, May 13, 2010 at 1:57 AM, Kao Chen <kaochen2 gmail com> wrote:
>
> Hi Giovanni!
>
>>
>> I've seen your page and I must admit I like it. Just I think the
>> "Desktop" is not the right concept here. In fact, the desktop
>> metaphor, while being very familiar to users, has some limits:
>>  - like wooden desktops, it tends to become a mess;
>
>
> It's already a mess. I don't know anybody capable to keep a desktop clean and a strict folder organization.

That's exactly why we should not encourage such behaviour.

>>
>>  - it requires you to minimize the current windows (something we should
>>   avoid given the difficulty to restore a window).
>
>
> It's a big problem in my opinion, if we can't minimize windows we can't use the only desktop folder we have.
>
>>
>> In addition, the GNOME 2 desktop implementation has some more
>> "flaws" (as I see them):
>>  - it mixes volumes (USB, SD), network shares, standard icons (Computer,
>> Trash) with real existing files
>
>
> I don't understand, don't we already do that?

Yeah. I pointed out it is a GNOME 2 flaw. Changing it would be
appreciated, at least by part of the users.

>>
>>  - being a Freedesktop, it uses $XDG_DESKTOP_DIR (and assumes there is
>> one such directory)
>
>
> I know it's a big change ;)
>
>>
>> Therefore I think that projects should be moved to a separate ~/Projects
>> directory, and that an extension be made to Shell to add either a
>> Plasma-like widget to the background, clearly distinguished from the
>> remaining ~/Desktop, or something like the proposed Task Pooper,
>> overlaying windows from the bottom.
>
>
> I have made a  mockup with a Plasma-like widget but it just hided a unnecessary desktop because at this time  we are working in a project. I deliberately decide to not use widget and  directly put the documents on the desktop.
> http://nsa15.casimages.com/img/2010/05/02/100502065741947598.png

But the difference is that a desktop is spacially organized: you can
put files here and there, icons are not all the same size, some appear
in random locations...
A FolderView, on the other hand, is always aligned and looks
definitely cleaner. Plus it is a widget, not an empty space: it can
have icons, thumbnails can be put aside with some description, you can
use column view, list view or grid view, you can have like multiple
tabs (like separating URL from applications from documents) and most
important it scrolls, meaning that you get more space for more
documents.

>>
>> Also, I think that instead of fixed directories like ~/Projects/Work and
>> ~/Projects/Home, we should add tags in each directory, using a .project
>> file, or extending current .directory syntax. In particular we should
>> avoid dot-files whenever possible, as GtkFileChooser showes them
>> randomly
>
>
> I prefer working in a desktop folder, because in my idea I display the folder in full screen.

But the desktop folder, being some sort of temporary pastebin for
stuff yet to classify, is not a project, which is organized and
tightly coupled.
Also, not having a desktop in the background prevents fast handling of
asyncronous interrupt. Think of evolution notification, new mail, has
attachment:
where do you save it for later handling? it goes to the desktop, even
if it is completely unrelated to your current task.

> But if we can tag any folder, and transform it in a desktop folder, it's can be interesting.

I didn't mean any folder, any meant any folder in ~/Projects, that is
putting project folders directly under the main project dir, without
intervening classification.
It is technically impossible to make any folder anywhere a project by
using .project, as it requires opening any folder shown in Nautilus.
Could you imagine the mess with automount? You could go with xattrs or
gvfs-metadata, but I don't think that is the best way.
Also, we should decide what the content of project dirs should be:
should it make sense to cd to a project dir? Should it hold files,
symbolic links or just .desktop files? Is the idea to just
cd ~/Project
git ssh://random.location/repo.git
cd repo/
<start working>
or you want a more complex user interface concept?

> For technical questions, it seems important to have a draft copy on a USB stick and go with all the elements the most easily possible.
> For technical questions, it seems important to easily copy on a USB stick and go with all the elements as simply as possible.
>
> kind regards,
> Kao
>
>
>>
>> Giovanni
>>
>> > 2010/5/8 Virgil Brummond <uraharakisuke153 gmail com>
>> >         Kao Chen, the idea about projects seems great. Just have an
>> >         activity and
>> >         drop it, though I think it might be better if you drop it
>> >         twice to just
>> >         move all the currently open ones to the workspace in question,
>> >         and not
>> >         open another copy of them. What do you think?
>> >
>> >
>> >         _______________________________________________
>> >         gnome-shell-list mailing list
>> >         gnome-shell-list gnome org
>> >         http://mail.gnome.org/mailman/listinfo/gnome-shell-list
>> >
>> >
>> > _______________________________________________
>> > gnome-shell-list mailing list
>> > gnome-shell-list gnome org
>> > http://mail.gnome.org/mailman/listinfo/gnome-shell-list
>>
>>
>
>