Re: UI Rantings [was: Re: gmc and file-selection mockups]

["James M. Cape" <jcape jcinteractive com>]

"Jesse D. Sightler" wrote:
> 
> >You open a copy of the Open Dialog to print something. That is behavior
> >you learned from Win9x, and because you've gotten into a bad habit of
> >doing it, would like to be able to do in Gnome as well.
> 
> No, I just find it quicker than opening a file manager, browsing to the
> file, and then right-clicking on it and clicking print.  :)  Using the open
> dialog saves several steps.

So put an "Open This Folder in Gmc" button on the dialog. Simple,
effective, and prevents us having to hack at the GUI because *you*
started doing something in Windows that is 100% contrary to the way
things *should* work. If Windows didn't do something dumb with the
dialog, then it never would've crossed your mind to use the Open Dialog
to print something -- This is because it's not intuitive to use the Open
Dialog to print something.

This goes back to my original Rant. "In Windows 95, I can do this one
kewl thing (which violates quite a few basic UI principles and should
never have been included in the first place). In Gnome/X/whatever, I
can't do that, so Gnome/X/whatever should change."

Printing from an Open Dialog is exactly the kind of thing I was talking
about here.

> >I completely,
> >firmly, and undeniably disagree with this idea, because it is completely
> >counter-intuitive, and new computer users (not just new Linux users)
> >should never find anything that forms bad habits. Don't copy
> >bad-habit-forming things from Windows just because they are there and
> >you have made it a bad habit. Break your bad habit, don't spread it to
> >others.
> 
> Ok, so you think that using the context menu of a file is a bad habit for
> printing?  Please explain to me what is bad about it.  Go into detail about
> this, too, as I really don't see the problem here.

Because it shouldn't be there! Open != Printing! Opening an Open Dialog
to print a file is not the correct way to do it, because it promotes a
bad habit (like putting spaces in created directories). Best to leave it
out, so new users don't pick it up.

> >Copy and Move are grey areas, and I personally wouldn't object to them
> >because they can be useful.
> >
> >Delete and Rename need to be there, IMO.
> 
> Agreed, on both counts.  :)

Consider these superceeded by the "Open Directory in Gmc" button.

> >However: Cancel should undo *all* changes. Period. I don't care if
> >Windows does it wrong, Cancel should *always* return *everything*
> >(*including* the filesystem) to it's original state, as if the dialog
> >had never been opened. I can't possibly stress this one single point
> >enough.
> 
> Remember here, though, that the problem is that what if after doing all of
> my file-management related things I decide I didn't really want a doc opened
> to begin with.  :)  Then I'm gonna really wish I had a "cancel only my last
> action button".  In other words, cancel really is inconvenient in these
> circumstances (er, cancel the print job, too?).

Well, you shouldn't be using an Open dialog to manage files, because
that's what the File Manager is for! Making the Cancel dialog cancel
everything keeps people from using it as a mini-Gmc, which they
shouldn't be doing in the first place.

The Open Dialog should open files. Period.

The File Manager should manage the files. Period.

Crossover is not a good thing.

    Jim Cape
    http://www.jcinteractive.com

    "All animals are equal, some animals
     are more equal than others."
         -- George Orwell, Animal Farm