Re: Minutes of the Foundation Board, 13th March

On Wed, 2018-03-14 at 10:00 +0000, Allan Day wrote:
= Foundation Board Minutes for Tue, March 13th 2018, 18:00 UTC =
== Minutes ==

 * Tile server options for Maps (Allan)
  * The board has previously discussed paying Mapbox to use their
servers. Since then some cheaper alternatives have appeared. Our
current options:
   1. Use OpenStreetMap's tile servers directly. This would be free,
but there aren't any satellite images.
   2. - costs $40 a month for their "vector" plan -
provides relatively low resolution satellite images.
   3. Mapbox - costs about $300 a month (this would be capped) and
includes detailed satellite images. This cost falls within budget
  * There is a Maps branch which allows these different options to be
used. The Maps developers are fine with any of them, but would like a
  * Neil has talked to OpenStreetMap and they're OK with us using
their servers directly.
  * Mapbox currently isn't providing Maps with tiles, so this is
somewhat urgent.
  * Nuritzi - in favour of Mapbox, on the basis of quality
  * Allan - no satellite images would be a major regression for Maps
  * Neil - the quality of anything other than Mapbox is low
  * VOTE: approve $300 a month to pay Mapbox - passed unanimously
  * ACTION: Meg to inform Mapbox and the Maps team, cc'ing Rosanna
and Neil
   * We might want to revisit this when we set future budgets

From outside, and setting aside the quality of the product, it is hard
to asses whether this is a good decision or not.

To do so, we would need to know what the recurrent income and expenses
are. It could be monthly or yearly. If we receive more than we spend,
then it might be a doable decision. Otherwise, we need think a better
long term solution.

 * Moderation of public mailing lists (Carlos)
  * There have been some complaints that mailing lists aren't being
properly moderated - primarily unpleasant/toxic emails being ignored
  * There's no escalation process - what can people do if they feel
they've been mistreated?
  * There's no process for becoming a moderator or joining a
moderators team
  * Questions:
   * Would it be better to tackle this issue once we have a code of
   * Is it the moderator's role to police behaviour, or is it more of
an admin role?
  * Rosanna - some moderators have taken a more active role in the

FWIW, I am the administrator of the gtk-list, and my role has always
been checking the queue of pending messages to the list. Some eons ago
I requested to pass the list to the moderators team, with no response

When I stepped in, I think that was the role it was always expected for
the list's "moderator".

The thing is, I could barely moderate the behaviour in the list if I
unsubscribed myself of such list several years ago (more than 5 or 6,
for sure). Whenever I need to figure out something, I read (or search)
the archives.

My understanding is that many in the moderator team (or as it was
originally proposed) did not need to be subscribed. Even more, it was a
way for newcomers to get involved.

Anyhow, if someone in the gtk-list is giving a headache to anyone, drop
me an email.

  * Allan - moderators will have to play a role in policing once we
have a code of conduct - they are the ones who have the power to ban
people. A code of conduct will require some procedures and agreements
for how and when people get banned.

By doing so, you will either need to recruit moderators or establish a
mechanism that an unsubscribed moderator get the message or complain.

  * Carlos - even if we don't have a code of conduct in place, there
might be other things we can do, like trying to recruit extra
modorators. The problem is, right now there's no process for
appointing moderators.
  * The board isn't currently managing the mailing lists, but they
hosted on GNOME infrastructure and they do therefore fall under the
board's remit.
  * Carlos - we should write a process for putting more people into
moderator and administratory roles.
  * Nuritzi - we could put out a public call to find out if there are
any moderators who want help, or if anyone has had problems with a
  * Cosimo - would prefer to wait until we have a code of conduct.
Didier and Nuritzi too. Carlos is mindful that this topic is already
  * ACTION: add this item to ongoing items and check back in a month

When there is lack of volunteers for a boring role, why would you need
a process? Who are you going to recruit?

What are you going to do if a core developer or a maintainer or the
list moderator is the one misbehaving? (other than talk to them)

In practical terms, Code of conducts are guidelines, it shows what a
community aims; but Code of conducts are hard to enforce. The exception
could be a gathering or conference. There is no balance in power. To
put it simple: it is easy to ban a random troll, but banning a troll
with power is a different thing without paying a high toll (like
discarding a project).

FWIW, I have been trying to find records where a CoC has been enforced
(other than node.js), no luck so far. Perhaps there has been no need.
Pointers are welcomed :-)

Germán Poo-Caamaño

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