Re: GNOME 3.0 in March 2011

[Bastien Nocera <hadess hadess net>]

On Thu, 2010-07-29 at 13:06 +0200, Xavier Claessens wrote:
> Le 29/07/10 09:56, Bastien Nocera a écrit :
> > On Thu, 2010-07-29 at 09:24 +0200, Frederic Peters wrote:
> >> Paolo Borelli wrote:
> >>
> >>> I still would like to have a definitive description of what 2.32 apps
> >>> can and cannot use: for instance will the new glib be part of the
> >>> release (and hence gsettings etc)?
> >>
> >> There will be both a glib and a GTK+ 2.x release in September; modules
> >> should still be ported to use GSettings, hopefully a GtkApplication
> >> backport will land soon in GTK+ and module are encouraged to use it.
> >>
> >> Also the GTK+ 3 migrating story ("get your module building with gseal,
> >> without using deprecated parts, and it will work") should still hold
> >> true; there was a GTK+ meeting yesterday, probably they will send
> >> minutes and a detailed status update.
> >>
> >> In the specific case of gedit, there's the issue of libpeas, it is
> >> really your call if you want to start using it already in 2.32.
> >
> > Given that apps that wanted to port to GSettings are already ported, I
> > really don't see why we're advising to use GTK+ 2.x/3.x selection at
> > configure-time when we've been telling people to target GTK+ 3.x.
> 
> IMO the big mistake here is to have accepted modules to drop GTK2 
> compatibility. I told the RT to make clear that modules must keep that 
> compatibility, but they are only realizing it now... I think we should 
> now remember: NEVER DEPEND ON GTK VERSION THAT ARE NOT RELEASED EARLY IN 
> GNOME SCHEDULE!!! We already had that issue in the past, and we did the 
> same mistake again.

That's completely bogus. We're not blocking on GTK+ 3, and we never have
been. We're blocking on the shell, and some of the ancillary projects.
Whether or not GTK3 was ready (some of the changes that will come in now
will be because we're slipping, not because it wasn't "finished").

> > Speaking about my modules, I will not accept any changes to make them
> > work with GTK+ 2.x again, nor would I want people to waste their times
> > doing that.
> 
> Why? As I understand, GTK3's only advantage is to have GtkApplication, 
> which is being backported to 2.22, right? So I don't see why you can't 
> make a --enable-gtk3 switch in your modules. Empathy is doing that from 
> the beginning, and it works fine.

Because we have Python extensions that now use PyGI, and we switched the
plugin system to libpeas.

We also use the new dark theme support in GTK+, as well as the symbolic
icons theming. Those aren't available in GTK+ 2.22.

> > The 2.32 story is inexistent: "Hey, you have a couple of weeks to
> > release something that you didn't plan for, and that didn't exist".
> 
> If I understood, the story for 2.32 is the same than what we planned to 
> be 3.0 so far. Except:
> 1) modules should release with the version '2.32' instead of '3.0'.
> 2) gnome-shell won't be part of that release
> 3) modules must build with GTK 2.22, with extra bonus if they also build 
> with 3.0.
> 4) did I forgot something else?

For your particular application, yes. For other apps, see the e-mail
Vincent sent after our discussion about the scope of 2.32.

Cheers