Re: [orca-list] Emacs editor

[Peter Vágner <pvdeejay gmail com>]

Hello,

Most likelly this is now going slightly off topic however I did not have 
an opportunity to get thus far with emacs and its accessibility so 
generally I am curious. If you find this iritating just stop me and I 
will listen.

As I am understanding this is that emacspeak is building on emacs and 
adds ability to do various other things that may even have nothing to do 
with emacs e.g. reading rss feeds, posting to twitter, listening to 
music and even some other crazy things which in some way or another 
might be usefull to assistive technologies users.
At the other hand you are saying that speechd-el just allows emacs to 
remain emacs without additional bloatware.
Emacs displays various types of content in so called buffers. As I 
imagine it there are some emacs specific buffers that display logs, 
messages etc. Depending what's shown in such a buffer, there are emacs 
modes. but the first most obvious thing appears to be that sighted 
people use different modes for different tasks and when viewing 
different file types. This most likelly adds different style of 
displaying text, does syntaks highlighting and similar. Is there 
something usefull to you while using speechd-el or emacsspeak on this 
architecture?
There are various 3rd party libraries and other apps for emacs. Do 
usually speechd-el and emacspeak need to be aware of these things or 
does it just work seamlesly?
I know that I can run almost any GTk3 app on gnome and it is expected to 
be mostly accessible. Can this also said about emacs and its additions?

It's time to see Alex's tutorial, perhaps some of these things are 
already answered there.

Thank you all

Greetings

Peter

On 26.10.2015 at 14:07 Will Estes wrote:
> It's been several years since I dropped emacspeak. And frankly, it's a relief. No more pointless seeing eye dog jokes 
> in the manual. I don't even need to read the manual for speechd-el--I just read the manuals for the emacs packages I'm 
> learning. No more waiting for emacspeak to "support" new things in emacs. They just work because speechd-el 
> just lets emacs be emacs. (vi/m fans generally thing that's not a good thing, but then they're using vi/m, and that's 
> just a different use case.)
>
> speechd-el is simpler and smaller. It enables emacs-centric speech output and then gets out of the way.
>
> Emacspeak wants to change how you do everything, whether or not you want that.
>
> On Monday, 26 October 2015,  8:00 am -0500, Christopher Chaltain <chaltain gmail com> wrote:
>
> > I haven't tried speechd-el yet, but I've been an Emacspeak user for almost
> > 20 years. I can't compare the two, since I only have experience with
> > Emacspeak.
> >
> > I do know the following though:
> >
> > It isn't true that all of the Emacspeak development is just on adding
> > Emacspeak specific functionality that isn't needed. I'm not saying there
> > aren't reason to use speechd-el over Emacspeak, and I'm sure there are some
> > grains of truth to a statement like this, but it's so generic and using so
> > many superlatives, it's almost certainly not true and stated from a
> > philosophical position rather than a pragmatic one. I'd ask for more
> > specific details before putting any stock in statements like this.
> >
> > I never found the build process for Emacspeak to be fragile or opaque. It's
> > no different than compiling any other source code using a make file.
> >
> > Emacspeak generally speaks what you need to hear while working with Emacs. I
> > virtually never need to use Emacspeak specific key strokes, but they're nice
> > to have when I want to drill down for more specific information or get it
> > more efficiently.
> >
> >
> > On 10/26/2015 07:43 AM, Will Estes wrote:
> > > All the active development on emacspeak is on adding functionality that is emacspeak specific and generally not needed. 
> > > It's also, often, things that would be better handled outside of the "screen reading" component. When I last 
> > > used emacspeak, I found its build process fragile and opaque.
> > >
> > > speechd-el, on the other hand, simply lets emacs be emacs -- just with speech output. So you're not 
> > > remembering additional screen reader specific commands other than the basics to make speech output the way 
> > > you ened it.
> > >
> > > There is a good tutorial inside emacs itself. speechd-el explains how to get it up and running inside emacs 
> > > -- which you could do outside of emacs using another editor if you'd rather. Although the trick about using 
> > > emacs in non-windowing mode mentioned on the list earlier is workable, certainly as a starting point.
> > >
> > > On Monday, 26 October 2015,  1:34 pm +0100, Peter Vágner <pvdeejay gmail com> wrote:
> > >
> > > > Hello,
> > > >
> > > > I think emacs is really powerfull editor.
> > > >
> > > > Can some of you knowing it better either give a few words on why you prefer
> > > > speechd-el over emacspeak or the other way round?
> > > > It appears emacspeak is more active developed than speechd-el.
> > > >
> > > > Also is there a howto for beginers and noobs looking at learning this?
> > > >
> > > > Greetings
> > > >
> > > > Peter
> > > >
> > > > On 26.10.2015 at 09:16 Alex ARNAUD wrote:
> > > > > On 25/10/2015 22:48, Mike Dupont wrote:
> > > > > > https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Emacspeak check out emacspeak it is
> > > > > > supposed to be very good and also allows for access to other things.
> > > > > There are also speechd-el. You can find information here :
> > > > > http://devel.freebsoft.org/speechd-el
> > > > >
> > > > > I use this line in my bashrc to make Emacs in CLI automatically :
> > > > > alias emacs='emacs -nw'
> > > > >
> > > > > Best regards,
> > > > > Alex.
> > > > > _______________________________________________
> > > > > orca-list mailing list
> > > > > orca-list gnome org
> > > > > https://mail.gnome.org/mailman/listinfo/orca-list
> > > > > Orca wiki: https://wiki.gnome.org/Projects/Orca
> > > > > Orca documentation: https://help.gnome.org/users/orca/stable/
> > > > > GNOME Universal Access guide:
> > > > > https://help.gnome.org/users/gnome-help/stable/a11y.html
> > > > > Log bugs and feature requests at http://bugzilla.gnome.org
> > > > _______________________________________________
> > > > orca-list mailing list
> > > > orca-list gnome org
> > > > https://mail.gnome.org/mailman/listinfo/orca-list
> > > > Orca wiki: https://wiki.gnome.org/Projects/Orca
> > > > Orca documentation: https://help.gnome.org/users/orca/stable/
> > > > GNOME Universal Access guide: https://help.gnome.org/users/gnome-help/stable/a11y.html
> > > > Log bugs and feature requests at http://bugzilla.gnome.org
> > --
> > Christopher (CJ)
> > chaltain at Gmail
> > _______________________________________________
> > orca-list mailing list
> > orca-list gnome org
> > https://mail.gnome.org/mailman/listinfo/orca-list
> > Orca wiki: https://wiki.gnome.org/Projects/Orca
> > Orca documentation: https://help.gnome.org/users/orca/stable/
> > GNOME Universal Access guide: https://help.gnome.org/users/gnome-help/stable/a11y.html
> > Log bugs and feature requests at http://bugzilla.gnome.org