I have avoided chiming in on this one to date, and I will probably avoid
it in future, but I wanted to say this...
I am a person who reads those stock and investment plan (some would say
scheme) newsletters, such as the stuff produced by the Sovereign Society
and S&A Research (basically the whole Agora family) for fun and
amusement
(and the odd useful piece of investment information).
If you know what I'm talking about, then you know that I know whereof I
speak, when I say that I have seen copyrighting and "creative"
advertising, ranging from the absolutely absurd, to the world class.
While claiming Vibuntu as "the first fully accessible version of
Linux...", or variations on that phrase, is certainly hyperbolic and
rather overdone, it may have some effect with the target population.
and
isn't that the point of marketing? Getting a foot in the door?
I probably would not have said it, but then I have never been good at
selling things.
Systems like Slackware, and I think even Redhat, have been fully
accessible (or at least as accessible) for years, _if_ you knew how to
get
started.
But that's the problem: if you need a howto in order to get it going,
even
if it's a relatively short one, you're already behind the ball, in
trying
to get your foot in the door.
I believe it can be said to be true that most blind people using
Windows,
had a sightie do the installation. By the time the blind user got to the
system, it was likely already talking, or could be made so with relative
ease.
With Linux, having someone else do the install is rarely an option. So,
you start out, when promoting it, in "catch up" mode. Add to that,
having
to go to some web site, and follow a possibly complex set of
instructions
in a howto (complex to someone who has only ever used Windows, or never
used anything), when they have never actually heard of a HowTo, and
aren't
convinced that "this Linux thing" is worth all the trouble, is not at
all
a good beginning.
I have nothing invested in VIbuntu (except that I like the name:)), and
am
not myself convinced that it is a necessary project on its own (I.E.
that
it might not be better for it to either absorb, or be absorbed into,
another project).
I have seen (and been a part of) too many projects driven by a need and
a
key personality (I.E. not driven by a team), that started out with a
bang,
but then flamed out just when they had a chance, because they did not
have
enough of a foundation in the community they existed to operate within
and
support, so I am cautious.
However the need is real, and since this does seem, at least as I
understand the situation, to be a reasonable way of going about things
for
a quick launch of a good idea (which, unlike many other good
ideas, has a substantive product behind it), I say why not?
Yeah it has bugs. Yeah there are things I think could and should be
changed about the way it operates. Yeah remastersys is probably not the
best way to roll a distribution. Who cares? It works, it is out there,
and it is constantly being worked on--I do not believe that the
self-proclaimed deluded megalomaniac has claimed that it is complete and
perfect yet.
Anthony may eventually decide to merge Vibuntu with something else. We
may even discover that it does not appeal to the intended target
audience
for what ever reason.
Ubuntu may even recognize the value in adding at least a beeping
bootloader, and a less tricky installation process for disabled users.
That would go a long way to eliminating the need for this project, I
think, and is probably the way I would rather see things go.
But so what? Are we not all about offering alternatives and choices?
Too
many choices can be a bad thing. Are we even close to having too many
choices yet?
I have seen many people confused by which distribution to get into; but
I
have seen more of them struggling through the trials of getting their
chosen distribution up and talking fully in a productive way, to think
that there is no value in what Anthony is doing. "Put this CD in, boot
it
up, and follow the spoken or brailled or magnified instructions", is not
usually the response given to such questions. Maybe soon it can be.
That is probably simplistic--one must still understand partitioning and
multi booting and such, but that is well documented in simple ways. To
me, the holy grail of Linux deployment is "it just works".
Am I likely to use VIBuntu for anything other than a lark, or to aid
with
development? No. I've been using Linux for twelve or more years, and
unixes longer than that. I'm used to the hardships and hitches, and
know where to find help, and what questions to ask. but then, it wasn't
meant for me, was it?
Regards,
Luke
On Sun, 14 Dec 2008, Anthony Sales wrote:
Hi Tom, its the self-deluded megalomaniac who thinks he has solved all
of
the
world's problems with a simple remix of Ubuntu. I think the key here is
to
remember that this distro is not really aimed at Linux users at all -
but
visually impaired users who maybe haven't even heard of linux before. I
am
trying to 'sell it' (for free remember) to teachers, trainers, colleges
and
institutions in the UK who probably have never heard of or used Linux
before.
When promoting something it is usually to emphasise its strengths
rather
than
weaknesses. No one is going to sell many cars if they use the slogan,
'its
OK, its pretty much like other models really'. In the same spirit that
Carlsberg claim to brew 'probably the best larger in the world', I have
claimed to have produced 'the first fully accessible version of Linux
for
visually impaired users who have never used Linux before'. It has
certainly
got peoples attention and a bit of a debate going! You know that I
don't
take
myself that seriously, but I think you would have to agree that
Vibuntu,
even
though it still needs lots of work, is probably the only Linux distro
that
you or I know of that could be booted and experimented with by someone
with
no experience of Linux, who would have no chance of being able to
configure
it themselves without support and/or sighted help. I think a lot of
people in
the Linux VI community forget just how difficult it is to get into
Linux,
and
the fact they they are so technically competant themselves etc makes
them
lose sight of the fact that the vast majority of VI users are not
hackers
and
have no ambitions to be so. They just want to browse the web, send a
few
e-mails or write a letter etc. If Vibuntu helps just a few people kick
their
dependancy on microsoft than I will consider it a time well spent.
(What
would you rather be doing - translating T3 scripts into Welsh or
tinkering
with Ubuntu?) Yours in humble modesty, drbongo.
-----Original Message-----
From: ubuntu-accessibility-bounces lists ubuntu com on behalf of Thomas
Lloyd
Sent: Sun 14/12/2008 22:02
To: ubuntu-accessibility lists ubuntu com
Subject: Re: Vibuntu the most accessible Ubuntu Linux live cd for
theVisually
Impaired EVA III
I also agree that the claim of the first accessible Linux is a tad far
fetched and maybe the most accessible Ubuntu Linux live cd for the
Visually Impaired. Is more accurate? We all fall victim to claims of
self grandeur at times, especially when it our baby.
I think that the proof is in the pudding as Tony has said himself the
community will decide. I have no issues with slightly misleading
marketing if it saves any disabled people money and opens up more
opportunity for them.
This is not to undermine what has been done in the past by other groups
and if there are better products for those people they will find them.
But we all need a starting point and if you are forced to spend a small
fortune to start on a computer many people who can, either can not or
don't.
So all in all keep up the good work make sure you add in a feature that
forces the user to change their password at least and maybe their
username after an install and I will stop worrying about security.
NL
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