Re: Weighing in and other thoughts about recent discussions

[Ross Howard <ross analog co nz>]

>However, the save dialog is mearly a file open dialog with the word "save"
>swapped with the word "open."  The user is _still_ shown with the nicely
>designed file listing that, as we said, presented a CHOICE for him: the
>choice of which file to OPEN.  Oh! But remember, this is a SAVE dialog!  The
>user is confused because he thought he is supposed to save a file, but is
>still presented a choice of which file to open with the file listing.  In
>other words, in a real office, do you look through all the other files in a
>directory before you put a new file in?  I don't.  It's irrelevant what
>other files are in a folder to my decision on where to put a new file.


Mmmm I must say that I do enjoy having a file listing, it gives me 
important perspective as to where I am... what about a quick save function 
that just displays a little dialog box with one field containing the path 
and file name... I also enjoy - as you describe below, the way in MS 
explorer how you can manage your files from any save or open dialog box, 
new folders, rename, delete, copy etc... this is something that is still 
not implemented in the MacOs and drives me batty.


>Here's my solution.  Yes, there are some issues with it, but the original
>problem remains. There might be other ways to solve the problem though, but
>this is what I came up with: I think we would confuse new users less by
>removing the file listing from save dialogs, and we'd also reduce clutter.
>Perhaps we could put something more useful in its place.
>
>Also, the user only uses the delete, rename, and new folder commands in a
>save dialog and not in a open dialog because conceptually, and open dialog
>is read-only, and a save dialog is write only.  For example, I only create a
>new folder in a file dialog when I realize that my file I'm saving doesn't
>fit into the folder categories I've created.
>
Good point, I never really thought about the lack of functionality of the 
these in the open dialog...



>I've also have been playing around with the idea that file names should be
>optional.  You can do a lot of things with the eazel zoom tool that allows
>you to see inside of files (in the icon) without opening them.  File names
>were made to give you hints about what's inside a file.  By being able to
>see inside a file without opening it, there is no need for a hint to what is
>in a file because the contents is already visible.  So, user creates a new
>file, drags it to the desktop (or wherever).  No need for file dialogs
>either.  When the destop gets too cluttered, the user has to start
>categorizing items-like cleaning a desk by putting stuff in folders.
>Perhaps later on, if he wants to, file names could be optionally added.  The
>only problem is that there would have to be a high zoom level, and I don't
>know how many documents you could fit on screen on lower resolutions and at
>high zoom levels.  However, I realize GNOME is probably too far along for
>such a radical change, but who knows, and if anything else, it helped expand
>our horizons a bit more.

NO way man.. we need file names.. and I am not keen on eazel at all! plus 
do we want to enforce such a rule because *one* new file prog can do 
without it...


BTW I'm new round here, so please excuse myself if I am missing the point.