Re: Official Compliant

[Ali Akcaagac <aliakc web de>]

On Thu, 2004-07-15 at 14:58 +1200, Glynn Foster wrote:

Good morning,

> Grow up. I have yet to see a substantial contribution from you. As far
> as I can see you just turn up to consistently annoy developers with your
> whinges.

But this is not how GNOME works. From the Charta everyone who
contributes to GNOME has the same right to bring up his opinion, to have
his voice heard and to have the ability to shape GNOME in the same way
like those who regulary contribute to it (or those getting paid to work
on GNOME). The Charta was written to guarantee that these things to
actually happen, that new people as well as old people who work on GNOME
have the same rights. It doesn't matter how much a single person has
written as long as he has contributed something to that project. Of
course we can discuss how the weight is being split across these
opinions. At the moment the GNOME project is only seeking out for people
who are going to fix the bugs rather as if their opinion counts. At
least that's how I see the GNOME project has shaped.

> If you want people to take you seriously, you will have to prove
> yourself - contributing solid ideas and rationale, backing them up
> with code contributions or mockups, fixing bugs....everything else will
> just fall on deaf ears. Others have proved themselves in this fashion,
> and are respected contributors to the project - what makes you so
> different? Something that I think you need to go away and think about.

Excuse me, why don't you take some mins and check up the projects I have
contributed to ? You find my name or even my nick more than ONE time in
plenty of GNOME modules in at least one you find me as co-author.

> Typically that's not how OSS development works. You need to build up
> trust before you can expect to determine the direction of the project.
> It's pretty clear you haven't.

Is it so ? I have contributed to plenty of OSS projects, be it in the
QNX world, be it in the MorphOS world and even in the Linux Kernel
world, be it in the AROS world (to name some) and from the various
communities I belong to I can tell you that I do criticise some people
of the GNOME community as one of the most evil I've ever met (and of
course again always the same persons). I haven't been treated that ugly
in my whole life (and I am 31 now) than from some individuals within the
GNOME community - and wow, how they excuse everything only to make it
look acceptable in the public.

> I have no idea why your request for a CVS account was ignored. Perhaps
> your years of rubbing people up the wrong way and getting on their bad
> side worked against you.

No of course not...

> I think you should be blaming yourself as much as you blame other
> people. You have consistently proved to be an utter pain in the ass on
> mailing lists, on IRC, on various news forums and many other locations.
> Many people have issues with you. Why do you think that is? There are a
> *lot* of other contributors to the project that have no problem getting
> involved. Of course there will always be exceptions to that rule where
> some people can't get along, and maybe it's time to pack your bags and
> go home if that is the case. I'd welcome the 'others' to comment, but I
> suspect they'll be keeping quiet and not look like fools ;)

Listen carefully,

I am sick being accused all the time for these things. Tell me one
person within the GNOME community, be it on IRC, be it on the
mailinglists or elsewhere who didn't had a bad day and acted bad ? Can
you name one ? Anyone free from sin should throw the first stone.

I've seen people on IRC who truly behaved like jerks, I've seen people
writing on the mailing lists who behaved like jerks.

This is no excuse for other people to behave like this - no ! but I am
also terrible sick how you (and the same handful of people I am refering
to) >>> EXCUSE <<< the rude behaviour of Mark while the same people
condemn when I or others wrote one bad thing or when I need to steer up
and justify myself for things never done (again to the same people).

It's not me, who is the bad guy here, it's YOU and the same handful of
people who presume they could do everything. I read it plenty of times
on different newssites how the same handful of people bash, slander and
attack other people and it is my good right to bring this up here.

You call it 'annoying' I call it informing, you call it 'trolling' I
call it informing. It is important to inform other people about the
general attitude towards others done by certain individuals. It is
impossible to ever work with you people, it's impossible to even bring
up an opinion without being called a troll, it's impossible to even
shape GNOME (as it was stated in the Charta). Everything that does not
FIT into your own vision, your own understanding is either 'annoying' or
'trolling' and you (and of course the same handful of people) do this
over and over again with other people. You are refering to my bad
behaviour on IRC or the mailing lists - ok I am a bad person (not born
like that and just here in the GNOME community) - how about all the
other bad people in the GNOME community that you stand up for and
JUSTIFY their rudeness and sick behaviour ?

Now let's forget me as person for a moment. As you can see in Mark's
reply he also treated Eugenia in a bad behaviour. The reply wasn't just
targetted towards me. I see this happening over and over again, either
on IRC or on the mailinglists (this was one example) that totally goes
against the Charta and what we believe in. This is unacceptable not only
for my person - also for every other person as well.

That's why I had come over here in hope that the Foundation will
intervene here.

> There is nothing to stop you running for the board next year. I would
> welcome your candidacy, and since GNOME is an open project you have as
> much chance of being elected as some of the eliteist members of the
> current Board.

The entire election is a farce as much as I start to believe the Charta
is. 2/3 of the people didn't elected at all - a sign how much they care.