Re: [Usability]GNOME main menu and panel

[Stephen Tomlinson <stephen flawed co uk>]

On 2003.01.16 13:31 Jeroen Verhoeckx wrote:
> Hi Dave,
>
> So Ximian is behind the two panel structure. They have
> to think commercial, so it is strange that they choose
> this structure. (I know you are not sure about ximian)

I don't have a clue what you mean.

> I don't say that you have to copy Windows!! But they
> did something good. Right now KDE is even much further
> in the development of a usable desktop that Microsoft
> or Apple. So we have to look at them. (I use KDE too)

What did they do good, please be specific. In what ways is KDE further 
ahead in development... details, details, details. Grandiose but empty 
statements like these are insulting and of no use.
> We have to think as a user, so we must make it easy to
> use. But we also have to keep it proffesional. Right
> now GNOME even has to little functions. The
> configuration menu must get much more functions. That
> makes GNOME more attractive than other desktops.

We are trying to think like users, and employ users to give us feedback 
via mailing lists such as this one or the various bugtracking systems 
of GNOME and the distros. We are quite aware GNOME should be easy to 
use (hence this list), it's an interface to your computer! GNOME is 
pretty scant on features but this is precisely for the reasons you are 
arguing, to make it easier for the user. Lots of functions doing not 
very useful things are merely going to confuse and disorientate users. 
Primarily GNOME is supposed to allow you to use your computer 
effectively and productively. Aside from administration you can work 
perfectly capably in GNOME as is. What functions do you think we need, 
and in what menus should they go. Functions to merely fill a menu.

> summury: GNOME must get a modern interface
> (nice icons, nice theme etc.)

I'd say GNOME has a modern interface. It implements contemporary 
graphical design (and is themable if you don;t like it) and some very 
new ideas about GUIs. It is modular and all in all a great 
infrastucture to build software on. What constitutes modern and how 
should we implement it? Those would be _useful_ critisisms.

The stock icons of GNOME far exceed those of other interfeces in 
quality in my opinion.

> Greetings GNOME user Jeroen Verhoeckx (the
> netherlands)
> Jeroenverh2002 yahoo com
>
> I have to work now.........
>
>
>
>
> --- Dave Bordoley <bordoley msu edu> wrote:
> > On Thu, 2003-01-16 at 06:43, Jeroen Verhoeckx wrote:
> > > Does anyone know who is responsible for the GNOME
> > main
> > > menu?? Because it's terrible!!
> >
> > I think it was ximian....
> >
> > > For example: screenshot as a main menu????
> > strange,
> > > strange. How can anyone take GNOME serious this
> > way?
> > > Gnome must get a new menu, probably something like
> > > WindowsXP. People of KDE are also working on
> > something
> > > like this. (I think it will be even better that
> > XP)
> > > Can someone write a program like this?
> > > I would like to help designing the interface...
> >
> > The window xp start menu sucks pretty bad as well.
> > If anything just
> > using the file manager for launching applications
> > might be preferable
> > alternative to application menus in general, but i'm
> > not totally sure.
> >
> > >
> > > And does anyone know who is responsible for the
> > choice
> > > of having two panels as default instead of just
> > one at
> > > the bottum?
> >
> > Once again i think ximian started the idea, but Nils
> > at sun played a
> > pretty large role as well. He knows quite a bit
> > about usability too.
> >
> > http://www242.pair.com/nilsp/nils/panel/menus.html
> >
> > > Because this simply doesn't work. (Where is the
> > > usabilty?????) It uses more space than needed. It
> > > looks terrible when you have your window
> > maximized.
> > >
> >
> > It's customizable change it if you don't like it...
> > (this of course is a
> > bullshit answer, but hey i like the default)
> >
> > > GNOME will never been taken serious and will never
> > be
> > > used by the mass if this doesn't change.
> > > The default must be one panel at the bottum!!!
> >
> > Translation:
> >
> > If you don't copy windows your fucked....
> >
> > >
> > > I would like to see GNOME more usable and used by
> > more
> > > people.
> > > It's also very important for companies like Ximian
> > if
> > > they want to sell there software. (Companies have
> > to
> > > take the software serious)
> > >
> > > Greetings jeroen
> >
> > Of course If i had it my way we would rip off the
> > mac and put the menus
> > at the top of the screen, but that just isn't in the
> > cards. Sorry for
> > swearing so much in this email..
> >
> > dave
>
>
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--
Stephen Tomlinson		[e] stephen at flawed.co.uk
				[w] http://flawed.co.uk