Re: Icons during dragging (should have text part IMHO)

[Ralph Aichinger <ralph pangea at>]

On Tue, 2004-04-20 at 11:12, Alexander Larsson wrote:
> On Wed, 2004-04-14 at 09:13, Ralph Aichinger wrote:
> 
> > One thing is the "feel" of dragging icons, this is maybe my largest
> > "problem" with Nautilus now.
> > 
> > To me dragging simply does not feel quite right yet. I think part 
> > of the problem is that activating the Icon gets lots of feedback (good)
> > but the "state change" to "dragged" is not really visible. I.e.
> > if you drag the Icon just for a few pixels you are never quite sure
> > if you've really "got" it, or just activated it. Or so it feels
> > to me. The cursor form switch simply does not do it for me, on some
> > unconscious level. Might sound strange, but Windows XP and -- most of 
> > all -- classic MacOS work much much better in that respect IMHO.
> 
> I don't have a classic MacOS here, how does it work there? I agree that
> we could do this better. 

I don't have one at the moment either, but I spent a lot of time
dragging and dropping between a Windows box and Gnome today.

I think there are three "effects" that ever so slightly annoy me
with the way Gnome does it.

1) Missing icon name: This is the largest problem IMHO, because
   it changes the silhouette of the dragged icon just at the
   wrong moment, when you are not quite sure if you've "got"
   it. Things staying "identical" to themselves is one of the
   cornerstones of the spatial/object oriented principle, and
   I think this breaks it, if only slightly.

2) Feedback at the wrong moment: At the moment, when you start
   to drag an icon, there are three forms of feedback.
   a) If the icon is not active, it gets activated at the
      first click.
   b) If you drag it a few pixels, the cursor shape changes,
      to the "right angle" form.
   c) The last thing I normally notice is the icon actually
      moving.

   I am not completely sure about this, but I *think* i would
   like more feedback at the moment of the click (especially
   if the icon has been selected already), and less inbetween.

   Feedback at the moment of the click is especially nice
   when working with bad/old mice (like in a University computer
   lab), which have no more audible and/or tactile click themselves.

   The way feeback works now, I more or less find it distracting,
   especially because the icon changes shape (due to text below
   it not moving) and the large cursor shape. *And* the fact, that
   this happens after moving a few pixels gives a sort of "delayed"
   effect IMHO.

   When I drag window titles in Metacity, the cursor switches at
   the moment of click. I prefer this behaviour. I don't know if 
   this can be done in nautilus, because you have to be able to
   activate without dragging, and don't want that to be confusing.
 
3) Icons are dragged "behind" cursor "on a string"
   What I mean with this ist that if you click and drag an icon 
   rather quickly, as you drag it along, it lags behind the cursor
   often twenty or more pixels, depending on speed of dragging.
   It feels as if the icon was dragged along on a string or rubber
   band behind the cursor. 

   This makes handling icons slightly less direct than I would 
   like. Ideally I think the icon should stick like glue to the
   cursor. I don't know if that can be done on X11.

   Windows e.g. has less feedback, but it "feels" more direct to me,
   which might be a direct result of the cursor *never* leaving 
   the icon when dragging.

> I'm not sure why this isn't done. We could at least show the text for
> the primary dragged icon.

I think this would go a *long* way towards a dragging behaviour feeling
"nicer" and more direct. 

I hope all this stuff does not sound too esoteric, but I really would
love Gnome to feel "just right" in these minor aspects. Because I
want it to be perfect ; )

Thanks for improving nautilus from revision to revision.

/ralph