Re: [jokosher-devel] [PATCH] InstrumentViewer volume slider patch (SVN Rev. 1519) (Jeff Ratliff)

["Tom Halligan" <tom halligan gmail com>]

Hi Knut,

I agree completely with the volume control as a necessity,
particularly if Jokosher is to be considered the user-friendly audio
editor of choice. Right now I'm kind of leaning towards an
'all-in-one' solution:

1: Recording monitor when the instrument is armed for recording -
preferably with an input volume control if possible.
2: Volume control when instrument is not armed for recording - this
could also be a peak monitor: even if the track is recorded without
peaking, further manipulation may cause peaks.
3: When not armed for recording, it would make sense for the volume
control to incorporate the mute function - say, by right-clicking.

If we included all 3 points, we could get rid of the mute button
itself, and use the freed-up space to have a slightly larger vumeter
on the right hand side of the instrument viewer, which I think would
be the best solution.

On 6/25/08, Knut Erik Teigen <knutert gmail com> wrote:
> Hey,
>
> I was the one submitting that patch. I haven't really participated
> afterward, work on my
> PhD thesis has consumed all my time, unfortunately. But I try to follow the
> progress, and
> hope to contribute more when the dust settles.
>
> I really like the idea of having a VUWidget in the instrument view as well.
> Also, I believe pop-up buttons generally are a bad solution. Changing the
> volume is something
> you do very often when recording, so it should be instantly accessible.
>
> Regards,
> Knut Erik Teigen
>
>
> On Wed, Jun 25, 2008 at 3:42 PM, Tom Halligan <tom halligan gmail com>
> wrote:
>
>> I do like the mockup - maybe a little polish would be needed, but it
>> does the job. I don't really like the way it looks as if it's just
>> drawn on top of the InstrumentViewer, rather than an actual feature of
>> it, but that's just nit-picking.
>>
>> I found this:
>> http://www.mail-archive.com/jokosher-devel-list gnome org/msg00239.html
>>
>> Did you ever get a response? I'm not that up to date on gstreamer
>> itself so I'm not entirely sure what I'm looking for there - but since
>> Jokosher has a VUWidget anyway, am I right in assuming that the
>> problem is fixed? If so, we could just go ahead and try that patch,
>> maybe with a few alterations here and there (say, to include input
>> volume control, and track volume control when not armed to record?) -
>> see if people like it or not.
>>
>> On 6/25/08, Laszlo Pandy <laszlok2 gmail com> wrote:
>> > Tom Halligan wrote:
>> >> ....
>> >>
>> >> Maybe the easiest solution would be to use a small, horizontal VUWidget
>> >> rather than the current volume slider? Although this doesn't solve the
>> >> space issue - it would at least be more intuitive as a volume control,
>> >> and also doubles up as a level monitor. The mute functionality could be
>> >> incorporated into this, so then we'd just have three buttons to deal
>> with.
>> >>
>> >
>> > See this bug from a *really long* time ago:
>> > https://bugs.launchpad.net/jokosher/+bug/70351
>> >
>> > And the screenshot accompanying it:
>> > http://www.kryogenix.org/random/jokosher-vumeter.gif
>> >
>> >
>> >> Another option, although a lot more work than the above, would be to
>> >> implement a rotating 'dial' widget (like those used in FruityLoops, for
>> >> example). This would look out of place with Jokosher, though - and I
>> >> don't think many people honestly like these things anyway, so probably
>> >> best to avoid it.
>> >>
>> >
>> > This is explicitly prohibited by the Jokosher way, as originally defined
>> > by Jono when he wrote about the stupidity and unusability of audio
>> > editors which try to be familiar by copying the mixer desk controls.
>> > They fail miserably because mixing desks were not meant for mouse
>> > manipulation.
>> >
>> > The prime example of this is the rotating dial because it is really easy
>> >   to control with your fingers when you have grasp and tactile feedback,
>> > but it is absolutely impossible to use when a mouse pointer.
>> >
>> >> I do think a sliding control is still the best option, but I guess to
>> >> some, the horizontal slider would remind them of a pan control.
>> >> However,
>> >> the slider's 'groove' (Or whatever you want to call it) does become
>> >> shaded to the left of the slider handle, which does suggest some kind
>> >> of
>> >> 'increase' as we move towards the right, rather than just a left vs
>> >> right balance. Perhaps if we could make it more obvious that it was a
>> >> volume control somehow - although I don't think the confusion between
>> >> volume and pan would be anything serious, even for people used to such
>> >> a
>> >> thing. A fixed, vertical slider could be the easiest way around the
>> >> space issue, although this obviously means something else would have to
>> >> be compromised.
>> >>
>> >> Tom
>> >>
>> >>     From: "Jeff Ratliff" <jefrat gmail com <mailto:jefrat gmail com>>
>> >>     To: jokosher-devel-list gnome org
>> >> <mailto:jokosher-devel-list gnome org>
>> >>     Date: Tue, 24 Jun 2008 08:33:07 -0400
>> >>     Subject: Re: [jokosher-devel] [PATCH] InstrumentViewer volume
>> >> slider
>> >>     patch (SVN Rev. 1519)
>> >>     Sorry, don't think I sent this to the list:
>> >>
>> >>     The volume slider in this position makes the think of a pan
>> >> control,
>> >>     not a volume control. This comes from my experience with physical
>> >>     sound boards though, and a novice may not have this problem.
>> >>
>> >>     You could do a volume icon that pops up a volume slider, a la
>> >>     rhythmbox and others. If you were really clever, you could find a
>> way
>> >>     to integrate it with the mute button and take up no additional
>> space.
>> >>     This is less discoverable though, and would really rely on a good
>> >>     descriptive icon, or a little mini popup arrow thingy (excuse my
>> >>     advanced technical jargon). :)
>> >>
>> >>
>> >> ------------------------------------------------------------------------
>> >>
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>> >
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