First of all, to all that may feel upset about this change: the GUADEC comittee thinks that moving locations is an appropriate step and we think that GUADEC7 in Vilanova will be as brilliant as it could have been in Barcelona city. And much more manageable. We have preferred to make the decision now rather than keep the previous way and face increasing problems of coordination and combination between two events and two organisations so different like GUADEC and IGC. En/na DANIELLLANO terra es ha escrit: > I think it's going to be a BIG inconvenience for lots of people, since > many people were hoping to go to Barcelona to see the city and spend some > time with other GNOME people seeing the city. There are about 70+70 trains connecting Vilanova-Barcelona-Vilanova during the day, from 5.30am to 00.06. The average is 4-5 trains every hour. The trip takes 34 or 42 minutes depending on the train - http://renfe.es says. There are also regular bus connection plus 4 night buses at 1.00, 2.00, 3.00 and 4.00 in both directions. The single ticket costs about 2,30€, 1,70€ if you buy a 10 trips ticket. In bigger cities this would be the description of a regular urban transport - http://www.renfe.es/cercanias/barcelona/mapa_zonas.html (Vilanova is in the zone 4 of the green line, left in the coast). > Isn't there any other possibility to stay in Barcelona? > Please, Could you do some more research? I'll help if I can. With only half year of margin is not easy to find facilities available for about +500 people / 1 week. Barcelona is a city of congresses, most of them work on a 2 year plan in advance. It wasn't even clear that we would find a place in a university campus. The STSI (dependant of the same Department as the Catalan universities) did the research. > Many people won't have any problem to pay more to stay in Barcelona > if they already have to fly there. People wanting to stay in Barcelona can stay in Barcelona, of course. They will only need to wake up 1h earlier and if they wish they will get back to Barcelona before dinner time and with +2h of sunlight. Lots of people commute Vilanova-Barcelona everyday to work or study. And the core GUADEC lasts 3 days, so if people want to do some tourism they will find the time, I guess. > As an example, I've changed my mind from 100% sure to go to GUADEC7 to > "I'll have to think twice if I'm going". No te enfades, pero... if 42 minutes and 2,30€ make you think it twice, think it twice. :) You seem to have a big GNOME hart, You will forgive the GUADEC, I hope. En/na Ludovic Danigo ha escrit: > Sadly I can only agree :-( > > I personnaly see severals problems here : > > * People have been sold Guadec 2006 in Barcelona in the Fira facilities > in parallel with IGC, a way to reach a new public. I know what you mean. I was the one who suggested back in February to organise the joint event with the IGC in the Fira to reach a new public. And I have been the one who half year later proposed to find an alternative because the GUADEC organisation could be seriously compromised if trying to fit in IGC way of doing things (which is fully professional and good, but with a different style and priorities than us). The IGC is still open to collaborate. We may suggest them to have a GNOME presence in the next IGC. I know it's not the same but the first priority is to organise a useful GUADEC for the known public, and once this is accomplished then try to get new public. I think the institutional & corporate representatives will be in Vilanova anyway. Surely not so many, but probably the ones attending will be more on-topic as an average. > Less people are to be expected. The GUADEC comittee prefers to organise a good GUADEC for 500 rather than an insufficient or altered GUADEC for 1000. > * Developers paid by their company to come won't mind the change > of course but casual developer and more general public willing to > assits might. Again, this is an international event that happens once every year. If someone's problem for attending this event are the 42 extra minutes between Sants Estació (near the Fira de Barcelona) and Vilanova... People travel a lot more to attend to a football game or a music concert (many times a year). > * Selling Vilanova instead of Barcelona to sponsors is going to be > harder. We are selling GUADEC and the sponsors want to reach the GNOME community, wherever we meet up. On the other hand, selling an alone GUADEC to sponsors is simpler than selling it as joint event with the IGC, specially when the target and sponsorship of both events is so similar. > * Selling Vilanova as Barcelona would be a lie. It is going to be as > much Barcelona 2006 as Tarragona 2006. > (from my point of view :-) We are not going to sell "GUADEC BCN" anymore. Yesterday the board took the final decision. This morning I have sent the email to the list. This evening I wanted to change the wiki and web pages. Instead, I'm replying you here. :) GUADEC7 will we publicly held in Vilanova only. No "London-Luton" or "Frankfurt-Hahn" tricks. > * People willing to help organise might be more hesitant. As for > myself, I am willing to help but honestly it's a bit far and I don't know > if I will actually be helpful. I don't have much freetime and I don't have > car. (Lo siento pero Ripollet <-> Vilanova es un palo) > That said I am sure people from there will be glad to help. You have email and you have will to help, this is already a lot. The Vilanova people is willing to help in the very local tasks, I don't think we will need to bring people from Barcelona to deal with local accomodation or luch discounts, for instance. We can talk about the possibility of offering free/cheap accomodation to the core people volunteering during the GUADEC days. Let's think of the alternatives and the new possibilities Vilanova may offer to us. > Can you give a sum up of the problem Gnome Foundation had with the IGC ? > I am just subscribe to guadec-list ultimatly. Different cultures of organisation, different schedules, different priorities. None better or worst, simply different. Something like trying to develop a joint GNU/Linux distribution between Slackware and Ubuntu developers, if you know what I mean. :) Common protocols could have been possibly agreed but at the begginning there was a whole bunch of good faith from both sides and when we all realised the trouble it was too late to react. The IGC has most of the core structure and contents already planned. We are just starting. They are following the same calendar as always, the one that works for them. We too. > Anyway I'll try to come the 12 to see if I can be of any help :-) Thanks so much! En/na Lluis Sanchez ha escrit: > Hi, > > I have to agree with all being said. It's for me hard to believe that > it's not possible to find some place for the GUADEC in Barcelona in > those dates (although I don't know much about organizing this kind of > events). See above. Planning only six months in advance for about 500 people for at least 5 days requiring a single venue and a main space with capacity for all is not a joke. En/na Jordi Mas ha escrit: > Sorry, I have been off for the last three weeks. I do not want to > criticise the work that others have done since everyone knows how much > work is involved in organising a GUADEC. > > Said that, as Lluis, I think we should reconsider the decision of doing > GUADEC in Vilanova. Jordi, I'm really sorry to read this now. You have been following during monts the process of charm and crisis with the IGC and the GUADEC. We were talking about the need to do something to avoid something worst two months ago. I actually thought you were subscribed to guadec-planning since long time ago, and following all the discussion. You were CCed with Carlos González of the STSI in the earliest mails where I urged to do moves... At the very end Carlos and I were the ones having to make decisions to offer a sustainable alternative to the GNOME Foundation. And this is what we did, as good as we could. > This is no longer Barcelona's GUADEC. Vilanova is > 45/50 minutes by train from the city center and we lost all the strength > points of been in a city with good public transport, full of cultural > activities, etc. Mmmm I'm starting to think that this issue is relevant mostly to the people living in Barcelona city and the close surroundings. The GUADEC has an international scope, more than 80% of the attendants are usually complete foreigners and the other 20% involves people from other corners of the same country. If people can have great meetings during three summer days in "remote" places like Tàrrega, Roses, Campllong or Benicàssim why Vilanova can't be a good place (if we want to). I agree we might lose some strong points going to Vilanova. In exchange we get other strong points Barcelona can't offer. > I have contacts in many local universities of people that likes and uses > FOSS, we can contact them to look for alternatives. I do not know if > this step have been already done. > > Any possibility to reconsider this decision? The STSI looked for alternatives and they recommended Vilanova. IMHO it's too late now. The UPC is hosting the event in Vilanova, they like and use free software as you know. :) En/na Murray Cumming ha escrit: > Barcelona is not far away. I hear it's 25 minutes away on the train. The Barcelona airport is about 25 minutes away from Vilanova. Jordi is right when he says it may take 50 minutes with the train. Or 34, depending of the trains and the train stops in Barcelona (I'm counting Sants because is the closest to the Fira, the previous reference). Again, I don't see that distrances and transport are the big deal here. As a conclusion of this first round of replies, I feel really sorry if I haven't been able to do the best for the Local Team... But I'm doing my best to try to find the right solutions together with the people in the GUADEC comittee. And I know this comittee is still not consolidated and has a lack of local people but since right after getting the GUADEC7 I have done and I'm doing my best to try to convince the local supporters to be there. Now, please, can we move forward? Together? -- Quim Gil - http://desdeamericaconamor.org
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