Re: [GnomeMeeting-devel-list] Why NetMeeting is still needed - was Re: [Discuss] Windows Service (NOT Service Pack ; )

[Craig Southeren <craigs postincrement com>]

To all,

The original message was massively cross-posted, but I think the
response is warranted so I have preserved the addresses. Apolgies in
advance to anyone who does not agree.

As with any piece of software, like a word processor or spread sheet,
there are two different communities who use NetMeeting. These can be
roughly characterized as "personal users" and "corporate users". 

Personal users think:

- I only want simple voice or video calls. 
- Will this work on my dialup connection?
- I always have problems caused by NAT
- The user interface is not cool - where are the skins?
- Why is this not integrated with my IM program>
- The address book sucks
- I never use app sharing or whiteboarding. 
- If I need text chat, I'll use IM.
- If I need file transfer, I'll use email
- Does this work on my $200 PC and my $15 camera and my $10 sound card?
- I like the price (free) and it was pre-installed on my machine
- I'll drop this program tomorrow if I see something else I like better
- So what is H.323 and what is a codec?

Corporate users think:

- I need shared whiteboards and shared desktops and text messaging and
  file transfer
- Bandwidth is not a problem
- I have an IT dept that can do gatekeepers and fix NAT problems
- Keep the user interface simple so I can train anybody how to use it
- Thank goodness this works with the third party gear I purchased four
years ago for $100,000 
- I will only buy hardware that is compatible with this software
- I'm prepared to pay for the software if that means it works properly, I
  can get problems fixed, and there is good documentation
- I'll be using this program until I have a good reason to change
- Can I embed this as an ActiveX control in a web page?
- I need it to work everytime, all the time
- I need this to be secure
- I need H.323V5 compatibility, with support for these specific codecs

Most users of GM fall into the "personal user" category, and GM is doing
a great job of working for those people. Corporate NM users have a heavy
investment in compatible hardware, training and documentation and as
long as it keeps on working, and as long as Microsoft keeps providing NM
on new platforms (even the latest XP release has NM) there is no need
for them to change. The push to a Linux desktop has not yet forced that
issue, although I am seeing some noises in that direction.

The single biggest problem with making GM a replacement for corporate NM
is the lack of an Open Source implementation of T.120 that would allow
development of a compatible desktop sharing and whiteboarding capability.
No-one has been prepared to take on that task - until they do, we will
have make do with use loosely coupled solutions like VNC.

   Craig

On Sat, 19 Jun 2004 17:39:11 +0100
Mike Hearn <mh codeweavers com> wrote:

> I think this is a pretty insightful summary of why NetMeeting is still
> being used and why we're getting requests to make it run via Wine, so
> I'm CCing this to the GnomeMeeting developer list to make sure they are
> aware of these issues (they probably are but just in case).
> 
> Context is "Why doesn't NetMeeting let me use application sharing?".
> 
> NetMeeting runs pretty well on Wine and a fair number of people use it,
> in fact we've had corporate clients ask us to improve it. The first
> question people always ask about this (and I did the same) is "Why not
> use GnomeMeeting?". Well, here's why. NetMeeting is more a collaboration
> tool. GnomeMeeting is more a video conferencing tool.
> 
> Hope this helps.
> 
> thanks -mike
> 
> On Sat, 2004-06-19 at 11:23 -0400, Stef wrote:
> > I dont know quite how Windows does the GDI or
> > backend of netmeeting, to be honest, so i would
> > rather not give my 2c on that .. however .. i do
> > have a '2cents' on the following paragraph :)
> > 
> > > Alternatively somebody else in the community might do it but I think
> > > NetMeeting is the only sort of program that needs it, and GnomeMeeting
> > > works great for most.
> > > 
> > 
> > sorry, but this is really comparing apples and
> > oranges. GnomeMeeting is closer to a V&VoIP tool
> > whereas NetMeeting is more akin to WhiteBoard.
> > 
> > Now, thats not meaning to take anything away
> > from GnomeMeeting, but the concept of holding 
> > up a diagram to a camera to allow them to view
> > it and then show with a pen on the diagram, well,
> > thats not my concept of WhiteBoard or 'remote
> > demonstration'
> > 
> > Perhaps, its a conceptual problem, as in most
> > people think NetMeeting does -only- V&VoIP sort
> > of things. If you start to use it (NetMeeting this
> > is) you will see that there are tools that do part
> > of the task, but usually not all of it. 
> > 
> > 
> > Also, this is not even touching on the fact that
> > sometimes you have clients in the Business World
> > that dictate to you which software to use. Sad
> > but true.
> > 
> > 
> > anyway, thanks for the pointers/thoughts :)
> > Steff
> > (ps. this is not a defense of NetMeeting, jst 
> > trying to explain the rationale behind needing
> > it ;)


-----------------------------------------------------------------------
 Craig Southeren, craigs postincrement com http://www.postincrement.com
 Post Increment - Software, Consulting and Services
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