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Re: open translations database

On Fri, 3 Nov 2000, Kenneth Christiansen wrote:

> I will ask Martin (of Gnome fame) to create a 
> gnome-i18n-tools@gnome.org list. If anyone has a better idea
> for a name tell now ;)

Excellent, let us know when the alias is available for 
subscription

> Also, I will suggest an irc meeting on irc.gnome.org sometime 
> after the weekend. 
> 
> People who would like to join this discussion, please give 
> dates and Greenwitch times for when you are available next week.
> -------------------
> My available times:
> -------------------
> Monday:    18:00->
> Tuesday:   19:00->
> Wednesday: busy
> Thursday:  19:00->
> Friday:    busy
> -------------------

Thursday: 19:00 is O.K., earlier if possible 18:00?.  How does the 
time work for everyone else?.

BTW, I am out of the office next week - Mon 13th - Fri 17th Nov.

Aoife

> From: "Kenneth Christiansen" <kenneth@gnu.org>
> To: "Aoife Dunne - Sunsoft ELC" <Aoife.Dunne@ireland.sun.com>
> Cc: <gnome-i18n@gnome.org>
> Subject: Re: open translations database
> Date: Thu, 3 Feb 2000 16:59:24 +0100
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> 
> Hi Aoife,
> 
> Thanks for your reply!
> 
> >I would like Sun's efforts to be directed toward helping 
> >the open source community with tools and processes working 
> >towards improving the overall quality of Gnome and similar 
> >open source localised products. I do not see Sun actively 
> >involved in the translations of the applications, unless 
> >explicitly requested by the country teams.
> This sound really good!
> 
> >For our perspective the translators are the experts and no 
> >term is wrong.  Our QA team would be concerned with 
> >inconsistency, where one translator has a preference for 
> >one term and another translator has a preference for 
> >another term.  This causes confusion to the user.
> I understand you completely. Especially because of this, we 
> [the Danish team] has a working group who make an official
> list of good and bad translations. In the future we will 
> also have examples, comments, etc in this list.
> 
> >We feel that these are process related solutions and I 
> >would like to join your purposed team of translators, i18n 
> >developers, etc. to start discussion how we can best move 
> >forward.
> 
> >Do you want to create an alias, then people can add 
> >themselves if they are interested?.
> 
> I will ask Martin (of Gnome fame) to create a 
> gnome-i18n-tools@gnome.org list. If anyone has a better idea
> for a name tell now ;)
> 
> Also, I will suggest an irc meeting on irc.gnome.org sometime 
> after the weekend. 
> 
> People who would like to join this discussion, please give 
> dates and Greenwitch times for when you are available next week.
> 
> The headline for the meeting will be "How to handle the i18n 
> process". Please send me idea for items to discuss. Here are 
> some of mine
> 
> - What apart from Gnome is of our responsobility
>   (GNU, Mozilla, other Gnome friendly dists?) 
> - Can we readapt the gettext developement
> - XML translation, bonobo-ui
> - Sawfish, lisp translation
> - The Gnome translation scripts
> - Documentation on how to make a program support
>   i18n, and how to translate
> - How to handle other things than po files
> - Consistency
> - Wordlists
> - Mozilla, AbiWord XP-translations
> - Problems with the current tools
> - Making sure that all files get translated
> - Making package maintainers aware of the importaince
>   of well translated products
> - Status of translations
> - How to handle size depending translations
> - Keybindings, accelerators
> - etc etc
> 
> Please 
> 
> Cheers, Kenneth
> 
> -------------------
> My available times:
> -------------------
> Monday:    18:00->
> Tuesday:   19:00->
> Wednesday: busy
> Thursday:  19:00->
> Friday:    busy
> -------------------
> 
> Aoife
> 
> 
> 
> > Delivered-To: gnome-i18n@gnome.org
> > X-Authentication-Warning: llephaane.bergsoe.dtu.dk: 
> kanikus owned process doing -bs
> > Date: Thu, 2 Nov 2000 18:36:04 +0100 (CET)
> > From: Kenneth Christiansen <kenneth@gnu.org>
> > X-Sender: kanikus@llephaane.bergsoe.dtu.dk
> > To: Christian Rose <menthos@menthos.com>
> > Cc: GNOME i18n list <gnome-i18n@gnome.org>
> > Subject: Re: open translations database
> > MIME-Version: 1.0
> > Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8BIT
> > X-BeenThere: gnome-i18n@gnome.org
> > X-Loop: gnome-i18n@gnome.org
> > X-Mailman-Version: 2.0beta5
> > List-Id: Internationalization (I18N) of GNOME 
> <gnome-i18n.gnome.org>
> > 
> > 
> > I am looking very much forward to this aswell ;) The 
> more we can do to
> > ease the translations with tools (I am activily 
> developing these myself), 
> > QA-testing, etc. the better for the whole open source 
> community.
> > 
> > One of the things that this community really need is an 
> better translation
> > process. The problem is often not the quality with the 
> translations, but
> > that the translator cannot keep up with all the new 
> strings, cannot figure
> > out the meaning, cannot figure out weather to change a 
> keybinding or not 
> > (which ones are already used?). Also, the Gnome apps are 
> often not tested
> > carefully if they are totally translatable, comments are 
> missing in the 
> > pot files, applications are being released without the 
> translators ever
> > knew that a release was pending.
> > 
> > I am sure that Sun can be a great help in this 
> respect...maybe we cannot
> > solve all, but we can atleast do a try. I recomment that 
> we gather some of
> > the most active translators, i18n developers, etc. and 
> then in a small
> > group discuss how to do all this together with the new 
> Sun people. Also
> > this way we can define the way to do this, so people do 
> not feel that Sun
> > is going to take over their domain (I know Sun will not 
> do this, but you
> > can easily misinteprediate it, if someone QA-person at 
> Sun suddently
> > starts to say that it's called "laptop" and not "bærbar" 
> in Danish.)
> > 
> > I say this, since I know that a lot of the people who 
> are translating are
> > doing it also for their own language. This is a good 
> thing I think! We do
> > not want to scare these people away, just because of 
> small things like
> > this. These people (myself included) believe that it's 
> still possible to
> > learn people new words...so for instance if most 
> computer nerds in Denmark
> > are saying "Device", this does not mean that it is the 
> word we will settle
> > on. If the original translation team decide that "Enhed" 
> is better, then
> > "Enhed" it is. - This is very importain if Sun is 
> offering QA-help, that
> > we get a good descussion started first (in the language 
> team, with the sun
> > person for that language), and that the QA-person will 
> look at the
> > translators as equal people.
> > 
> > Well I am not trying to say that this would ever happen 
> ;) I just want to
> > point out, that we need to make sure that is does not, 
> orelse the free
> > software translation project has failed.
> > 
> > Cheers, and hopes for a good cooperation,
> > 
> > Kenneth Christiansen,
> > 
> > GNOME, GNU, Red Hat translator
> > and i18n tool developer
> >  
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > On Thu, 2 Nov 2000, Christian Rose wrote:
> > 
> > > Hello Aoife,
> > > 
> > > I believe most teams are interested in working 
> together with people from
> > > Sun and it's contractors with improving the GNOME 
> translations.
> > > Of course, I can only speak for the Swedish team, but 
> we look very much
> > > forward to hear from Sun and the Swedish freelancer 
> working for Sun (is
> > > there one?), possibly with a QA on existing GNOME 
> translations.
> > > 
> > > 
> > > Christian
> > > 
> > > 
> > > 
> > > > Aoife Dunne - Sunsoft ELC wrote:
> > > > Gustavo, I can have our Brazilian Portuguese 
> freelancer
> > > > perform a QA on GNOME translations and report 
> his/her
> > > > feedback to the Brazilian Translation Team.  Let me 
> know if
> > > > you are interested.
> > > > 
> > > > Bye for now
> > > > Aoife
> > > 
> > > 
> > > 
> > > 
> ##########################################################
> #############
> > > Christian Rose
> > > http://www.menthos.com                        
> menthos@menthos.com
> > > 
> ##########################################################
> #############
> > > 
> > > _______________________________________________
> > > gnome-i18n mailing list
> > > gnome-i18n@gnome.org
> > > http://mail.gnome.org/mailman/listinfo/gnome-i18n
> > > 
> > 
> > 
> > _______________________________________________
> > gnome-i18n mailing list
> > gnome-i18n@gnome.org
> > http://mail.gnome.org/mailman/listinfo/gnome-i18n
> 
> Aoife Dunne
> Program Manager
> European Localisation Centre
> Sun Microsystems Ireland Ltd
> Hamilton House
> East Point Business Park
> Dublin 3
> Ireland
> Tel.:  +353-1-8199-266
> Fax:. +353-1-8199-261
> Email: aoife.dunne@Ireland.Sun.COM
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 

Aoife Dunne
Program Manager
European Localisation Centre
Sun Microsystems Ireland Ltd
Hamilton House
East Point Business Park
Dublin 3
Ireland
Tel.:  	+353-1-8199-266
Fax:.	+353-1-8199-261
Email:	aoife.dunne@Ireland.Sun.COM
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