Re: To answer your question about the upcoming Style-Guide...

["Dan Kaminsky" <effugas best com>]

-----Original Message-----
From: Tom Vogt <tom@lemuria.org>
To: gnome-gui-list@gnome.org <gnome-gui-list@gnome.org>
Date: Saturday, July 25, 1998 3:25 AM
Subject: Re: To answer your question about the upcoming Style-Guide...


>Dan Kaminsky <effugas@best.com> wrote:
>> >just a weird idea.
>>
>> Not a weird idea at all!  Excellent concept.  The only thing I worry
about
>> is the bookmark syndrome...people will just put it in root because
they're
>> lazy, then complain that their bookmark list is so long.  Start menus are
>> also horrible messes because of the company default, even though the
company
>> default is easily overridden.  So, how 'bout an installation defaults to
the
>> app category/subcategory but can be added any number of times to any
number
>> of locations?
>
>than how about my other proposal to change/extend this idea? installations
>ARE done by root, but maybe the fitting in of the new icon to the panel
>should be done according to user preferences...


Should?  Must is a better phrase.  Root can decide what's lying around but
user has to be able to decide his or her interface to that something.

Root can even make a standard setup, just not force it on all :-)

>
>> Gotta pick some default case.  Users forget how they've organized things,
or
>> forget to correctly install something, or whatever.
>
>then let them create RULES. do it via a simple (kiss!) interface. let them
>click or select that anything with "game" in the keywords goes to the
>"recreation" folder.


So where would "Starcraft" go?  No "game" in there.

>
>> >> Interfaces should be customizable, but the average user must be
expected
>> NOT
>> >> to customize their interface and should thus be given the best
possible
>> >> initial experience.
>> >sorry, but I STRONGLY disagree here. the average user WILL customize his
or
>> >her interface, I'll take absolutely ANY bet on that.
>>
>> I'll send you screen shots of start menus, quickstart bars, etc. on
>> Win95/98/NT for normal users.  Very few people take the time to
reorganize
>> their start menu, to add a new button to their quickstart bars, etc.
>
>on windoze, most customization is done in two areas. one is look&feel. nice
>cursors, sound, desktop backgrounds, screensavers - "cute things". two is
>the desktop. it's right that most user's don't do anything to the start
>menu, but then most don't know it's possible and it's really hidden deep
>away (start->system->task bar->(notebook)->advanced).
>simple users put icons on their desktop. I've seen 1024x768 desktops FILLED
>with icons.


This is true.  Putting stuff on the desktop is pretty common and seems
unnaturally intuitive :-)  Hopefully the quicklaunch bar will cut down on
this a little.

Needs to be REAL easy to mess with everything in GNOME.  I dunno if you
already can do this(don't ask), but one needs to be able to take an icon
from Midnight Commander, drag it up to the gnomeprint, move down to "games",
and drop it in straight.

>
>> Note the irony...people are quick to customize for aesthetics but are
>> incredibly slow at customizing things that provide increased
productivity.
>
>as I said: ask the average windoze user how he can customize the start
menu.
>I'm sure the majority of replies will be like "I can customize the menu?".
>:)
>
>that's one of the reasons I argue so strongly for SHOWING that it's
possible
>right from the start.


So how do you show it?  Screenplays are one way, stderr or stdhelp windows
on the panel are another.

Of course, it'd be best to have a self-documenting interface on this
part...thinking...