Re: Possible UI Freeze Break in Clearlooks

[Andrea Cimitan <andrea cimitan gmail com>]

Il giorno Sat, 17 Feb 2007 09:07:09 +1300
Matthew Paul Thomas <mpt myrealbox com> ha scritto:

> On Feb 15, 2007, at 1:04 PM, Andrea Cimitan wrote:
> > ...
> > before: http://img243.imageshack.us/img243/3184/schermata4ec8.png
> > after: http://img408.imageshack.us/img408/7032/schermata3sd1.png
> > (here we are showing an added style, btw the checkboxes and arrows
> > are the same accross all those styles).
> >
> > Using clearlooks-cairo 2.8.x versions I've noticed i got few
> > difficulties reading checkboxes/radiobuttons, while with other
> > engines and previous version of clearlooks those widgets looked
> > nicer and more visible. The light color of the tick (taken from
> > bg[SELECTED], and the design of it was causing few usability
> > problems with a lot of themes.
> 
> The color change is an improvement, because it increases the contrast 
> between checked and unchecked states.
> 
> > That's why i've proposed those new checkbuttons, more visible, with
> > a clean style, and that are using text[NORMAL] which is the
> > correct / logical color since the background of those widgets is
> > taken from a base[NORMAL] (in the past clearlooks was not
> > supporting text[colors] and just bg and base ones, that's why it
> > wasn't implemented in 2.8.x branch, but this was an _error_, not an
> > improvement). For usability point of view, error fixed
> > (base[normal] and text[normal] and not base with bg[selected]),
> > better style I really think that's there's no reason in remove
> > those improvements.
> 
> Except for the good reason Calum already mentioned, that a cross can
> be confused with off state.
> 
> Throwing around vague words like "clean" and "better" doesn't help.
I have personally had difficulties in reading previous checkboxes,
while these new one are cleaner and much more visible. (So why not the
word "better"?)

> In what way, precisely, is a cross better than a tick? If the concern
> is with the number of different pixels between checked and unchecked 
> state, there are less confusing ways to increase that -- such as 
> extending the checkmark beyond the box, and/or changing the
> background color of checked checkboxes. (Yes, I know, Aqua does both
> of those, but there are only so many ways to draw a checkbox.)
> 
We can simply take the tick back with the new color. I agree that
people may confusing between cross and ticks.
> > Gnome users are expecting nice improvements in 2.18 release, they
> > will use that release for 6 months, we _really_ should provide our
> > new cool stuff (remember kde4 is coming... :D)
> > ...
> 
> Your enthusiasm is appreciated, but that's a series of non-sequiturs. 
> How long people use 2.18 for has nothing to do with the ideal shape
> for Clearlooks checkmarks. The proximity of KDE 4 has nothing to do
> with the ideal shape for Clearlooks checkmarks. And changing the
> shape of checkmarks in checkboxes is not "new cool stuff", not even
> slightly.
> 
Every single improvements is a cool stuff.
Remember that a theme is composed by a lot of single little stuff, so
an improvements in checkboxes is as good as an improvement on buttons
or other widgets. All those aspects will make the overall look of the
theme, so I will _never_ focus just on few things, but I will try to
provide a general good user experience.
I've mentioned KDE4 for the simple thing that we need to work harder in
every single aspect to continue providing a nice proposal for the
community.

> (At the theme level, "new cool stuff" would be things like a rounded 
> button option so that media players could be both theme-compliant and 
> non-ugly while making Play larger than Rewind; 
mmm this is a tweak of the mediaplayer code, they have to change
propreties of glade GUI, for example tweaking padness of the play
button.
> sliders that looked
> like sliders instead of like sticking plasters; 
please specify i haven't understand what you mean and i would
very glad to implement those improvements you have n mind.
> animated feedback on
> which item had been selected from a menu; and subtler control
> outlines that made the theme in general look less like a cartoon.)
> 
specify too... my english is not very good I haven't understand your
specific idea

> Cheers
Cheers too!!!

-- 
Cimi - Andrea Cimitan
http://cimi.netsons.org