Re: [Gimp-gui] Improving Export

[Jehan <jehan girinstud io>]

Hi,

On 2015-10-13 00:43, Elle Stone wrote:
> On 10/12/2015 06:07 PM, Jehan wrote:
>
> > > In the proposed export dialog, will there be a place to choose the
> >
> > Just making sure this is clear. Workgroups are a public brainstorming 
> > of
> > what will become GIMP. There is no "proposed" dialog yet, and we can't
> > say what "will be". We have barely started discussing this 
> > improvement.
>
> OK, then I'm proposing that there should be a way to choose the
> precision of the exported image, as otherwise the user will have to
> change the precision of the layer stack in order to export the image
> at the desired precision.
>
> > > precision for the exported file? For example, when exporting an image
> > > file from a 32-bit floating point xcf layer stack:
> > >
> > > * jpegs can be exported at 8-bit integer
> > > * pngs can be exported as 8-bit or 16-bit integer
> > > * tiffs can be exported as 8-bit integer, 16-bit integer or floating
> > > point, 32-bit integer or floating point, etc
> > > * I'm not sure what all the export precision options are for OpenEXR
> > > images, but there's many more than one
> > > * etc for other file formats
> > >
> > > As exporting to a lower precision is likely to invoke the dither
> > > dialog, it would be nice to be able to set global dither preferences,
> > > including "No, never dither upon changing the precision and don't 
> > > ever
> > > show the dither dialog".
> >
> > All these are filetype-specific options, and therefore will not be
> > discussed in this spec. Filetype-specific options will stay handled as
> > filetype handler plugins.
>
> I'm not sure how the dither dialog is a filetype-specific option. It's
> a rdialog that pops up whenever the user changes precision of the xcf
> file, and there's no way to permanently dismiss it. This is a
> useability issue that affects exporting an image (as well as any other
> reason a user might have for changing precision).

Yes you are right that this is something which could be thought as a 
generic option. We should think how this could be handled generically.

> > What we "may" change within this spec is how we will handle filetype
> > specific options. The current logic is to let plugins fully manage 
> > these
> > by constructing their own UI. The consequence is that exporting files 
> > is
> > usually a 2 popup steps: the first (generic) dialog, then a second
> > dialog (filetype specific options).
> > This would be worth improving by having filetype handler plugin only
> > advertize their options to GIMP core so that we could dynamically
> > construct filetype-specific options within the main dialog.
> >
> > But the content of these specific options is out of scope from current
> > discussion.
> >
> > > In the proposed export dialog, will there be a way to set a default
> > > for exporting metadata in tiffs and other file formats?
> >
> > Metadata on the other hand can indeed maybe be handled partly in the
> > spec since they are used across image formats. Well this would have to
> > be thought about.
> >
> > > * For example, right now the tiff export dialog has an advanced menu,
> > > that's closed by default, that defaults to exporting all the metadata
> > > that's associated with the xcf layer stack.
> > >
> > > * There are use cases for exporting all of the metadata, some of the
> > > metadata, and none of the metadata.
> > >
> > > * Currently the user has to click open the advanced dialog and change
> > > the metadata export settings as desired, and then do it all again the
> > > next time GIMP is opened.
> >
> > Here the problem is more generic than just metadata: the problem is 
> > that
> > chosen export options are not kept across GIMP restart. This is
> > something I thought about too, though I forgot to add this into the 
> > wiki.
>
> Some of the export dialogs do allow to save preferences. The tiff
> export dialog doesn't.

Yes most options are handled per-plugin right now, whereas sometimes 
they could be handled on an upper level. For instance someone was noting 
that some format have a preview on canvas (well jpg has at least), 
whereas this should typically be considered a generic feature.
Saving option preferences is one of these things which should be handled 
by GIMP, so that plugin don't have to deal with the problematic and have 
auto-saving by default.

> > This said, the "preset" idea is even an advanced version of saving
> > option values, as you could keep several (named) sets of option 
> > values.
>
> It would be nice if users could set up presets, or "metadata
> templates" based on the metadata they really want to export.
>
> For example, when I upload photographic images to the web, first I use
> exiftool to strip out all the metadata, including any embedded sRGB
> profile, and then I use exiftool to embed just copyright information
> metadata, plus a V2 sRGB profile.
>
> When exporting sRGB images for use as part of a web design element,
> the user probably doesn't want to embed an sRGB profile. But maybe
> they do want to embed copyright information, depending on the
> particular design element.
>
> Most users aren't going to resort to using a command line tool for
> removing old metadata and embedding new metadata and maybe a V2 sRGB
> profile. So this seems like a natural fit for user-saved templates
> that could be applied during export.
>
> If this is the wrong place to mention templates for metadata and
> embedded ICC profiles in exported images, my apologies!

No this is the right place. And clearly metadata is related to export. I 
could indeed imagine there would a way to edit metadata from the export 
dialog without editing the main metadata, and have these export metadata 
saved.

Let's note also that it could be worth opening another workgroup for 
dealing with the main metadata dialog by the way. The current GUI for 
metadata is really minimalist and even quite terrible (not even speaking 
of editing — which is not possible right now — but just the way it 
displays the metadata looks really improvable).
Do not hesitate if you want to open a separate discussion for this 
specific aspect.

Jehan

> > > * It would really be nice to be able to save metadata and other 
> > > export
> > > presets, to avoid having to make the same choices every time an image
> > > is exported from GIMP.
> > >
> > > Several suggestions regarding the export dialog were made in an
> > > earlier thread:
> > > http://gimp.1065349.n5.nabble.com/Useability-enhancement-request-unified-expanded-file-export-dialog-td44924.html
> >
> > I'll read this later. This said, just skimming through the first 
> > email,
> > I see you are also mixing filetype-specific and generic options. So 
> > for
> > reminder, this spec will only discuss generic options (working across
> > file types) as well as the way to manage specific options (without 
> > going
> > into their contents).
>
> Several people offered a diverse set of suggestions. I haven't reread
> the thread to see what might count as filetype vs generic options. But
> some of the suggestions are already in the wireframe.
>
> > All supported formats being handled as plugins and not in the core of
> > the codebase is — I believe — an important feature since it allows to
> > add new format support very easily.
>
> Elle
>
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