Re: [way offtopic] Re: ugh, moore's "law"

[Lars Clausen <lrclause cs uiuc edu>]

On Fri, 23 Aug 2002, Jason Maiorana wrote:
> > Java has a bad reputation, it is not that slow.
> > Java is also fast enough.
>
> I use a few java programs. Proof is in the pudding. They are _*SLOW*_.
> (on both windows and linux, and the UI sucks on both. Java gui apps
> crawl and squirm, and they look nasty.)

I agree that the UI sucks.  I've tried it a few times, and it was
universally a horrible experience.  I use Java daily for non-UI things
(such as a on-line code generation and rewrite systems), and it's plenty
fast there.  I'm sure it would be faster with C or C++, but that would also
increase the dev time significantly, and that's my main worry here.

> Also, dev times are much more affected by individual programmer than
> by tool.

Not so -- think of the difference between assembly and C.  Or C and Perl
for text processing.  It's a combination, of course.  You can always come
up with an example where a particular language is better (except for some
of the nastier ones like Befunge:).  It also depends on quality of build
tools, quality of libraries, programmer experience with the language, focus
of the project, interoperability requirements etc etc etc.  The simple
answer is:  There is no simple answer.  Having a bunch of languages at your
beck and call is better than digging into a single one.

> > Slower languages such as C/C++ replaced faster assembly languages
> because
> > convenient development usually far outweighs the benifits.
>
> C++ can be faster than C code, and assembly is unwritable. Judicious
> use of templates is usally the key. Many C/C++ compilers could use
> work... but I think gcc3 is going to be fantastic.

I won't get into the whole C vs. C++ flame war.  I'll just repeat:  The
right tools for the job.  It may be speed, it may be simplicity, it may be
availability, it may be a dozen other reasons.  The world is never as
simple as /. pundits like to believe.

-Lars

-- 
Lars Clausen (http://shasta.cs.uiuc.edu/~lrclause)| Hårdgrim of Numenor
"I do not agree with a word that you say, but I   |----------------------------
will defend to the death your right to say it."   | Where are we going, and
    --Evelyn Beatrice Hall paraphrasing Voltaire  | what's with the handbasket?