Re: GNOME user survey 2011

On Mon, Aug 01, 2011 at 11:00:31AM +0300, Felipe Contreras wrote:
> On Mon, Aug 1, 2011 at 12:49 AM, Olav Vitters <olav vitters nl> wrote:
> > On Mon, Aug 01, 2011 at 12:16:54AM +0300, Felipe Contreras wrote:
> >> On Sun, Jul 31, 2011 at 11:14 PM, Olav Vitters <olav vitters nl> wrote:
> >> > On Sun, Jul 31, 2011 at 07:11:34PM +0300, Felipe Contreras wrote:
> >> >> It would be great if some sort of notification would popup directly on
> >> >> user's desktops, this way it can ensured that the maximum amount of
> >> >> people are notified. Otherwise, I think planet GNOME, reddit, twitter,
> >> >
> >> > That's impossible.
> >>
> >> Everything is possible.
> >>
> >> >> Google+ and so on should give plenty of feedback. Maybe also contact
> >> >> Ars Technica, LWN, Phornix, and so on would help.
> >> >
> >> > Those are only technical sites. I think the results are going to be
> >> > biased whatever you do.
> >>
> >> How do you suggest to reach the end users if you already dismissed a
> >> pop up directly from the desktop? If there isn't any way, at least
> >> it's better than nothing.
> >
> > I didn't dismiss. I said it was impossible to popup a notification.
> I already explained how it would be possible; you create a new package
> that checks for notifications on a server. And this new packages is
> added as a dependency on distro packages. Perfectly possible.

I guess you're talking about popping up a notification in future GNOME
versions? I was talking about existing desktops as various things in
your initial email indicated you wanted to ask existing people (the
GNOME version question + 2011 in the subject).

Note: I didn't see that explanation. Please just copy/paste when it is
clear I am not aware.

> >> >> === 03. How do you describe the amount of configurations available? ===
> >> >
> >> > I don't see the relevance of asking this. Furthermore the question is
> >> > suggestive. Seems more to prove a point than anything else.
> >>
> >> I do see the relevance, as I think it has been a big point of
> >> contention raised by many users.
> >
> > Something should be done with a survey. No matter the outcome of this
> > question, you won't be able to take these results and change things.
> >
> > Asking if people want more configuration options goes against why
> > options are removed. Ideally everything should happen automatically.
> >
> > I'm only interested in the cases where it doesn't work.
> I other words, you are saying that it doesn't matter if 100% of the
> responders of this survey say GNOME has too few options, nothing would
> be done? Is there *any* kind of evidence that would convince GNOME ppl
> that users want more options? Or is it what the wishes of users are
> completely irrelevant?

That doesn't reflect what I said. As such, the statement that nothing
would be done is not accurate. What I'd rather have is something like
  "Does GNOME do everything what you want to do?"
and then
  "not at all", "somewhat", "mostly", "everything"

then maybe a small textbox to indicate what it doesn't do... but that
would have to be analyzed (summarized) again.

> >> If you don't think it's very important, it could go to the end.
> >> Besides, if the results are overwhelmingly pointing to "Too few"?
> >> Don't you think it would be worth investigating? If the results end up
> >> being "Just enough", then no harm done.
> >
> > The question is suggestive so the results will be biased. It is better
> > to ask something like "does GNOME do what you want?" and then have a
> > text field where they can specify what GNOME lacks.
> Something like:
> === . In your opinion, which areas in GNOME need improvement? ===
> (matrix)
>   Columns: don't need / a little / some / much
>  + applications
>  + usability
>  + documentation
>  + configuration
>  + localization (translation)

The question already suggests that GNOME needs improvement. I rather
have non-suggestive questions. Further, I think 'applications' is vague.
I don't think many people will know which parts are GNOME and which
parts are not.

e.g. 'How happy are you with GNOME in regards to'

(happy is not as suggestive as you might think; though another word
might be better)

and then rephrase some of the items (usability -> ease of use;
localization -> available in your language; etc)

if we then get responses indicating 'very unhappy' then we know what to
work upon. Perhaps also something which indicates stability.. but then
explained in a simple way ('crashers' => bad).

> >> >> === 06. What channel(s) do you use to request help about GNOME (if any)? ===
> >> >
> >> > With what purpose is this asked? No support is given on GNOME Bugzilla.
> >> > Only minimal on gnome-list.
> >>
> >> It's important to have a two-way communication with the users, don't
> >> you think? So it's important to figure out what channels they actually
> >> use. In fact, I was thinking to add another question asking if they
> >> feel there's lack of communication with the team.
> >
> > I don't see giving support as:
> >  * something which shouldn't be done
> >  * two-way communication
> >  * a way that contributors communicate amongst each other
> >
> > However, we don't really give support. It would be nice to do more,
> > but.. it is not done that much (bit on IRC, mailing lists, some forums).
> > Though I'll say beforehand that I see support as separate from a
> > developer task.
> I still don't see any suggestions.

My suggestion is to remove the question.

> >> Resolving bugs is also support. But feel free to rephrase the question
> >> to find out how users provide any kind feedback; questions, bug
> >> reports, issues, etc.
> >
> > I again disagree. A support issue can be caused by a bug. Such a bug can
> > be a requirement to solve the support issue. But this doesn't mean
> > fixing bugs is support.
> It definitely is. When a product ends its support, it means bugs are
> not going to be fixed any more.

I already explained that support can mean bugs, but bugs doesn't mean
support. You're repeating what I said without addressing my suggestion.
does not imply
(bugs, support)

We do not really give support. However, a small amount of support is
given. E.g. in #gnome channel. Questions regarding how to use an applet,
evolution, set keyboard shortcuts and whatnot. No bugs (commits) for
GNOME 2.30 will be fixed anymore (though in practice they'll still be
fixed in the latest version), but that doesn't mean I won't answer
questions in #gnome anymore.

> It is important to know how many people actually use bugzilla, and how
> many people ask questions in IRC channels, mailing lists, etc.

With what purpose? What would GNOME get out of this information?

> Maybe:
> What channel(s) do you use to communicate with the GNOME team (if any)?

This doesn't reflect support anymore?

> >> > Things I'd like to know:

Other idea is asking which distribution they use. Might be handy as I
saw someone mention GNOME 3 is very crash prone and it should not be. We
might also get people who might think 'Unity' and 'KDE' == GNOME.
Perhaps ask what their desktop looks similar to with some example


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