Re: Some more thoughts on Java vs Mono debate

[Sean Middleditch <elanthis awesomeplay com>]

On Tue, 2004-03-30 at 10:42, Trent Lloyd wrote:

> It should be noted any windows compatibility stuff (like the WINE
> Windows.Forms implementation) would only run on x86

Why?  WineLib runs on a lot more than x86.

> 
> > The performance issues bother me, both .net and java people sound like
> > the (now defunct) OS world of microkernels "Its only 10% slower in our
> > carefully rigged demo not measuring system wide impact - but its worth
> > it". Native code may well solve this a JIT is unlikely to, however good.
> 
> I haven't done much or any real big applications in Mono, but it seems
> reasonably usable on my P166 laptop as mentioned above.
> 
> Most GNOME apps these days arent really usable at that speed tho, its
> sortof on the very borderline.

Things like speeding up the underlying toolkit/libraries or application
algorithms are going to have a much, much higher impact on performance
than *any* core-level language stuff.  The slowdowns from a poor
language implementation are pretty much unnoticeable in a GUI
application anyway.  Java has the perception of being slow not because
the language is slow, but because the standard Java GUI toolkits suck
like a cheerleader on prom night (my apologies to any cheerleaders
reading this).  You can write a high-quality 3D game engine (one of the
most performance-demanding classes of application there are) in Java
that's just as usable as one in C.  

We have tons of Python applications, applets, Nautilus/application
plugins, desklets, etc.  All of these perform very, very well.  Python
is a lot slower than Mono/JVM, even without JIT or AOT compilation. 
People who go complain that "Java/C# are too slow" and don't mind at all
when Python is proposed need to stop and think for a minute.

> Cheers,
> Trent
-- 
Sean Middleditch <elanthis awesomeplay com>
AwesomePlay Productions, Inc.