Re: [Usability] Keyboard prefs, layouts tab

[Joachim Noreiko <jnoreiko yahoo com>]

--- Matthew Paul Thomas <mpt myrealbox com> wrote:

> On Mar 29, 2006, at 7:47 PM, Joachim Noreiko wrote:
> >
> > --- Matthew Paul Thomas <mpt myrealbox com> wrote:
> > ...
> >> Absolutely. What is the list for? Windows has a
> list labelled
> >> "Installed keyboard languages and layouts". I can
> kind of understand
> >> that, though it seems to be to do with disk space
> rather than 
> >> utility. Mac OS X has a list "Select the keyboard
> layouts,
> >> input methods, and palettes that appear in the
> input menu". I can
> >> understand that, though it's a bit wordy. But
> what is "Selected 
> >> layouts" good for?
> > ...
> > As far as I can tell, the topmost one is the
> default. The order in the 
> > list affects how they cycle
> 
> Is it really necessary to determine in which order
> they cycle? I'm 
> trying to imagine a use case where doing that would
> save you noticable 
> time.

Since underlying X issues that we can do nothing about
limit us to 4 layouts, no, the order in which they
cycle is practically irrelevant.

> 
> I ask because if it isn't necessary, this interface
> can become both 
> simpler and more efficient: instead of having a
> separate "Choose A[sic] 
> Layout" dialog, the list of available layouts can be
> *this* list in the 
> Keyboard Preferences window itself, with a checkbox
> for each layout 
> determining whether it appears in the menu.

The layouts selection dialog shows you the diagram of
the keyboard.
This has problems of its own: the dialog is as big as
it can be, but the diagram is too small to be useful.
http://bugzilla.gnome.org/show_bug.cgi?id=335836
The only thing I can think of for this would be to
allow dialog boxes to have two minimum sizes, one for
640x480 displays, and one for everyone else.
Can anyone think of a better and more elegant way to
fix this?


> > with you press keys defined elswhere.
> 
> Where's "elsewhere"? :-) I can't find it anywhere.

Of course not!
It's the amazingly named 'Group Shift/Lock behavior'
option in the next tab.
No, *nothing* in this label indicates is has anything
to do with layouts, unless you happen to know what
some kinds of layouts are called 'groups'.
Once again, AFAIK, this text is determined by X, not
GNOME. So we're stuck with it.

> > ...
> > When you add more than one layout, you have no
> indication of which is 
> > active, unless you know how to add the indicator
> to the panel 
> > yourself. This is a major usability problem, and
> the maintainer 
> > doesn't want to fix it (Pseudobug: Waiting For
> Godot).
> > ...

Update on this: Vuntz tells me that he plans to work
on stuff in panels that would allow a button in this
pref tool 'Add keyboard indicator to the panel'. 
This would be a good stopgap until the new
notification architecture comes in & the applet moves
to the notification area.


> This bug is also what makes the list nearly
> impossible to label. If you 
> could guarantee that having more than one label
> selected resulted in 
> the keyboard layout menu appearing on the panel,
> then the list could be 
> labelled "Show these layouts in the keyboard menu:".
> If you could 
> guarantee that the keyboard combo for cycling was
> the same, the list 
> could be labelled "Ctrl+Space cycles between these
> keyboard layouts:", 
> though the former would be better following the
> HIG's advice on modes.

Would 'Use these layouts' do?

We're limited to the choice of keys by X...

So basically, a lot of our problems with this pref
tool, and with keyboard layouts in general, are down
to problems in X.
Remind me, someone, what are the *advantages* of using X?


		
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