Re: Please participate in OpenFormula! First issue: Where should the mailing list be?

[Niklas Nebel <Niklas Nebel Sun COM>]

Jody Goldberg wrote:
> > From my point of view, to complement the OpenDocument specification in 
> > a useful way, what we need is something that's confined to the file 
> > format. It would probably include the general formula syntax, a list of 
> > function names, but not much more.
>
> That seems like a fairly vacuous result.  What is the utility in
> knowing that there is an ADDRESS function without knowing that it
> will have the same calling convention and results ?

Expressing intent. The order of a function's parameters would need to be 
specified, but not the details about its results. Just like in a word 
processing document, where the file format says nothing about where on a 
page a single word will appear. It only stores the logical structure. 
For interoperability, similar-looking layout results are important, but 
that's a separate issue, not part of the file format.

> I'd rather see a more long term goal of providing a specification
> to help us improve interoperability.  The vast majority of existing
> spreadsheets are from MS Excel and can not be changed.  For any
> other product to compete or replace it will require us to calculate
> the same results given the same input files.  We either standardize
> on semantics and and names that are different than XL and add ever
> more complex translations on import and export, or we codify the
> already existing behaviors for the majority case and fix our apps.
>
> The former does not seem likely to succeed.

If there is a requirement of "the same results", that doesn't leave much 
room for calling things like non-existing dates, rounding in value 
comparisons, or conversion from text or boolean to numbers 
"implementation specific".

In fact, a specification that says "the same results as Excel" doesn't 
add much value at all. Today, Excel interoperability is already a goal, 
but complete compatibility isn't reached by any application. With such a 
specification, OpenFormula compliance will be a goal that nobody 
completely achieves. So what is gained?

A shared file format (syntax) for formulas would be useful on its own, 
allowing one to express "this is a sum of those cells", whatever an 
application considers a sum.

An "Excel calculation documentation project" would be useful, too, no 
question.

But those two things are separate, and there's no point in mixing them 
together.

And, I keep repeating myself, these issues need to be sorted out first. 
Call this a meta argument, but discussing about schedules and standards 
bodies, or details like calculation order and date formats, is a waste 
of time as long as nobody knows what the whole effort is all about.

Niklas