Re: Web browser tabs, panel position, icons in the overview and a few more things.

[William Jon McCann <william jon mccann gmail com>]

Hi,

On Fri, Nov 27, 2009 at 2:36 PM, Ivan Denker <airsnail gmail com> wrote:
> I'm getting comfortable in the shell, liking it more and more and missing
> the taskbar less and less. But that's partly because most of my time is
> spent in Google Chrome, where I use its tab bar much like I used to use the
> taskbar. I worry that Chrome, and web browsers in general, still don't feel
> to me like they fit well in the shell.

Glad to hear you are enjoying the Shell.

> With Chrome, the primary difficulty for me is having the panel on the top.
> Chrome works best without a top panel so the tabs can run along the edge of
> the screen, which is not possible with the shell. There are a number of
> reasons given in the design doc for putting the panel on top, and my
> understanding is that the notifications are going to be on the bottom. But I
> wonder it it would be possible to integrate notifications into the panel
> (there's lots of space, even if controls for maximized windows were added)
> and give at least the option of locating the panel on the bottom. I
> understand that a consistent interface is a priority and this is likely too
> fundamental to make a preference, but I myself don't see many drawbacks.
> More fundamentally, on the topic of web browsing itself, not just Chrome, I
> wonder whether there is any discussion about integrating web pages into the
> shell's window management, whether with a tabless browser (using Epiphany?)
> or by somehow presenting tabs in the overview. Many of the applications I
> use often are on the web, which means that they are trapped inside my
> browser, where I can't manage them using the shell like I can local apps. I
> think it would be great if the shell made no distinction between Gmail and
> Evolution, or Banshee and Pandora. Tabs may make sense in an app like a text
> editor or terminal, but they don't seem so useful anymore with a web browser
> given all the various things that they now contain, both documents and apps.
> For what it's worth, no graphical shell right I've yet seen seems to resolve
> this well. Having the browser button open a launch page might work, but
> could the overlay handle the number of tabs people often have open
> currently? Maybe if people learned to trust that their history was easily
> searchable and browsable, and their programs were state-less then they
> wouldn't leave so many tabs open.

I actually agree with a lot of this.  I'll try to list some items:
 * make a distinction between web apps and web pages/documents
 * allow the shell search to find open tabs
 * allow the shell search to find tab history
 * allow tabs to be found just as documents are - visually
 * allow alt-tab switching between the last two things I was doing -
regardless of whether they are tabs or windows or apps
 * easily support side-by-side viewing of tabs
 * allow tabs that are applications to do windowy things like ask for
your attention
 * have a way to mark things as needing attention later - add to a to
view list (this is why i have dozens of tabs open usually)
 * etc

So yeah let's do it.  But first we have to figure out how.  We need to
work on the design for how all this would fit in.  Any ideas?

> And a few more unrelated comments and questions:
> I really like the alt-tab switcher, especially that it doesn't switch
> windows as you tab, which can create a lot of flashing, and that it uses
> icons not windows, icons often being more recognizable than thumbnails. That
> use of icons makes me wonder whether there are plans to associate icons with
> apps in the overlay mode, whether on the thumbnail or attached to the
> caption.

In the Activities Overview?  I'm not sure what you mean actually.  The
idea for now is that apps look like apps look like apps.  I mean the
thing in the app well looks like the thing in the "more" selection,
looks like the thing in the search results, looks sorta like the thing
in the application switcher, and looks vaguely like the thing in the
application menu (but is more different than the others).

Other than that I want to limit use of the application icon.  The
window selector should be about the window contents.

> Will the status icons for network connection and wifi and such be made into
> native panel applets, with menus that look and slide like the calendar?

Yes, eventually.  I think we want the status items to look and behave
like the rest of the top bar items.

> Are there plans to make the full width of the category names in the overview
> clickable, not just the little arrow on the right?

Not the full width but a larger area than just the arrow.  But we'll see.

> How about having a place to drag stuff to, a kind of shelf, whether for
> documents or parts of a web page or what not? This might be part of the
> sidebar, or maybe another hot corner. I imagine dragging a photo from a
> browser there, then switching to another page and dragging the photo onto
> it. Perhaps cases like that one are beyond the responsibilities or abilities
> of the shell, though.

There will certainly be some discussion around this issue while we
figure out how to marry nautilus and the shell.  I can't really say
where we'll end up yet.

> And, finally, is there any consideration of allowing the panel to autohide?
> Since most of the action is in the two hot corners, I can imagine being
> happy with autohide (especially if the panel only appeared when a hot corner
> was hit, which might solve my problem with Google Chrome).

I'm not sure.  I think autohiding does limit the effectiveness of
almost everything that is in the top bar.  The hot corner wouldn't
work very well or would be triggered accidentally too often I think.

> Hope this is the sort of feedback that is useful, and thanks for your work.

Great feedback!

Thanks,
Jon