Re: Spanish Gnome Translation Project publishes GR about Rossetta

["Francisco Javier F. Serrador" <serrador tecknolabs com>]

El lun, 20-12-2004 a las 13:32 -0600, Daniel Espinosa escribió:
> Then...
> 
> Is Rosetta a usefull tool?

It depends on your objectives. 

The Spanish team objective is giving Gnome a professional quality
localization to Spanish language, so it can compete against Windows at
the same level.

That means that we are focusing in ways to attract professional
translators to Gnome, so that they can bring new blood to our
localization process and give us feedback to improve our work.

Rossetta actually doesn't fulfill our requirements for technical
reasons, because of it lack of features. For example, now anyone can
input a wrong translation or correct a translation if he has enough
Karma. 

Another problematic issue is translation overwriting. A developer can
inadvertently replace a good translation with another not-so-good
translation for a particular language.

All this points that it can be problematic a wide adoption of Rossetta
as a standard, as it is immature for our needs.

Another issue we can argue, is that Rossetta is closed source. It is a
web service, but it could be nicer to allow us to hack code into it. I
think that we must use a completely free software translation process. 

Carlos, by the way thinks different than me (and others) in that point,
but he is one of Rossettas developers.

> 
> Will it be powerfull to other translators?

Maybe, just think about what objectives do you want for your particular
translation project, and if depending in a non-free tool meets your way
of thinking about software.

> 
> Can be use as a web tool only in other projects? As
> for as, we need this kind of application to have
> contributors in an specific language (like native
> mexican languages) in an easy to use tool...

There is no other way to use it.
You can use Rossetta to have a Desktop translated, but I think that it
is not enough.
 
> 
> I've contribute with the es_MX translation of GConf
> (100% now), but this work will be mirrored to the
> project manteiner?

Currently I think Gnome must establish a general policy, not allowing
developers to import translations from Rossetta directly, but allowing
translation teams to use Rossetta if they think it can be useful. 


> 
>  --- "Francisco Javier F. Serrador"
> <franciscojavier fernandez serrador hispalinux es>
> escribió: 
> > El sáb, 18-12-2004 a las 14:11 +0100, Carlos Perelló
> > Marín escribió:
> > > Dude, only YOU agreed on that so please DON'T use
> > the "Spanish GNOME
> > > Translation Project" name until most of them agree
> > on it because none in
> > > the mailing list said that they agree at this
> > moment.
> > Concerning our organization:
> > 
> > We are a few people, but not only me. People who I
> > would liked to hear
> > more about, Pablo, German, Lucas, they post on the
> > list occasionally.
> > 
> > > 
> > > As I told you in the Spanish mailing list, your
> > claim is wrong because
> > > Rosetta is only a Web service and as such, could
> > have any free software
> > > license and you will not be able to get it because
> > it's not being
> > > redistributed at all.
> > 
> > Concerning GPL...
> > 
> > I'm sure you know that GPL v2 dates from 1991, when
> > web services were
> > not used widespread, and GPL v3 will deal with web
> > services when
> > released. Making a proprietary approach with
> > Rossetta and the rest of
> > Canonical's  platform makes me think it's almost
> > unethical.
> > 
> > By the other way, GPL v2 talks about not only public
> > release, but "for
> > private use". I understand that being Rossetta
> > available from Internet
> > to use, it is not "private use".
> > 
> > 
> > Concerning the Project...
> > 
> > Rossetta can bypass the localization groups already
> > established, so
> > Gnome developers must be warned when there is a
> > localization group which
> > is not going to use this tool. 
> > 
> > Concerning Carlos...
> > 
> > I'm sure you will continue with your work at i18n
> > team with the status
> > pages. This issue is about Canonical business model,
> > so please don't
> > take it like a personal revenge against you. I'm
> > pretty sure you know
> > (as me) what Free Software is and the way we work. 
> >  
> > > Also, in case there is any doubt, I want to say
> > that I'm still working
> > > and maintaining http://l10n-status.gnome.org not
> > as fast as I would wish
> > > but Rosetta does not affects that tool at all.
> > > 
> > > Cheers.
> > > 
> > > On Fri, 2004-12-17 at 19:26 +0100, Francisco
> > Javier F. Serrador wrote:
> > > > Hi everybody.
> > > > 
> > > > After the Ubuntu conference that took place at
> > Mataro, and after some
> > > > discussion about Rosetta, we have concluded the
> > following:
> > > > 
> > > > - Some of our current needs are:
> > > >   - Quality Control over the translation process
> > > >   - Quality Assurance for the desktop
> > > >   - Enhanced methods for error detection
> > > >   - Enhanced Memory Translation Management
> > > >   - Immediate testing on the application
> > > >   - Terminology management
> > > >   - Integrated documentation translation
> > management
> > > >   - Develop a set of free software applications
> > to manage our
> > > > translation project.  
> > > > 
> > > > 
> > > > So, presented the current facts we, the Spanish
> > Gnome Translation
> > > > Project, publish the following GENERAL
> > RESOLUTION:
> > > > 
> > > > 1.- Rossetta licensing is not clear, so we
> > cannot approve the inclusion
> > > > of a non-GPL tool in our translation work until
> > Rossetta is released
> > > > under a GPL-compatible license. We currently
> > have enough proprietary
> > > > translation memory tools to accomplish this job
> > better than with
> > > > Rossetta. 
> > > > 
> > > > 2.- Rosetta still is too inmature and is not a
> > suitable tool for our
> > > > current needs, so the project will NOT adopt
> > Rossetta in its current
> > > > state and will not integrate it in our
> > translation process.
> > > > 
> > > > We as free software contributors, hope that
> > Rossetta will be finally
> > > > released under the terms of the GPL license (or
> > equivalent). Until that
> > > > moment we discorage the use of this tool, or any
> > further support and
> > > > concentrate in bringing up Free Software
> > Translation tools.
> > > > 
> > > > Francisco Javier F. Serrador
> > > > Gnome-l10n-project.
> > > > 
> > > > 
> > > > _______________________________________________
> > > > gnome-i18n mailing list
> > > > gnome-i18n gnome org
> > > >
> > http://mail.gnome.org/mailman/listinfo/gnome-i18n
> > > _______________________________________________
> > > gnome-i18n mailing list
> > > gnome-i18n gnome org
> > > http://mail.gnome.org/mailman/listinfo/gnome-i18n
> > -- 
> > 
> > _______________________________________________
> > gnome-i18n mailing list
> > gnome-i18n gnome org
> > http://mail.gnome.org/mailman/listinfo/gnome-i18n
> >  
> 
> =====
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
> Trabajar es la mejor arma para tu superación.
> 
> _________________________________________________________
> Do You Yahoo!?
> La mejor conexión a internet y 2GB en tu buzón de Correo Yahoo! por $100 al mes. http://net.yahoo.com.mx
> _______________________________________________
> gnome-i18n mailing list
> gnome-i18n gnome org
> http://mail.gnome.org/mailman/listinfo/gnome-i18n
--