Re: OO as GNOME software (topic change)

[Havoc Pennington <hp redhat com>]

Sam TH <sam uchicago edu> writes: 
> That sounds like including OpenOffice to me.  Am I just confused?

We thought it would be fine to include it. I don't think the
OpenOffice team has actually made any attempt to be included yet.
 
> Ok, here's another example.  Keith Packard has on his TODO list (I
> think he's kidding about this, but still) making twm GNOME/KDW WM
> compliant.  At that point, twm would be about as far towards meeting
> your three criteria as OpenOffice is now (or as KDevelop is now, as
> Seth pointed out).  Would it make the cut?

For the "core desktop" no, but we don't have any office suites there
either. But I would have no problem with twm in the extra apps release
or something.

But I think it's kind of academic; it's not like Keith will want twm
in there. Really the most important criterion of all is that the
maintainer wants to actually worry about making our deadlines and
doing the work to be in the release. And that the maintainer is doing
a good job making a useful app, fixing bugs, etc.
 
> Well, I meant "applications" in the "not including libraries" sense
> (it would be hard to use GTK in libxml).
> 
> And Nautilus uses the rendering engine from Mozilla, not the GUI,
> right?  So all the widgets on screen are still GTK widgets?

Except the ones in web pages, sure.
 
> Well, I hope you aren't accusing me of NIH syndrome, given where I
> come to this debate from.  AbiWord is just as much NIH as OpenOffice.
> But we've put in lots of work to interoperate with GNOME, to have the
> GNOME look and feel, etc.  

No, I'm not accusing you of anything, just pointing out that rewriting
every piece of code on earth isn't really the goal of GNOME, when we
can avoid it. And there's also room for using a short-term solution
even if you are rewriting over the long term.

> 
> NIH is bad.  But interface consistency in project that's about
> "usability for free software operating systems" is good.  
>            

I agree, but as soon as we make "all stuff we think is good must be
implemented" a criterion we are going to have a big shortage of
apps. ;-)

Yes I agree OpenOffice would be nicer if it used GTK, I'm not sure
that means we should boycott it.

Havoc