Re: Proposal for File-Selection Dialog

[sml13 cornell edu]

On Mon, 21 Dec 1998, Tom Vogt wrote:

>  Justin Ross <opiskin@hotmail.com> wrote:
>  > >Will all Gnome compliant window manager be required to recognize the
>  > >idea of a desktop?
>  > It seems a general enough phenomenon in GUI environments that they
>  > should.  I don't know if they need to, though.
> 
>  whoops? I always thought the "desktop" is the desperate try of single-user
>  operation systems to have something that resembles the home directory
>  system? I haven't yet noticed a "desktop" or a "my computer" or similiar
>  useless items on any unix system (that is: aix, digital, solaris or Linux) I
>  have used.

<flamebait> Maybe that is why every UNIX with the exception of Linux is 
declining in market share: http://www.softwaremag.com/Sept98/sm098ed.htm

If Gnome aims to bring an easy-to-use, intuitive graphical shell to 
Linux, I don't think prior Unices are the model to follow.  Scott 
McNealy, Lew Platt, Jim Clark, etc. aren't exactly the gurus when it 
comes to ease-of-use.
</flamebait>

I think the optimal approach would be to have the icon behavior be the 
default, which could then be shut off by old Unix farts who loath icons 
and the like.  That way, your grandma could still get that warm, fuzzy 
feeling when she sees the cute little icon of the desktop...but you can 
feel secure in seeing your /usr/people/harryunixuser.  The best of both 
worlds, no?

Remember our role as "cherry pickers

"The Linux community is very willing to copy features from other OS's if
it will serve their needs. Consequently, there is the very real long term threat
that as MS expends the development dollars to create a bevy of new features in NT,
Linux will simply cherry pick the best features an incorporate them into 
their codebase."

	-- Vinod Valloppillil (VinodV@microsoft.com, vinod@vinod.com, 
http://www.vinod.com), Sr. Microsoft Engineer, "Halloween II" 
(http://www.opensource.org/halloween2.html)

> 
>  > >I really don't like the desktop icon, I would prefer a cool looking
>  > >tilde. After all if you are refering to /home/<user> as the desktop,
>  > >then why not use the tilde -- its been that way for years.
>  >
>  > You and I know what a tilde represents, but my grandma thinks only
>  > Spanish-speaking people use them.  The icon, or some icon like it,
>  > reinforces the metaphor of the desktop.
> 
>  people who are going to use a new operating system are more than willing to
>  learn a couple of new things. all it needs is to give them the chance and
>  make it easy. so if they move the mouse over the ~, a tooltip should say
>  "home directory".
> 

Tilde is very non-intuitive if you don't come from a Unix background and 
have no desire to learn the filesystem.  The Unix filesystem is very 
consistent and (arguably) intuitive once you take the time to learn it, 
but most people don't give a shit about such things.  Only geeks like you 
and I would take the time to learn that ~ = homedir, /var/log = 
logfiledir, /etc = configdir, /usr/X11R6/lib = x lib dir, etc...

>  contrary to public fud, unix principles are far from hard to grasp. I've by
>  now installed Linux systems for several people with zero unix knowledge and
>  sometimes zero computer knowledge and none of them have any problems with
>  concepts like home directories, and learning that ~ is an abbreviation for
>  that is memorized instantly.

I am highly skeptical that this is generally the case.

> 
> 
>  > >I really do not like the Windows way of putting my computer under the
>  > >desktop.  The computer should the top of the hierarchy, with desktop
>  > >(or $HOME) in the correct location under the proper storage device.
>  >
>  > I like the mac way of doing it.  Removable media automatically appear on
>  > the desktop, and so do network links.  These items then appear at the
>  > top of file-selection dialog file lists.
> 
>  make that configurable, PLEASE! I can see the points for the mac's way, but
>  I know at least one person (me) that hates it when the machine does
>  something on it's own without me having it told to.
> 

Let's make it configurable, so not everyone has to do it _your_ way.  
That way, UNIX geeks and grandmothers can live in harmony!

shane

> 
> -- 
> Those who do not understand Unix are condemned to reinvent it, poorly.
> 		-- Henry Spencer
> 
> 
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