Re: What I'm doing

[Tom Vogt <tom lemuria org>]

Dan Effugas Kaminsky <effugas@best.com> wrote:
> >true. I've already proposed what I consider a good AND easy-enough-for-the-
> >simple-user solution to this. scream if you missed it and I'll post it
> >again.
>
> You know what?  I must have missed it.  All I remember was that bit about
> "system apps going into system, and user apps going into user, and the user
> being able to specify exactly what subfolders stuff goes into" and then me
> saying "Uh, that's what happens on windows basically and users just don't
> specify the subfolders, we NEED to have detailed defaults."

looks like you  got parts of it. the fancy thing  was that for once there's
quite a difference to windoze, because there is a  user-created structure,
not just one  big  "program" menu  where every install thing dumps its
icons.
second, true to my "in your face" attitude, the user should be shown the
obvious place where he can configure his stuff in a very simple way. see, I
know most users won't touch a thing if it requires even the least amount of
thinking. so what they'll get is a dialog that gives them a handful of very
simple choices, plus an option to get into in-depth ("advanced")
configuration.
classification of apps will be done using the keywords from the Linux
software map (lsm files).  there should be a default configuration that
shows some of the possibilities AND is useful to the vast majority of people
(for example having games and apps in seperate folders is useful to almost
everyone except those people who don't have a single game (I don't think
there are pure gamers on Linux already).


> >> I'd say *many* more users are pissed off about every time they modify a
> >> system setting, they have to reboot.
> >
> >ditto - true, but not a problem on unix.
> 
> Yes, but it's a style issue.  Remember:  Gnome GUI shouldn't really be tied
> to Linux, Unix, or anything.  It's worth it to say "Reboot modalities suck
> ass".

I don't think it's a style issue. any, and I mean ANY, user-level stuff that
requires a reboot is a big, fat bug. simple as that. the uptime of the
machine I'm writing this on is at (shell) 122 days now. I'm NOT going to
reboot for ANY application, no matter what it is. that's not a style issue,
it's a question of whether you're writing unix or windoze apps.

(actually, I know one unix app that requires reboots. it tweaks solaris
kernel parameters, that's why. and I DO consider that bad behaviour
nevertheless.)


> >but those are the BACKGROUNDS. better coding brings more stability, more
> >elegance makes better coding easier and leads to things like dynamic
> >changing of  settings (i.e. no reboots). greater freedom  has brought us
> the
> >most powerful (gnu) tools. and years and years of research are what makes
> >things  like tex possible in the first place.
> >
> >sure people don't care about that. but it's necessary groundwork for the
> >things they DO care about.
> 
> This is true.  But we can't advertise or brag about the backgrounds.
> "Thirty years?  Old technology, so what.  OH!  IT NEVER REBOOTS!  KILLER!"

of course we can. main marketing rule: you can advertise ANYTHING. :)

it's a question of how you do it.



--
Those who do not understand Unix are condemned to reinvent it, poorly.
		-- Henry Spencer