Re: GNOME and Lampadas

On Thu, Jul 11, 2002 at 11:30:53PM -0500, Eric Baudais wrote:
> First of all I'm not really comfortable talking about these plans which
> directly affect the GDP privately.  Therefore I'm mailing the doc list
> so other people can also comment.
> On Thu, 2002-07-11 at 22:10, John Fleck wrote:
> > David -
> > I'm on vacation, so I'm not in a position to do anything 'til the
> > weekend at the earliest, but I'll forward this to Eric.
> > Cheers,
> > John
> > 
> > On Wed, 2002-07-10 at 19:59, David Merrill wrote:
> > > Greetings,
> > > 
> > > I want to begin work on GNOME support in Lampadas. I need for you to
> > > help me get an environment set up for doing that. We will need someone
> > > from the GNOME team to manage the actual GNOME data, because I can't
> > > do that and develop as well. Consider it a pilot project, so we can
> > > put up a demo of Lampadas running the GDP. I believe that right now
> > > Lampadas is very near to having all of the features you want, and if
> > > we start getting a GDP installation going now, I will be polishing
> > > things up while you're getting the data together, and you can launch
> > > officially at the time we go to beta, which is in only three weeks.
> I'd be willing to manage the GNOME data.  I'll be trying to get some
> space on one of the GNOME servers to set Lampadas up.  There are a
> couple things I'll need to know first.  What exactly does Lampadas need
> in terms of server requirements?  I know it needs an account in Apache,
> but other than that what else does Lampadas need?  Are there any
> requirements for Lampadas to work with the GNOME CVS server?  This
> weekend I intend to read that developer documentation you pointed to in
> your previous emails.

Apache and PostgreSQL or MySQL. MySQL has never been tested, but
Python abstracts the DB so I don't expect any major problems. And
mod_python. The INSTALL file lists all the utilities is calls on --
there are quite a few of them. All are readily available, and you
probably have most or all of them already installed.

The CVS support is not yet implemented in Lampadas. I need a test CVS
server to develop against and don't have one yet. But even without it
it would do the stuff the DocTable was doing.

> > > I am not a believer in spec everything out. I believe in incremental
> > > development. This approach will make sure that the system is
> > > everything you want it to be. If we wait until all is implemented, you
> > > will not be as happy as you will with what is basically a
> > > GDP-optimized system.
> > >
> > > Have you taken a look at the demo site? It has no real documents, but
> > > has almost complete meta-data support, which is what you're looking
> > > for anyway. If you can, help get some GDP people to give it a serious
> > > review, so I know what they think of it and in what areas is falls
> > > short of GDP needs.
> First, I think we need to define what we want exactly from Lampadas. 
> Since no one has commented on my goals for the Lampadas, except the goal
> of working well with CVS from John, I'm going to assume those goals are
> what the GDP really wants.
> >From those goals I think we want a more specific categories.  I think
> these categories should follow those which are being set by Eugene for
> inclusion into Scrollkeeper.  Perhaps they could be expanded a bit more
> if need be.  It would be nice if categories could be added.  The
> categories for GNOME have changed multiple times and I doubt this recent
> change will be the last.

I can import the ScrollKeeper categories so you can work with them.

> The ISDN number isn't needed.  I don't think we will track the book's
> ISDN.  There was once an offer to write a book for GNOME 1.4 by the GDP,
> but that never materialized.  The vast majority of the GNOME
> documentation is not in book form and we don't use the ISDN number for
> any type of metadata.

For now, ignore the field. The next release will replace the current
code with a templating system for forms, so you can design forms that
look just how you want them. This first release, all you can do is
move the forms around, but you cannot actually edit them w/o editing
the code itself.

> What exactly is the difference between the Home URL, the URL, and the
> document files?  I think the GDP needs the document files to define all
> the files related to the specific documentation.  I think the GDP needs
> a URL if the documentation is on the web.  The Home URL could be used
> for the location of the document in CVS using LXR.  That is similar to
> what the old GDP DocTable used to do.  I'm not sure this is the best
> solution though.

Those are old LDPDB fields which you won't be using. Home URL is where
the author publishes the doc, outside of the LDP. The document files
are the individual files in the CVS tree that make up the document.

> One format for the document files which is very common in GNOME is
> HTML.  It is the default format which we convert our source XML files
> into.  This needs to be added.

The "format" field in Lampadas is used for the source file only. It is
assumed that all sources can and will be converted into html, ps, pdf,

> What is a tickle date?

A reminder date. It is for an author/editor/manager. It tells you that
you're supposed to check up on the document at that date. For example,
when I send out a letter to an author, I set the tickle date and write
a note that I'm waiting on a reply. When that date comes, I check the
doc and am reminded that I'm still waiting, so I can follow up on it.

> We need to have a bit more information about the license for each
> document.  We need to know the version of the license and the holder of
> the rights to the license.


> We need to two descriptions of the document.  The first description is a
> one line description and the other description is the abstract already
> in Lampadas.

Lampadas will populate the abstract field with the contents of
<abstract> if it's a DocBook or LinuxDoc document. I will add an
additional field for you to put your own shorter description.

> The main goal for tweaking the fields is to generate the OMF files
> automatically from an entry in Lampadas.  This OMF file would be
> included in the document files section of the document entry in
> Lampadas.  The OMF file is used by Scrollkeeper to register the document
> locally in the user's system.

Right. I know a bit about OMF. The LDPDB generates OMF automatically
but I still need to port the code over to Lampadas.

> > > BTW, the next big feature to be implemented will be the translation
> > > synchronization and management feature. We want to eat our own
> > > dogfood, and use it to manage translations of Lampadas strings. I
> > > think this would help the GDP to coordinate translations effortlessly.
> Yes, that would help us a lot.  Hopefully translators can see how much
> of the document has been translated and the this feature can interact
> with the CVS server so a translator only needs to commit the translation
> to CVS and Lampadas would automatically update the translation status.

That's the idea.

David C. Merrill               
Linux Documentation Project                   david lupercalia net
Lead Developer                       

In honor of the death of Bohemia an impromptu salon will
commence immediately following dinner... Mimi Marquez,
clad only in bubble wrap, will perform her famous lawn
chair-handcuff dance to the sounds of iced tea being stirred.
	-- RENT

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