Re: [gdm-list] BORDER element in the greeter.dtd

[Brian Cameron <Brian Cameron Sun COM>]

Dave:

> Your welcome, updating the file allowed me to get a better understanding 
> of the xml behind the themed greeter.  I did run the existing themes 
> through the xmllint with the new dtd file.  The Happygnome-list has one 
> error in it which is easily fixed.  All of the other themes checked out 
> OK.  I'll update the Happygnome-list theme and upload the corrected xml 
> file to bugzilla.

Great.  Thanks for doing this.  It is easier for people to get involved
when the documentation is quality.

> > I would love for someone to be more involved in this area of the code.
> > I'm a bit unsure, though, about what you are wanting to maintain. Are
> > you wanting to maintain just the existing themes, or also related
> > gdmgreeter maintenance and enhancements. For example, do you plan on
> > enhancing the theme to have new keys/elements and then updating the
> > gdmgreeter source code to have those new enhancements?
>
> My intention was to maintain the greeter.dtd file and any changes, 
> updates or creation of the themes.  Although I can read code and 
> understand what the majority of it is doing, I am not capable of 
> maintaining the greeter application itself. 

That's perfect.  As we are discussing, there are plenty of areas
where the code, documentation, and existing themes could be
improved.  There are also many themes at http://art.gnome.org/
that might be appropriate to integrate into GDM, though many themes
there do not have the minimal set of features that a theme needs
to have (e.g. many themes there don't have both pam-message and
pam-error text fields, which really are both needed).  It would
be good to update the best themes there and get them into GDM.
Note that only themes that are reasonably licensed to allow
people to distribute and modify the theme should be considered.

> /*>1) The DTD probably should contain more comments explaining how to
> > actually define a theme, and the existing docs in docs/C/gdm.xml
> > are poor. Although the docs do list out what the different tags
> > and elements means, there are not really many examples nor an
> > overview helping people know how to go about putting together a
> > theme.
>
> This is definitely an area I can help with.  Interestingly enough, I had 
> already planned on writing a how too for the GDM Themes but was unsure 
> of where it would best be posted.  Certainly examples in the dtd and the 
> docs would be the best place for it.  I'll have to go over the writing 
> standards for the GNOME docs.    I am also writing a GDM-Functional 
> reference for the Bluefish editor which should provide assistance to 
> users who use that editor.  I'm sure that I could port that functional 
> reference over to other editors if needed.

Excellent.  I would recommend reviewing the documentation in
docs/C/gdm.xml and I'm sure that the docs could be improved to help
people know how to go about writing themes, not just explaining the
tags and elements.

You can find the docs here online as well:

   http://www.gnome.org/projects/gdm/docs.html

> > 2) The existing themes could use some design love. As I've added new
> > features to the greeter.xml I add them as examples to the default
> > themes. This means that the default themes have two methods for
> > selecting language/session (the combobox and the dialog). Might
> > be better if different themes showed off different features?
>
> The existing themes were among the first resources I used to figure out 
> how the xml was structured.  I agree that the default themes can and 
> should be used as examples of how the gdm xml is used, and I would even 
> recommend that the comments in the default themes be expand to provide 
> an explanation of how to implement theme features.

That's a great idea.

> > Also I think the overall design of the existing default themes could
> > be improved and made to look nicer, more modern, etc.
>
> > 3) Add new themes. GDM could use some cooler more modern theming.
>
> This is certainly something I could sink my teeth into and would 
> consider it a challenge to come up with updates to the existing themes 
> and add a few new themes for a variety of looks (personal, professional, 
> technical, etc..).

I would appreciate any help here.  Even if you don't have an interest
in doing graphic design work, it might be easier to find volunteers to
help in this area by making images/SVG/etc. if there's someone doing the
xml work.

> Unfortunately, writing or maintaining the code at this point is beyond 
> my capabilities.  I would be more that happy to work with anyone 
> developing the code to provide a sounding board, ideas, or functional 
> recommendations, but couldn't actually put together any working code. 
> (sorry)

No worries.  If you find that you want to dig into this code and need
help understanding how to make changes here, I'd be happy to help.

> > As I said, I'd be curious to know more specifically what you are interested
> > in doing. I'd recommend that if you put together some code that makes GDM
> > work better, submit it as an enhancement request to bugzilla.gnome.org in
> > the "gdm" category, and attach the patch. You can also send patches to
> > the gdm-list gnome org if that is easier for you. But it's good to track
> > changes in bugzilla.
>
> To wrap up.  I would like to maintain the greeter.dtd file and the 
> maintenance, update and addition of existing and new themes.  Updating 
> the online documentation and providing instructional comments in the dtd 
> file and the theme xml files is definitely an area I would be happy to 
> assist with. While I can not help write or maintain the code, I would be 
> able to provide assistance with whatever I could to the maintainer.

Great.  I'm excited to work with you, and welcome to the GDM team.  You
should add yourself to the AUTHORS file and include that in your next
patch you provide to bugzilla.

Brian