Re: Shelling Epiphany

[Alexandre Mazari <scaroo gmail com>]

Le vendredi 18 mars 2011 à 14:37 +0000, Allan Day a écrit :
> Alexandre Mazari wrote:
> > Hi Everyone,
> > 
> > I recently joined the Epiphany effort thanks to my awesome employer
> > letting me contribute to this lean and mean browser.
> 
> Whoop!
> 
> > I am particularly interested in the integration of the Web with the
> > desktop, and think ephy has strong advantages in that regard.
> > 
> > Indeed, being a non-multi-platform browser, ephy is free of the
> > constraints/compromises the others have to make in order to coherently
> > run in different environments. We should take this opportunity and go
> > wild on integration with gnome-shell and the Gnome 3 Desktop in general.
> > Really become "the Gnome Web Browser".
> 
> Couldn't agree more!
> 

Nice to read!

> > Obviously, the gnome-design team members have a clearer view on the kind
> > of global experience the desktop should offer to the user. Ephy being a
> > part of that whole, their input/directions is invaluable. There are
> > already some (controversial, see below) mock-ups regarding ephy in their
> > git repo. Lets build a stronger communication channel.
> 
> Definitely.
> 
> > Here are some ideas/user stories/brainfarts on how we could achieve such
> > a synergy. 
> > Feedback, comments, other ideas, even bashing, are welcome!
> 
> Boo to bashing, that's what I say.
> 
> > = Let the user use web-applications in the same way they use "native"
> > ones  =
> > The idea here is to make web applications first-class citizen of the
> > desktop. Those applications would benefits from the same integration
> > level that the "native" apps have:
> > • be launch-able in the overview app pane/dash
> > • have their window be manageable by g-s application switcher and
> > alt-tab switcher independently of ephy
> > • send notifications using the g-s notification area
> > • have nice icon badges for unread mails etc... (I think this feature is
> > planned in post-3.0 g-s)
> > • ...
> > Epiphany's role here would be to create/manage those webapps, actually
> > making a browsed site an application.
> 
> Yes! We spoke with the Epiphany crew about this at GUADEC...
> 
Cool. I have a lot to talk about with my fellow Igalians ! If you still
have memories about your conversations, do not hesitate to comment on
the related bug so we're all on the same page.

> > Also Ephy could be used to display those apps, with a streamlined
> > interface. Or a separate visor could be created.
> > see https://bugzilla.gnome.org/show_bug.cgi?id=644002
> 
> Perhaps. The shell might be able to do that work on its own.

Not sure the .desktop creation, favicon fetching and the (optional)
insertion in the packaging system is the responsability of the shell.
Not sure it is either Ephy's role. I personally favour a separate tool
(ala Fluid.app on osx) linked with Ephy by a small extension.
> 
> > = Let the user switch to a specific epiphany's opened site using g-s
> > facilities =
> > I am using the term site here, instead of tab, because it is not really
> > clear we should to keep the tabs management in ephy IMHO.
> > Tabs and notebooks are just a way to have application-local window
> > management, mostly duplicating wms/shells facilities, compensating for
> > their missing features (windows grouping for instance).
> > Re-giving that responsibility to the shell seems like a natural thing to
> > do, reducing the number of different ways to switch to a specific
> > site/app/context.
> > It seems the design team shares this opinion, as seen in
> > http://gitorious.org/gnome-design/gnome-design/blobs/raw/master/mockups/epiphany/epiphany2.png .
> 
> That particular design was my effort. I wouldn't say it was the view of
> the 'team' ;) (though one or two people did seem to like it). The way I
> left things, I was hoping for a prototype to do some user testing with.

You can test current epiphany without opening tabs, can't you ? :)

> (The design needs a lot more work, too.)

Keep the mockups coming !

>  That said, I'm of the opinion
> that tabs don't make a huge amount of sense in the context of the shell.
> 

I am of the opinion that'd require adding some kind of windows
grouping/tabbing ala fluxbox. Is it something you guys and girls
consider as fitting in g-s ? 
I'd love to work on such thing technically-wise. Maybe a shell extension
with some modification in mutter (for the tabbing decorations) would be
"enough" ? 
G-s already kinda groups the modal window with their parents so the
logic is mostly here, right ?

> > This idea being very controversial, going against years of tabbing
> > browsers usage, displaying ephy tabs contents in alt-tab switcher and/or
> > overview might be an intermediate solution.
> > Here is a quick and dirty mockup:
> > http://people.igalia.com/amazari/ephy-tabs-in-switcher.webm
> 
> I think one of the real shell designers should comment on this. It makes
> sense in one way, but it also breaks the convention that each of those
> thumbnails is a window.
> 

With windows-grouping that would work "for free", IMHO. But if the tabs
way is the way, then clearly your input will be appreciated. Notably
regarding scalability and readability/recognizability issues.
Technically-wise, that mean sub-classing/traiting GtkNotebook to make it
expose its children as X windows with a hint to avoid making them
composited in the overview, right ? 

> > = Let the user open a recently visited or a favourite site from g-s =
> > - integrate with the future g-s jump-lists
> > - make gnome-shell's search box access ephy bookmarks/history
> > - make gnome-shell's search box delegates to ephy if the entered text
> > looks like an URL
> 
> Including browser history makes a lot of sense. That history is noisy
> though: we'd need to be smart about how the history gets processed. We
> also need a way to present those search results. This is something to
> consider when the GS documents stuff is designed.

Absolutely. Is that something planned for the 3.0 timeframe or next
release ?

> 
> > = Make the user's experience coherent with the rest of the desktop =
> > - comply with http://live.gnome.org/ThreePointZero/AppIntegration
> > (notably regarding dialogs)
> 
> Yep.
> 
> > - use symbolic icons wherever possible, see
> > http://jimmac.musichall.cz/log/?p=974
> 
> Yep, see:
> 
> http://live.gnome.org/GnomeShell/Design/Whiteboards/SymbolicIcons
> 
> > - share data with the shell and other applications (Zeigeist ?
> > Tracker ?)
> 
> I guess this will largely depend on how the shell's document stuff gets
> implemented.
> 
> > - get the warning theme colours for the location entry in https mode
> > - ...
> 
> 
> > What do you think ?
> 
> That this is awesome. Integrating the shell and the browser could be
> amazing.

Yeah !
> 
> Allan