Re: Apologies to gnome-gui if I ever said you guys were flamers...

["Dan \"Effugas\" Kaminsky" <effugas best com>]

-----Original Message-----
From: Scott Goehring <scott@poverty.bloomington.in.us>
To: Dan "Effugas" Kaminsky <effugas@best.com>
Cc: gnome-gui-list@gnome.org <gnome-gui-list@gnome.org>
Date: Tuesday, August 18, 1998 6:51 PM
Subject: Re: Apologies to gnome-gui if I ever said you guys were flamers...


>You were ignorant of this issue.  The fact that you had to be told of
>it indicates that you were ignorant.  You didn't find out if it was
>possible or practical before advertising the idea.  This is ignorance.
>You should talk to programmers before you publish an idea, rather than
>after.


Well, hate to break it to ya Scott, but in a world where 1) Iconify exists,
2) There are other WMs that shrink graphics down, and 3) I can personally
describe a low CPU algorithm to shrink down an image, I guess I just didn't
think it was that hard of a thing to do, you know, since it's been done
before.

Maybe next time I should ask, "By the way, Scott, can you extract the text
out of a title bar?  How bout close a window from outside that window?"

>Personally, I don't like your minbar proposal because I think it's not
>worthwhile.  I don't see any value in a grossly shrunk view of a
>window as a icon, in the general case.

This I will deal with, by the way, others disagree.

>  (There are cases where it is
>useful; I think the application should make that call, not the window
>manager.)  I would never have realized that there were technical
>problems as well had you not pressed me on it.


Well then, Scott.  It's pretty obvious that the technical infeasability of
the minbar isn't plainly obvious.

>And, again, you didn't investigate adequately so as to not be ignorant
>of either zsh's or emacs' completion facilities.  Again, you exhibit a
>profound ignorance of the state of the art that you propose to
>advance.


Ohhhhh EXCUUUUUUUUSE me, Scott.  I'm a GUI designer.  Did I not know about
certain CLI things?  Yup.  Look at me, Scott.  Unlike you, I have the balls
to admit I don't know everything and I'm seeking the *HELP* of others that
do.

At least I'm not so arrogant as to think that I know everything and that
anybody who doesn't know what me, in my extreme intelligence, happens to be
aware of is a complete fool.

So why didn't *YOU* post anything to the list when I put THE ENTIRE FULL
TEXT of Cluehunting online?  Why didn't you say "By the way, Dan, zsh,
emacs, and the readline library do things that are similar"?  What more can
I do to investigate than *ASK OTHERS IN MY FIELD*?

>(The fact that you use Microsoft Outlook for writing messages to this
>forum probably doesn't help any, either.  Do you use the paperclip,
>too?)


So let me get this straight...I don't hate Microsoft software(just their
business practices), thus I'm an idiot?  That's more idiotic than
corporations who won't pick up free software because "there's nobody to
sue".