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From: Jason Lo <yet2bedefined@gmail.com>
Date: Sun, 2 Jan 2011 10:29:29 -0800
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Subject: GCI: Update Gnome Usergroup Info, Introduction
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Hello, my name is Jason Lo, and I have taken this GCI task (
http://www.google-melange.com/gci/task/show/google/gci2010/gnome/t129061755958#c16001).
I was asked by Dave Neary to prepare an email to send out, but before I do
that, I'd like to ask to some questions.
Namely, what should the overall tone and content of this email be? And also,
should I mention that I am a GCI student, and should I even go as far as to
mention the two previous students that tried to undertake this task, maybe
in a sort of apologetic tone? Thanks.

--90e6ba4fbd9c8b263e0498e138e5
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<div>Hello, my name is Jason Lo, and I have taken this GCI task (<a href=3D=
"http://www.google-melange.com/gci/task/show/google/gci2010/gnome/t12906175=
5958#c16001">http://www.google-melange.com/gci/task/show/google/gci2010/gno=
me/t129061755958#c16001</a>). I was asked by Dave Neary to prepare an email=
 to send out, but before I do that, I&#39;d like to ask to some questions. =
</div>

<div>Namely, what should the overall tone and content of this email be? And=
 also, should I mention that I am a GCI student, and should I even go as fa=
r as to mention the two previous students that tried to undertake this task=
, maybe in a sort of apologetic tone? Thanks.<br clear=3D"all">

</div><br>

--90e6ba4fbd9c8b263e0498e138e5--
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To: Jason Lo <yet2bedefined@gmail.com>
Subject: Re: GCI: Update Gnome Usergroup Info, Introduction
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Hi Jason,

Jason Lo wrote:
> Namely, what should the overall tone and content of this email be?

Informal and short. "Hi! I know you've been bothered a couple of times
with this already, but I'm helping update which GNOME user groups are
active and what you're up to, and I'd really appreciate a quick answer
from you, since you're listed as a contact for <GNOME user group name>.
Can you let me know if you're still involved with the GUG? If not, can
you let me know who is now the main contact for the GUG, please?"


> And also, should I mention that I am a GCI student, and should I even go as
> far as to mention the two previous students that tried to undertake this
> task, maybe in a sort of apologetic tone? Thanks.

I definitely think that a somewhat apologetic tone is appropriate. Also,
describing what GCI is, and the task as defined there, at the end of
your mail, might help smooth things over too. I suspect many GNOME User
Group people don't really know what GCI is.

Cheers,
Dave.

-- 
Dave Neary
GNOME Foundation member
dneary@gnome.org
From ak-47@gmx.net  Mon Jan  3 22:41:02 2011
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Subject: Re: GCI: Update Gnome Usergroup Info, Introduction
From: Andre Klapper <ak-47@gmx.net>
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Am Montag, den 03.01.2011, 17:40 +0100 schrieb Dave Neary:
> Can you let me know if you're still involved with the GUG? If not, can
> you let me know who is now the main contact for the GUG, please?"

This assumes that the GUG has a leader, however I have the feeling that
some GUGs listed are just mailing lists without a defined "internal
hierarchy"?

andre
-- 
mailto:ak-47@gmx.net | failed
http://blogs.gnome.org/aklapper

From stormy.gnome@gmail.com  Mon Jan  3 22:55:01 2011
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Subject: Re: GCI: Update Gnome Usergroup Info, Introduction
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--20cf3054963d06ea7a0498f90aa4
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I agree with Dave Neary's points. I also think showing that you are going to
follow up and record the information might encourage people to take your
request seriously. Maybe create the wiki page beforehand and populate it
with all the information you have?

On Mon, Jan 3, 2011 at 3:40 PM, Andre Klapper <ak-47@gmx.net> wrote:

> This assumes that the GUG has a leader, however I have the feeling that
> some GUGs listed are just mailing lists without a defined "internal
> hierarchy"?
>

Maybe one piece of information is how many people are signed up on the
mailing list and how active it is, i.e. how many mails/month? The sys admin
team can probably help gather any information that's not public (like number
of people on the list).

Stormy

--20cf3054963d06ea7a0498f90aa4
Content-Type: text/html; charset=ISO-8859-1
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

I agree with Dave Neary&#39;s points. I also think showing that you are goi=
ng to follow up and record the information might encourage people to take y=
our request seriously. Maybe create the wiki page beforehand and populate i=
t with all the information you have?<br>

<br><div class=3D"gmail_quote">On Mon, Jan 3, 2011 at 3:40 PM, Andre Klappe=
r <span dir=3D"ltr">&lt;<a href=3D"mailto:ak-47@gmx.net">ak-47@gmx.net</a>&=
gt;</span> wrote:<br><blockquote class=3D"gmail_quote" style=3D"margin:0 0 =
0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex;">


This assumes that the GUG has a leader, however I have the feeling that<br>
some GUGs listed are just mailing lists without a defined &quot;internal<br=
>
hierarchy&quot;?<br></blockquote><div><br>Maybe one piece of information is=
 how many people are signed up on the mailing list and how active it is, i.=
e. how many mails/month? The sys admin team can probably help gather any in=
formation that&#39;s not public (like number of people on the list).<br>

<br>Stormy<br></div></div>

--20cf3054963d06ea7a0498f90aa4--
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Subject: Re: GCI: Update Gnome Usergroup Info, Introduction
To: Stormy Peters <stormy@gnome.org>
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--0016363b83c03bd20e0498fadd43
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I went and added a subsection with an email template based off Dave's. Any
comments or suggestions?

http://live.gnome.org/UserGroups#Template_Email

On Mon, Jan 3, 2011 at 2:54 PM, Stormy Peters <stormy@gnome.org> wrote:

> I agree with Dave Neary's points. I also think showing that you are going
> to follow up and record the information might encourage people to take your
> request seriously. Maybe create the wiki page beforehand and populate it
> with all the information you have?
>
> On Mon, Jan 3, 2011 at 3:40 PM, Andre Klapper <ak-47@gmx.net> wrote:
>
>> This assumes that the GUG has a leader, however I have the feeling that
>> some GUGs listed are just mailing lists without a defined "internal
>> hierarchy"?
>>
>
> Maybe one piece of information is how many people are signed up on the
> mailing list and how active it is, i.e. how many mails/month? The sys admin
> team can probably help gather any information that's not public (like number
> of people on the list).
>
> Stormy
>



-- 
Jason

--0016363b83c03bd20e0498fadd43
Content-Type: text/html; charset=ISO-8859-1
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<div>I went and added a subsection with an email template based off Dave&#3=
9;s. Any comments or suggestions?</div><div><br></div><a href=3D"http://liv=
e.gnome.org/UserGroups#Template_Email">http://live.gnome.org/UserGroups#Tem=
plate_Email</a><br>

<br><div class=3D"gmail_quote">On Mon, Jan 3, 2011 at 2:54 PM, Stormy Peter=
s <span dir=3D"ltr">&lt;<a href=3D"mailto:stormy@gnome.org">stormy@gnome.or=
g</a>&gt;</span> wrote:<br><blockquote class=3D"gmail_quote" style=3D"margi=
n:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex;">

I agree with Dave Neary&#39;s points. I also think showing that you are goi=
ng to follow up and record the information might encourage people to take y=
our request seriously. Maybe create the wiki page beforehand and populate i=
t with all the information you have?<br>



<br><div class=3D"gmail_quote"><div class=3D"im">On Mon, Jan 3, 2011 at 3:4=
0 PM, Andre Klapper <span dir=3D"ltr">&lt;<a href=3D"mailto:ak-47@gmx.net" =
target=3D"_blank">ak-47@gmx.net</a>&gt;</span> wrote:<br><blockquote class=
=3D"gmail_quote" style=3D"margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padd=
ing-left:1ex">




This assumes that the GUG has a leader, however I have the feeling that<br>
some GUGs listed are just mailing lists without a defined &quot;internal<br=
>
hierarchy&quot;?<br></blockquote></div><div><br>Maybe one piece of informat=
ion is how many people are signed up on the mailing list and how active it =
is, i.e. how many mails/month? The sys admin team can probably help gather =
any information that&#39;s not public (like number of people on the list).<=
br>



<br>Stormy<br></div></div>
</blockquote></div><br><br clear=3D"all"><br>-- <br>Jason<br>

--0016363b83c03bd20e0498fadd43--
From fredm@gnome.org  Tue Jan  4 04:38:31 2011
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From: Frederic Muller <fredm@gnome.org>
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Excellent! Great to see this task moving as it should be an important 
piece of our marketing and outreach efforts.

I would replace "open source" by "free and open source" to make the 
email more inclusive, especially since GNOME is part of the GNU project 
(www.gnome.org/about/ ).

If you need any help getting 'faster' responses with the GUGs in Asia 
please let me know as this is an area where I should be able to help.

Thank you very much for your time and commitment.

Fred

On 01/04/2011 09:05 AM, Jason Lo wrote:
> I went and added a subsection with an email template based off Dave's.
> Any comments or suggestions?
>
> http://live.gnome.org/UserGroups#Template_Email
>
> On Mon, Jan 3, 2011 at 2:54 PM, Stormy Peters <stormy@gnome.org
> <mailto:stormy@gnome.org>> wrote:
>
>     I agree with Dave Neary's points. I also think showing that you are
>     going to follow up and record the information might encourage people
>     to take your request seriously. Maybe create the wiki page
>     beforehand and populate it with all the information you have?
>
>     On Mon, Jan 3, 2011 at 3:40 PM, Andre Klapper <ak-47@gmx.net
>     <mailto:ak-47@gmx.net>> wrote:
>
>         This assumes that the GUG has a leader, however I have the
>         feeling that
>         some GUGs listed are just mailing lists without a defined "internal
>         hierarchy"?
>
>
>     Maybe one piece of information is how many people are signed up on
>     the mailing list and how active it is, i.e. how many mails/month?
>     The sys admin team can probably help gather any information that's
>     not public (like number of people on the list).
>
>     Stormy
>
>
>
>
> --
> Jason
>

From nearyd@gmail.com  Tue Jan  4 13:56:28 2011
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Sender: Dave Neary <nearyd@gmail.com>
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Hi,

Jason Lo wrote:
> I went and added a subsection with an email template based off Dave's.
> Any comments or suggestions?

The one suggestion I have is to start really small - ask them to reply
saying that they got your mail & are still involved in the GUG, and if
not to help redirect you.

You can always follow up afterwards to get more information on what the
GUG does.

The longer someone has to spend replying to your email, the lower the
response rate.

And then, IMHO, it's good to go - could you perhaps let us know who you
intend to email with this, please? It'd be good to know who it's going
out to, whether they're mailing lists, contact@ addresses, or the names
of people.

Thanks!
Dave.

-- 
Dave Neary
GNOME Foundation member
dneary@gnome.org
From andreasn.pixel@gmail.com  Tue Jan  4 14:10:29 2011
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Wanted to do some modifications to the Friends of GNOME website as the 
design me and Kalle did hasn't scaled well with the content added over 
time and with the new website [1] coming around the corner, needs a 
facelift anyway.
The current site is getting a bit cluttered and I wanted make the 
process of donating as simple as possible. Some darlings might have gone 
lost in the process. :)

http://www.andreasn.se/diverse/temp/friends-of-gnome-2.0/

This can be considered alpha state as I think the forms are a bit broken 
here and there and not all sub pages are finished.
If you find something broken, fix it here:
http://gitorious.org/gnome-design/gnome-design/trees/master/www/friends-of-gnome-2.0

1. http://wptest.gnome.org/
- Andreas
From stormy.gnome@gmail.com  Tue Jan  4 14:35:50 2011
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Subject: Re: New face to Friends of GNOME
To: Andreas Nilsson <nisses.mail@home.se>
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Thanks, Andreas. It definitely needed an update and I like how it all fits
above the fold now.

I would actually suggest simplifying it more and only giving people 2-3
options. If we could offer them monthly and one time and then take them to
payment page and fill in a default (editable) amount and list what all the
amounts benefit from, that would be great. (I don't think we can easily do
that with Paypal though.)

FYI, in the last box, Philanthropist, when I select it, the words overwrite
the title.

Stormy

On Tue, Jan 4, 2011 at 7:10 AM, Andreas Nilsson <nisses.mail@home.se> wrote:

> Wanted to do some modifications to the Friends of GNOME website as the
> design me and Kalle did hasn't scaled well with the content added over time
> and with the new website [1] coming around the corner, needs a facelift
> anyway.
> The current site is getting a bit cluttered and I wanted make the process
> of donating as simple as possible. Some darlings might have gone lost in the
> process. :)
>
> http://www.andreasn.se/diverse/temp/friends-of-gnome-2.0/
>
> This can be considered alpha state as I think the forms are a bit broken
> here and there and not all sub pages are finished.
> If you find something broken, fix it here:
>
> http://gitorious.org/gnome-design/gnome-design/trees/master/www/friends-of-gnome-2.0
>
> 1. http://wptest.gnome.org/
> - Andreas
> --
> marketing-list mailing list
> marketing-list@gnome.org
> http://mail.gnome.org/mailman/listinfo/marketing-list
>

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Thanks, Andreas. It definitely needed an update and I like how it all fits =
above the fold now.<br><br>I would actually suggest simplifying it more and=
 only giving people 2-3 options. If we could offer them monthly and one tim=
e and then take them to payment page and fill in a default (editable) amoun=
t and list what all the amounts benefit from, that would be great. (I don&#=
39;t think we can easily do that with Paypal though.)<br>

<br>FYI, in the last box, Philanthropist, when I select it, the words overw=
rite the title.<br><br>Stormy<br><br><div class=3D"gmail_quote">On Tue, Jan=
 4, 2011 at 7:10 AM, Andreas Nilsson <span dir=3D"ltr">&lt;<a href=3D"mailt=
o:nisses.mail@home.se">nisses.mail@home.se</a>&gt;</span> wrote:<br>

<blockquote class=3D"gmail_quote" style=3D"margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1p=
x #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex;">Wanted to do some modifications to the Frie=
nds of GNOME website as the design me and Kalle did hasn&#39;t scaled well =
with the content added over time and with the new website [1] coming around=
 the corner, needs a facelift anyway.<br>


The current site is getting a bit cluttered and I wanted make the process o=
f donating as simple as possible. Some darlings might have gone lost in the=
 process. :)<br>
<br>
<a href=3D"http://www.andreasn.se/diverse/temp/friends-of-gnome-2.0/" targe=
t=3D"_blank">http://www.andreasn.se/diverse/temp/friends-of-gnome-2.0/</a><=
br>
<br>
This can be considered alpha state as I think the forms are a bit broken he=
re and there and not all sub pages are finished.<br>
If you find something broken, fix it here:<br>
<a href=3D"http://gitorious.org/gnome-design/gnome-design/trees/master/www/=
friends-of-gnome-2.0" target=3D"_blank">http://gitorious.org/gnome-design/g=
nome-design/trees/master/www/friends-of-gnome-2.0</a><br>
<br>
1. <a href=3D"http://wptest.gnome.org/" target=3D"_blank">http://wptest.gno=
me.org/</a><br>
- Andreas<br><font color=3D"#888888">
-- <br>
marketing-list mailing list<br>
<a href=3D"mailto:marketing-list@gnome.org" target=3D"_blank">marketing-lis=
t@gnome.org</a><br>
<a href=3D"http://mail.gnome.org/mailman/listinfo/marketing-list" target=3D=
"_blank">http://mail.gnome.org/mailman/listinfo/marketing-list</a><br>
</font></blockquote></div><br>

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From sri@ramkrishna.me  Tue Jan  4 19:56:44 2011
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From: Sriram Ramkrishna <sri@ramkrishna.me>
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Any chance we could get the DNS entry www.gnome3.org (and I think gnome4 and
gnome5 etc) so that we can use it to centralize messaging to a particular
URL?  I think as we get close we want to be able to point people to a site
that is simple to remember and specific to gnome 3.

What do you guys think?

sri

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Any chance we could get the DNS entry <a href=3D"http://www.gnome3.org">www=
.gnome3.org</a> (and I think gnome4 and gnome5 etc) so that we can use it t=
o centralize messaging to a particular URL?=A0 I think as we get close we w=
ant to be able to point people to a site that is simple to remember and spe=
cific to gnome 3.<br>

<br>What do you guys think?<br><br>sri<br>

--20cf30549dab3c415b04990aaa91--
From brian.cameron@oracle.com  Tue Jan  4 20:05:03 2011
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Andreas:

The new design looks nice.  A few comments:

- Currently the "Corporate Sponsorship" only includes being an "Advisory
   Board member".  I'm not sure I like the term "Corporate" since
   Advisory Board members can be other non-for-profits, Foundations, or
   other non-Corporate organizations.  It would be nice to include
   information about Advisory Board fees.

   It would also be nice to provide options for organizations that wish
   to donate but not be on the Advisory Board (or not donate as much as
   the fee).  Perhaps we could provide a page where we put logos/links
   to organizations who donate in this way.  Or perhaps we could include
   logos for organizations who donate a certain amount at events we
   organize.  Perhaps we could offer a menu of choices where
   organizations could be recognized in different ways based on the
   amount donated.

- The "List of Previous Donors" would be more cool if it allowed
   people to provide links to their personal page if they wish
   (perhaps their live.gnome.org page if they have one, for example).

   I don't know how to improve this page, but just a long list of names
   doesn't seem to be the best way to honor those who help us.

- There are a number of places you can buy official GNOME branded
   merchandise.  Shouldn't we highlight those here?

- In the "Thanks to donations, in 2010 we were able to:" section
   it says "Hold a women outreach".  This seems oddly worded or an
   incomplete sentence.  Perhaps "Organize a Women's Outreach Program"
   might be more clear.

- Also, I liked how the old FoG page highlighted that the GNOME
   project benefits humanitarian projects like OLPC and a11y.  Would be
   nice to be able to continue to highlight a more humanitarian message.
   I would think this would encourage donations.

- Will it be possible to earmark donations for certain projects (such
   as Women's Outreach or a11y)?  If so, the page should highlight how
   to do this.

Brian


On 01/ 4/11 08:10 AM, Andreas Nilsson wrote:
> Wanted to do some modifications to the Friends of GNOME website as the
> design me and Kalle did hasn't scaled well with the content added over
> time and with the new website [1] coming around the corner, needs a
> facelift anyway.
> The current site is getting a bit cluttered and I wanted make the
> process of donating as simple as possible. Some darlings might have gone
> lost in the process. :)
>
> http://www.andreasn.se/diverse/temp/friends-of-gnome-2.0/
>
> This can be considered alpha state as I think the forms are a bit broken
> here and there and not all sub pages are finished.
> If you find something broken, fix it here:
> http://gitorious.org/gnome-design/gnome-design/trees/master/www/friends-of-gnome-2.0
>
>
> 1. http://wptest.gnome.org/
> - Andreas

From stormy.gnome@gmail.com  Tue Jan  4 20:11:53 2011
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From: Stormy Peters <stormy@gnome.org>
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Subject: Re: getting www.gnome3.org
To: Sriram Ramkrishna <sri@ramkrishna.me>
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We do have gnome3.org and we worked on it at the last marketing hackfest. At
that time, it was really close to launching ...

Paul, Andreas, what is left? What can we help with?

Stormy

On Tue, Jan 4, 2011 at 12:56 PM, Sriram Ramkrishna <sri@ramkrishna.me>wrote:

> Any chance we could get the DNS entry www.gnome3.org (and I think gnome4
> and gnome5 etc) so that we can use it to centralize messaging to a
> particular URL?  I think as we get close we want to be able to point people
> to a site that is simple to remember and specific to gnome 3.
>
> What do you guys think?
>
> sri
>
> --
> marketing-list mailing list
> marketing-list@gnome.org
> http://mail.gnome.org/mailman/listinfo/marketing-list
>
>

--0023547c8b375c10e404990ae04d
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We do have <a href=3D"http://gnome3.org">gnome3.org</a> and we worked on it=
 at the last marketing hackfest. At that time, it was really close to launc=
hing ...<br><br>Paul, Andreas, what is left? What can we help with?<br><br>

Stormy<br><br><div class=3D"gmail_quote">On Tue, Jan 4, 2011 at 12:56 PM, S=
riram Ramkrishna <span dir=3D"ltr">&lt;<a href=3D"mailto:sri@ramkrishna.me"=
>sri@ramkrishna.me</a>&gt;</span> wrote:<br><blockquote class=3D"gmail_quot=
e" style=3D"margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex;"=
>

Any chance we could get the DNS entry <a href=3D"http://www.gnome3.org" tar=
get=3D"_blank">www.gnome3.org</a> (and I think gnome4 and gnome5 etc) so th=
at we can use it to centralize messaging to a particular URL?=A0 I think as=
 we get close we want to be able to point people to a site that is simple t=
o remember and specific to gnome 3.<br>



<br>What do you guys think?<br><br>sri<br>
<br>--<br>
marketing-list mailing list<br>
<a href=3D"mailto:marketing-list@gnome.org">marketing-list@gnome.org</a><br=
>
<a href=3D"http://mail.gnome.org/mailman/listinfo/marketing-list" target=3D=
"_blank">http://mail.gnome.org/mailman/listinfo/marketing-list</a><br>
<br></blockquote></div><br>

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From me@jasonclinton.com  Tue Jan  4 20:35:11 2011
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Subject: Re: getting www.gnome3.org
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Since it was supposed to be almost entirely video thumbnails on the front
page, the videos need to go up there. And since we don't have a UI freeze
for a few more months, it wasn't in the plan to have it up until then.

But I think there is a value in making this a kind of process-marketing. I
think we could launch the site with a "Beta" decal and post the unfinished
videos with the time codes in them so that no one gets any ideas about
posting them as the final marketing assets.

On Tue, Jan 4, 2011 at 14:11, Stormy Peters <stormy@gnome.org> wrote:

> We do have gnome3.org and we worked on it at the last marketing hackfest.
> At that time, it was really close to launching ...
>
> Paul, Andreas, what is left? What can we help with?
>
> Stormy
>
> On Tue, Jan 4, 2011 at 12:56 PM, Sriram Ramkrishna <sri@ramkrishna.me>wrote:
>
>> Any chance we could get the DNS entry www.gnome3.org (and I think gnome4
>> and gnome5 etc) so that we can use it to centralize messaging to a
>> particular URL?  I think as we get close we want to be able to point people
>> to a site that is simple to remember and specific to gnome 3.
>>
>> What do you guys think?
>>
>> sri
>>
>> --
>> marketing-list mailing list
>> marketing-list@gnome.org
>> http://mail.gnome.org/mailman/listinfo/marketing-list
>>
>>
>
> --
> marketing-list mailing list
> marketing-list@gnome.org
> http://mail.gnome.org/mailman/listinfo/marketing-list
>
>

--0016e6de00edc30f8e04990b33ca
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Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

Since it was supposed to be almost entirely video thumbnails on the front p=
age, the videos need to go up there. And since we don&#39;t have a UI freez=
e for a few more months, it wasn&#39;t in the plan to have it up until then=
.<div>
<br></div><div>But I think there is a value in making this a kind of proces=
s-marketing. I think we could launch the site with a &quot;Beta&quot; decal=
 and post the unfinished videos with the time codes in them so that no one =
gets any ideas about posting them as the final marketing assets.<br>
<br><div class=3D"gmail_quote">On Tue, Jan 4, 2011 at 14:11, Stormy Peters =
<span dir=3D"ltr">&lt;<a href=3D"mailto:stormy@gnome.org">stormy@gnome.org<=
/a>&gt;</span> wrote:<br><blockquote class=3D"gmail_quote" style=3D"margin:=
0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex;">
We do have <a href=3D"http://gnome3.org" target=3D"_blank">gnome3.org</a> a=
nd we worked on it at the last marketing hackfest. At that time, it was rea=
lly close to launching ...<br><br>Paul, Andreas, what is left? What can we =
help with?<br>
<br>

Stormy<br><br><div class=3D"gmail_quote"><div><div></div><div class=3D"h5">=
On Tue, Jan 4, 2011 at 12:56 PM, Sriram Ramkrishna <span dir=3D"ltr">&lt;<a=
 href=3D"mailto:sri@ramkrishna.me" target=3D"_blank">sri@ramkrishna.me</a>&=
gt;</span> wrote:<br>
</div></div><blockquote class=3D"gmail_quote" style=3D"margin:0 0 0 .8ex;bo=
rder-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex"><div><div></div><div class=3D"h5=
">

Any chance we could get the DNS entry <a href=3D"http://www.gnome3.org" tar=
get=3D"_blank">www.gnome3.org</a> (and I think gnome4 and gnome5 etc) so th=
at we can use it to centralize messaging to a particular URL?=C2=A0 I think=
 as we get close we want to be able to point people to a site that is simpl=
e to remember and specific to gnome 3.<br>




<br>What do you guys think?<br><br>sri<br>
<br></div></div>--<br>
marketing-list mailing list<br>
<a href=3D"mailto:marketing-list@gnome.org" target=3D"_blank">marketing-lis=
t@gnome.org</a><br>
<a href=3D"http://mail.gnome.org/mailman/listinfo/marketing-list" target=3D=
"_blank">http://mail.gnome.org/mailman/listinfo/marketing-list</a><br>
<br></blockquote></div><br>
<br>--<br>
marketing-list mailing list<br>
<a href=3D"mailto:marketing-list@gnome.org">marketing-list@gnome.org</a><br=
>
<a href=3D"http://mail.gnome.org/mailman/listinfo/marketing-list" target=3D=
"_blank">http://mail.gnome.org/mailman/listinfo/marketing-list</a><br>
<br></blockquote></div><br></div>

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From sri@ramkrishna.me  Tue Jan  4 21:50:45 2011
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From: Sriram Ramkrishna <sri@ramkrishna.me>
Date: Tue, 4 Jan 2011 13:50:11 -0800
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Subject: Re: getting www.gnome3.org
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On Tue, Jan 4, 2011 at 12:34 PM, Jason D. Clinton <me@jasonclinton.com>wrote:

> Since it was supposed to be almost entirely video thumbnails on the front
> page, the videos need to go up there. And since we don't have a UI freeze
> for a few more months, it wasn't in the plan to have it up until then.
>
> But I think there is a value in making this a kind of process-marketing. I
> think we could launch the site with a "Beta" decal and post the unfinished
> videos with the time codes in them so that no one gets any ideas about
> posting them as the final marketing assets.
>
>

Due to all the noise that we're getting on DDL, I wanted focus a little on
community management from now till release.  So having a website fro simple
messaging sounds good.  Of course, if we're using it for video thumbnails
and what not maybe this might not be the best place for it.  I had forgotten
about the details on the marketing hackfest so I don't want to interfere
with plans already in progress.

The idea is to pool resources of people who are already doing community
management (eg engaging people who ask questions) on g-s and ddl and maybe
work together on creating a more positive impression of gnome shell.  Rather
than discussing the same issues, this allows developers to focus on
completing Gnome 3 without the distraction of spending time trying to allay
fears of change and in the process feeling stop energy.  if there are real
issues than perhaps we can advocate on those issues and so Jon, Owen and
others can work with us rather than random people who are made about
something.

We've never done community management (well or at all) and it might be a
good way to do a sales job on our own existing user base who fear change.
It will also prepare us for after the release for questions that will
certainly be forthcoming when we make presentations at various conferences.
I have two conferences that I'll be talking at, Open Source Bridge and
Linuxfest Northwest.  I've already put in the paperwork for them and I want
to make sure that I can address any users who might be confrontational.

Making the effort will earn us some brownie points I think.

sri



>
> On Tue, Jan 4, 2011 at 14:11, Stormy Peters <stormy@gnome.org> wrote:
>
>> We do have gnome3.org and we worked on it at the last marketing hackfest.
>> At that time, it was really close to launching ...
>>
>> Paul, Andreas, what is left? What can we help with?
>>
>> Stormy
>>
>> On Tue, Jan 4, 2011 at 12:56 PM, Sriram Ramkrishna <sri@ramkrishna.me>wrote:
>>
>>> Any chance we could get the DNS entry www.gnome3.org (and I think gnome4
>>> and gnome5 etc) so that we can use it to centralize messaging to a
>>> particular URL?  I think as we get close we want to be able to point people
>>> to a site that is simple to remember and specific to gnome 3.
>>>
>>> What do you guys think?
>>>
>>> sri
>>>
>>> --
>>> marketing-list mailing list
>>> marketing-list@gnome.org
>>> http://mail.gnome.org/mailman/listinfo/marketing-list
>>>
>>>
>>
>> --
>> marketing-list mailing list
>> marketing-list@gnome.org
>> http://mail.gnome.org/mailman/listinfo/marketing-list
>>
>>
>

--90e6ba61361ee8014504990c41d8
Content-Type: text/html; charset=ISO-8859-1
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

<br><br><div class=3D"gmail_quote">On Tue, Jan 4, 2011 at 12:34 PM, Jason D=
. Clinton <span dir=3D"ltr">&lt;<a href=3D"mailto:me@jasonclinton.com">me@j=
asonclinton.com</a>&gt;</span> wrote:<br><blockquote class=3D"gmail_quote" =
style=3D"margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex;">

Since it was supposed to be almost entirely video thumbnails on the front p=
age, the videos need to go up there. And since we don&#39;t have a UI freez=
e for a few more months, it wasn&#39;t in the plan to have it up until then=
.<div>


<br></div><div>But I think there is a value in making this a kind of proces=
s-marketing. I think we could launch the site with a &quot;Beta&quot; decal=
 and post the unfinished videos with the time codes in them so that no one =
gets any ideas about posting them as the final marketing assets.<div>

<div></div><div><br></div></div></div></blockquote><div><br><br>Due to all =
the noise that we&#39;re getting on DDL, I wanted focus a little on communi=
ty management from now till release.=A0 So having a website fro simple mess=
aging sounds good.=A0 Of course, if we&#39;re using it for video thumbnails=
 and what not maybe this might not be the best place for it.=A0 I had forgo=
tten about the details on the marketing hackfest so I don&#39;t want to int=
erfere with plans already in progress.<br>

<br>The idea is to pool resources of people who are already doing community=
 management (eg engaging people who ask questions) on g-s and ddl and maybe=
 work together on creating a more positive impression of gnome shell.=A0 Ra=
ther than discussing the same issues, this allows developers to focus on co=
mpleting Gnome 3 without the distraction of spending time trying to allay f=
ears of change and in the process feeling stop energy.=A0 if there are real=
 issues than perhaps we can advocate on those issues and so Jon, Owen and o=
thers can work with us rather than random people who are made about somethi=
ng.<br>

<br>We&#39;ve never done community management (well or at all) and it might=
 be a good way to do a sales job on our own existing user base who fear cha=
nge.=A0 It will also prepare us for after the release for questions that wi=
ll certainly be forthcoming when we make presentations at various conferenc=
es.=A0 I have two conferences that I&#39;ll be talking at, Open Source Brid=
ge and Linuxfest Northwest.=A0 I&#39;ve already put in the paperwork for th=
em and I want to make sure that I can address any users who might be confro=
ntational.<br>

<br>Making the effort will earn us some brownie points I think.<br><br>sri<=
br><br>=A0<br></div><blockquote class=3D"gmail_quote" style=3D"margin: 0pt =
0pt 0pt 0.8ex; border-left: 1px solid rgb(204, 204, 204); padding-left: 1ex=
;">

<div><div><div class=3D"h5">
<br><div class=3D"gmail_quote">On Tue, Jan 4, 2011 at 14:11, Stormy Peters =
<span dir=3D"ltr">&lt;<a href=3D"mailto:stormy@gnome.org" target=3D"_blank"=
>stormy@gnome.org</a>&gt;</span> wrote:<br><blockquote class=3D"gmail_quote=
" style=3D"margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex">


We do have <a href=3D"http://gnome3.org" target=3D"_blank">gnome3.org</a> a=
nd we worked on it at the last marketing hackfest. At that time, it was rea=
lly close to launching ...<br><br>Paul, Andreas, what is left? What can we =
help with?<br>


<br>

Stormy<br><br><div class=3D"gmail_quote"><div><div></div><div>On Tue, Jan 4=
, 2011 at 12:56 PM, Sriram Ramkrishna <span dir=3D"ltr">&lt;<a href=3D"mail=
to:sri@ramkrishna.me" target=3D"_blank">sri@ramkrishna.me</a>&gt;</span> wr=
ote:<br>


</div></div><blockquote class=3D"gmail_quote" style=3D"margin:0 0 0 .8ex;bo=
rder-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex"><div><div></div><div>

Any chance we could get the DNS entry <a href=3D"http://www.gnome3.org" tar=
get=3D"_blank">www.gnome3.org</a> (and I think gnome4 and gnome5 etc) so th=
at we can use it to centralize messaging to a particular URL?=A0 I think as=
 we get close we want to be able to point people to a site that is simple t=
o remember and specific to gnome 3.<br>






<br>What do you guys think?<br><br>sri<br>
<br></div></div>--<br>
marketing-list mailing list<br>
<a href=3D"mailto:marketing-list@gnome.org" target=3D"_blank">marketing-lis=
t@gnome.org</a><br>
<a href=3D"http://mail.gnome.org/mailman/listinfo/marketing-list" target=3D=
"_blank">http://mail.gnome.org/mailman/listinfo/marketing-list</a><br>
<br></blockquote></div><br>
<br>--<br>
marketing-list mailing list<br>
<a href=3D"mailto:marketing-list@gnome.org" target=3D"_blank">marketing-lis=
t@gnome.org</a><br>
<a href=3D"http://mail.gnome.org/mailman/listinfo/marketing-list" target=3D=
"_blank">http://mail.gnome.org/mailman/listinfo/marketing-list</a><br>
<br></blockquote></div><br></div></div></div>
</blockquote></div><br>

--90e6ba61361ee8014504990c41d8--
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Hey Andreas,

Am 04.01.2011 15:10, schrieb Andreas Nilsson:
> http://www.andreasn.se/diverse/temp/friends-of-gnome-2.0/

really nice work, thank you! It is a big improvement over the last
design, which was already great. A few ideas, not necessarily connected
to your design, though:

* We might want to highlight the amounts that our friends will
eventually contribute a bit more. You don't see how much we ask a friend
to give until you click one of the buttons. That might put some
potential friends off.

* I think Stormy made this great deal with LWN and we will give out an
LWN subscription for the first 500 subscribers in 2011 or so. This does
not seem to be highlighted anywhere on the page.

* Not a big deal, but can we remove the T-Shirt size after a friend has
chosen not to receive a gift?

* Jaap did these great Amazon search plugins for Firefox and Epiphany.
We might want to promote these in addition to the Gnome store. I think
that there is a lot more potential in these plugins than in a store
purchase, because people might do one purchase at the store and then
forget but will keep the search plugin around like forever. Also, at
least in Germany, Amazon did add the referral fee to the prices at the
stores the last time I looked, so the search plugins might be a better
deal for our friends.

* Finally, I think that the FoG program is a bit US centric right now.
There might be a lot of potential that we miss here. We might want to
translate the page into multiple languages. We might want to check, if
we can find charitable organizations in other jurisdictions that would
be willing to take donations on our behalf and then spend it on Gnome
love (think of Wau Holland Foundation as an example, who does this for
Wikileaks ;). That way, a FoG donation would be tax-deductible in more
jurisdictions or we could offer some other kinds of money transfer that
is more common in a jurisdiction. Also, it should be technically
possible to detect where our friends are coming from and convert the
amount into their currency. Maybe just provide a box to choose the
currency. For some friends, it may not be obvious that Paypal will
convert to their native currency or they just wont take the hassle to
convert it themselves beforehand to check if it is a feasible amount for
them to spend.

Anyway, keep up the good work.

Cheers!

:-) Patrick
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Subject: Pre-release marketing and community management [Was: getting
	www.gnome3.org]
From: Allan Day <allanpday@gmail.com>
To: Sriram Ramkrishna <sri@ramkrishna.me>
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On Tue, 2011-01-04 at 13:50 -0800, Sriram Ramkrishna wrote:
> 
> 
> On Tue, Jan 4, 2011 at 12:34 PM, Jason D. Clinton
> <me@jasonclinton.com> wrote:
>         Since it was supposed to be almost entirely video thumbnails
>         on the front page, the videos need to go up there. And since
>         we don't have a UI freeze for a few more months, it wasn't in
>         the plan to have it up until then.
>         
>         
>         But I think there is a value in making this a kind of
>         process-marketing. I think we could launch the site with a
>         "Beta" decal and post the unfinished videos with the time
>         codes in them so that no one gets any ideas about posting them
>         as the final marketing assets.

Apologies if this is a discussion which has already taken place, but can
I ask: are there any plans to put out positive stories and messages
about GNOME Shell and GNOME 3 in the run up to the release? (And if so,
what are they?!) I can see this being highly beneficial. It doesn't have
to involve the gnome3 site - we could focus on getting positive stories
about GNOME Shell into the press, for example. Just a handful of such
stories would be immensely beneficial.

> Due to all the noise that we're getting on DDL, I wanted focus a
> little on community management from now till release.  So having a
> website fro simple messaging sounds good.  Of course, if we're using
> it for video thumbnails and what not maybe this might not be the best
> place for it.  I had forgotten about the details on the marketing
> hackfest so I don't want to interfere with plans already in progress.
> 
> The idea is to pool resources of people who are already doing
> community management (eg engaging people who ask questions) on g-s and
> ddl and maybe work together on creating a more positive impression of
> gnome shell.  Rather than discussing the same issues, this allows
> developers to focus on completing Gnome 3 without the distraction of
> spending time trying to allay fears of change and in the process
> feeling stop energy.  if there are real issues than perhaps we can
> advocate on those issues and so Jon, Owen and others can work with us
> rather than random people who are made about something.
> 
> We've never done community management (well or at all) and it might be
> a good way to do a sales job on our own existing user base who fear
> change.  It will also prepare us for after the release for questions
> that will certainly be forthcoming when we make presentations at
> various conferences.  I have two conferences that I'll be talking at,
> Open Source Bridge and Linuxfest Northwest.  I've already put in the
> paperwork for them and I want to make sure that I can address any
> users who might be confrontational.
> 
> Making the effort will earn us some brownie points I think.

*raises hand*

Me and Sri have discussed this a bit online. There already seems to be
an unorganised effort to do community management on the lists and
channels. Pooling, recycling and generating resources in the fight
against stop energy would only enhance that effort, I think.

Allan
-- 
Blog: http://afaikblog.wordpress.com/
IRC: aday on irc.gnome.org

From allanpday@gmail.com  Wed Jan  5 12:35:32 2011
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Subject: Re: Pre-release marketing and community management [Was: getting
	www.gnome3.org]
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On Wed, 2011-01-05 at 09:05 +0000, Allan Day wrote:
> On Tue, 2011-01-04 at 13:50 -0800, Sriram Ramkrishna wrote:
> > 
> > 
> > On Tue, Jan 4, 2011 at 12:34 PM, Jason D. Clinton
> > <me@jasonclinton.com> wrote:
> >         Since it was supposed to be almost entirely video thumbnails
> >         on the front page, the videos need to go up there. And since
> >         we don't have a UI freeze for a few more months, it wasn't in
> >         the plan to have it up until then.
> >         
> >         
> >         But I think there is a value in making this a kind of
> >         process-marketing. I think we could launch the site with a
> >         "Beta" decal and post the unfinished videos with the time
> >         codes in them so that no one gets any ideas about posting them
> >         as the final marketing assets.
> 
> Apologies if this is a discussion which has already taken place, but can
> I ask: are there any plans to put out positive stories and messages
> about GNOME Shell and GNOME 3 in the run up to the release? (And if so,
> what are they?!) I can see this being highly beneficial. It doesn't have
> to involve the gnome3 site - we could focus on getting positive stories
> about GNOME Shell into the press, for example. Just a handful of such
> stories would be immensely beneficial.

I just had a little look at what other projects are doing in this
regard...

 * The Firefox 4 site [1] has some really nice details on the upcoming
release.

 * The Unity pages [2] are upbeat and they look nice, though rather
lacking on detail. (Jono has been getting positive articles [3] into
circulation, though.)

 * The OS X Lion page [4] describes upcoming features and explains their
benefits.

What are the chances of throwing together a preview page of this ilk? I
could chip in with some copy...

Allan

[1] http://www.mozilla.com/en-US/firefox/beta/features/
[2] http://unity.ubuntu.com/about/
[3]
http://www.techradar.com/news/software/operating-systems/the-evolution-of-the-linux-desktop-914736
[4] http://www.apple.com/macosx/lion/

-- 
Blog: http://afaikblog.wordpress.com/
IRC: aday on irc.gnome.org

From paul.r.cutler@gmail.com  Wed Jan  5 14:02:00 2011
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Subject: Re: Pre-release marketing and community management [Was: getting
	www.gnome3.org]
From: Paul Cutler <pcutler@gnome.org>
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Hi Allan,

Thanks for kicking off this discussion.

Andreas and I did some work on GNOME3.org which can be found on Github:

https://github.com/andreasn/gnome3-website

We were pretty close - the design is done and some of the copy needs
to be updated.  We were waiting for some videos and screenshots and
then we wanted to launch it, but it's a bit stalled.  I don't see any
reason we couldn't take it, update the screenshots and copy, and
launch it fairly quickly.

I strongly agree with you that it would be beneficial to get some
positive marketing out there sooner rather than later.

Paul

On Wed, Jan 5, 2011 at 6:35 AM, Allan Day <allanpday@gmail.com> wrote:
> On Wed, 2011-01-05 at 09:05 +0000, Allan Day wrote:
>> On Tue, 2011-01-04 at 13:50 -0800, Sriram Ramkrishna wrote:
>> >
>> >
>> > On Tue, Jan 4, 2011 at 12:34 PM, Jason D. Clinton
>> > <me@jasonclinton.com> wrote:
>> > =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 Since it was supposed to be almost entirely video thum=
bnails
>> > =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 on the front page, the videos need to go up there. And=
 since
>> > =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 we don't have a UI freeze for a few more months, it wa=
sn't in
>> > =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 the plan to have it up until then.
>> >
>> >
>> > =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 But I think there is a value in making this a kind of
>> > =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 process-marketing. I think we could launch the site wi=
th a
>> > =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 "Beta" decal and post the unfinished videos with the t=
ime
>> > =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 codes in them so that no one gets any ideas about post=
ing them
>> > =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 as the final marketing assets.
>>
>> Apologies if this is a discussion which has already taken place, but can
>> I ask: are there any plans to put out positive stories and messages
>> about GNOME Shell and GNOME 3 in the run up to the release? (And if so,
>> what are they?!) I can see this being highly beneficial. It doesn't have
>> to involve the gnome3 site - we could focus on getting positive stories
>> about GNOME Shell into the press, for example. Just a handful of such
>> stories would be immensely beneficial.
>
> I just had a little look at what other projects are doing in this
> regard...
>
> =A0* The Firefox 4 site [1] has some really nice details on the upcoming
> release.
>
> =A0* The Unity pages [2] are upbeat and they look nice, though rather
> lacking on detail. (Jono has been getting positive articles [3] into
> circulation, though.)
>
> =A0* The OS X Lion page [4] describes upcoming features and explains thei=
r
> benefits.
>
> What are the chances of throwing together a preview page of this ilk? I
> could chip in with some copy...
>
> Allan
>
> [1] http://www.mozilla.com/en-US/firefox/beta/features/
> [2] http://unity.ubuntu.com/about/
> [3]
> http://www.techradar.com/news/software/operating-systems/the-evolution-of=
-the-linux-desktop-914736
> [4] http://www.apple.com/macosx/lion/
>
> --
> Blog: http://afaikblog.wordpress.com/
> IRC: aday on irc.gnome.org
>
> --
> marketing-list mailing list
> marketing-list@gnome.org
> http://mail.gnome.org/mailman/listinfo/marketing-list
>
From paul.r.cutler@gmail.com  Wed Jan  5 14:05:28 2011
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Subject: Q4 Updates Due
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Hi Marketing team!

The Q4 team updates are due and we had a bunch of activity over the
last 3 months, with Friends of GNOME, GCI, etc.

Would anyone like to try their hand at writing the update?  You can
see an example of the Q2 update[1] and I'm working to get the GNOME Q3
update up later today.  We need to have the Q4 report written in a
week by Jan 12th.

Thanks for the help!

Paul

[1] http://foundation.gnome.org/reports/gnome-report-2010-Q2.html
From brian.cameron@oracle.com  Wed Jan  5 15:34:59 2011
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Patrick:

> * Finally, I think that the FoG program is a bit US centric right now.
> There might be a lot of potential that we miss here. We might want to
> translate the page into multiple languages. We might want to check, if
> we can find charitable organizations in other jurisdictions that would
> be willing to take donations on our behalf and then spend it on Gnome
> love (think of Wau Holland Foundation as an example, who does this for
> Wikileaks ;). That way, a FoG donation would be tax-deductible in more
> jurisdictions or we could offer some other kinds of money transfer that
> is more common in a jurisdiction. Also, it should be technically
> possible to detect where our friends are coming from and convert the
> amount into their currency. Maybe just provide a box to choose the
> currency. For some friends, it may not be obvious that Paypal will
> convert to their native currency or they just wont take the hassle to
> convert it themselves beforehand to check if it is a feasible amount for
> them to spend.

Didn't we make arrangements to accept donations in boletos in Brazil?
I remember Jonh Wendell was working on this.

If so, we should explain how to give such donations on the page.  Does
anybody have a pointer to instructions?

Brian

cc:ing Jonh
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On Wed, Jan 5, 2011 at 2:05 AM, Allan Day <allanpday@gmail.com> wrote:

> On Tue, 2011-01-04 at 13:50 -0800, Sriram Ramkrishna wrote:
> > We've never done community management (well or at all) and it might be
> > a good way to do a sales job on our own existing user base who fear
> > change.  It will also prepare us for after the release for questions
> > that will certainly be forthcoming when we make presentations at
> > various conferences.  I have two conferences that I'll be talking at,
> > Open Source Bridge and Linuxfest Northwest.  I've already put in the
> > paperwork for them and I want to make sure that I can address any
> > users who might be confrontational.
> >
> > Making the effort will earn us some brownie points I think.
>
> *raises hand*
>
> Me and Sri have discussed this a bit online. There already seems to be
> an unorganised effort to do community management on the lists and
> channels. Pooling, recycling and generating resources in the fight
> against stop energy would only enhance that effort, I think.
>
>
It seems like we need two things:
1) a website to speak to the world (our our community) about GNOME 3.0 -
that's gnome3.org
2) a place for all those interested in helping with community management to
share stories and ideas - is that this list?

Stormy

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<br><br><div class=3D"gmail_quote">On Wed, Jan 5, 2011 at 2:05 AM, Allan Da=
y <span dir=3D"ltr">&lt;<a href=3D"mailto:allanpday@gmail.com">allanpday@gm=
ail.com</a>&gt;</span> wrote:<br><blockquote class=3D"gmail_quote" style=3D=
"margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex;">

On Tue, 2011-01-04 at 13:50 -0800, Sriram Ramkrishna wrote:<br>
&gt; We&#39;ve never done community management (well or at all) and it migh=
t be<br>
&gt; a good way to do a sales job on our own existing user base who fear<br=
>
&gt; change. =A0It will also prepare us for after the release for questions=
<br>
&gt; that will certainly be forthcoming when we make presentations at<br>
&gt; various conferences. =A0I have two conferences that I&#39;ll be talkin=
g at,<br>
&gt; Open Source Bridge and Linuxfest Northwest. =A0I&#39;ve already put in=
 the<br>
&gt; paperwork for them and I want to make sure that I can address any<br>
&gt; users who might be confrontational.<br>
&gt;<br>
&gt; Making the effort will earn us some brownie points I think.<br>
<br>
*raises hand*<br>
<br>
Me and Sri have discussed this a bit online. There already seems to be<br>
an unorganised effort to do community management on the lists and<br>
channels. Pooling, recycling and generating resources in the fight<br>
against stop energy would only enhance that effort, I think.<br>
<br></blockquote><div><br>It seems like we need two things:<br>1) a website=
 to speak to the world (our our community) about GNOME 3.0 - that&#39;s <a =
href=3D"http://gnome3.org">gnome3.org</a><br>2) a place for all those inter=
ested in helping with community management to share stories and ideas - is =
that this list?<br>

<br>Stormy <br></div></div>

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From nearyd@gmail.com  Wed Jan  5 16:42:12 2011
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Sender: Dave Neary <nearyd@gmail.com>
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Date: Wed, 05 Jan 2011 17:41:18 +0100
From: Dave Neary <dneary@gnome.org>
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To: Stormy Peters <stormy@gnome.org>
Subject: Re: Pre-release marketing and community management [Was: getting
	www.gnome3.org]
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Hi,

Stormy Peters wrote:
> It seems like we need two things:
> 1) a website to speak to the world (our our community) about GNOME 3.0 -
> that's gnome3.org <http://gnome3.org>
> 2) a place for all those interested in helping with community management
> to share stories and ideas - is that this list?

Just to avoid a Vizzini & Inigo Montoya moment later on [1], can I just
ask: what do people here mean when they talk about "community management"?

Cheers,
Dave.

[1] http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=G2y8Sx4B2Sk

-- 
Dave Neary
GNOME Foundation member
dneary@gnome.org
From sri@ramkrishna.me  Wed Jan  5 17:50:30 2011
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From: Sriram Ramkrishna <sri@ramkrishna.me>
Date: Wed, 5 Jan 2011 09:49:55 -0800
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On Wed, Jan 5, 2011 at 8:41 AM, Dave Neary <dneary@gnome.org> wrote:

> Hi,
>
> Stormy Peters wrote:
> > It seems like we need two things:
> > 1) a website to speak to the world (our our community) about GNOME 3.0 -
> > that's gnome3.org <http://gnome3.org>
> > 2) a place for all those interested in helping with community management
> > to share stories and ideas - is that this list?
>
> Just to avoid a Vizzini & Inigo Montoya moment later on [1], can I just
> ask: what do people here mean when they talk about "community management"?
>


I think in this case, we want to be a buffer between devs and enthusiasts.
In general, I want to address the frustration devs feel with having to
continually defend design decisions by people who fear change.  By
continuing to address them and to focus on positive aspects of the Gnome
shell design.  In addition, we can also perhaps turn shrill user enthusiasts
to hopefully people who will contribute positively.

But my motivation is really to get people off devs back so that they can
focus on getting the design done.  And since you decide to give a video
response. I have one in turn. :-)

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Vdc7v4vkbJI

sri

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<br><br><div class=3D"gmail_quote">On Wed, Jan 5, 2011 at 8:41 AM, Dave Nea=
ry <span dir=3D"ltr">&lt;<a href=3D"mailto:dneary@gnome.org">dneary@gnome.o=
rg</a>&gt;</span> wrote:<br><blockquote class=3D"gmail_quote" style=3D"marg=
in:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex;">

Hi,<br>
<div class=3D"im"><br>
Stormy Peters wrote:<br>
&gt; It seems like we need two things:<br>
&gt; 1) a website to speak to the world (our our community) about GNOME 3.0=
 -<br>
</div>&gt; that&#39;s <a href=3D"http://gnome3.org" target=3D"_blank">gnome=
3.org</a> &lt;<a href=3D"http://gnome3.org" target=3D"_blank">http://gnome3=
.org</a>&gt;<br>
<div class=3D"im">&gt; 2) a place for all those interested in helping with =
community management<br>
&gt; to share stories and ideas - is that this list?<br>
<br>
</div>Just to avoid a Vizzini &amp; Inigo Montoya moment later on [1], can =
I just<br>
ask: what do people here mean when they talk about &quot;community manageme=
nt&quot;?<br></blockquote><div><br><br>I think in this case, we want to be =
a buffer between devs and enthusiasts.=A0 In general, I want to address the=
 frustration devs feel with having to continually defend design decisions b=
y people who fear change.=A0 By continuing to address them and to focus on =
positive aspects of the Gnome shell design.=A0 In addition, we can also per=
haps turn shrill user enthusiasts to hopefully people who will contribute p=
ositively.<br>

<br>But my motivation is really to get people off devs back so that they ca=
n focus on getting the design done.=A0 And since you decide to give a video=
 response. I have one in turn. :-)<br><br><a href=3D"http://www.youtube.com=
/watch?v=3DVdc7v4vkbJI">http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3DVdc7v4vkbJI</a><br=
>

<br>sri<br></div></div>

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From: Jason Lo <yet2bedefined@gmail.com>
Date: Wed, 5 Jan 2011 09:54:28 -0800
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It seems to fit more with contact addresses. You said to a previous student
that there were others doing this task as well, and that I should coordinate
my efforts with them to make sure we don't pester the same folks over and
over again. Also, in your post on GCI, you said you would provide emails
that I could send this to.

And I apologize in advance if my updates are a bit more sparse: school is
starting up in my area again.

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It seems to fit more with contact addresses. You said to a previous
student that there were others doing this task as well, and that I
should coordinate my efforts with them to make sure we don&#39;t pester the
same folks over and over again. Also, in your post on GCI, you said you
would provide emails that I could send this to.<br>
<br>And I apologize in advance if my updates are a bit more sparse: school is starting up in my area again.

--0016362844f2d0deaf04991d1432--
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Sender: Dave Neary <nearyd@gmail.com>
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Subject: Re: GCI: Update Gnome Usergroup Info, Introduction
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Hi,

Jason Lo wrote:
> It seems to fit more with contact addresses. You said to a previous
> student that there were others doing this task as well, and that I
> should coordinate my efforts with them to make sure we don't pester the
> same folks over and over again. Also, in your post on GCI, you said you
> would provide emails that I could send this to.

There is the gugmasters list:
http://mail.gnome.org/mailman/listinfo/gugmasters-list - but I think if
you mail the list, you will not get a good response rate. Worth trying -
but if you don't get a good response rate, we can try & send an email to
each member individually. Perhaps I could do it on your behalf...

The other contacts are those in this wiki page. The list of lists you
point to is OK, but bear in mind that mailing a list is hit & miss at
best. You might get a better response rate by sending an email to the
"Contact" field, if it's set. The French one is definitely out of date,
though :) You should contact Vincent Untz instead.

There is also a GNOME developing world list: developing-world-list - I
don't really know who's on it.

You will need to be persistent, and make sure you keep us posted on what
groups you have information for, and which you don't, when information
starts coming in.

Thanks!
Dave.

-- 
Dave Neary
GNOME Foundation member
dneary@gnome.org
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Subject: Re: Pre-release marketing and community management [Was: getting
	www.gnome3.org]
From: Allan Day <allanpday@gmail.com>
To: Sriram Ramkrishna <sri@ramkrishna.me>
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Date: Thu, 06 Jan 2011 10:32:54 +0000
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Sriram Ramkrishna wrote:
> 
> 
> On Wed, Jan 5, 2011 at 8:41 AM, Dave Neary <dneary@gnome.org> wrote:
>         Hi,
>         
>         Stormy Peters wrote:
>         > It seems like we need two things:
>         > 1) a website to speak to the world (our our community) about
>         GNOME 3.0 -
>         
>         > that's gnome3.org <http://gnome3.org>
>         > 2) a place for all those interested in helping with
>         community management
>         > to share stories and ideas - is that this list?
>         
>         
>         Just to avoid a Vizzini & Inigo Montoya moment later on [1],
>         can I just
>         ask: what do people here mean when they talk about "community
>         management"?
> 
> 
> I think in this case, we want to be a buffer between devs and
> enthusiasts.  In general, I want to address the frustration devs feel
> with having to continually defend design decisions by people who fear
> change.  By continuing to address them and to focus on positive
> aspects of the Gnome shell design.  In addition, we can also perhaps
> turn shrill user enthusiasts to hopefully people who will contribute
> positively.
> 
> But my motivation is really to get people off devs back so that they
> can focus on getting the design done.  And since you decide to give a
> video response. I have one in turn. :-)

Personally speaking, I'd add a few other ambitions:

 * Ensuring that those from outside the project have a positive
experience when they come into contact with GNOME. A bit more
micromanagement here would help our public relations, I think.

 * Communicating and explaining the direction of the project. 3 dot oh
involves some big changes and our community would benefit from some
positive messages in that regard.

Do those sound useful? 

Also: GNOME 3 is going to be met with criticism. We don't know how much,
but there's definitely going to be some. Sri made a really good point to
me the other day - we need well-rehearsed and effective responses to
those criticisms, and this kind of community management is an
opportunity to identify and rehearse those arguments. Maybe we could
work together to produce some kind of PR play sheet? Or would that be
taking things too far?

Allan
-- 
Blog: http://afaikblog.wordpress.com/
IRC: aday on irc.gnome.org

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On 01/05/2011 03:01 PM, Paul Cutler wrote:
> Hi Allan,
>
> Thanks for kicking off this discussion.
>
> Andreas and I did some work on GNOME3.org which can be found on Github:
>
> https://github.com/andreasn/gnome3-website
>
> We were pretty close - the design is done and some of the copy needs
> to be updated.  We were waiting for some videos and screenshots and
> then we wanted to launch it, but it's a bit stalled.  I don't see any
> reason we couldn't take it, update the screenshots and copy, and
> launch it fairly quickly.
Agreed, this page have been to long in the making. Doing some 
screenshots instead of videos for now sounds like a good compromise. 
Will fix some screenshots, kill some content (the a11y, devs and 
applications pages for now, until we have some content for those) and 
hopefully we can get something live maybe this weekend (this probably 
means next week).
- Andreas
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To: Lucas Rocha <lucasr@gnome.org>
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Lucas,

Paul Cutler has already pushed the text to the /friends/ directory in
gnomewml. Could you make the changes for us?

Thanks,
-- 
Og B. Maciel
GNOME Foundation Board of Directors

omaciel@foresightlinux.org
ogmaciel@gnome.org

GPG Keys: D5CFC202

http://www.ogmaciel.com (en_US)
http://blog.ogmaciel.com (pt_BR)
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Subject: A few pending items for FoG updates
From: Og Maciel <ogmaciel@gnome.org>
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Quick questions (sorry, I'm in the middle of a release at work):

* What is the status of the video campaign?
* Joey: how about the text for the magazine adds you were going to show us?
* Before the end of last year we had an IRC meeting and I was asked
about the objectives of our FoG campaign... I feel that we don't seem
to have a clear message as to what this campaign is for (do we have a
goal other than getting 400 new subscriptions?) and I would like to
know that before a battery of posts and social media messages.

Thanks in advance,
-- 
Og B. Maciel
GNOME Foundation Board of Directors

omaciel@foresightlinux.org
ogmaciel@gnome.org

GPG Keys: D5CFC202

http://www.ogmaciel.com (en_US)
http://blog.ogmaciel.com (pt_BR)
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Sender: Dave Neary <nearyd@gmail.com>
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Subject: Re: Pre-release marketing and community management [Was: getting
	www.gnome3.org]
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Hi,

Allan Day wrote:
> Sriram Ramkrishna wrote:
>> I think in this case, we want to be a buffer between devs and
>> enthusiasts.

Ah... I'm not a big fan of buffers. I prefer trying to quieten people
down when they're distracting. That means channelling the noise
elsewhere, and perhaps taking a slightly drastic measure of moderating
all posts to d-d-l for a few months.

>> In general, I want to address the frustration devs feel
>> with having to continually defend design decisions by people who fear
>> change.

Characterising any questions/queries/doubts/fears about GNOME 3 as
"people who fear change" is not going to win friends and influence
people. We need to start framing the way we talk about this issue
correctly, because the way we talk about it affects the way we think
about it, affects the way others perceive us.

>> But my motivation is really to get people off devs back so that they
>> can focus on getting the design done.

So - to summarise: the problems I've seen are:

* A lot of GNOME members (be it foundation members, translators, members
of teams not directly involved in the shell, even members of the release
team, but also those "shrill activists") do not have all of the
rationale & thought processes that have gone into GNOME Shell. Most
people have not been following the shell list or the release team
archives. So some major decisions are coming out piecemeal and are
presented as faits accomplis - "this is the way things are, live with
it". The shell team and release team have not been their own best friend
in this respect.

* There appears to be cognitive dissonance between the resources that
some GNOME people believe are there for maintenance and the resources
that are actually there - esp. related to fallback mode - panel +
applets + metacity.

* A lot of people (myself included) are worried whether we're going to
need hardware that a substantial proportion of our user base just don't
have.

And we can fix all these things by:

(To fill the knowledge gap:)
 - Documenting any major design decisions made in the shell and their
rationale, and presenting those in a nicer way
 - Ensure that the release team is also framing things in a nicer way,
and explaining the rationale behind things rather than just saying
"that's the why". Notably, I think the release team should say that
panel support is a question of manpower not policy, and it'd be nice if
Jon backed that up.
 - We need to start talking about all that's good in shell, what it
brings to the table, and why it's better than what went before. Videos,
success stories, interviews with happy users, all that kind of thing

(To be clear on what we want to see done but can't commit to, versus
what we definitely don't want to see done)
 - Help the release team and the shell team draft a "Here's stuff we're
against" list (with justifications) and "Here's stuff we'd like to see
in GNOME 3.0, but there's just no way we can commit to getting it done
with the resources we have" (things like Orca) - I'd also live to see
the GNOME project as a whole be clearer on who's involved in the actual
maintenance of core modules and what developer resources there actually
are - I'd estimate it at 40 to 50 full time developers, but I suspect
I'm on the high side there.

(To allay fears of hardware compat issues)
 - Draw up a list of graphics cards used in desktop hardware in the past
3 to 5 years, ordered by market share/volume of sales, and match that to
current compatibility of free software drivers for the hardware with the
3D requirements of Clutter. Ideally, someone with a GNOME 2.x desktop
should be able to run a command, get a chipset, and be able to tell
before he installs how well GNOME 3 will work.
 - Start publishing screenshots of fallback mode on chipsets that don't
support it & making sure it's still a nice experience.

> Personally speaking, I'd add a few other ambitions:
> 
>  * Ensuring that those from outside the project have a positive
> experience when they come into contact with GNOME. A bit more
> micromanagement here would help our public relations, I think.

This is a vast task, and I'm not sure how we can make a big dent in it
with limited volunteer resources - even doing basic communication of the
project goals and allaying concerns people have is probably more than we
can manage, but it is pretty much a minimum.

>  * Communicating and explaining the direction of the project. 3 dot oh
> involves some big changes and our community would benefit from some
> positive messages in that regard.

Absolutely agree.

> Do those sound useful? 
> 
> Also: GNOME 3 is going to be met with criticism. We don't know how much,
> but there's definitely going to be some. Sri made a really good point to
> me the other day - we need well-rehearsed and effective responses to
> those criticisms, and this kind of community management is an
> opportunity to identify and rehearse those arguments. Maybe we could
> work together to produce some kind of PR play sheet? Or would that be
> taking things too far?

A FAQ will help for the most predictable criticisms, and a list of
talking points (the "what's great about GNOME 3" list I mentioned above)
should help us frame the messaging around the release in March, and
everyone giving interviews or presentations should have these down pat.

That's a big list of stuff though... Who can give time, to do what, over
the next few weeks?

Cheers,
Dave.

-- 
Dave Neary
GNOME Foundation member
dneary@gnome.org
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Subject: Re: Pre-release marketing and community management [Was: getting
	www.gnome3.org]
From: Allan Day <allanpday@gmail.com>
To: Dave Neary <dneary@gnome.org>
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Dave Neary wrote:
> Hi,
> 
> Allan Day wrote:
> > Sriram Ramkrishna wrote:
> >> I think in this case, we want to be a buffer between devs and
> >> enthusiasts.
> 
> Ah... I'm not a big fan of buffers. I prefer trying to quieten people
> down when they're distracting. That means channelling the noise
> elsewhere, and perhaps taking a slightly drastic measure of moderating
> all posts to d-d-l for a few months.
> 
> >> In general, I want to address the frustration devs feel
> >> with having to continually defend design decisions by people who fear
> >> change.
> 
> Characterising any questions/queries/doubts/fears about GNOME 3 as
> "people who fear change" is not going to win friends and influence
> people. We need to start framing the way we talk about this issue
> correctly, because the way we talk about it affects the way we think
> about it, affects the way others perceive us.
> 
> >> But my motivation is really to get people off devs back so that they
> >> can focus on getting the design done.
> 
> So - to summarise: the problems I've seen are:
> 
> * A lot of GNOME members (be it foundation members, translators, members
> of teams not directly involved in the shell, even members of the release
> team, but also those "shrill activists") do not have all of the
> rationale & thought processes that have gone into GNOME Shell. Most
> people have not been following the shell list or the release team
> archives. So some major decisions are coming out piecemeal and are
> presented as faits accomplis - "this is the way things are, live with
> it". The shell team and release team have not been their own best friend
> in this respect.
> 
> * There appears to be cognitive dissonance between the resources that
> some GNOME people believe are there for maintenance and the resources
> that are actually there - esp. related to fallback mode - panel +
> applets + metacity.

This is something that I tried to clarify in a recent message to
desktop-devel [1]. We need an easy to understand statement here and we
need to spread it round a bit.

> * A lot of people (myself included) are worried whether we're going to
> need hardware that a substantial proportion of our user base just don't
> have.
> 
> And we can fix all these things by:
> 
> (To fill the knowledge gap:)
>  - Documenting any major design decisions made in the shell and their
> rationale, and presenting those in a nicer way
>  - Ensure that the release team is also framing things in a nicer way,
> and explaining the rationale behind things rather than just saying
> "that's the why". Notably, I think the release team should say that
> panel support is a question of manpower not policy, and it'd be nice if
> Jon backed that up.
>  - We need to start talking about all that's good in shell, what it
> brings to the table, and why it's better than what went before. Videos,
> success stories, interviews with happy users, all that kind of thing

The first priority is to get some positive marketing on the shell out
there. I'm working on the text for gnome3.org and Andreas is working on
the site. Getting that up will be a good first step.

I'm also planning to blog about some user testing I've been doing on
GNOME Shell. That will hopefully allay a few fears.

Another item that is high on my list is to turn the shell design page
[2] into something positive and explanatory. Not sure when I'll get to
that, but I'll try not to let it slip.

> (To be clear on what we want to see done but can't commit to, versus
> what we definitely don't want to see done)
>  - Help the release team and the shell team draft a "Here's stuff we're
> against" list (with justifications) and "Here's stuff we'd like to see
> in GNOME 3.0, but there's just no way we can commit to getting it done
> with the resources we have" (things like Orca) - I'd also live to see
> the GNOME project as a whole be clearer on who's involved in the actual
> maintenance of core modules and what developer resources there actually
> are - I'd estimate it at 40 to 50 full time developers, but I suspect
> I'm on the high side there.
> 
> (To allay fears of hardware compat issues)
>  - Draw up a list of graphics cards used in desktop hardware in the past
> 3 to 5 years, ordered by market share/volume of sales, and match that to
> current compatibility of free software drivers for the hardware with the
> 3D requirements of Clutter. Ideally, someone with a GNOME 2.x desktop
> should be able to run a command, get a chipset, and be able to tell
> before he installs how well GNOME 3 will work.

It'd be awesome if we had this.

We also need a realistic marketing message wrt hardware requirements.
Some people won't be able to run the Shell, and it does us no favours to
pretend otherwise. But we can still give a positive message here: 'GNOME
3 is a cutting edge desktop built not just for today but also for the
future; the GNOME project and its partners are working hard on ensuring
that everybody will be able to enjoy the benefits it brings.'

>  - Start publishing screenshots of fallback mode on chipsets that don't
> support it & making sure it's still a nice experience.

This is tricky. I'm personally unconvinced that we can have a coherent
marketing strategy and promote two desktop interfaces. Saying 'we also
have this other desktop which is really good' will just dilute the
message. There will be people who are unable to use GNOME Shell, and we
don't want them feeling too bitter but, to be honest, we *do* want them
to feel like they are missing out. GNOME 3 is a great product that they
should want to have.

> > Personally speaking, I'd add a few other ambitions:
> > 
> >  * Ensuring that those from outside the project have a positive
> > experience when they come into contact with GNOME. A bit more
> > micromanagement here would help our public relations, I think.
> 
> This is a vast task, and I'm not sure how we can make a big dent in it
> with limited volunteer resources - even doing basic communication of the
> project goals and allaying concerns people have is probably more than we
> can manage, but it is pretty much a minimum.

Yeah, it's a big job, and I'm not proposing that we attempt to take care
of the whole thing (though that would be nice :) ). The idea, as I
understand it, is merely to be more more efficient in what is happening
already and to hone our 3.0 PR skills before the big event. That
basically means sharing resources (and developing them if possible) and
experiences.

> >  * Communicating and explaining the direction of the project. 3 dot oh
> > involves some big changes and our community would benefit from some
> > positive messages in that regard.
> 
> Absolutely agree.
> 
> > Do those sound useful? 
> > 
> > Also: GNOME 3 is going to be met with criticism. We don't know how much,
> > but there's definitely going to be some. Sri made a really good point to
> > me the other day - we need well-rehearsed and effective responses to
> > those criticisms, and this kind of community management is an
> > opportunity to identify and rehearse those arguments. Maybe we could
> > work together to produce some kind of PR play sheet? Or would that be
> > taking things too far?
> 
> A FAQ will help for the most predictable criticisms, and a list of
> talking points (the "what's great about GNOME 3" list I mentioned above)
> should help us frame the messaging around the release in March, and
> everyone giving interviews or presentations should have these down pat.

gnome3.org will do much of this. Do we need anything else? (That's a
serious question - there might be.)

> That's a big list of stuff though... Who can give time, to do what, over
> the next few weeks?

You've got my to do list. :) It would be awesome if others wanted to
chip in (if they aren't already). The more we do before the release, the
better the reception will be. The clock is ticking!

Allan

[1]
http://mail.gnome.org/archives/desktop-devel-list/2011-January/msg00059.html
[2] http://live.gnome.org/GnomeShell/Design

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Sender: Dave Neary <nearyd@gmail.com>
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Date: Thu, 06 Jan 2011 19:14:34 +0100
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Hi,

Allan Day wrote:
> Dave Neary wrote:
> This is something that I tried to clarify in a recent message to
> desktop-devel [1]. We need an easy to understand statement here and we
> need to spread it round a bit.

There might be some usable data we can get from gitdm on the number of
code committers in GNOME modules?

>>  - We need to start talking about all that's good in shell, what it
>> brings to the table, and why it's better than what went before. Videos,
>> success stories, interviews with happy users, all that kind of thing
> 
> The first priority is to get some positive marketing on the shell out
> there. I'm working on the text for gnome3.org and Andreas is working on
> the site. Getting that up will be a good first step.

I agree. Wasn't there an original vision document for shell that framed
the design in terms of the stuff that we wanted to make easy, and the
broken stuff we wanted to fix? I remember reading somethhing like that a
couple of years back. That would be a great start.

> Another item that is high on my list is to turn the shell design page
> [2] into something positive and explanatory. Not sure when I'll get to
> that, but I'll try not to let it slip.

Cool.

>> (To allay fears of hardware compat issues)
>>  - Draw up a list of graphics cards used in desktop hardware in the past
>> 3 to 5 years, ordered by market share/volume of sales, and match that to
>> current compatibility of free software drivers for the hardware with the
>> 3D requirements of Clutter. Ideally, someone with a GNOME 2.x desktop
>> should be able to run a command, get a chipset, and be able to tell
>> before he installs how well GNOME 3 will work.
> 
> It'd be awesome if we had this.

Someone suggested that the Linux Foundation might be able to help... I
think Xorg would be a good place to start too.

I found another site with a list of a bucketload of graphics cards:
http://worldwindcentral.com/wiki/Video_Card_Compatibility

> We also need a realistic marketing message wrt hardware requirements.
> Some people won't be able to run the Shell, and it does us no favours to
> pretend otherwise. But we can still give a positive message here: 'GNOME
> 3 is a cutting edge desktop built not just for today but also for the
> future; the GNOME project and its partners are working hard on ensuring
> that everybody will be able to enjoy the benefits it brings.'

Yeah - turning the "not everyone will be able to run Shell" into a
positive is important, but it also makes it important that we allow
people to know beforehand whether they can expect it to work or not, and
that we reassure people to the user experience they get if their
hardware isn't supported and they do upgrade.

>>  - Start publishing screenshots of fallback mode on chipsets that don't
>> support it & making sure it's still a nice experience.
> 
> This is tricky. I'm personally unconvinced that we can have a coherent
> marketing strategy and promote two desktop interfaces. Saying 'we also
> have this other desktop which is really good' will just dilute the
> message. There will be people who are unable to use GNOME Shell, and we
> don't want them feeling too bitter but, to be honest, we *do* want them
> to feel like they are missing out. GNOME 3 is a great product that they
> should want to have.

I see it more as "We're not leaving our users behind, even if your
hardware isn't supported, you can upgrade to get the benefit of the
latest releases of your favourite applications, in a simplified 2D
desktop experience" (or something like that). People upgrade for the
distro, or for the apps, not necessarily for the desktop environment.

> Yeah, it's a big job, and I'm not proposing that we attempt to take care
> of the whole thing (though that would be nice :) ). The idea, as I
> understand it, is merely to be more more efficient in what is happening
> already and to hone our 3.0 PR skills before the big event. That
> basically means sharing resources (and developing them if possible) and
> experiences.

And positioning members of the team as legitimate people to answer
classes of questions. If members of the marketing team aren't empowered
to handle questions, intervene to moderate threads, etc. all the good
will in the world won't make a difference. What's that saying? "What do
you call a leader with no followers? A guy taking a walk."

>> A FAQ will help for the most predictable criticisms, and a list of
>> talking points (the "what's great about GNOME 3" list I mentioned above)
>> should help us frame the messaging around the release in March, and
>> everyone giving interviews or presentations should have these down pat.
> 
> gnome3.org will do much of this. Do we need anything else? (That's a
> serious question - there might be.)

Somemedia training & half a dozen people who can handle local media
enquiries and a co-ordinated conference drive where we try to get people
giving presentations at conferences like SCALE, OLF, LinuxTag, etc would
be good too.

Cheers,
Dave.

-- 
Dave Neary
GNOME Foundation member
dneary@gnome.org
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Hi,

Dave Neary wrote:
> (To allay fears of hardware compat issues)
>  - Draw up a list of graphics cards used in desktop hardware in the past
> 3 to 5 years, ordered by market share/volume of sales, and match that to
> current compatibility of free software drivers for the hardware with the
> 3D requirements of Clutter. Ideally, someone with a GNOME 2.x desktop
> should be able to run a command, get a chipset, and be able to tell
> before he installs how well GNOME 3 will work.

I found this:
http://www.notebookcheck.net/Mobile-Graphics-Cards-Benchmark-List.844.0.html

Which is a list of currently commercially available graphics cards

This list doesn't cover all the SIS, Via, S3 or Matrox cards that are
still out in the wild, but it's a list that probably covers >99% of
shipped desktops, laptops and nettops.

And this: http://www.x.org/wiki/Projects/Drivers - which is a list of
Xorg drivers.

Cheers,
Dave.

-- 
Dave Neary
GNOME Foundation member
dneary@gnome.org
From sri@ramkrishna.me  Thu Jan  6 18:38:47 2011
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On Thu, Jan 6, 2011 at 9:33 AM, Dave Neary <dneary@gnome.org> wrote:

> Hi,
>
> Dave Neary wrote:
> > (To allay fears of hardware compat issues)
> >  - Draw up a list of graphics cards used in desktop hardware in the past
> > 3 to 5 years, ordered by market share/volume of sales, and match that to
> > current compatibility of free software drivers for the hardware with the
> > 3D requirements of Clutter. Ideally, someone with a GNOME 2.x desktop
> > should be able to run a command, get a chipset, and be able to tell
> > before he installs how well GNOME 3 will work.
>
> I found this:
>
> http://www.notebookcheck.net/Mobile-Graphics-Cards-Benchmark-List.844.0.html
>
> Which is a list of currently commercially available graphics cards
>

Sounds like we could get a matrix list going and send a call out for
volunteers to try it on the various chipsets.  It is probably too early to
do that just yet as jhbuilds of gnome-shell is still not quite stable.
We'll need to figure out when is an appropriate time to do that.  If there
is a separate testing mechanism for clutter that we could use that would be
great.  Probably ask ebassi about that.

Are we including Wayland on this as well?  Probably not I guess.

sri

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<br><br><div class=3D"gmail_quote">On Thu, Jan 6, 2011 at 9:33 AM, Dave Nea=
ry <span dir=3D"ltr">&lt;<a href=3D"mailto:dneary@gnome.org">dneary@gnome.o=
rg</a>&gt;</span> wrote:<br><blockquote class=3D"gmail_quote" style=3D"marg=
in:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex;">

Hi,<br>
<div class=3D"im"><br>
Dave Neary wrote:<br>
&gt; (To allay fears of hardware compat issues)<br>
&gt; =A0- Draw up a list of graphics cards used in desktop hardware in the =
past<br>
&gt; 3 to 5 years, ordered by market share/volume of sales, and match that =
to<br>
&gt; current compatibility of free software drivers for the hardware with t=
he<br>
&gt; 3D requirements of Clutter. Ideally, someone with a GNOME 2.x desktop<=
br>
&gt; should be able to run a command, get a chipset, and be able to tell<br=
>
&gt; before he installs how well GNOME 3 will work.<br>
<br>
</div>I found this:<br>
<a href=3D"http://www.notebookcheck.net/Mobile-Graphics-Cards-Benchmark-Lis=
t.844.0.html" target=3D"_blank">http://www.notebookcheck.net/Mobile-Graphic=
s-Cards-Benchmark-List.844.0.html</a><br>
<br>
Which is a list of currently commercially available graphics cards<br></blo=
ckquote><div><br>Sounds like we could get a matrix list going and send a ca=
ll out for volunteers to try it on the various chipsets.=A0 It is probably =
too early to do that just yet as jhbuilds of gnome-shell is still not quite=
 stable.=A0 We&#39;ll need to figure out when is an appropriate time to do =
that.=A0 If there is a separate testing mechanism for clutter that we could=
 use that would be great.=A0 Probably ask ebassi about that.<br>

<br></div>Are we including Wayland on this as well?=A0 Probably not I guess=
.<br><br>sri<br></div>

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From: Sriram Ramkrishna <sri@ramkrishna.me>
Date: Thu, 6 Jan 2011 11:14:53 -0800
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Subject: Re: Pre-release marketing and community management [Was: getting
	www.gnome3.org]
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Hi Dave, thanks for your thoughtful response.. my comments below.

On Thu, Jan 6, 2011 at 7:32 AM, Dave Neary <dneary@gnome.org> wrote:

> Hi,
>
> Allan Day wrote:
> > Sriram Ramkrishna wrote:
> >> I think in this case, we want to be a buffer between devs and
> >> enthusiasts.
>
> Ah... I'm not a big fan of buffers. I prefer trying to quieten people
> down when they're distracting. That means channelling the noise
> elsewhere, and perhaps taking a slightly drastic measure of moderating
> all posts to d-d-l for a few months.
>


I think that is the action, but to be more succinct, I am saying that devs
don't have to do this.  For the most part they aren't but there are a number
of us who are advocating for gnome-shell but we're doing it in a vacuum.
I'm merely trying to get those people together to do exactly what we are
doing now but in a more cohesive manner.

If you moderate, you'll have a lot more angry people since it seems like
you're trying to shut them up.  They'll complain somewhere else.  Better to
let them talk and if they break the Code of Conduct, then we have grounds to
kick them off the mailing list or put them into a position where all their
posts have to be approved. Olav did something similar for Lefty on the
foundation-list.  That is a good example of managing the mailing list.  It's
imperative we let them talk and just as imperative we respond with data.
And continue to respond.  This wears out devs but it won't wear us down
we're emotionally geared for it.


>
> >> In general, I want to address the frustration devs feel
> >> with having to continually defend design decisions by people who fear
> >> change.
>
> Characterising any questions/queries/doubts/fears about GNOME 3 as
> "people who fear change" is not going to win friends and influence
> people. We need to start framing the way we talk about this issue
> correctly, because the way we talk about it affects the way we think
> about it, affects the way others perceive us.
>

OK, point taken. Let's modify that argument instead to "people who are
worried as there isn't any documented evidence that this design is going to
work".  We do not have official Gnome usability studies to back up our
design of shell.  We need something that we can point to that says that we
thought of all possibilities.  When there is a lack of evidence then indeed
people do fear change.  I know Jon and others are using research material,
books and what not to back up their design and they have done some internal
testing.  None of which is public.


> >> But my motivation is really to get people off devs back so that they
> >> can focus on getting the design done.
>
> So - to summarise: the problems I've seen are:
>

Identifying the problems and figuring out how to resolve them the first step
at all.  So I'm glad we are having this conversation because nobody else.
Managing the people side is important since we do need to depend on these
people to spread word of mouth on Gnome 3.0.


>
> * A lot of GNOME members (be it foundation members, translators, members
> of teams not directly involved in the shell, even members of the release
> team, but also those "shrill activists") do not have all of the
> rationale & thought processes that have gone into GNOME Shell. Most
> people have not been following the shell list or the release team
> archives. So some major decisions are coming out piecemeal and are
> presented as faits accomplis - "this is the way things are, live with
> it". The shell team and release team have not been their own best friend
> in this respect.
>

This.  You've definitely identified one problem here.  There is no action to
plan so to speak.  We look for documentation and there is nothing there.
Right now, I feel new features are coming out in piecemeal.  I think that's
somewhat OK, provided that we have a quarterly update on what that is so
that we can at least point to it somewhere in a clear concise manner.

* There appears to be cognitive dissonance between the resources that
> some GNOME people believe are there for maintenance and the resources
> that are actually there - esp. related to fallback mode - panel +
> applets + metacity.
>

I'm not sure I understand this point regarding maintenance.  Are you
referring to the maintenance of gnome 2.0?


>
> * A lot of people (myself included) are worried whether we're going to
> need hardware that a substantial proportion of our user base just don't
> have.
>


I'm less worried about this.  I make the assumption that clutter is going to
work on any hardware where compiz works.  In which case, I would argue that
Ubuntu is making the exact risk we are by moving to Unity.  Their "fail
back" is on the same metacity, or probably whatever other third party window
manager is out there.  I rather we work harder on making clutter work on as
many hardware devices to get as many of our existing user base as we can.


>
> And we can fix all these things by:
>
> (To fill the knowledge gap:)
>  - Documenting any major design decisions made in the shell and their
> rationale, and presenting those in a nicer way
>  - Ensure that the release team is also framing things in a nicer way,
> and explaining the rationale behind things rather than just saying
> "that's the why". Notably, I think the release team should say that
> panel support is a question of manpower not policy, and it'd be nice if
> Jon backed that up.
>  - We need to start talking about all that's good in shell, what it
> brings to the table, and why it's better than what went before. Videos,
> success stories, interviews with happy users, all that kind of thing
>

I think this is pretty much what community management is. :-)  Talk to
stakeholders, get them to document what they are doing, give a unified
consistent view of Gnome 3.0 to the community that we've extracted from
stakeholders.I've been bothered by the whole communication of Gnome 3.0 and
its feature set for a couple of months now just from the perspective how we
are going to market this.

I think you're list is a good start.


> (To be clear on what we want to see done but can't commit to, versus
> what we definitely don't want to see done)
>  - Help the release team and the shell team draft a "Here's stuff we're
> against" list (with justifications) and "Here's stuff we'd like to see
> in GNOME 3.0, but there's just no way we can commit to getting it done
> with the resources we have" (things like Orca) - I'd also live to see
> the GNOME project as a whole be clearer on who's involved in the actual
> maintenance of core modules and what developer resources there actually
> are - I'd estimate it at 40 to 50 full time developers, but I suspect
> I'm on the high side there.
>
>
I think as I pointed out before, not everything is going to be feature
complete at launch.  It will take some cycles before we are on par with
Gnome 2.x.  That especially is important since a lot of people expect to
just change over.  A document on who should switch might be in order.


> (To allay fears of hardware compat issues)
>  - Draw up a list of graphics cards used in desktop hardware in the past
> 3 to 5 years, ordered by market share/volume of sales, and match that to
> current compatibility of free software drivers for the hardware with the
> 3D requirements of Clutter. Ideally, someone with a GNOME 2.x desktop
> should be able to run a command, get a chipset, and be able to tell
> before he installs how well GNOME 3 will work.
>

I wonder if Emmanuelle has some kind of perf tool for clutter.  That would
make things simpler with an auto submission.


>  - Start publishing screenshots of fallback mode on chipsets that don't
> support it & making sure it's still a nice experience.
>
>
Agreed.


> > Personally speaking, I'd add a few other ambitions:
> >
> >  * Ensuring that those from outside the project have a positive
> > experience when they come into contact with GNOME. A bit more
> > micromanagement here would help our public relations, I think.
>
> This is a vast task, and I'm not sure how we can make a big dent in it
> with limited volunteer resources - even doing basic communication of the
> project goals and allaying concerns people have is probably more than we
> can manage, but it is pretty much a minimum.
>
>
Yes, and that's why I believe that talking to people who are doing this
engagement already and working together will help.


>  >  * Communicating and explaining the direction of the project. 3 dot oh
> > involves some big changes and our community would benefit from some
> > positive messages in that regard.
>
> Absolutely agree.
>
> > Do those sound useful?
> >
> > Also: GNOME 3 is going to be met with criticism. We don't know how much,
> > but there's definitely going to be some. Sri made a really good point to
> > me the other day - we need well-rehearsed and effective responses to
> > those criticisms, and this kind of community management is an
> > opportunity to identify and rehearse those arguments. Maybe we could
> > work together to produce some kind of PR play sheet? Or would that be
> > taking things too far?
>
> A FAQ will help for the most predictable criticisms, and a list of
> talking points (the "what's great about GNOME 3" list I mentioned above)
> should help us frame the messaging around the release in March, and
> everyone giving interviews or presentations should have these down pat.
>

Shell has a FAQ it's not really getting updated.  In fact we have all kinds
of documentation, but it's not presented in a single area (eg gnome3.org)
and it is not present.  Secondly, no matter how much documentation you have
out there people will not read it.  That's why engagement has to be part of
the equation.  Also we need to constantly in the front page and others to
point to gnome 3.0.  A banner on w.g.o saying "are you ready for gnome 3?"
pointing to the website would be another refinement.


>
> That's a big list of stuff though... Who can give time, to do what, over
> the next few weeks?
>
>
I'm willing to do some work.  I have a bit of a break before things start
picking up again.

sri

--20cf30549b0b4b06380499325271
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Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

Hi Dave, thanks for your thoughtful response.. my comments below.<br><br><d=
iv class=3D"gmail_quote">On Thu, Jan 6, 2011 at 7:32 AM, Dave Neary <span d=
ir=3D"ltr">&lt;<a href=3D"mailto:dneary@gnome.org">dneary@gnome.org</a>&gt;=
</span> wrote:<br>

<blockquote class=3D"gmail_quote" style=3D"margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1p=
x #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex;">Hi,<br>
<br>
Allan Day wrote:<br>
<div class=3D"im">&gt; Sriram Ramkrishna wrote:<br>
&gt;&gt; I think in this case, we want to be a buffer between devs and<br>
&gt;&gt; enthusiasts.<br>
<br>
</div>Ah... I&#39;m not a big fan of buffers. I prefer trying to quieten pe=
ople<br>
down when they&#39;re distracting. That means channelling the noise<br>
elsewhere, and perhaps taking a slightly drastic measure of moderating<br>
all posts to d-d-l for a few months.<br></blockquote><div><br><br>I think t=
hat is the action, but to be more succinct, I am saying that devs don&#39;t=
 have to do this.=A0 For the most part they aren&#39;t but there are a numb=
er of us who are advocating for gnome-shell but we&#39;re doing it in a vac=
uum.=A0 I&#39;m merely trying to get those people together to do exactly wh=
at we are doing now but in a more cohesive manner.<br>

<br>If you moderate, you&#39;ll have a lot more angry people since it seems=
 like you&#39;re trying to shut them up.=A0 They&#39;ll complain somewhere =
else.=A0 Better to let them talk and if they break the Code of Conduct, the=
n we have grounds to kick them off the mailing list or put them into a posi=
tion where all their posts have to be approved. Olav did something similar =
for Lefty on the foundation-list.=A0 That is a good example of managing the=
 mailing list.=A0 It&#39;s imperative we let them talk and just as imperati=
ve we respond with data.=A0 And continue to respond.=A0 This wears out devs=
 but it won&#39;t wear us down we&#39;re emotionally geared for it.<br>

=A0<br></div><blockquote class=3D"gmail_quote" style=3D"margin: 0pt 0pt 0pt=
 0.8ex; border-left: 1px solid rgb(204, 204, 204); padding-left: 1ex;">
<div class=3D"im"><br>
&gt;&gt; In general, I want to address the frustration devs feel<br>
&gt;&gt; with having to continually defend design decisions by people who f=
ear<br>
&gt;&gt; change.<br>
<br>
</div>Characterising any questions/queries/doubts/fears about GNOME 3 as<br=
>
&quot;people who fear change&quot; is not going to win friends and influenc=
e<br>
people. We need to start framing the way we talk about this issue<br>
correctly, because the way we talk about it affects the way we think<br>
about it, affects the way others perceive us.<br></blockquote><div><br>OK, =
point taken. Let&#39;s modify that argument instead to &quot;people who are=
 worried as there isn&#39;t any documented evidence that this design is goi=
ng to work&quot;.=A0 We do not have official Gnome usability studies to bac=
k up our=A0 design of shell.=A0 We need something that we can point to that=
 says that we thought of all possibilities.=A0 When there is a lack of evid=
ence then indeed people do fear change.=A0 I know Jon and others are using =
research material, books and what not to back up their design and they have=
 done some internal testing.=A0 None of which is public.<br>

<br></div><blockquote class=3D"gmail_quote" style=3D"margin: 0pt 0pt 0pt 0.=
8ex; border-left: 1px solid rgb(204, 204, 204); padding-left: 1ex;">
<div class=3D"im"><br>
&gt;&gt; But my motivation is really to get people off devs back so that th=
ey<br>
&gt;&gt; can focus on getting the design done.<br>
<br>
</div>So - to summarise: the problems I&#39;ve seen are:<br></blockquote><d=
iv><br>Identifying the problems and figuring out how to resolve them the fi=
rst step at all.=A0 So I&#39;m glad we are having this conversation because=
 nobody else.=A0 Managing the people side is important since we do need to =
depend on these people to spread word of mouth on Gnome 3.0.<br>

=A0<br></div><blockquote class=3D"gmail_quote" style=3D"margin: 0pt 0pt 0pt=
 0.8ex; border-left: 1px solid rgb(204, 204, 204); padding-left: 1ex;">
<br>
* A lot of GNOME members (be it foundation members, translators, members<br=
>
of teams not directly involved in the shell, even members of the release<br=
>
team, but also those &quot;shrill activists&quot;) do not have all of the<b=
r>
rationale &amp; thought processes that have gone into GNOME Shell. Most<br>
people have not been following the shell list or the release team<br>
archives. So some major decisions are coming out piecemeal and are<br>
presented as faits accomplis - &quot;this is the way things are, live with<=
br>
it&quot;. The shell team and release team have not been their own best frie=
nd<br>
in this respect.<br></blockquote><div><br>This.=A0 You&#39;ve definitely id=
entified one problem here.=A0 There is no action to plan so to speak.=A0 We=
 look for documentation and there is nothing there.=A0 Right now, I feel ne=
w features are coming out in piecemeal.=A0 I think that&#39;s somewhat OK, =
provided that we have a quarterly update on what that is so that we can at =
least point to it somewhere in a clear concise manner. <br>

<br></div><blockquote class=3D"gmail_quote" style=3D"margin: 0pt 0pt 0pt 0.=
8ex; border-left: 1px solid rgb(204, 204, 204); padding-left: 1ex;">
* There appears to be cognitive dissonance between the resources that<br>
some GNOME people believe are there for maintenance and the resources<br>
that are actually there - esp. related to fallback mode - panel +<br>
applets + metacity.<br></blockquote><div><br>I&#39;m not sure I understand =
this point regarding maintenance.=A0 Are you referring to the maintenance o=
f gnome 2.0?<br>=A0<br></div><blockquote class=3D"gmail_quote" style=3D"mar=
gin: 0pt 0pt 0pt 0.8ex; border-left: 1px solid rgb(204, 204, 204); padding-=
left: 1ex;">


<br>
* A lot of people (myself included) are worried whether we&#39;re going to<=
br>
need hardware that a substantial proportion of our user base just don&#39;t=
<br>
have.<br></blockquote><div><br><br>I&#39;m less worried about this.=A0 I ma=
ke the assumption that clutter is going to work on any hardware where compi=
z works.=A0 In which case, I would argue that Ubuntu is making the exact ri=
sk we are by moving to Unity.=A0 Their &quot;fail back&quot; is on the same=
 metacity, or probably whatever other third party window manager is out the=
re.=A0 I rather we work harder on making clutter work on as many hardware d=
evices to get as many of our existing user base as we can.<br>

=A0<br></div><blockquote class=3D"gmail_quote" style=3D"margin: 0pt 0pt 0pt=
 0.8ex; border-left: 1px solid rgb(204, 204, 204); padding-left: 1ex;">
<br>
And we can fix all these things by:<br>
<br>
(To fill the knowledge gap:)<br>
=A0- Documenting any major design decisions made in the shell and their<br>
rationale, and presenting those in a nicer way<br>
=A0- Ensure that the release team is also framing things in a nicer way,<br=
>
and explaining the rationale behind things rather than just saying<br>
&quot;that&#39;s the why&quot;. Notably, I think the release team should sa=
y that<br>
panel support is a question of manpower not policy, and it&#39;d be nice if=
<br>
Jon backed that up.<br>
=A0- We need to start talking about all that&#39;s good in shell, what it<b=
r>
brings to the table, and why it&#39;s better than what went before. Videos,=
<br>
success stories, interviews with happy users, all that kind of thing<br></b=
lockquote><div><br>I think this is pretty much what community management is=
. :-)=A0 Talk to stakeholders, get them to document what they are doing, gi=
ve a unified consistent view of Gnome 3.0 to the community that we&#39;ve e=
xtracted from stakeholders.I&#39;ve been bothered by the whole communicatio=
n of Gnome 3.0 and its feature set for a couple of months now just from the=
 perspective how we are going to market this.<br>

<br>I think you&#39;re list is a good start.<br><br></div><blockquote class=
=3D"gmail_quote" style=3D"margin: 0pt 0pt 0pt 0.8ex; border-left: 1px solid=
 rgb(204, 204, 204); padding-left: 1ex;">
<br>
(To be clear on what we want to see done but can&#39;t commit to, versus<br=
>
what we definitely don&#39;t want to see done)<br>
=A0- Help the release team and the shell team draft a &quot;Here&#39;s stuf=
f we&#39;re<br>
against&quot; list (with justifications) and &quot;Here&#39;s stuff we&#39;=
d like to see<br>
in GNOME 3.0, but there&#39;s just no way we can commit to getting it done<=
br>
with the resources we have&quot; (things like Orca) - I&#39;d also live to =
see<br>
the GNOME project as a whole be clearer on who&#39;s involved in the actual=
<br>
maintenance of core modules and what developer resources there actually<br>
are - I&#39;d estimate it at 40 to 50 full time developers, but I suspect<b=
r>
I&#39;m on the high side there.<br>
<br></blockquote><div><br>I think as I pointed out before, not everything i=
s going to be feature complete at launch.=A0 It will take some cycles befor=
e we are on par with Gnome 2.x.=A0 That especially is important since a lot=
 of people expect to just change over.=A0 A document on who should switch m=
ight be in order.<br>

=A0<br></div><blockquote class=3D"gmail_quote" style=3D"margin: 0pt 0pt 0pt=
 0.8ex; border-left: 1px solid rgb(204, 204, 204); padding-left: 1ex;">
(To allay fears of hardware compat issues)<br>
=A0- Draw up a list of graphics cards used in desktop hardware in the past<=
br>
3 to 5 years, ordered by market share/volume of sales, and match that to<br=
>
current compatibility of free software drivers for the hardware with the<br=
>
3D requirements of Clutter. Ideally, someone with a GNOME 2.x desktop<br>
should be able to run a command, get a chipset, and be able to tell<br>
before he installs how well GNOME 3 will work.<br></blockquote><div><br>I w=
onder if Emmanuelle has some kind of perf tool for clutter.=A0 That would m=
ake things simpler with an auto submission.<br>=A0<br></div><blockquote cla=
ss=3D"gmail_quote" style=3D"margin: 0pt 0pt 0pt 0.8ex; border-left: 1px sol=
id rgb(204, 204, 204); padding-left: 1ex;">


=A0- Start publishing screenshots of fallback mode on chipsets that don&#39=
;t<br>
support it &amp; making sure it&#39;s still a nice experience.<br>
<div class=3D"im"><br></div></blockquote><div><br>Agreed.<br>=A0<br></div><=
blockquote class=3D"gmail_quote" style=3D"margin: 0pt 0pt 0pt 0.8ex; border=
-left: 1px solid rgb(204, 204, 204); padding-left: 1ex;"><div class=3D"im">
&gt; Personally speaking, I&#39;d add a few other ambitions:<br>
&gt;<br>
&gt; =A0* Ensuring that those from outside the project have a positive<br>
&gt; experience when they come into contact with GNOME. A bit more<br>
&gt; micromanagement here would help our public relations, I think.<br>
<br>
</div>This is a vast task, and I&#39;m not sure how we can make a big dent =
in it<br>
with limited volunteer resources - even doing basic communication of the<br=
>
project goals and allaying concerns people have is probably more than we<br=
>
can manage, but it is pretty much a minimum.<br>
<div class=3D"im"><br></div></blockquote><div><br>Yes, and that&#39;s why I=
 believe that talking to people who are doing this engagement already and w=
orking together will help.<br>=A0<br></div><blockquote class=3D"gmail_quote=
" style=3D"margin: 0pt 0pt 0pt 0.8ex; border-left: 1px solid rgb(204, 204, =
204); padding-left: 1ex;">

<div class=3D"im">
&gt; =A0* Communicating and explaining the direction of the project. 3 dot =
oh<br>
&gt; involves some big changes and our community would benefit from some<br=
>
&gt; positive messages in that regard.<br>
<br>
</div>Absolutely agree.<br>
<div class=3D"im"><br>
&gt; Do those sound useful?<br>
&gt;<br>
&gt; Also: GNOME 3 is going to be met with criticism. We don&#39;t know how=
 much,<br>
&gt; but there&#39;s definitely going to be some. Sri made a really good po=
int to<br>
&gt; me the other day - we need well-rehearsed and effective responses to<b=
r>
&gt; those criticisms, and this kind of community management is an<br>
&gt; opportunity to identify and rehearse those arguments. Maybe we could<b=
r>
&gt; work together to produce some kind of PR play sheet? Or would that be<=
br>
&gt; taking things too far?<br>
<br>
</div>A FAQ will help for the most predictable criticisms, and a list of<br=
>
talking points (the &quot;what&#39;s great about GNOME 3&quot; list I menti=
oned above)<br>
should help us frame the messaging around the release in March, and<br>
everyone giving interviews or presentations should have these down pat.<br>=
</blockquote><div><br>Shell has a FAQ it&#39;s not really getting updated.=
=A0 In fact we have all kinds of documentation, but it&#39;s not presented =
in a single area (eg <a href=3D"http://gnome3.org">gnome3.org</a>) and it i=
s not present.=A0 Secondly, no matter how much documentation you have out t=
here people will not read it.=A0 That&#39;s why engagement has to be part o=
f the equation.=A0 Also we need to constantly in the front page and others =
to point to gnome 3.0.=A0 A banner on w.g.o saying &quot;are you ready for =
gnome 3?&quot; pointing to the website would be another refinement.<br>

=A0<br></div><blockquote class=3D"gmail_quote" style=3D"margin: 0pt 0pt 0pt=
 0.8ex; border-left: 1px solid rgb(204, 204, 204); padding-left: 1ex;">
<br>
That&#39;s a big list of stuff though... Who can give time, to do what, ove=
r<br>
the next few weeks?<br><br></blockquote><div><br>I&#39;m willing to do some=
 work.=A0 I have a bit of a break before things start picking up again.=A0 =
<br><br>sri <br></div></div>

--20cf30549b0b4b06380499325271--
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Subject: Re: Pre-release marketing and community management [Was: getting
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Hi,

Sriram Ramkrishna wrote:
> On Thu, Jan 6, 2011 at 7:32 AM, Dave Neary wrote:
>     Ah... I'm not a big fan of buffers. I prefer trying to quieten people
>     down when they're distracting. That means channelling the noise
>     elsewhere, and perhaps taking a slightly drastic measure of moderating
>     all posts to d-d-l for a few months.

<snip>

> If you moderate, you'll have a lot more angry people since it seems like
> you're trying to shut them up.

<ahem> But we are. desktop-devel-list is supposed to be a list for
desktop development. Not bitching about desktop development. The whole
reason it was created was to get away from gnome-list. There is no place
for non-developers complaining to developers there. That's what bugzilla
is for.

We should moderate the list, because its members are not
self-moderating. We should ensure that there is a really good forum
where people can go complain into the ether - we'll hear about it every
now & again when we mess up really badly because someone syndicated on
pgo will point to a forum post.

> Olav did something similar
> for Lefty on the foundation-list.  That is a good example of managing
> the mailing list.

I think it's a really bad example, actually. How much disruption was
caused by people on foundation-list before any action was taken? Far too
much I would say.

> It's imperative we let them talk and just as
> imperative we respond with data.  And continue to respond.  This wears
> out devs but it won't wear us down we're emotionally geared for it.

Speak for yourself :) I am as emotionally worn down as anyone, and at
some stage your answer has to be "put up or shut up. What gives you a
sense of entitlement?"

>     * There appears to be cognitive dissonance between the resources that
>     some GNOME people believe are there for maintenance and the resources
>     that are actually there - esp. related to fallback mode - panel +
>     applets + metacity.
> 
> I'm not sure I understand this point regarding maintenance.  Are you
> referring to the maintenance of gnome 2.0?

Specifically, I'm referring to the mixed messaging around the fallback
GNOME. Is it a deliberately pared down GNOME 2? Are significant modules
not being migrated by design? Or is it simply that there are no
developer resources to maintain the panel applets or Orca for the GNOME
3 fallback, and if people were to do the work then patches would be
welcome? Is it a design issue, or a resources issue?

> I think as I pointed out before, not everything is going to be feature
> complete at launch.  It will take some cycles before we are on par with
> Gnome 2.x.  That especially is important since a lot of people expect to
> just change over.  A document on who should switch might be in order.

Especially since "avoiding major functionality regressions" was a big
motivator behind the GNOME 3 development. Early on we said "we're not
going to have a KDE 4".

Cheers,
Dave.

-- 
Dave Neary
GNOME Foundation member
dneary@gnome.org
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On Thu, Jan 6, 2011 at 12:14 PM, Sriram Ramkrishna <sri@ramkrishna.me>wrote:

>
> OK, point taken. Let's modify that argument instead to "people who are
> worried as there isn't any documented evidence that this design is going to
> work".  We do not have official Gnome usability studies to back up our
> design of shell.  We need something that we can point to that says that we
> thought of all possibilities.  When there is a lack of evidence then indeed
> people do fear change.  I know Jon and others are using research material,
> books and what not to back up their design and they have done some internal
> testing.  None of which is public.
>
>
I've heard this again and again. That there were design decisions made that
were supposedly based on research and supposedly that information is public
but supposedly nobody can find it. (I personally haven't looked hard for it
online.)

I think it would be a huge help if someone could go through and document the
"Design principles behind GNOME 3.0". And talk about the major features,
changes and why they are good for users with pointers to any discussions or
supporting research. We could make it a subpage of gnome3.org. I think
having it all on one page, clearly laid out by features with rationale would
be great.

No matter what we write, people will argue, but at least we can point to
something and say this is what and why.

Stormy

--00151750ea40fe552b049935bb1b
Content-Type: text/html; charset=ISO-8859-1
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<br><br><div class=3D"gmail_quote">On Thu, Jan 6, 2011 at 12:14 PM, Sriram =
Ramkrishna <span dir=3D"ltr">&lt;<a href=3D"mailto:sri@ramkrishna.me">sri@r=
amkrishna.me</a>&gt;</span> wrote:<br><blockquote class=3D"gmail_quote" sty=
le=3D"margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex;">

<br><div class=3D"gmail_quote"><div>OK, point taken. Let&#39;s modify that =
argument instead to &quot;people who are worried as there isn&#39;t any doc=
umented evidence that this design is going to work&quot;.=A0 We do not have=
 official Gnome usability studies to back up our=A0 design of shell.=A0 We =
need something that we can point to that says that we thought of all possib=
ilities.=A0 When there is a lack of evidence then indeed people do fear cha=
nge.=A0 I know Jon and others are using research material, books and what n=
ot to back up their design and they have done some internal testing.=A0 Non=
e of which is public.<br>

<br></div></div></blockquote><div><br>I&#39;ve heard this again and again. =
That there were design decisions made that were supposedly based on researc=
h and supposedly that information is public but supposedly nobody can find =
it. (I personally haven&#39;t looked hard for it online.)<br>

<br>I think it would be a huge help if someone could go through and documen=
t the &quot;Design principles behind GNOME 3.0&quot;. And talk about the ma=
jor features, changes and why they are good for users with pointers to any =
discussions or supporting research. We could make it a subpage of <a href=
=3D"http://gnome3.org">gnome3.org</a>. I think having it all on one page, c=
learly laid out by features with rationale would be great.<br>

<br>No matter what we write, people will argue, but at least we can point t=
o something and say this is what and why.<br><br>Stormy <br></div></div>

--00151750ea40fe552b049935bb1b--
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From: Sriram Ramkrishna <sri@ramkrishna.me>
Date: Thu, 6 Jan 2011 17:00:48 -0800
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Subject: Re: Pre-release marketing and community management [Was: getting
	www.gnome3.org]
To: Dave Neary <dneary@gnome.org>
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On Thu, Jan 6, 2011 at 12:53 PM, Dave Neary <dneary@gnome.org> wrote:

> Hi,
>
> Sriram Ramkrishna wrote:
> > On Thu, Jan 6, 2011 at 7:32 AM, Dave Neary wrote:
> >     Ah... I'm not a big fan of buffers. I prefer trying to quieten people
> >     down when they're distracting. That means channelling the noise
> >     elsewhere, and perhaps taking a slightly drastic measure of
> moderating
> >     all posts to d-d-l for a few months.
>
> <snip>
>
> > If you moderate, you'll have a lot more angry people since it seems like
> > you're trying to shut them up.
>
> <ahem> But we are. desktop-devel-list is supposed to be a list for
> desktop development. Not bitching about desktop development. The whole
> reason it was created was to get away from gnome-list. There is no place
> for non-developers complaining to developers there. That's what bugzilla
> is for.
>


Yes, if you're defining "developers" as maintainers of core modules.
Unfortunately, people will go into deskop-devel because there is no
community mailing list that they can go to.  So they will participate in the
forum that they believe has the audience they seek.  Unless you close DDL of
course.


>
> We should moderate the list, because its members are not
> self-moderating. We should ensure that there is a really good forum
> where people can go complain into the ether - we'll hear about it every
> now & again when we mess up really badly because someone syndicated on
> pgo will point to a forum post.
>

How about creating a forum or something and keep such people out of the
regular mailing lists instead?


>
> > Olav did something similar
> > for Lefty on the foundation-list.  That is a good example of managing
> > the mailing list.
>
> I think it's a really bad example, actually. How much disruption was
> caused by people on foundation-list before any action was taken? Far too
> much I would say.
>


Well you really can't over moderate foundation list.  Those people are well
part of the foundation and our audience to some extent.  They are on there
because they've made some contribution in some way.

Stormy has warned Lefty before over private mail.  A public beating was
warranted.


>
> > It's imperative we let them talk and just as
> > imperative we respond with data.  And continue to respond.  This wears
> > out devs but it won't wear us down we're emotionally geared for it.
>
> Speak for yourself :) I am as emotionally worn down as anyone, and at
> some stage your answer has to be "put up or shut up. What gives you a
> sense of entitlement?"
>


I'm not really that worn down.  If you are, you're emotionally investing too
much into it.  I think once we have ordered information in hand, published
it will get a lot easier to stop trolling.  Right now, we don't have those
things and we need to fix that.  That's our job here.  We have some plans
here and we got some resources, let's get it done.


>
> >     * There appears to be cognitive dissonance between the resources that
> >     some GNOME people believe are there for maintenance and the resources
> >     that are actually there - esp. related to fallback mode - panel +
> >     applets + metacity.
> >
> > I'm not sure I understand this point regarding maintenance.  Are you
> > referring to the maintenance of gnome 2.0?
>
> Specifically, I'm referring to the mixed messaging around the fallback
> GNOME. Is it a deliberately pared down GNOME 2? Are significant modules
> not being migrated by design? Or is it simply that there are no
> developer resources to maintain the panel applets or Orca for the GNOME
> 3 fallback, and if people were to do the work then patches would be
> welcome? Is it a design issue, or a resources issue?
>

I'm still sort of annoyed that the Orca question was not yet answered.  I
wish Vincent and the release team will address that soon.  I agree that the
fallback Gnome situation is murky.  I think I liked Owen stance, that
failback mode should be Gnome 3 based with a panel.  I would like to see
someone try to port it before release.  I've been told that it was a
resource issue and that there is no objection that I can tell to having
applets.  I think Owen wasn't against it at all from what I've read.  I
think if Owen thinks that then that is the stance.  Perhaps we can talk with
the release team behind the scenes and get clarification.  We might as well
address this now.  We only have a couple of months left to get this working
correctly.


> > I think as I pointed out before, not everything is going to be feature
> > complete at launch.  It will take some cycles before we are on par with
> > Gnome 2.x.  That especially is important since a lot of people expect to
> > just change over.  A document on who should switch might be in order.
>
> Especially since "avoiding major functionality regressions" was a big
> motivator behind the GNOME 3 development. Early on we said "we're not
> going to have a KDE 4".
>
>
I think in that case, they were talking about API and ABI breakage.  We
didn't want people to port their apps to a completely new platform like what
KDE4 did.  That's a cruel thing to do to app developers.  Remember how long
it took Gnucash to get ported to 2.0?  So regressions was always from a
development platform perspective.  From a user perspective we were making
changes to the Ui constantly over the life of 2.0.  Gnome 2.4 is
functionally different than Gnome 2.18.  We wanted to completely overhaul
the UI experience and that's where shell came into play.  So how we worked
with the desktop changed, and yet we didn't have to do anything to port the
applications to the new experience.

sri

--90e6ba6e8822562d5404993727c5
Content-Type: text/html; charset=ISO-8859-1
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

<br><br><div class=3D"gmail_quote">On Thu, Jan 6, 2011 at 12:53 PM, Dave Ne=
ary <span dir=3D"ltr">&lt;<a href=3D"mailto:dneary@gnome.org">dneary@gnome.=
org</a>&gt;</span> wrote:<br><blockquote class=3D"gmail_quote" style=3D"mar=
gin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex;">

Hi,<br>
<br>
Sriram Ramkrishna wrote:<br>
<div class=3D"im">&gt; On Thu, Jan 6, 2011 at 7:32 AM, Dave Neary wrote:<br=
>
&gt; =A0 =A0 Ah... I&#39;m not a big fan of buffers. I prefer trying to qui=
eten people<br>
&gt; =A0 =A0 down when they&#39;re distracting. That means channelling the =
noise<br>
&gt; =A0 =A0 elsewhere, and perhaps taking a slightly drastic measure of mo=
derating<br>
&gt; =A0 =A0 all posts to d-d-l for a few months.<br>
<br>
</div>&lt;snip&gt;<br>
<div class=3D"im"><br>
&gt; If you moderate, you&#39;ll have a lot more angry people since it seem=
s like<br>
&gt; you&#39;re trying to shut them up.<br>
<br>
</div>&lt;ahem&gt; But we are. desktop-devel-list is supposed to be a list =
for<br>
desktop development. Not bitching about desktop development. The whole<br>
reason it was created was to get away from gnome-list. There is no place<br=
>
for non-developers complaining to developers there. That&#39;s what bugzill=
a<br>
is for.<br></blockquote><div><br><br>Yes, if you&#39;re defining &quot;deve=
lopers&quot; as maintainers of core modules.=A0 Unfortunately, people will =
go into deskop-devel because there is no community mailing list that they c=
an go to.=A0 So they will participate in the forum that they believe has th=
e audience they seek.=A0 Unless you close DDL of course.<br>

=A0<br></div><blockquote class=3D"gmail_quote" style=3D"margin: 0pt 0pt 0pt=
 0.8ex; border-left: 1px solid rgb(204, 204, 204); padding-left: 1ex;">
<br>
We should moderate the list, because its members are not<br>
self-moderating. We should ensure that there is a really good forum<br>
where people can go complain into the ether - we&#39;ll hear about it every=
<br>
now &amp; again when we mess up really badly because someone syndicated on<=
br>
pgo will point to a forum post.<br></blockquote><div><br>How about creating=
 a forum or something and keep such people out of the regular mailing lists=
 instead?=A0 <br>=A0<br></div><blockquote class=3D"gmail_quote" style=3D"ma=
rgin: 0pt 0pt 0pt 0.8ex; border-left: 1px solid rgb(204, 204, 204); padding=
-left: 1ex;">


<div class=3D"im"><br>
&gt; Olav did something similar<br>
&gt; for Lefty on the foundation-list. =A0That is a good example of managin=
g<br>
&gt; the mailing list.<br>
<br>
</div>I think it&#39;s a really bad example, actually. How much disruption =
was<br>
caused by people on foundation-list before any action was taken? Far too<br=
>
much I would say.<br></blockquote><div><br><br>Well you really can&#39;t ov=
er moderate foundation list.=A0 Those people are well part of the foundatio=
n and our audience to some extent.=A0 They are on there because they&#39;ve=
 made some contribution in some way.<br>

<br>Stormy has warned Lefty before over private mail.=A0 A public beating w=
as warranted.<br>=A0<br></div><blockquote class=3D"gmail_quote" style=3D"ma=
rgin: 0pt 0pt 0pt 0.8ex; border-left: 1px solid rgb(204, 204, 204); padding=
-left: 1ex;">


<div class=3D"im"><br>
&gt; It&#39;s imperative we let them talk and just as<br>
&gt; imperative we respond with data. =A0And continue to respond. =A0This w=
ears<br>
&gt; out devs but it won&#39;t wear us down we&#39;re emotionally geared fo=
r it.<br>
<br>
</div>Speak for yourself :) I am as emotionally worn down as anyone, and at=
<br>
some stage your answer has to be &quot;put up or shut up. What gives you a<=
br>
sense of entitlement?&quot;<br></blockquote><div><br><br>I&#39;m not really=
 that worn down.=A0 If you are, you&#39;re emotionally investing too much i=
nto it.=A0 I think once we have ordered information in hand, published it w=
ill get a lot easier to stop trolling.=A0 Right now, we don&#39;t have thos=
e things and we need to fix that.=A0 That&#39;s our job here.=A0 We have so=
me plans here and we got some resources, let&#39;s get it done.<br>

=A0<br></div><blockquote class=3D"gmail_quote" style=3D"margin: 0pt 0pt 0pt=
 0.8ex; border-left: 1px solid rgb(204, 204, 204); padding-left: 1ex;">
<div class=3D"im"><br>
&gt; =A0 =A0 * There appears to be cognitive dissonance between the resourc=
es that<br>
&gt; =A0 =A0 some GNOME people believe are there for maintenance and the re=
sources<br>
&gt; =A0 =A0 that are actually there - esp. related to fallback mode - pane=
l +<br>
&gt; =A0 =A0 applets + metacity.<br>
&gt;<br>
&gt; I&#39;m not sure I understand this point regarding maintenance. =A0Are=
 you<br>
&gt; referring to the maintenance of gnome 2.0?<br>
<br>
</div>Specifically, I&#39;m referring to the mixed messaging around the fal=
lback<br>
GNOME. Is it a deliberately pared down GNOME 2? Are significant modules<br>
not being migrated by design? Or is it simply that there are no<br>
developer resources to maintain the panel applets or Orca for the GNOME<br>
3 fallback, and if people were to do the work then patches would be<br>
welcome? Is it a design issue, or a resources issue?<br></blockquote><div><=
br>I&#39;m still sort of annoyed that the Orca question was not yet answere=
d.=A0 I wish Vincent and the release team will address that soon.=A0 I agre=
e that the fallback Gnome situation is murky.=A0 I think I liked Owen stanc=
e, that failback mode should be Gnome 3 based with a panel.=A0 I would like=
 to see someone try to port it before release.=A0 I&#39;ve been told that i=
t was a resource issue and that there is no objection that I can tell to ha=
ving applets.=A0 I think Owen wasn&#39;t against it at all from what I&#39;=
ve read.=A0 I think if Owen thinks that then that is the stance.=A0 Perhaps=
 we can talk with the release team behind the scenes and get clarification.=
=A0 We might as well address this now.=A0 We only have a couple of months l=
eft to get this working correctly.<br>

<br></div><blockquote class=3D"gmail_quote" style=3D"margin: 0pt 0pt 0pt 0.=
8ex; border-left: 1px solid rgb(204, 204, 204); padding-left: 1ex;">
<div class=3D"im"><br>
&gt; I think as I pointed out before, not everything is going to be feature=
<br>
&gt; complete at launch. =A0It will take some cycles before we are on par w=
ith<br>
&gt; Gnome 2.x. =A0That especially is important since a lot of people expec=
t to<br>
&gt; just change over. =A0A document on who should switch might be in order=
.<br>
<br>
</div>Especially since &quot;avoiding major functionality regressions&quot;=
 was a big<br>
motivator behind the GNOME 3 development. Early on we said &quot;we&#39;re =
not<br>
going to have a KDE 4&quot;.<br>
<div><div></div><br></div></blockquote><div><br>I think in that case, they =
were talking about API and ABI breakage.=A0 We didn&#39;t want people to po=
rt their apps to a completely new platform like what KDE4 did.=A0 That&#39;=
s a cruel thing to do to app developers.=A0 Remember how long it took Gnuca=
sh to get ported to 2.0?=A0 So regressions was always from a development pl=
atform perspective.=A0 From a user perspective we were making changes to th=
e Ui constantly over the life of 2.0.=A0 Gnome 2.4 is functionally differen=
t than Gnome 2.18.=A0 We wanted to completely overhaul the UI experience an=
d that&#39;s where shell came into play.=A0 So how we worked with the deskt=
op changed, and yet we didn&#39;t have to do anything to port the applicati=
ons to the new experience.=A0 <br>

<br>sri<br><br></div></div>

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From: Sriram Ramkrishna <sri@ramkrishna.me>
Date: Thu, 6 Jan 2011 17:09:03 -0800
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Subject: Re: Pre-release marketing and community management [Was: getting
	www.gnome3.org]
To: Stormy Peters <stormy@gnome.org>
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On Thu, Jan 6, 2011 at 3:19 PM, Stormy Peters <stormy@gnome.org> wrote:

>
>
> On Thu, Jan 6, 2011 at 12:14 PM, Sriram Ramkrishna <sri@ramkrishna.me>wrote:
>
>>
>> OK, point taken. Let's modify that argument instead to "people who are
>> worried as there isn't any documented evidence that this design is going to
>> work".  We do not have official Gnome usability studies to back up our
>> design of shell.  We need something that we can point to that says that we
>> thought of all possibilities.  When there is a lack of evidence then indeed
>> people do fear change.  I know Jon and others are using research material,
>> books and what not to back up their design and they have done some internal
>> testing.  None of which is public.
>>
>>
> I've heard this again and again. That there were design decisions made that
> were supposedly based on research and supposedly that information is public
> but supposedly nobody can find it. (I personally haven't looked hard for it
> online.)
>

I hear it on and off.  I have tried to look but I don't think there is
anything on l.g.o.  So, they need to document something otherwise this cycle
will continue.


>
> I think it would be a huge help if someone could go through and document
> the "Design principles behind GNOME 3.0". And talk about the major features,
> changes and why they are good for users with pointers to any discussions or
> supporting research. We could make it a subpage of gnome3.org. I think
> having it all on one page, clearly laid out by features with rationale would
> be great.
>


We didn't do this for 2.0 which fed into a lot of rage on a number of
forums.  Nobody could understand why we were removing features or the
philosophy behind it.  Because of that history, Gnome 3.0 will fall into the
same cycle.  Let's hope we can avoid doing it this time with a little
forethought now that we are a lot more mature project. :-)

I think your idea is exactly where this was heading, that's why I was
interested in gnome3.org is to get people to focus on an easy to remember
site where they can get all the information about gnome 3.0 they need.  Keep
people off the developer forums and hopefully also create something that we
can get users into developers or something like that.


>
> No matter what we write, people will argue, but at least we can point to
> something and say this is what and why.
>

And we should do that continually until people get it.

sri

--20cf3054a031d63fd804993744b6
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<br><br><div class=3D"gmail_quote">On Thu, Jan 6, 2011 at 3:19 PM, Stormy P=
eters <span dir=3D"ltr">&lt;<a href=3D"mailto:stormy@gnome.org">stormy@gnom=
e.org</a>&gt;</span> wrote:<br><blockquote class=3D"gmail_quote" style=3D"m=
argin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex;">

<br><br><div class=3D"gmail_quote"><div class=3D"im">On Thu, Jan 6, 2011 at=
 12:14 PM, Sriram Ramkrishna <span dir=3D"ltr">&lt;<a href=3D"mailto:sri@ra=
mkrishna.me" target=3D"_blank">sri@ramkrishna.me</a>&gt;</span> wrote:<br><=
blockquote class=3D"gmail_quote" style=3D"margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px=
 #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex">



<br><div class=3D"gmail_quote"><div>OK, point taken. Let&#39;s modify that =
argument instead to &quot;people who are worried as there isn&#39;t any doc=
umented evidence that this design is going to work&quot;.=A0 We do not have=
 official Gnome usability studies to back up our=A0 design of shell.=A0 We =
need something that we can point to that says that we thought of all possib=
ilities.=A0 When there is a lack of evidence then indeed people do fear cha=
nge.=A0 I know Jon and others are using research material, books and what n=
ot to back up their design and they have done some internal testing.=A0 Non=
e of which is public.<br>



<br></div></div></blockquote></div><div><br>I&#39;ve heard this again and a=
gain. That there were design decisions made that were supposedly based on r=
esearch and supposedly that information is public but supposedly nobody can=
 find it. (I personally haven&#39;t looked hard for it online.)<br>

</div></div></blockquote><div><br>I hear it on and off.=A0 I have tried to =
look but I don&#39;t think there is anything on l.g.o.=A0 So, they need to =
document something otherwise this cycle will continue.<br>=A0<br></div><blo=
ckquote class=3D"gmail_quote" style=3D"margin: 0pt 0pt 0pt 0.8ex; border-le=
ft: 1px solid rgb(204, 204, 204); padding-left: 1ex;">

<div class=3D"gmail_quote"><div>

<br>I think it would be a huge help if someone could go through and documen=
t the &quot;Design principles behind GNOME 3.0&quot;. And talk about the ma=
jor features, changes and why they are good for users with pointers to any =
discussions or supporting research. We could make it a subpage of <a href=
=3D"http://gnome3.org" target=3D"_blank">gnome3.org</a>. I think having it =
all on one page, clearly laid out by features with rationale would be great=
.<br>

</div></div></blockquote><div><br><br>We didn&#39;t do this for 2.0 which f=
ed into a lot of rage on a number of forums.=A0 Nobody could understand why=
 we were removing features or the philosophy behind it.=A0 Because of that =
history, Gnome 3.0 will fall into the same cycle.=A0 Let&#39;s hope we can =
avoid doing it this time with a little forethought now that we are a lot mo=
re mature project. :-)<br>

<br>I think your idea is exactly where this was heading, that&#39;s why I w=
as interested in <a href=3D"http://gnome3.org">gnome3.org</a> is to get peo=
ple to focus on an easy to remember site where they can get all the informa=
tion about gnome 3.0 they need.=A0 Keep people off the developer forums and=
 hopefully also create something that we can get users into developers or s=
omething like that.<br>

=A0<br></div><blockquote class=3D"gmail_quote" style=3D"margin: 0pt 0pt 0pt=
 0.8ex; border-left: 1px solid rgb(204, 204, 204); padding-left: 1ex;"><div=
 class=3D"gmail_quote"><div>

<br>No matter what we write, people will argue, but at least we can point t=
o something and say this is what and why.<br></div></div></blockquote><div>=
<br>And we should do that continually until people get it.<br><br>sri <br>

</div></div><br>

--20cf3054a031d63fd804993744b6--
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On Jan 6, 2011, at 5:00 PM, Sriram Ramkrishna wrote:
>=20
> On Thu, Jan 6, 2011 at 12:53 PM, Dave Neary <dneary@gnome.org> wrote:
>=20
> > Olav did something similar
> > for Lefty on the foundation-list.  That is a good example of =
managing
> > the mailing list.
>=20
> I think it's a really bad example, actually. How much disruption was
> caused by people on foundation-list before any action was taken? Far =
too
> much I would say.
>=20
> Well you really can't over moderate foundation list.  Those people are =
well part of the foundation and our audience to some extent.  They are =
on there because they've made some contribution in some way.
>=20
> Stormy has warned Lefty before over private mail.  A public beating =
was warranted.

For heaven's sake, _please_ leave me out of your "how can we keep the =
little people from being so gosh-darned disruptive?"-fest.

If you'd like to discuss an essentially chronic passive-aggressive =
situation where messages espousing the "free software movement"-approved =
terminology from Mr. Stallman (messages which everyone privately admits =
are disruptive, but suggests should simply be universally ignored, =
because, "well, that's just _Richard_") are somehow just fine, but =
messages suggesting that people actually take the time to critically =
examine that position must be banned, I'm certainly game. If that's not =
what you're after, than perhaps you'd best try another tack to support =
your position.

Feel free to moderate me here, as well, for insufficient zeal=97thereby =
essentially demonstrating my point for me=97but if you feel impelled to =
do so, at least do me the courtesy of leaving me out of your =
ill-considered examples in the future. Thanks for your ongoing =
consideration.



--Apple-Mail-1-378169967
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	charset=windows-1252

<html><head></head><body style=3D"word-wrap: break-word; =
-webkit-nbsp-mode: space; -webkit-line-break: after-white-space; =
"><div><div>On Jan 6, 2011, at 5:00 PM, Sriram Ramkrishna =
wrote:</div><blockquote type=3D"cite"><br><div class=3D"gmail_quote">On =
Thu, Jan 6, 2011 at 12:53 PM, Dave Neary <span dir=3D"ltr">&lt;<a =
href=3D"mailto:dneary@gnome.org">dneary@gnome.org</a>&gt;</span> =
wrote:<br><blockquote class=3D"gmail_quote" style=3D"margin-top: 0pt; =
margin-right: 0pt; margin-bottom: 0pt; margin-left: 0.8ex; =
border-left-width: 1px; border-left-style: solid; border-left-color: =
rgb(204, 204, 204); padding-left: 1ex; position: static; z-index: auto; =
"><div class=3D"im"><br>
&gt; Olav did something similar<br>
&gt; for Lefty on the foundation-list. &nbsp;That is a good example of =
managing<br>
&gt; the mailing list.<br>
<br>
</div>I think it's a really bad example, actually. How much disruption =
was<br>
caused by people on foundation-list before any action was taken? Far =
too<br>
much I would say.<br></blockquote><div><br>Well you really can't over =
moderate foundation list.&nbsp; Those people are well part of the =
foundation and our audience to some extent.&nbsp; They are on there =
because they've made some contribution in some way.<br>

<br>Stormy has warned Lefty before over private mail.&nbsp; A public =
beating was warranted.</div></div></blockquote><br></div><div>For =
heaven's sake, _please_ leave me out of your "how can we keep the little =
people from being so gosh-darned =
disruptive?"-fest.</div><div><br></div><div>If you'd like to discuss an =
essentially chronic passive-aggressive situation where messages =
espousing the "free software movement"-approved terminology from Mr. =
Stallman (messages which everyone privately admits are disruptive, but =
suggests should simply be universally ignored, because, "well, that's =
just _Richard_") are somehow just fine, but messages suggesting that =
people actually take the time to critically examine that position must =
be banned, I'm certainly game. If that's not what you're after, than =
perhaps you'd best try another tack to support your =
position.</div><div><br></div><div>Feel free to moderate me here, as =
well, for insufficient zeal=97thereby essentially demonstrating my point =
for me=97but if you feel impelled to do so, at least do me the courtesy =
of leaving me out of your ill-considered examples in the =
future.&nbsp;Thanks for your ongoing =
consideration.</div><div><br></div><div><br></div></body></html>=

--Apple-Mail-1-378169967--
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On Thu, Jan 6, 2011 at 6:09 PM, Sriram Ramkrishna <sri@ramkrishna.me> wrote:

>
> We didn't do this for 2.0 which fed into a lot of rage on a number of
> forums.  Nobody could understand why we were removing features or the
> philosophy behind it.  Because of that history, Gnome 3.0 will fall into the
> same cycle.  Let's hope we can avoid doing it this time with a little
> forethought now that we are a lot more mature project. :-)
>

So my concern isn't making sure everyone agrees or even gets it but rather
that everyone who wants to can explain why we did it (or at least point to
somewhere that does explain.)

Is someone willing to go through archives and talk to the people close to
the decision to try to document the features and rationale?

Stormy

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<br><br><div class=3D"gmail_quote">On Thu, Jan 6, 2011 at 6:09 PM, Sriram R=
amkrishna <span dir=3D"ltr">&lt;<a href=3D"mailto:sri@ramkrishna.me">sri@ra=
mkrishna.me</a>&gt;</span> wrote:<br><blockquote class=3D"gmail_quote" styl=
e=3D"margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex;">

<div class=3D"gmail_quote"><div><br>We didn&#39;t do this for 2.0 which fed=
 into a lot of rage on a number of forums.=A0 Nobody could understand why w=
e were removing features or the philosophy behind it.=A0 Because of that hi=
story, Gnome 3.0 will fall into the same cycle.=A0 Let&#39;s hope we can av=
oid doing it this time with a little forethought now that we are a lot more=
 mature project. :-)<br>

</div></div></blockquote><div><br>So my concern isn&#39;t making sure every=
one agrees or even gets it but rather that everyone who wants to can explai=
n why we did it (or at least point to somewhere that does explain.)<br>

<br>Is someone willing to go through archives and talk to the people close =
to the decision to try to document the features and rationale?<br><br>Storm=
y<br><br></div></div>

--00151750ea40179d27049939169f--
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From: Jason Lo <yet2bedefined@gmail.com>
Date: Thu, 6 Jan 2011 21:07:08 -0800
Message-ID: <AANLkTi==F_f=PTM3Q29q1q5nqa7MwVSAJ7A-S1129308@mail.gmail.com>
Subject: Re: GCI: Update Gnome Usergroup Info, Introduction
To: Dave Neary <dneary@gnome.org>
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Hi, just an update. I've sent emails to Gnome Australia, Brazil, Chicago,
Chile, China, and Deutschland so far, and am waiting for replies.

On Wed, Jan 5, 2011 at 12:10 PM, Dave Neary <dneary@gnome.org> wrote:

> Hi,
>
> Jason Lo wrote:
> > It seems to fit more with contact addresses. You said to a previous
> > student that there were others doing this task as well, and that I
> > should coordinate my efforts with them to make sure we don't pester the
> > same folks over and over again. Also, in your post on GCI, you said you
> > would provide emails that I could send this to.
>
> There is the gugmasters list:
> http://mail.gnome.org/mailman/listinfo/gugmasters-list - but I think if
> you mail the list, you will not get a good response rate. Worth trying -
> but if you don't get a good response rate, we can try & send an email to
> each member individually. Perhaps I could do it on your behalf...
>
> The other contacts are those in this wiki page. The list of lists you
> point to is OK, but bear in mind that mailing a list is hit & miss at
> best. You might get a better response rate by sending an email to the
> "Contact" field, if it's set. The French one is definitely out of date,
> though :) You should contact Vincent Untz instead.
>
> There is also a GNOME developing world list: developing-world-list - I
> don't really know who's on it.
>
> You will need to be persistent, and make sure you keep us posted on what
> groups you have information for, and which you don't, when information
> starts coming in.
>
> Thanks!
> Dave.
>
> --
> Dave Neary
> GNOME Foundation member
> dneary@gnome.org
>



-- 
Jason

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Hi, just an update. I&#39;ve sent emails to Gnome Australia, Brazil, Chicag=
o, Chile, China, and Deutschland so far, and am waiting for replies.<br><br=
><div class=3D"gmail_quote">On Wed, Jan 5, 2011 at 12:10 PM, Dave Neary <sp=
an dir=3D"ltr">&lt;<a href=3D"mailto:dneary@gnome.org">dneary@gnome.org</a>=
&gt;</span> wrote:<br>

<blockquote class=3D"gmail_quote" style=3D"margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1p=
x #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex;">Hi,<br>
<div class=3D"im"><br>
Jason Lo wrote:<br>
&gt; It seems to fit more with contact addresses. You said to a previous<br=
>
&gt; student that there were others doing this task as well, and that I<br>
&gt; should coordinate my efforts with them to make sure we don&#39;t peste=
r the<br>
&gt; same folks over and over again. Also, in your post on GCI, you said yo=
u<br>
&gt; would provide emails that I could send this to.<br>
<br>
</div>There is the gugmasters list:<br>
<a href=3D"http://mail.gnome.org/mailman/listinfo/gugmasters-list" target=
=3D"_blank">http://mail.gnome.org/mailman/listinfo/gugmasters-list</a> - bu=
t I think if<br>
you mail the list, you will not get a good response rate. Worth trying -<br=
>
but if you don&#39;t get a good response rate, we can try &amp; send an ema=
il to<br>
each member individually. Perhaps I could do it on your behalf...<br>
<br>
The other contacts are those in this wiki page. The list of lists you<br>
point to is OK, but bear in mind that mailing a list is hit &amp; miss at<b=
r>
best. You might get a better response rate by sending an email to the<br>
&quot;Contact&quot; field, if it&#39;s set. The French one is definitely ou=
t of date,<br>
though :) You should contact Vincent Untz instead.<br>
<br>
There is also a GNOME developing world list: developing-world-list - I<br>
don&#39;t really know who&#39;s on it.<br>
<br>
You will need to be persistent, and make sure you keep us posted on what<br=
>
groups you have information for, and which you don&#39;t, when information<=
br>
starts coming in.<br>
<div><div class=3D"h5"><br>
Thanks!<br>
Dave.<br>
<br>
--<br>
Dave Neary<br>
GNOME Foundation member<br>
<a href=3D"mailto:dneary@gnome.org">dneary@gnome.org</a><br>
</div></div></blockquote></div><br><br clear=3D"all"><br>-- <br>Jason<br>

--0016363b83c03e6e7c04993a9879--
From sri@ramkrishna.me  Fri Jan  7 08:11:09 2011
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References: <4D148FC9.9070800@initmarketing.com>
From: Sriram Ramkrishna <sri@ramkrishna.me>
Date: Fri, 7 Jan 2011 00:10:35 -0800
Message-ID: <AANLkTinZeq32_HLYquO_Tc_MEAs85NosWdrdH=fKE+go@mail.gmail.com>
Subject: Re: Short slide decks for use in GNOME community presentations
To: Vikram Vaswani <vikram.vaswani@initmarketing.com>
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On Fri, Dec 24, 2010 at 4:19 AM, Vikram Vaswani <
vikram.vaswani@initmarketing.com> wrote:

> Hello all
>
> My name is Vikram Vaswani and I work with Initmarketing, the open source
> marketing agency (www.initmarketing.com). We've been working with the
> GNOME Foundation for the last few weeks to build a set of modular slide
> decks for community members to use when making presentations.
>

That's great!


>
> We currently have nine decks covering the following topics:
>
> - GNOME Overview
> - GNOME History
> - GNOME Foundation
> - GNOME Accessibility
> - GNOME Mobile
> - GNOME 3 Applications
> - How to Contribute to GNOME
> - GNOME for Users
> - Getting Started with GNOME Development
>
> You can find them here:
> http://live.gnome.org/GnomeMarketing/MarketingMaterial/Presentations?action=AttachFile&do=view&target=gnome-slides-2.zip
>
> They are also linked on the Presentations page of the wiki (under Short
> Topic Segments):
> http://live.gnome.org/GnomeMarketing/MarketingMaterial/Presentations
>
> These decks are designed to be "mix and match" - you can use them "as is"
> for presentations on the above topics, or combine decks from different
> slides to build your own presentation as per your needs.
>
> We'd be interested in any feedback on these slides; please post your
> feedback directly to the list. We'll collect feedback until the second week
> of January and then make revisions as per feedback.
>
>
Has anybody gotten back to you regarding this?  We are heading into the
second of week of January now.


Regards,
sri

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<br><br><div class=3D"gmail_quote">On Fri, Dec 24, 2010 at 4:19 AM, Vikram =
Vaswani <span dir=3D"ltr">&lt;<a href=3D"mailto:vikram.vaswani@initmarketin=
g.com">vikram.vaswani@initmarketing.com</a>&gt;</span> wrote:<br><blockquot=
e class=3D"gmail_quote" style=3D"margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc sol=
id;padding-left:1ex;">

Hello all<br>
<br>
My name is Vikram Vaswani and I work with Initmarketing, the open source ma=
rketing agency (<a href=3D"http://www.initmarketing.com" target=3D"_blank">=
www.initmarketing.com</a>). We&#39;ve been working with the GNOME Foundatio=
n for the last few weeks to build a set of modular slide decks for communit=
y members to use when making presentations.<br>

</blockquote><div><br>That&#39;s great!=A0 <br>=A0<br></div><blockquote cla=
ss=3D"gmail_quote" style=3D"margin: 0pt 0pt 0pt 0.8ex; border-left: 1px sol=
id rgb(204, 204, 204); padding-left: 1ex;">
<br>
We currently have nine decks covering the following topics:<br>
<br>
- GNOME Overview<br>
- GNOME History<br>
- GNOME Foundation<br>
- GNOME Accessibility<br>
- GNOME Mobile<br>
- GNOME 3 Applications<br>
- How to Contribute to GNOME<br>
- GNOME for Users<br>
- Getting Started with GNOME Development<br>
<br>
You can find them here: <a href=3D"http://live.gnome.org/GnomeMarketing/Mar=
ketingMaterial/Presentations?action=3DAttachFile&amp;do=3Dview&amp;target=
=3Dgnome-slides-2.zip" target=3D"_blank">http://live.gnome.org/GnomeMarketi=
ng/MarketingMaterial/Presentations?action=3DAttachFile&amp;do=3Dview&amp;ta=
rget=3Dgnome-slides-2.zip</a><br>


<br>
They are also linked on the Presentations page of the wiki (under Short Top=
ic Segments): <a href=3D"http://live.gnome.org/GnomeMarketing/MarketingMate=
rial/Presentations" target=3D"_blank">http://live.gnome.org/GnomeMarketing/=
MarketingMaterial/Presentations</a><br>


<br>
These decks are designed to be &quot;mix and match&quot; - you can use them=
 &quot;as is&quot; for presentations on the above topics, or combine decks =
from different slides to build your own presentation as per your needs.<br>


<br>
We&#39;d be interested in any feedback on these slides; please post your fe=
edback directly to the list. We&#39;ll collect feedback until the second we=
ek of January and then make revisions as per feedback.<br>
<br></blockquote><div><br>Has anybody gotten back to you regarding this?=A0=
 We are heading into the second of week of January now.<br><br>=A0<br></div=
>Regards,<br>sri<br></div>

--90e6ba6e8678563a7104993d2866--
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References: <4D148FC9.9070800@initmarketing.com>
From: Sriram Ramkrishna <sri@ramkrishna.me>
Date: Fri, 7 Jan 2011 00:13:13 -0800
Message-ID: <AANLkTimt=zgtVNwhD=ShFPLCHZD-43kHjwRMQaDACOa=@mail.gmail.com>
Subject: Re: Short slide decks for use in GNOME community presentations
To: Vikram Vaswani <vikram.vaswani@initmarketing.com>
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--20cf30549b0bbed31704993d31f0
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Is this related to a recent mail by Paul Cutler:

http://mail.gnome.org/archives/marketing-list/2010-December/msg00077.html

?

sri


On Fri, Dec 24, 2010 at 4:19 AM, Vikram Vaswani <
vikram.vaswani@initmarketing.com> wrote:

> Hello all
>
> My name is Vikram Vaswani and I work with Initmarketing, the open source
> marketing agency (www.initmarketing.com). We've been working with the
> GNOME Foundation for the last few weeks to build a set of modular slide
> decks for community members to use when making presentations.
>
> We currently have nine decks covering the following topics:
>
> - GNOME Overview
> - GNOME History
> - GNOME Foundation
> - GNOME Accessibility
> - GNOME Mobile
> - GNOME 3 Applications
> - How to Contribute to GNOME
> - GNOME for Users
> - Getting Started with GNOME Development
>
> You can find them here:
> http://live.gnome.org/GnomeMarketing/MarketingMaterial/Presentations?action=AttachFile&do=view&target=gnome-slides-2.zip
>
> They are also linked on the Presentations page of the wiki (under Short
> Topic Segments):
> http://live.gnome.org/GnomeMarketing/MarketingMaterial/Presentations
>
> These decks are designed to be "mix and match" - you can use them "as is"
> for presentations on the above topics, or combine decks from different
> slides to build your own presentation as per your needs.
>
> We'd be interested in any feedback on these slides; please post your
> feedback directly to the list. We'll collect feedback until the second week
> of January and then make revisions as per feedback.
>
> Many thanks in advance for your participation,
>
> Vikram Vaswani
> Initmarketing
> --
> marketing-list mailing list
> marketing-list@gnome.org
> http://mail.gnome.org/mailman/listinfo/marketing-list
>

--20cf30549b0bbed31704993d31f0
Content-Type: text/html; charset=ISO-8859-1
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

Is this related to a recent mail by Paul Cutler:<br><br><a href=3D"http://m=
ail.gnome.org/archives/marketing-list/2010-December/msg00077.html">http://m=
ail.gnome.org/archives/marketing-list/2010-December/msg00077.html</a><br><b=
r>

?<br><br>sri<br><br><br><div class=3D"gmail_quote">On Fri, Dec 24, 2010 at =
4:19 AM, Vikram Vaswani <span dir=3D"ltr">&lt;<a href=3D"mailto:vikram.vasw=
ani@initmarketing.com">vikram.vaswani@initmarketing.com</a>&gt;</span> wrot=
e:<br>

<blockquote class=3D"gmail_quote" style=3D"margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1p=
x #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex;">Hello all<br>
<br>
My name is Vikram Vaswani and I work with Initmarketing, the open source ma=
rketing agency (<a href=3D"http://www.initmarketing.com" target=3D"_blank">=
www.initmarketing.com</a>). We&#39;ve been working with the GNOME Foundatio=
n for the last few weeks to build a set of modular slide decks for communit=
y members to use when making presentations.<br>


<br>
We currently have nine decks covering the following topics:<br>
<br>
- GNOME Overview<br>
- GNOME History<br>
- GNOME Foundation<br>
- GNOME Accessibility<br>
- GNOME Mobile<br>
- GNOME 3 Applications<br>
- How to Contribute to GNOME<br>
- GNOME for Users<br>
- Getting Started with GNOME Development<br>
<br>
You can find them here: <a href=3D"http://live.gnome.org/GnomeMarketing/Mar=
ketingMaterial/Presentations?action=3DAttachFile&amp;do=3Dview&amp;target=
=3Dgnome-slides-2.zip" target=3D"_blank">http://live.gnome.org/GnomeMarketi=
ng/MarketingMaterial/Presentations?action=3DAttachFile&amp;do=3Dview&amp;ta=
rget=3Dgnome-slides-2.zip</a><br>


<br>
They are also linked on the Presentations page of the wiki (under Short Top=
ic Segments): <a href=3D"http://live.gnome.org/GnomeMarketing/MarketingMate=
rial/Presentations" target=3D"_blank">http://live.gnome.org/GnomeMarketing/=
MarketingMaterial/Presentations</a><br>


<br>
These decks are designed to be &quot;mix and match&quot; - you can use them=
 &quot;as is&quot; for presentations on the above topics, or combine decks =
from different slides to build your own presentation as per your needs.<br>


<br>
We&#39;d be interested in any feedback on these slides; please post your fe=
edback directly to the list. We&#39;ll collect feedback until the second we=
ek of January and then make revisions as per feedback.<br>
<br>
Many thanks in advance for your participation,<br>
<br>
Vikram Vaswani<br>
Initmarketing<br><font color=3D"#888888">
-- <br>
marketing-list mailing list<br>
<a href=3D"mailto:marketing-list@gnome.org" target=3D"_blank">marketing-lis=
t@gnome.org</a><br>
<a href=3D"http://mail.gnome.org/mailman/listinfo/marketing-list" target=3D=
"_blank">http://mail.gnome.org/mailman/listinfo/marketing-list</a><br>
</font></blockquote></div><br>

--20cf30549b0bbed31704993d31f0--
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To: Sriram Ramkrishna <sri@ramkrishna.me>
Subject: Re: Short slide decks for use in GNOME community presentations
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Hi Sriram,

>> We'd be interested in any feedback on these slides; please post your
>> feedback directly to the list. We'll collect feedback until the second week
>> of January and then make revisions as per feedback.
>>
>>
> Has anybody gotten back to you regarding this?  We are heading into the
> second of week of January now.

Nope, no feedback yet.

Vikram
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Subject: Re: Pre-release marketing and community management [Was: getting
	www.gnome3.org]
From: Allan Day <allanpday@gmail.com>
To: Stormy Peters <stormy@gnome.org>
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Date: Fri, 07 Jan 2011 08:29:14 +0000
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Stormy Peters wrote:
> 
> 
> On Thu, Jan 6, 2011 at 6:09 PM, Sriram Ramkrishna <sri@ramkrishna.me>
> wrote:
>         
>         We didn't do this for 2.0 which fed into a lot of rage on a
>         number of forums.  Nobody could understand why we were
>         removing features or the philosophy behind it.  Because of
>         that history, Gnome 3.0 will fall into the same cycle.  Let's
>         hope we can avoid doing it this time with a little forethought
>         now that we are a lot more mature project. :-)
>         
> 
> So my concern isn't making sure everyone agrees or even gets it but
> rather that everyone who wants to can explain why we did it (or at
> least point to somewhere that does explain.)
> 
> Is someone willing to go through archives and talk to the people close
> to the decision to try to document the features and rationale?

That was my plan for the shell design page. I'm familiar with most of
the design principles as well as the documentation which has been
produced. I can also dredge the lists, and I can harass Jon and Jimmac
if it comes down to it. :)

Sri's comments earlier in this thread point to the desire for an
evidence base or some kind of research into the shell. I think we do
have some good material there, as I pointed out on desktop-devel
recently [1]. We need that in a public place too.

Allan

[1]
http://mail.gnome.org/archives/desktop-devel-list/2011-January/msg00105.html
-- 
Blog: http://afaikblog.wordpress.com/
IRC: aday on irc.gnome.org

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Subject: Re: Pre-release marketing and community management [Was: getting
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Hi,

Sriram Ramkrishna wrote:
> Yes, if you're defining "developers" as maintainers of core modules. 
> Unfortunately, people will go into deskop-devel because there is no
> community mailing list that they can go to.  So they will participate in
> the forum that they believe has the audience they seek.  Unless you
> close DDL of course.

It is not the job of the mailing lists to provide an expert audience to
non-experts who want to complain to them.

If we need to moderate d-d-l to reclaim it for Real Work, then so be it.

> How about creating a forum or something and keep such people out of the
> regular mailing lists instead? 

http://www.gnomesupport.org could use more visibility & some official
community buy-in. A more active "Development" forum would be useful.

Cheers,
Dave.

-- 
Dave Neary
GNOME Foundation member
dneary@gnome.org
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Hi,

Allan Day wrote:
> Sri's comments earlier in this thread point to the desire for an
> evidence base or some kind of research into the shell. I think we do
> have some good material there, as I pointed out on desktop-devel
> recently [1]. We need that in a public place too.

Bear in mind when publishing research that the response can be lukewarm
if the content doesn't live (cf. betterdesktop.org initiative Anna Dirks
from Novell was involved in a few years back).

(just a data point)

Cheers,
Dave.

-- 
Dave Neary
GNOME Foundation member
dneary@gnome.org
From nearyd@gmail.com  Fri Jan  7 10:07:58 2011
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Hi,

Sriram Ramkrishna wrote:
> Has anybody gotten back to you regarding this?  We are heading into the
> second of week of January now.

I sent Vikram my feedback before the slides were set to the foundation
(via InitMarketing, who I have done a little work with). I'm happy with
them as they are. I would be interested in seeing someone give a 30
minute proposal by mixing and matching these though - seems like it
would take still some work to do.

Cheers,
Dave.
-- 
Dave Neary
GNOME Foundation member
dneary@gnome.org
From vikram.vaswani@initmarketing.com  Fri Jan  7 11:17:17 2011
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Hi Sriram,

> Is this related to a recent mail by Paul Cutler:
> 
> http://mail.gnome.org/archives/marketing-list/2010-December/msg00077.html

No, it's not.

I'd encourage everyone to take a look at the slides and send 
thoughts/feedback to the list within next week. Many thanks in advance 
for your time.

Vikram
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Subject: Re: FoG pending Tasks
From: Lucas Rocha <lucasr@gnome.org>
To: Og Maciel <ogmaciel@gnome.org>
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Hi Og,

2011/1/6 Og Maciel <ogmaciel@gnome.org>:
> Lucas,
>
> Paul Cutler has already pushed the text to the /friends/ directory in
> gnomewml. Could you make the changes for us?

Sure. I just need a few more details to get the ruler ready to publish:
- Are showing a counter of subscribers as a progress bar?
- How many subscribers do we currently have?
- Target number of subscribers is 400, right?

Once it's ready, should I publish it straight away or should I wait
for something (press release, blog post, etc) on your side first?

Cheers!

--lucasr
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Subject: Re: FoG pending Tasks
From: Og Maciel <ogmaciel@gnome.org>
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Hey Lucas!

> Sure. I just need a few more details to get the ruler ready to publish:
> - Are showing a counter of subscribers as a progress bar?

Yes

> - How many subscribers do we currently have?

Sadly, 13 is what I came up with since we launched. :/

> - Target number of subscribers is 400, right?
 Yes

> Once it's ready, should I publish it straight away or should I wait
> for something (press release, blog post, etc) on your side first?

You can go ahead and publish it. We will follow up with blog more
posts and social network messages, etc.

Thank you so much for doing this Lucas! :)

Cheers,
-- 
Og B. Maciel
GNOME Foundation Board of Directors

omaciel@foresightlinux.org
ogmaciel@gnome.org

GPG Keys: D5CFC202

http://www.ogmaciel.com (en_US)
http://blog.ogmaciel.com (pt_BR)
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Subject: Re: FoG pending Tasks
From: Lucas Rocha <lucasr@gnome.org>
To: Og Maciel <ogmaciel@gnome.org>
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Hi,

It's now published on www.gnome.org and planet.gnome.org. Let me know
if you need any further support.

Cheers!

--lucasr


2011/1/7 Og Maciel <ogmaciel@gnome.org>:
> Hey Lucas!
>
>> Sure. I just need a few more details to get the ruler ready to publish:
>> - Are showing a counter of subscribers as a progress bar?
>
> Yes
>
>> - How many subscribers do we currently have?
>
> Sadly, 13 is what I came up with since we launched. :/
>
>> - Target number of subscribers is 400, right?
> =A0Yes
>
>> Once it's ready, should I publish it straight away or should I wait
>> for something (press release, blog post, etc) on your side first?
>
> You can go ahead and publish it. We will follow up with blog more
> posts and social network messages, etc.
>
> Thank you so much for doing this Lucas! :)
>
> Cheers,
> --
> Og B. Maciel
> GNOME Foundation Board of Directors
>
> omaciel@foresightlinux.org
> ogmaciel@gnome.org
>
> GPG Keys: D5CFC202
>
> http://www.ogmaciel.com (en_US)
> http://blog.ogmaciel.com (pt_BR)
>
From paul.r.cutler@gmail.com  Fri Jan  7 17:04:06 2011
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Hi,
I just pushed a couple small updates to the Friends website[1]. =A0I
updated the sidebar to be add updates from 2010, including a11y,
usability and hiring a sysadmin.  (It was showing 2008 stuff!)

I also updated the Amazon page[2] with support for Chromium and Chrome
from Jaap's last blog post. =A0(Thanks Jaap!)

Paul

[1]=A0http://www.gnome.org/friends/
[2]=A0http://www.gnome.org/friends/amazon/
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Hi Jason,

To get around Melange's funky feature set, can you please resubmit this
update plus a link to the wiki page as "Work submitted"? I will then be
able to extend the deadline for you.

Thanks!
Dave.

Jason Lo wrote:
> Hi, just an update. I've sent emails to Gnome Australia, Brazil,
> Chicago, Chile, China, and Deutschland so far, and am waiting for replies.
> 
> On Wed, Jan 5, 2011 at 12:10 PM, Dave Neary <dneary@gnome.org
> <mailto:dneary@gnome.org>> wrote:
> 
>     Hi,
> 
>     Jason Lo wrote:
>     > It seems to fit more with contact addresses. You said to a previous
>     > student that there were others doing this task as well, and that I
>     > should coordinate my efforts with them to make sure we don't
>     pester the
>     > same folks over and over again. Also, in your post on GCI, you
>     said you
>     > would provide emails that I could send this to.
> 
>     There is the gugmasters list:
>     http://mail.gnome.org/mailman/listinfo/gugmasters-list - but I think if
>     you mail the list, you will not get a good response rate. Worth trying -
>     but if you don't get a good response rate, we can try & send an email to
>     each member individually. Perhaps I could do it on your behalf...
> 
>     The other contacts are those in this wiki page. The list of lists you
>     point to is OK, but bear in mind that mailing a list is hit & miss at
>     best. You might get a better response rate by sending an email to the
>     "Contact" field, if it's set. The French one is definitely out of date,
>     though :) You should contact Vincent Untz instead.
> 
>     There is also a GNOME developing world list: developing-world-list - I
>     don't really know who's on it.
> 
>     You will need to be persistent, and make sure you keep us posted on what
>     groups you have information for, and which you don't, when information
>     starts coming in.
> 
>     Thanks!
>     Dave.
> 
>     --
>     Dave Neary
>     GNOME Foundation member
>     dneary@gnome.org <mailto:dneary@gnome.org>
> 
> 
> 
> 
> -- 
> Jason

-- 
Dave Neary
GNOME Foundation member
dneary@gnome.org
From sri@ramkrishna.me  Fri Jan  7 17:17:39 2011
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From: Sriram Ramkrishna <sri@ramkrishna.me>
Date: Fri, 7 Jan 2011 09:17:06 -0800
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To: Vikram Vaswani <vikram.vaswani@initmarketing.com>
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On Fri, Jan 7, 2011 at 12:18 AM, Vikram Vaswani <
vikram.vaswani@initmarketing.com> wrote:

> Hi Sriram,
>
>
>  We'd be interested in any feedback on these slides; please post your
>>> feedback directly to the list. We'll collect feedback until the second
>>> week
>>> of January and then make revisions as per feedback.
>>>
>>>
>>>  Has anybody gotten back to you regarding this?  We are heading into the
>> second of week of January now.
>>
>
> Nope, no feedback yet.
>
> Vikram
>


I have to make two presentations on Gnome 3.0 so I'll evaluate them and send
you some feedback.  I think I'll do as Dave as suggested which is to come up
with a mix and match 30 minute presentation.  It will be good practice for
me.

sri

--90e6ba6e85c2d9e945049944cacb
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<br><br><div class=3D"gmail_quote">On Fri, Jan 7, 2011 at 12:18 AM, Vikram =
Vaswani <span dir=3D"ltr">&lt;<a href=3D"mailto:vikram.vaswani@initmarketin=
g.com">vikram.vaswani@initmarketing.com</a>&gt;</span> wrote:<br><blockquot=
e class=3D"gmail_quote" style=3D"margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc sol=
id;padding-left:1ex;">

Hi Sriram,<div class=3D"im"><br>
<br>
<blockquote class=3D"gmail_quote" style=3D"margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1p=
x #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex"><blockquote class=3D"gmail_quote" style=3D"m=
argin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex">
We&#39;d be interested in any feedback on these slides; please post your<br=
>
feedback directly to the list. We&#39;ll collect feedback until the second =
week<br>
of January and then make revisions as per feedback.<br>
<br>
<br>
</blockquote>
Has anybody gotten back to you regarding this? =A0We are heading into the<b=
r>
second of week of January now.<br>
</blockquote>
<br></div>
Nope, no feedback yet.<br><font color=3D"#888888">
<br>
Vikram<br>
</font></blockquote></div><br><br>I have to make two presentations on Gnome=
 3.0 so I&#39;ll evaluate them and send you some feedback.=A0 I think I&#39=
;ll do as Dave as suggested which is to come up with a mix and match 30 min=
ute presentation.=A0 It will be good practice for me.<br>

<br>sri<br>

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Subject: Re: FoG pending Tasks
From: Lucas Rocha <lucasr@gnome.org>
To: Og Maciel <ogmaciel@gnome.org>
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--0023547c8a71477b800499436727
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1

Hi,

See attached image to know how it looks. Just need the actual data to
publish it.

--lucasr


2011/1/7 Lucas Rocha <lucasr@gnome.org>:
> Hi Og,
>
> 2011/1/6 Og Maciel <ogmaciel@gnome.org>:
>> Lucas,
>>
>> Paul Cutler has already pushed the text to the /friends/ directory in
>> gnomewml. Could you make the changes for us?
>
> Sure. I just need a few more details to get the ruler ready to publish:
> - Are showing a counter of subscribers as a progress bar?
> - How many subscribers do we currently have?
> - Target number of subscribers is 400, right?
>
> Once it's ready, should I publish it straight away or should I wait
> for something (press release, blog post, etc) on your side first?
>
> Cheers!
>
> --lucasr
>

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	www.gnome3.org]
To: allanpday@gmail.com
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Hi Allan,

On Fri, Jan 7, 2011 at 1:29 AM, Allan Day <allanpday@gmail.com> wrote:

>
> > Is someone willing to go through archives and talk to the people close
> > to the decision to try to document the features and rationale?
>
> That was my plan for the shell design page. I'm familiar with most of
> the design principles as well as the documentation which has been
> produced. I can also dredge the lists, and I can harass Jon and Jimmac
> if it comes down to it. :)
>
> That'd be great. We could start it on the wiki and then move it to
gnome3.org/... when it's ready.

Stormy

--00151750ea409b8b20049944f6bf
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Hi Allan,<br><br><div class=3D"gmail_quote">On Fri, Jan 7, 2011 at 1:29 AM,=
 Allan Day <span dir=3D"ltr">&lt;<a href=3D"mailto:allanpday@gmail.com">all=
anpday@gmail.com</a>&gt;</span> wrote:<br><blockquote class=3D"gmail_quote"=
 style=3D"margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex;">

<div><div></div><div class=3D"h5"><br>
&gt; Is someone willing to go through archives and talk to the people close=
<br>
&gt; to the decision to try to document the features and rationale?<br>
<br>
</div></div>That was my plan for the shell design page. I&#39;m familiar wi=
th most of<br>
the design principles as well as the documentation which has been<br>
produced. I can also dredge the lists, and I can harass Jon and Jimmac<br>
if it comes down to it. :)<br><br></blockquote><div>That&#39;d be great. We=
 could start it on the wiki and then move it to <a href=3D"http://gnome3.or=
g/.">gnome3.org/.</a>.. when it&#39;s ready.<br><br>Stormy <br></div></div>


--00151750ea409b8b20049944f6bf--
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Subject: Re: Short slide decks for use in GNOME community presentations
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To: Vikram Vaswani <vikram.vaswani@initmarketing.com>
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On Fri, Dec 24, 2010 at 06:19, Vikram Vaswani <
vikram.vaswani@initmarketing.com> wrote:

> - GNOME 3 Applications
> ...

- GNOME for Users
>

These are the only two which concern me; the others look great.
Particularly, the jhbuild modulesets now define featured applications which
comply with our GNOME Goals. I'm not sure how we will manage the attention
to these applications from a marketing perspective. There was a discussion
about this at the Boston Summit 2010 but ultimately it's up to the release
team. The Users deck should probably have a slide about the user experience
improvements in Shell.

--0016367fb3ad94509004994729b2
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<div class=3D"gmail_quote">On Fri, Dec 24, 2010 at 06:19, Vikram Vaswani <s=
pan dir=3D"ltr">&lt;<a href=3D"mailto:vikram.vaswani@initmarketing.com">vik=
ram.vaswani@initmarketing.com</a>&gt;</span> wrote:<br><blockquote class=3D=
"gmail_quote" style=3D"margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding=
-left:1ex;">
- GNOME 3 Applications<br>...=C2=A0</blockquote><blockquote class=3D"gmail_=
quote" style=3D"margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1=
ex;">- GNOME for Users<br></blockquote><div><br></div><div>These are the on=
ly two which concern me; the others look great. Particularly, the jhbuild m=
odulesets now define featured applications which comply with our GNOME Goal=
s. I&#39;m not sure how we will manage the attention to these applications =
from a marketing perspective. There was a discussion about this at the Bost=
on Summit 2010 but ultimately it&#39;s up to the release team. The Users de=
ck should probably have a slide about the user experience improvements in S=
hell.</div>
<div>=C2=A0</div></div>

--0016367fb3ad94509004994729b2--
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Vikram:

>     My name is Vikram Vaswani and I work with Initmarketing, the open
>     source marketing agency (www.initmarketing.com
>     <http://www.initmarketing.com>). We've been working with the GNOME
>     Foundation for the last few weeks to build a set of modular slide
>     decks for community members to use when making presentations.

These look great.  I understand these were provided as consulting work
for The GNOME Foundation.  Note that the GNOME Foundation did recently
announce an interest in receiving bids for doing additional GNOME
Marketing related work, perhaps with more of a focus on GNOME 3.

Overall looks really good.  Some comments I have...

Template:

- The "GNOMETemplate" file downloads as a binary blob without an
   OpenOffice extension, as just "GNOMETemplate" instead of
   "GNOMETemplate.odp" or whatever the suffix should be.

- Considering GNOME 3 is a big release, maybe a "Try out GNOME 3"
   slide to encourage users about the new release would be something
   useful to include.

- Should the "Sponsored By GNOME" page also include a link to
   http://live.gnome.org/CodeOfConduct/SpeakerGuidelines?

- It might be good to encourage people to license their presentations
   showing how to do so with a good free license such as CC-BY-SA 3.0
   http://creativecommons.org/licenses/by-sa/3.0/

   Can these templates be released under a good license like this?
   A license could go near the beginning of a slideset after the
   title page or at the end, I'd think.  It could just include the
   CC license logo and a sentence highlighting that the presentation
   is released under this license.

Accessibility:

- I think that this slide deck lacks good use of branding the GNOME
   logo to the accessibility project.  Only the term "GNOME" is used
   on the slide title.  This slide does does do a good job of listing
   out the various GNOME accessibility programs.  Perhaps using the
   GNOME logo on these pages to clearly highlight that these are
   programs in the "GNOME" accessibility suite would help.  Also,
   perhaps a page declaring and defining what "GNOME" Accessibility
   means specifically.  Now that KDE is adopting the "GNOME"
   Accessibility infrastructure, it is perhaps a bit confusing what
   parts of A11Y are GNOME cross-desktop and which are not.  This
   slide deck could discuss what "cross desktop" means a bit more.

   I think this page has a cool GNOME branded a11y logo that would
   be nice to include in this slide deck, I think.  Perhaps removing
   the "Outreach Program:" text from the top or just using it in ways
   that relate to "reaching out".

   http://projects.gnome.org/outreach/a11y/

- The Accessibility slide deck says "The GNOME Accessibility project
   develops and fosters compelling free open source accessibility
   solutions for graphical user interfaces."

   The term "graphical" should probably be removed.  The accessibility
   project also supports tactile user interfaces (e.g. braille displays).
   Or perhaps this could be reworded to highlight that a11y interfaces
   do not always relate to graphics.

   Slide 3 says "Winner of numerous rewards".  Which ones?

   Slide 4 says "Available to other desktops".  I understand what you
   mean, but I'd think this could be explained a bit more clearly to
   avoid confusion.  Which desktops?  Available how?

   Slide 6 says "Mouse tweaks" which is an application while the
   other bullets are all general categories.  Might be better to
   explain what "Mouse tweaks" does rather than its name.

   Slides 7-12 could use a bit more description.  What does "Mouse
   only access" mean?  What is a "Screen reader"?  Why does "Head
   Movement" relate to accessibility? seems the sorts of questions
   I'd expect people to have seeing these slides.

   Accessibility is very much a humanitarian project.  A slide
   showing a photo of someone who benefits from GNOME accessibility
   with a quote or something would be a nice way to add a bit
   more humans into the slideset.

- The resources page should contain a link to a top-level a11y
   page like http://projects.gnome.org/accessibility.  Perhaps
   users can figure out there are screencasts there without
   needing to provide the most specific link.

- The Accessibility slide deck doesn't have any page asking
   people to become Friends of GNOME.  Considering that accessibility
   probably has unique opportunities for seeking donations to help
   the disabled, it might be useful to have a slide that reaches out
   to people to donate to improve free software a11y tools.

Applications

- It is important to many people that GNOME interoperate with some
   popular non-GNOME programs such as Firefox, Thunderbird, GIMP,
   OpenOffice, Flash, KDE applications, etc.  Some of the organizations
   providing these programs are a part of The GNOME Foundation and
   community, so it would be nice to highlight this relationship.  A
   page that discusses how well GNOME integrates with such popular
   programs would be nice, perhaps with a caveat that support does vary
   between distros.

- I think PDF support is an important feature to many people, so
   evince might be nice to discuss.

- It might be cool to highlight that GNOME media programs make
   use of the GStreamer engine which supports plugins for popular
   non-free media formats (such as MPEG, Windows Media, etc.) via
   vendors like Fluendo.  Then it could be made more clear that codec
   supports works well across all GNOME media programs.

- Why only discuss audio media programs?  Perhaps a videoconferencing
   program like ekiga would be good to highlight more.

- GNOME does have an "Office" suite.  Should we highlight
   this better, or perhaps organize those "Office" programs this
   slide already talks about so they are more clearly branded as
   "GNOME Office"?

   http://live.gnome.org/GnomeOffice

- I like how the programs graphics are used.  Why not use graphics
   where programs are discussed in the "Accessibility" slide?

Developers:

- I do not like the use of the term "Rule".  A lot of them do not
   really seem like rules.  "Examples are good!" or "Learn from
   documentation" are not really rules.  These seem more like Guides or
   Best Practices.

- Would it be good to highlight the process for how a module can be
   accepted into GNOME?  Perhaps a mention that it must meet certain
   requirements such as a reasonable plan for accessibility support.

- Should we highlight some general information about how GNOME manages
   licensing?  What licenses are normally used by GNOME, whether we
   require copyright assignment, perhaps an opportunity to highlight
   the benefits of being a free software project a bit more specifically.

- Additional resources to consider adding:

   http://developer.gnome.org
   http://live.gnome.org
   where to find developers on IRC,
   the "Getting Started" web page http://www.gnome.org/start, etc.

Contributing

- On the Marketing tab, could we use the "Spread the word" image
   instead of the text which is conveniently also green.

   http://live.gnome.org/GnomeMarketing

- Perhaps a Resources page like in the "Developers" slide deck would
   be useful to have here also.

From sri@ramkrishna.me  Fri Jan  7 21:46:55 2011
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OK, I'm a bit confused here.  For some reason I thought we had decided to go
from GNOME to Gnome as GNOME is no longer considered an abbreviation.  Is
this true?  It just seems that we seem to be using the two interchangeably.
For my part, I'm using Gnome.

sri

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OK, I&#39;m a bit confused here.=A0 For some reason I thought we had decide=
d to go from GNOME to Gnome as GNOME is no longer considered an abbreviatio=
n.=A0 Is this true?=A0 It just seems that we seem to be using the two inter=
changeably.=A0 For my part, I&#39;m using Gnome. <br>

<br>sri<br>

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http://mail.gnome.org/archives/marketing-list/2010-April/msg00052.html

On Fri, Jan 7, 2011 at 15:46, Sriram Ramkrishna <sri@ramkrishna.me> wrote:

> OK, I'm a bit confused here.  For some reason I thought we had decided to
> go from GNOME to Gnome as GNOME is no longer considered an abbreviation.  Is
> this true?  It just seems that we seem to be using the two interchangeably.
> For my part, I'm using Gnome.
>
> sri
>
> --
> marketing-list mailing list
> marketing-list@gnome.org
> http://mail.gnome.org/mailman/listinfo/marketing-list
>
>

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<meta http-equiv=3D"content-type" content=3D"text/html; charset=3Dutf-8"><a=
 href=3D"http://mail.gnome.org/archives/marketing-list/2010-April/msg00052.=
html">http://mail.gnome.org/archives/marketing-list/2010-April/msg00052.htm=
l</a><br>
<br><div class=3D"gmail_quote">On Fri, Jan 7, 2011 at 15:46, Sriram Ramkris=
hna <span dir=3D"ltr">&lt;<a href=3D"mailto:sri@ramkrishna.me">sri@ramkrish=
na.me</a>&gt;</span> wrote:<br><blockquote class=3D"gmail_quote" style=3D"m=
argin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex;">
OK, I&#39;m a bit confused here.=C2=A0 For some reason I thought we had dec=
ided to go from GNOME to Gnome as GNOME is no longer considered an abbrevia=
tion.=C2=A0 Is this true?=C2=A0 It just seems that we seem to be using the =
two interchangeably.=C2=A0 For my part, I&#39;m using Gnome. <br>


<br>sri<br>
<br>--<br>
marketing-list mailing list<br>
<a href=3D"mailto:marketing-list@gnome.org">marketing-list@gnome.org</a><br=
>
<a href=3D"http://mail.gnome.org/mailman/listinfo/marketing-list" target=3D=
"_blank">http://mail.gnome.org/mailman/listinfo/marketing-list</a><br>
<br></blockquote></div><br>

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On 01/06/2011 08:00 PM, Sriram Ramkrishna wrote:
> 
> I'm not really that worn down.  If you are, you're emotionally investing too
> much into it.

I haven't said much during this exchange, but this response surprised
me.  Developers getting worn down by the hate is a real thing.  It's so
not fair to say that developers who get worn down are too emotionally
invested or are otherwise doing it wrong.

We have this problem with Miro right now where we've got a tiny staff of
developers and no customer relations kind of person.  Thus developers
like me end up sifting through the hate.  We've been discussing this
problem on our mailing list and it's probably the case all the devs are
going to stop reading the forums.  This got sent out this morning and
really summed up the whole problem for us:

http://jeff-vogel.blogspot.com/2011/01/three-reasons-creators-should-never.html

This isn't anything new.  This is not a "developers who feel worn down
are deficient" problem.  This is a "there needs to be someone in
between" problem.

My question is one of ignorance: does the GNOME community have a team of
people who stand between the developers and the various forums?

/will
From sri@ramkrishna.me  Sat Jan  8 19:07:45 2011
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From: Sriram Ramkrishna <sri@ramkrishna.me>
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Hi Will,

On Sat, Jan 8, 2011 at 4:37 AM, will kahn-greene <willg@bluesock.org> wrote:

> On 01/06/2011 08:00 PM, Sriram Ramkrishna wrote:
> >
> > I'm not really that worn down.  If you are, you're emotionally investing
> too
> > much into it.
>
> I haven't said much during this exchange, but this response surprised
> me.  Developers getting worn down by the hate is a real thing.  It's so
> not fair to say that developers who get worn down are too emotionally
> invested or are otherwise doing it wrong.
>

My comment was in response to Dave.  Neither of us are developers but both
of us are doing non-technical things.  The original problem statement was
that exactly as you describe that developers can be worn out by hate.  But I
was talking about community people like myself should not get worn down by
hate precisely because we're approaching community management from a
different perspective.


> We have this problem with Miro right now where we've got a tiny staff of
> developers and no customer relations kind of person.  Thus developers
> like me end up sifting through the hate.  We've been discussing this
> problem on our mailing list and it's probably the case all the devs are
> going to stop reading the forums.  This got sent out this morning and
> really summed up the whole problem for us:
>

Yes, this is a real issue and you need non-developer types who can help you
in community management.  There are a lot of people who have a sense of
entitlement and sometimes that must be approached with a firm hand.  The
goal is to take those people and see if we can make them useful contributors
in other ways.  Bring them into your development cycle as triage, marketing
and whatever.


>
>
> http://jeff-vogel.blogspot.com/2011/01/three-reasons-creators-should-never.html
>
> This isn't anything new.  This is not a "developers who feel worn down
> are deficient" problem.  This is a "there needs to be someone in
> between" problem.
>

Developers being worn down is a symptom of a problem of a lack of
communications.


>
> My question is one of ignorance: does the GNOME community have a team of
> people who stand between the developers and the various forums?
>
>
Not traditionally.  In a normal cycle we don't generally need to do much
community management.  This is likely because Ubuntu, Fedora, and other
distros are managing the desktop experience.  But with GNOME 3.0 we are sort
of in a place where I and some others believe that community management is
required in the short term.  We'll probably need to do it for a couple of
releases.

If you're interested in community management there are plenty of blog posts
on the subject.  I think Jono himself wrote up a post on it on Planet GNOME.
 You probably can engage Jono in a conversation on IRC or if you can grab
him at a conference he's pretty approachable.

Your link makes a good argument against forums which I had brought up in
this thread.

sri

--20cf30549b0b765ddc04995a7264
Content-Type: text/html; charset=ISO-8859-1
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Hi Will,<br><br><div class=3D"gmail_quote">On Sat, Jan 8, 2011 at 4:37 AM, =
will kahn-greene <span dir=3D"ltr">&lt;<a href=3D"mailto:willg@bluesock.org=
">willg@bluesock.org</a>&gt;</span> wrote:<br><blockquote class=3D"gmail_qu=
ote" style=3D"margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex=
;">

<div class=3D"im">On 01/06/2011 08:00 PM, Sriram Ramkrishna wrote:<br>
&gt;<br>
&gt; I&#39;m not really that worn down. =A0If you are, you&#39;re emotional=
ly investing too<br>
&gt; much into it.<br>
<br>
</div>I haven&#39;t said much during this exchange, but this response surpr=
ised<br>
me. =A0Developers getting worn down by the hate is a real thing. =A0It&#39;=
s so<br>
not fair to say that developers who get worn down are too emotionally<br>
invested or are otherwise doing it wrong.<br></blockquote><div><br></div><d=
iv>My comment was in response to Dave. =A0Neither of us are developers but =
both of us are doing non-technical things. =A0The original problem statemen=
t was that exactly as you describe that developers can be worn out by hate.=
 =A0But I was talking about community people like myself should not get wor=
n down by hate precisely because we&#39;re approaching community management=
 from a different perspective.</div>

<div><br></div><blockquote class=3D"gmail_quote" style=3D"margin:0 0 0 .8ex=
;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex;">
<br>
We have this problem with Miro right now where we&#39;ve got a tiny staff o=
f<br>
developers and no customer relations kind of person. =A0Thus developers<br>
like me end up sifting through the hate. =A0We&#39;ve been discussing this<=
br>
problem on our mailing list and it&#39;s probably the case all the devs are=
<br>
going to stop reading the forums. =A0This got sent out this morning and<br>
really summed up the whole problem for us:<br></blockquote><div><br></div><=
div>Yes, this is a real issue and you need non-developer types who can help=
 you in community management. =A0There are a lot of people who have a sense=
 of entitlement and sometimes that must be approached with a firm hand. =A0=
The goal is to take those people and see if we can make them useful contrib=
utors in other ways. =A0Bring them into your development cycle as triage, m=
arketing and whatever.</div>

<div>=A0=A0</div><blockquote class=3D"gmail_quote" style=3D"margin:0 0 0 .8=
ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex;">
<br>
<a href=3D"http://jeff-vogel.blogspot.com/2011/01/three-reasons-creators-sh=
ould-never.html" target=3D"_blank">http://jeff-vogel.blogspot.com/2011/01/t=
hree-reasons-creators-should-never.html</a><br>
<br>
This isn&#39;t anything new. =A0This is not a &quot;developers who feel wor=
n down<br>
are deficient&quot; problem. =A0This is a &quot;there needs to be someone i=
n<br>
between&quot; problem.<br></blockquote><div><br></div><div>Developers being=
 worn down is a symptom of a problem of a lack of communications.</div><div=
>=A0</div><blockquote class=3D"gmail_quote" style=3D"margin:0 0 0 .8ex;bord=
er-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex;">


<br>
My question is one of ignorance: does the GNOME community have a team of<br=
>
people who stand between the developers and the various forums?<br>
<font color=3D"#888888"><br></font></blockquote><div><br></div><div>Not tra=
ditionally. =A0In a normal cycle we don&#39;t generally need to do much com=
munity management. =A0This is likely because Ubuntu, Fedora, and other dist=
ros are managing the desktop experience. =A0But with GNOME 3.0 we are sort =
of in a place where I and some others believe that community management is =
required in the short term. =A0We&#39;ll probably need to do it for a coupl=
e of releases.</div>

<div><br></div><div>If you&#39;re interested in community management there =
are plenty of blog posts on the subject. =A0I think Jono himself wrote up a=
 post on it on Planet GNOME. =A0You probably can engage Jono in a conversat=
ion on IRC or if you can grab him at a conference he&#39;s pretty approacha=
ble.</div>

<div><br></div><div>Your link makes a good argument against forums which I =
had brought up in this thread.</div><div><br></div><div>sri</div></div>

--20cf30549b0b765ddc04995a7264--
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On 01/04/2011 03:35 PM, Stormy Peters wrote:
> Thanks, Andreas. It definitely needed an update and I like how it all 
> fits above the fold now.
>
> I would actually suggest simplifying it more and only giving people 
> 2-3 options. If we could offer them monthly and one time and then take 
> them to payment page and fill in a default (editable) amount and list 
> what all the amounts benefit from, that would be great. (I don't think 
> we can easily do that with Paypal though.)
Hm, interesting idea, it would probably need a bit of different design 
though. Will think about it some more and experiment a bit.
> FYI, in the last box, Philanthropist, when I select it, the words 
> overwrite the title.
Will fix!
- Andreas
From paul.r.cutler@gmail.com  Sun Jan  9 22:40:57 2011
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Subject: Re: String and UI Change Announcement Period
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It would be helpful to let the Marketing team know too- there is
interest in doing videos, but we need to know when the UI gets close
so the videos are as accurate as possible.

Paul

On Sun, Jan 9, 2011 at 4:31 PM, Vincent Untz <vuntz@gnome.org> wrote:
> Hi all,
>
> We'll enter the String and UI Change Announcement Period at the end of
> tomorrow. This means that starting on Tuesday:
>
> =A0- all string changes must be announced to both gnome-i18n@ and
> =A0 =A0gnome-doc-list@.
>
> =A0- all user interface changes must be announced to gnome-doc-list@.
>
> It probably makes sense at least for the shell team and for the people
> working on the default theme to tell gnome-doc-list how much of the UI
> can be expected to still change during that period. It'd be a shame to
> have people starting to take many screenshots if they'll all be outdated
> a few weeks after.
>
> Thanks,
>
> Vincent
>
> --
> Les gens heureux ne sont pas press=E9s.
> --
> devel-announce-list mailing list
> devel-announce-list@gnome.org
> http://mail.gnome.org/mailman/listinfo/devel-announce-list
>
From andreasn.pixel@gmail.com  Sun Jan  9 22:58:58 2011
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On 01/04/2011 09:11 PM, Stormy Peters wrote:
> We do have gnome3.org <http://gnome3.org> and we worked on it at the 
> last marketing hackfest. At that time, it was really close to 
> launching ...
http://www.andreasn.se/diverse/temp/gnome3.org/
This design is a bit different from the one I did at the Marketing 
Hackfest in Spain, but it has basically the same stuff + some new 
content that Allan recently put together.
No videos for now, since we don't have any ready, but a bunch of 
screenshots, some info, a faq and ways to try it. We can add more stuff, 
or refocus the page if needed later.
Should be pretty ready to launch.
- Andreas
>
> On Tue, Jan 4, 2011 at 12:56 PM, Sriram Ramkrishna <sri@ramkrishna.me 
> <mailto:sri@ramkrishna.me>> wrote:
>
>     Any chance we could get the DNS entry www.gnome3.org
>     <http://www.gnome3.org> (and I think gnome4 and gnome5 etc) so
>     that we can use it to centralize messaging to a particular URL?  I
>     think as we get close we want to be able to point people to a site
>     that is simple to remember and specific to gnome 3.
>
>     What do you guys think?
>


--------------060900090601020806030105
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<html>
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    On 01/04/2011 09:11 PM, Stormy Peters wrote:
    <blockquote
      cite="mid:AANLkTi=urXPw7vvn9FnnZC=X4mH71tcpED3_hHTBXAZw@mail.gmail.com"
      type="cite">We do have <a moz-do-not-send="true"
        href="http://gnome3.org">gnome3.org</a> and we worked on it at
      the last marketing hackfest. At that time, it was really close to
      launching ...<br>
    </blockquote>
    <a class="moz-txt-link-freetext" href="http://www.andreasn.se/diverse/temp/gnome3.org/">http://www.andreasn.se/diverse/temp/gnome3.org/</a><br>
    This design is a bit different from the one I did at the Marketing
    Hackfest in Spain, but it has basically the same stuff + some new
    content that Allan recently put together.<br>
    No videos for now, since we don't have any ready, but a bunch of
    screenshots, some info, a faq and ways to try it. We can add more
    stuff, or refocus the page if needed later.<br>
    Should be pretty ready to launch.<br>
    - Andreas
    <blockquote
      cite="mid:AANLkTi=urXPw7vvn9FnnZC=X4mH71tcpED3_hHTBXAZw@mail.gmail.com"
      type="cite"><br>
      <div class="gmail_quote">On Tue, Jan 4, 2011 at 12:56 PM, Sriram
        Ramkrishna <span dir="ltr">&lt;<a moz-do-not-send="true"
            href="mailto:sri@ramkrishna.me">sri@ramkrishna.me</a>&gt;</span>
        wrote:<br>
        <blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0 0 0
          .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex;">
          Any chance we could get the DNS entry <a
            moz-do-not-send="true" href="http://www.gnome3.org"
            target="_blank">www.gnome3.org</a> (and I think gnome4 and
          gnome5 etc) so that we can use it to centralize messaging to a
          particular URL?&nbsp; I think as we get close we want to be able to
          point people to a site that is simple to remember and specific
          to gnome 3.<br>
          <br>
          What do you guys think?<br>
        </blockquote>
      </div>
    </blockquote>
    <br>
  </body>
</html>

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On 01/04/2011 09:04 PM, Brian Cameron wrote:
> Andreas:
>
> The new design looks nice.  A few comments:
>
> - Currently the "Corporate Sponsorship" only includes being an "Advisory
>   Board member".  I'm not sure I like the term "Corporate" since
>   Advisory Board members can be other non-for-profits, Foundations, or
>   other non-Corporate organizations.  It would be nice to include
>   information about Advisory Board fees.
But if they are a non-profit, we don't currently charge them.
Advisory board fees sounds like a good idea.
>
>   It would also be nice to provide options for organizations that wish
>   to donate but not be on the Advisory Board (or not donate as much as
>   the fee).  Perhaps we could provide a page where we put logos/links
>   to organizations who donate in this way.  Or perhaps we could include
>   logos for organizations who donate a certain amount at events we
>   organize.  Perhaps we could offer a menu of choices where
>   organizations could be recognized in different ways based on the
>   amount donated.
That needs a bunch of work on it's own, but I agree with the idea in 
general.
We also need to figure out how to word it and where to put it.
>
> - The "List of Previous Donors" would be more cool if it allowed
>   people to provide links to their personal page if they wish
>   (perhaps their live.gnome.org page if they have one, for example).
More forms to fill in feels like a bad thing, or are we collecting this 
data in the paypal forms already?
>
>   I don't know how to improve this page, but just a long list of names
>   doesn't seem to be the best way to honor those who help us.
>
> - There are a number of places you can buy official GNOME branded
>   merchandise.  Shouldn't we highlight those here?
We highlight the GNOME Store on the www.gnome.org frontpage already, and 
if you really want a t-shirt you can donate at the sponsor-level. :) I'm 
hesitant about filling the friends page with more noise again.
>
> - In the "Thanks to donations, in 2010 we were able to:" section
>   it says "Hold a women outreach".  This seems oddly worded or an
>   incomplete sentence.  Perhaps "Organize a Women's Outreach Program"
>   might be more clear.
Will fix.
>
> - Also, I liked how the old FoG page highlighted that the GNOME
>   project benefits humanitarian projects like OLPC and a11y.  Would be
>   nice to be able to continue to highlight a more humanitarian message.
>   I would think this would encourage donations.
I know, and it was really hard to cut out that part from the sidebar 
(because it's and awesome message). Is there any way we can highlight 
this in the initial text somehow?
>
> - Will it be possible to earmark donations for certain projects (such
>   as Women's Outreach or a11y)?  If so, the page should highlight how
>   to do this.
This makes the forms and other stuff more detailed as well, and it could 
be a slippery slope regarding what teams we list there. I would rather 
see this as aimed donation campaigns instead.
- Andreas

From andreasn.pixel@gmail.com  Mon Jan 10 01:14:52 2011
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On 01/10/2011 01:04 AM, Allan Day wrote:
> Andreas Nilsson<nisses.mail@home.se>  wrote:
>> On 01/04/2011 09:11 PM, Stormy Peters wrote:
>>
>> We do have gnome3.org and we worked on it at the last marketing hackfest. At
>> that time, it was really close to launching ...
>>
>> http://www.andreasn.se/diverse/temp/gnome3.org/
>> This design is a bit different from the one I did at the Marketing Hackfest
>> in Spain, but it has basically the same stuff + some new content that Allan
>> recently put together.
>> No videos for now, since we don't have any ready, but a bunch of
>> screenshots, some info, a faq and ways to try it. We can add more stuff, or
>> refocus the page if needed later.
>> Should be pretty ready to launch.
>> - Andreas
> A few things:
>
>   * The exclamation mark needs to be removed from 'And much, much more'
Fixed.
>
>   * I've tweaked the distraction free computing paragraph:
> http://etherpad.tugraz.at/t95fCI5z5L .
Fixed.
>
>   * 'removes the need to switch from keyboard to mouse' needs to be
> removed from the everything at your fingertips paragraph
Fixed.
>
> Ooo, and one last thing - the buttons for get it and the faq kinda
> break up the flow of the text. If you want to keep them there, maybe
> we should remove the first paragraph ('For GNOME 3...')? Otherwise,
> what about moving those buttons, possibly to the bottom of the page?
Agreed. Fixed.
- Andreas
From fredm@gnome.org  Mon Jan 10 03:13:59 2011
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	gnome-doc-list@gnome.org, release-team@gnome.org
Subject: Re: GNOME 3.0 Hackfest + 1 day conference for the launch(in Asia)
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On 12/14/2010 11:09 PM, Jason D. Clinton wrote:
> On Tue, Dec 14, 2010 at 07:09, Frederic Muller <fredm@gnome.org
> <mailto:fredm@gnome.org>> wrote:
>
>     I'd like to echo the call we made to the release team here
>     http://mail.gnome.org/archives/release-team/2010-December/msg00031.html
>
>     and get a consensus on which date works better around GNOME 3.0
>     release (April 06) for each team to have a hackfest. We've been
>     discussing the plan since September with various members of each
>     team (to get the 3 teams together in a hackfest before a 1 day
>     conference to celebrate GNOME 3.0 launch with the public in Asia)
>     though emails and at the Boston Summit.
>
>
> I think that only the first time frame makes sense from the marketing
> perspective. I see little reason to conference about marketing after the
> release date. But we don't *have* to have a marketing hackfest. If other
> dates work better for other teams, feel free to opt for those.
>
Dear Documentation, Marketing and Release teams,

We've been moving forward with the conference preparation (in Bangalore) 
and we now need to pick the best possible date for everyone. We have 
potentially identified 2 options for the hackfest + conference dates, 
based on the survey and discussions with all the party involved: The 
conference should be on a weekend to get most people involved, and the 
hackfest before the release date (April 6) and spreading over 5 days, 
having 2 optional days for people who feel 3 days would be too short. 
That gives us either:
1. Wednesday March 30th to Friday April 1st: hackfest with 2 optional 
days on Monday 28th, and Tuesday 29th March
Saturday 2nd April: GNOME.Asia Summit 2011 (conference day)

2. Wednesday April 6th to Friday April 8th: hackfest with 2 optional 
days on Monday 4th, and Tuesday 5th April
Saturday 9th April: GNOME.Asia Summit 2011 (conference day)

Of course any feedback on those dates is welcome and hopefully we can 
find a good timing for all teams to prepare and get GNOME 3.0 out together.

Thank you and looking forward to your responses.

Fred

From diegoe@gmail.com  Mon Jan 10 07:22:01 2011
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Subject: Re: getting www.gnome3.org
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You ate a letter:

* Dark application themes for when you want to focus on pictures and videos
* edesigned workspaces so you can easily organise your windows
  ^

On Sun, Jan 9, 2011 at 8:14 PM, Andreas Nilsson <nisses.mail@home.se> wrote=
:
> On 01/10/2011 01:04 AM, Allan Day wrote:
>>
>> Andreas Nilsson<nisses.mail@home.se> =C2=A0wrote:
>>>
>>> On 01/04/2011 09:11 PM, Stormy Peters wrote:
>>>
>>> We do have gnome3.org and we worked on it at the last marketing hackfes=
t.
>>> At
>>> that time, it was really close to launching ...
>>>
>>> http://www.andreasn.se/diverse/temp/gnome3.org/
>>> This design is a bit different from the one I did at the Marketing
>>> Hackfest
>>> in Spain, but it has basically the same stuff + some new content that
>>> Allan
>>> recently put together.
>>> No videos for now, since we don't have any ready, but a bunch of
>>> screenshots, some info, a faq and ways to try it. We can add more stuff=
,
>>> or
>>> refocus the page if needed later.
>>> Should be pretty ready to launch.
>>> - Andreas
>>
>> A few things:
>>
>> =C2=A0* The exclamation mark needs to be removed from 'And much, much mo=
re'
>
> Fixed.
>>
>> =C2=A0* I've tweaked the distraction free computing paragraph:
>> http://etherpad.tugraz.at/t95fCI5z5L .
>
> Fixed.
>>
>> =C2=A0* 'removes the need to switch from keyboard to mouse' needs to be
>> removed from the everything at your fingertips paragraph
>
> Fixed.
>>
>> Ooo, and one last thing - the buttons for get it and the faq kinda
>> break up the flow of the text. If you want to keep them there, maybe
>> we should remove the first paragraph ('For GNOME 3...')? Otherwise,
>> what about moving those buttons, possibly to the bottom of the page?
>
> Agreed. Fixed.
> - Andreas
> --
> marketing-list mailing list
> marketing-list@gnome.org
> http://mail.gnome.org/mailman/listinfo/marketing-list
>
From vikram.vaswani@initmarketing.com  Mon Jan 10 09:52:40 2011
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Hi Brian and Jason,

Many thanks for your comments on the slide decks. I've noted them down 
and will respond in detail next week after all feedback is in.

> for The GNOME Foundation.  Note that the GNOME Foundation did recently
> announce an interest in receiving bids for doing additional GNOME
> Marketing related work, perhaps with more of a focus on GNOME 3.

Yes, we saw this and we'll be getting in touch with the Foundation about 
it. Many thanks for pointing it out.

I'd again encourage everyone on the list to review the slides and send 
in their feedback and comments by the end of this week so I have a 
complete list of changes to work with.

Thanks in advance.

Vikram Vaswani
Initmarketing

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Subject: Re: getting www.gnome3.org
From: Allan Day <allanpday@gmail.com>
To: Andreas Nilsson <nisses.mail@home.se>
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Andreas Nilsson wrote:
> On 01/04/2011 09:11 PM, Stormy Peters wrote: 
> > We do have gnome3.org and we worked on it at the last marketing
> > hackfest. At that time, it was really close to launching ...
> http://www.andreasn.se/diverse/temp/gnome3.org/
> This design is a bit different from the one I did at the Marketing
> Hackfest in Spain, but it has basically the same stuff + some new
> content that Allan recently put together.
> No videos for now, since we don't have any ready, but a bunch of
> screenshots, some info, a faq and ways to try it. We can add more
> stuff, or refocus the page if needed later.
> Should be pretty ready to launch.
> - Andreas 

Thanks for all your work on this, Andreas. The site is looking really
nice.

One topic that I think we need to discuss is the getit.html page [1]
since, from a marketing perspective, we need to be very careful how we
present this. I can think of a few issues here:

 * GNOME Shell != GNOME 3. Visually, it's the font, wallpaper, etc, and
there are all the application improvements too. Do we want to include
instructions for just trying GNOME Shell on this page, or for trying the
whole thing? If we go for the former, we should include a statement that
explains the relationship of GNOME Shell to GNOME 3.

 * How up-to-date is the software made available through the channels
listed on this page? Do we need to do some quality control to ensure
that the recommended methods are reasonably up-to-date?

 * The experience these previews provide is going to be sub-standard
compared with the final 3.0 release, and we need to indicate that to
users (in big big letters). Instead of 'Try it now', something like
'Test the alpha' or 'Technology previews' could work. And we need a big
'Alpha Version' or 'Preview Versions' sticker on the page [1], plus some
text [2] which explains the quality issue.

Best,

Allan

[1] http://www.andreasn.se/diverse/temp/gnome3.org/getit.html

[2] What about: 'GNOME 3 is under active development and will not be
completed until March 2010. If you are interested in what it will look
like, want to help with testing, or just cannot wait to give it a go,
you can use one of the following methods to try a preview version.
Please be aware that these previews will not provide as good an
experience as the completed version of GNOME 3, however.'?
-- 
Blog: http://afaikblog.wordpress.com/
IRC: aday on irc.gnome.org

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Subject: Re: getting www.gnome3.org
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Suggestion from a friend of mine (who doesn't speak English): maybe we
should register madeofeasy.org too?

--lucasr


2011/1/10 Allan Day <allanpday@gmail.com>:
> Andreas Nilsson wrote:
>> On 01/04/2011 09:11 PM, Stormy Peters wrote:
>> > We do have gnome3.org and we worked on it at the last marketing
>> > hackfest. At that time, it was really close to launching ...
>> http://www.andreasn.se/diverse/temp/gnome3.org/
>> This design is a bit different from the one I did at the Marketing
>> Hackfest in Spain, but it has basically the same stuff + some new
>> content that Allan recently put together.
>> No videos for now, since we don't have any ready, but a bunch of
>> screenshots, some info, a faq and ways to try it. We can add more
>> stuff, or refocus the page if needed later.
>> Should be pretty ready to launch.
>> - Andreas
>
> Thanks for all your work on this, Andreas. The site is looking really
> nice.
>
> One topic that I think we need to discuss is the getit.html page [1]
> since, from a marketing perspective, we need to be very careful how we
> present this. I can think of a few issues here:
>
> =A0* GNOME Shell !=3D GNOME 3. Visually, it's the font, wallpaper, etc, a=
nd
> there are all the application improvements too. Do we want to include
> instructions for just trying GNOME Shell on this page, or for trying the
> whole thing? If we go for the former, we should include a statement that
> explains the relationship of GNOME Shell to GNOME 3.
>
> =A0* How up-to-date is the software made available through the channels
> listed on this page? Do we need to do some quality control to ensure
> that the recommended methods are reasonably up-to-date?
>
> =A0* The experience these previews provide is going to be sub-standard
> compared with the final 3.0 release, and we need to indicate that to
> users (in big big letters). Instead of 'Try it now', something like
> 'Test the alpha' or 'Technology previews' could work. And we need a big
> 'Alpha Version' or 'Preview Versions' sticker on the page [1], plus some
> text [2] which explains the quality issue.
>
> Best,
>
> Allan
>
> [1] http://www.andreasn.se/diverse/temp/gnome3.org/getit.html
>
> [2] What about: 'GNOME 3 is under active development and will not be
> completed until March 2010. If you are interested in what it will look
> like, want to help with testing, or just cannot wait to give it a go,
> you can use one of the following methods to try a preview version.
> Please be aware that these previews will not provide as good an
> experience as the completed version of GNOME 3, however.'?
> --
> Blog: http://afaikblog.wordpress.com/
> IRC: aday on irc.gnome.org
>
> --
> marketing-list mailing list
> marketing-list@gnome.org
> http://mail.gnome.org/mailman/listinfo/marketing-list
>
From sri@ramkrishna.me  Mon Jan 10 17:37:06 2011
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On Mon, Jan 10, 2011 at 2:17 AM, Allan Day <allanpday@gmail.com> wrote:

> Andreas Nilsson wrote:
> > On 01/04/2011 09:11 PM, Stormy Peters wrote:
> > > We do have gnome3.org and we worked on it at the last marketing
> > > hackfest. At that time, it was really close to launching ...
> > http://www.andreasn.se/diverse/temp/gnome3.org/
> > This design is a bit different from the one I did at the Marketing
> > Hackfest in Spain, but it has basically the same stuff + some new
> > content that Allan recently put together.
> > No videos for now, since we don't have any ready, but a bunch of
> > screenshots, some info, a faq and ways to try it. We can add more
> > stuff, or refocus the page if needed later.
> > Should be pretty ready to launch.
> > - Andreas
>
> Thanks for all your work on this, Andreas. The site is looking really
> nice.
>

Ditto!  I do have a couple of suggesiton.  The background seems to be of the
same palette as the letters and it makes it slightly harder to see.  I'm
wondering if a better contrasting background color (slightly darker
perhaps?) might make the letters pop out a little better.  This is just a
personal observation and of course YMMV.  It would be easier to read then.
But then I've found that my eyesight has gotten somewhat worse this past
couple of months!  Damn these post 40 years. :)


>
>  * The experience these previews provide is going to be sub-standard
> compared with the final 3.0 release, and we need to indicate that to
> users (in big big letters). Instead of 'Try it now', something like
> 'Test the alpha' or 'Technology previews' could work. And we need a big
> 'Alpha Version' or 'Preview Versions' sticker on the page [1], plus some
> text [2] which explains the quality issue.
>
> Just a slight digression on this, as your "preview release" reminded me of
something I wanted to mention regarding our own final release:

So, my observations regarding KDE4 on slashdot and other forums are that
users are nuts.  KDE 4.0 was released as a "preview release" and people were
bitching constantly about regressions despite whatever was said about it.
Basically, they've decided that if you put 4.0 in front of it it means that
it is stable and is ready to use and has all the bells and whistles like the
last release.  "3.0 == stable"  Now for us we aren't going to have
everything at 3.0, and I'm hoping GNOME users are a lot better at accepting
this than KDE users were.  I have no idea where you get that kind of idea in
software.  Nobody believes that a dot oh of anything is going to be
completely stable.  We need to be on our guard there as I don't believe we
will be feature complete by release.


Now as for previews itself, I think we will need to do that so that it is
constantly mentioned.  I would like to put something in slashdot and other
forums that it is available and it is a preview release.  With the final
release in mind, we will need to seed the expectation that GNOME 3.0 will
iteratively be feature complete a year after release or something and will
continue in a different direction.

Best,
>
> Allan
>
> [1] http://www.andreasn.se/diverse/temp/gnome3.org/getit.html
>
> [2] What about: 'GNOME 3 is under active development and will not be
> completed until March 2010. If you are interested in what it will look
> like, want to help with testing, or just cannot wait to give it a go,
> you can use one of the following methods to try a preview version.
> Please be aware that these previews will not provide as good an
> experience as the completed version of GNOME 3, however.'?
>

If you add that, we need to at least teach people how to interact with
developers on feedback.  I can imagine a fresh bunch of people joining the
mailing list and we'll have to go through the whole thing again.  Pointing
towards bugzilla, the faq, and design decisions also should be required.

sri

--20cf30549df1ebeb3304998169d1
Content-Type: text/html; charset=ISO-8859-1
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

<br><br><div class=3D"gmail_quote">On Mon, Jan 10, 2011 at 2:17 AM, Allan D=
ay <span dir=3D"ltr">&lt;<a href=3D"mailto:allanpday@gmail.com">allanpday@g=
mail.com</a>&gt;</span> wrote:<br><blockquote class=3D"gmail_quote" style=
=3D"margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex;">

<div class=3D"im">Andreas Nilsson wrote:<br>
&gt; On 01/04/2011 09:11 PM, Stormy Peters wrote:<br>
&gt; &gt; We do have <a href=3D"http://gnome3.org" target=3D"_blank">gnome3=
.org</a> and we worked on it at the last marketing<br>
&gt; &gt; hackfest. At that time, it was really close to launching ...<br>
&gt; <a href=3D"http://www.andreasn.se/diverse/temp/gnome3.org/" target=3D"=
_blank">http://www.andreasn.se/diverse/temp/gnome3.org/</a><br>
&gt; This design is a bit different from the one I did at the Marketing<br>
&gt; Hackfest in Spain, but it has basically the same stuff + some new<br>
&gt; content that Allan recently put together.<br>
&gt; No videos for now, since we don&#39;t have any ready, but a bunch of<b=
r>
&gt; screenshots, some info, a faq and ways to try it. We can add more<br>
&gt; stuff, or refocus the page if needed later.<br>
&gt; Should be pretty ready to launch.<br>
&gt; - Andreas<br>
<br>
</div>Thanks for all your work on this, Andreas. The site is looking really=
<br>
nice.<br></blockquote><div><br>Ditto!=A0 I do have a couple of suggesiton.=
=A0 The background seems to be of the same palette as the letters and it ma=
kes it slightly harder to see.=A0 I&#39;m wondering if a better contrasting=
 background color (slightly darker perhaps?) might make the letters pop out=
 a little better.=A0 This is just a personal observation and of course YMMV=
.=A0 It would be easier to read then.=A0 But then I&#39;ve found that my ey=
esight has gotten somewhat worse this past couple of months!=A0 Damn these =
post 40 years. :)<br>

=A0<br></div><blockquote class=3D"gmail_quote" style=3D"margin: 0pt 0pt 0pt=
 0.8ex; border-left: 1px solid rgb(204, 204, 204); padding-left: 1ex;">
<br>
=A0* The experience these previews provide is going to be sub-standard<br>
compared with the final 3.0 release, and we need to indicate that to<br>
users (in big big letters). Instead of &#39;Try it now&#39;, something like=
<br>
&#39;Test the alpha&#39; or &#39;Technology previews&#39; could work. And w=
e need a big<br>
&#39;Alpha Version&#39; or &#39;Preview Versions&#39; sticker on the page [=
1], plus some<br>
text [2] which explains the quality issue.<br>
<br></blockquote><div>Just a slight digression on this, as your &quot;previ=
ew release&quot; reminded me of something I wanted to mention regarding our=
 own final release:<br><br>So, my observations regarding KDE4 on slashdot a=
nd other forums are that users are nuts.=A0 KDE 4.0 was released as a &quot=
;preview release&quot; and people were bitching constantly about regression=
s despite whatever was said about it.=A0 Basically, they&#39;ve decided tha=
t if you put 4.0 in front of it it means that it is stable and is ready to =
use and has all the bells and whistles like the last release.=A0 &quot;3.0 =
=3D=3D stable&quot;=A0 Now for us we aren&#39;t going to have everything at=
 3.0, and I&#39;m hoping GNOME users are a lot better at accepting this tha=
n KDE users were.=A0 I have no idea where you get that kind of idea in soft=
ware.=A0 Nobody believes that a dot oh of anything is going to be completel=
y stable.=A0 We need to be on our guard there as I don&#39;t believe we wil=
l be feature complete by release.<br>

<br>=A0<br>Now as for previews itself, I think we will need to do that so t=
hat it is constantly mentioned.=A0 I would like to put something in slashdo=
t and other forums that it is available and it is a preview release.=A0 Wit=
h the final release in mind, we will need to seed the expectation that GNOM=
E 3.0 will iteratively be feature complete a year after release or somethin=
g and will continue in a different direction.<br>

<br></div><blockquote class=3D"gmail_quote" style=3D"margin: 0pt 0pt 0pt 0.=
8ex; border-left: 1px solid rgb(204, 204, 204); padding-left: 1ex;">
Best,<br>
<br>
Allan<br>
<br>
[1] <a href=3D"http://www.andreasn.se/diverse/temp/gnome3.org/getit.html" t=
arget=3D"_blank">http://www.andreasn.se/diverse/temp/gnome3.org/getit.html<=
/a><br>
<br>
[2] What about: &#39;GNOME 3 is under active development and will not be<br=
>
completed until March 2010. If you are interested in what it will look<br>
like, want to help with testing, or just cannot wait to give it a go,<br>
you can use one of the following methods to try a preview version.<br>
Please be aware that these previews will not provide as good an<br>
experience as the completed version of GNOME 3, however.&#39;?<br></blockqu=
ote><div><br>If you add that, we need to at least teach people how to inter=
act with developers on feedback.=A0 I can imagine a fresh bunch of people j=
oining the mailing list and we&#39;ll have to go through the whole thing ag=
ain.=A0 Pointing towards bugzilla, the faq, and design decisions also shoul=
d be required.<br>

<br>sri <br></div></div>

--20cf30549df1ebeb3304998169d1--
From sri@ramkrishna.me  Mon Jan 10 17:37:33 2011
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On Mon, Jan 10, 2011 at 2:45 AM, Lucas Rocha <lucasr@gnome.org> wrote:

> Suggestion from a friend of mine (who doesn't speak English): maybe we
> should register madeofeasy.org too?
> \
>

If it is available, then we should do it.

sri

--90e6ba6e897488ecd40499816bb0
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<br><br><div class=3D"gmail_quote">On Mon, Jan 10, 2011 at 2:45 AM, Lucas R=
ocha <span dir=3D"ltr">&lt;<a href=3D"mailto:lucasr@gnome.org">lucasr@gnome=
.org</a>&gt;</span> wrote:<br><blockquote class=3D"gmail_quote" style=3D"ma=
rgin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex;">

Suggestion from a friend of mine (who doesn&#39;t speak English): maybe we<=
br>
should register <a href=3D"http://madeofeasy.org" target=3D"_blank">madeofe=
asy.org</a> too?<br>
\<br></blockquote><div><br>If it is available, then we should do it.<br><br=
>sri <br></div></div>

--90e6ba6e897488ecd40499816bb0--
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Hi,

Allan Day wrote:
>  * GNOME Shell != GNOME 3. Visually, it's the font, wallpaper, etc, and
> there are all the application improvements too. Do we want to include
> instructions for just trying GNOME Shell on this page, or for trying the
> whole thing? If we go for the former, we should include a statement that
> explains the relationship of GNOME Shell to GNOME 3.

I'd like to try the whole thing. Ideally, I would love to be able to use
GNOME 2.91.x right now (and I think we should be encouraging as many
people on d-d-l who aren't already dogfooding to do so before the GNOME
3 release).

I haven't figured out any way to do this with 2.91.3 on Ubuntu, apart
from jhbuild (and I'd like to go through the package manager if I can).

>  * The experience these previews provide is going to be sub-standard
> compared with the final 3.0 release, and we need to indicate that to
> users (in big big letters). Instead of 'Try it now', something like
> 'Test the alpha' or 'Technology previews' could work. And we need a big
> 'Alpha Version' or 'Preview Versions' sticker on the page [1], plus some
> text [2] which explains the quality issue.

We discussed this on IRC a few days ago - I agree with Allan. We want to
get people using it, because that will dispell some of the FUD around
GNOME 3, whether hardware is compatible or not, etc. We should also
document (discretely ;) rollback instructions for returning to GNOME 2
if things don't work out.

Cheers,
Dave.

-- 
Dave Neary
GNOME Foundation member
dneary@gnome.org
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Andreas:

>> - Currently the "Corporate Sponsorship" only includes being an "Advisory
>> Board member". I'm not sure I like the term "Corporate" since
>> Advisory Board members can be other non-for-profits, Foundations, or
>> other non-Corporate organizations. It would be nice to include
>> information about Advisory Board fees.
> But if they are a non-profit, we don't currently charge them.

We should mention more about how non-profits work in terms of fees,
agreed.

But I was just trying to highlight that sponsors and Advisory Board
members are not necessarily "Corporate" entities, so I think it would
be best to avoid the term "Corporate".  For example, I could imagine a
"School for the Blind" being on the advisory board if they made use of
GNOME technologies and were in a good position to  provide The GNOME
Foundation with advisory input.  Such an organization may not be a
"corporate" one.

>> It would also be nice to provide options for organizations that wish
>> to donate but not be on the Advisory Board (or not donate as much as
>> the fee). Perhaps we could provide a page where we put logos/links
>> to organizations who donate in this way. Or perhaps we could include
>> logos for organizations who donate a certain amount at events we
>> organize. Perhaps we could offer a menu of choices where
>> organizations could be recognized in different ways based on the
>> amount donated.
> That needs a bunch of work on it's own, but I agree with the idea in
> general.
> We also need to figure out how to word it and where to put it.

Sure.

>> - Will it be possible to earmark donations for certain projects (such
>> as Women's Outreach or a11y)? If so, the page should highlight how
>> to do this.
> This makes the forms and other stuff more detailed as well, and it could
> be a slippery slope regarding what teams we list there. I would rather
> see this as aimed donation campaigns instead.

Anybody else have any thoughts about what we should do here?

Brian
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Subject: Re: getting www.gnome3.org
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<snip>
> So, my observations regarding KDE4 on slashdot and other forums are
> that users are nuts.  KDE 4.0 was released as a "preview release" and
> people were bitching constantly about regressions despite whatever was
> said about it.  Basically, they've decided that if you put 4.0 in
> front of it it means that it is stable and is ready to use and has all
> the bells and whistles like the last release.  "3.0 == stable"  Now
> for us we aren't going to have everything at 3.0, and I'm hoping GNOME
> users are a lot better at accepting this than KDE users were.  I have
> no idea where you get that kind of idea in software.  Nobody believes
> that a dot oh of anything is going to be completely stable.  We need
> to be on our guard there as I don't believe we will be feature
> complete by release.
> 
>  
> Now as for previews itself, I think we will need to do that so that it
> is constantly mentioned.  I would like to put something in slashdot
> and other forums that it is available and it is a preview release.
> With the final release in mind, we will need to seed the expectation
> that GNOME 3.0 will iteratively be feature complete a year after
> release or something and will continue in a different direction.
</snip>

I think it's fair for users to expect that a dot oh release should be
stable and ready for the vast majority of use cases. There might be the
odd niggle, but the essential functionality should be there. I would in
no way want people to get the impression that 3.0 will not be 'feature
complete'. (Please, let's not use that phrase; it could backfire
horribly!)

What we can do is spread the word that we have lots of cool and exciting
plans for the 3.x release series. 3.0 will be great, and it will
continue to get better and better in the months and years to come.

Allan

-- 
Blog: http://afaikblog.wordpress.com/
IRC: aday on irc.gnome.org

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On 01/10/2011 11:17 AM, Allan Day wrote:
> Andreas Nilsson wrote:
>> On 01/04/2011 09:11 PM, Stormy Peters wrote:
>>> We do have gnome3.org and we worked on it at the last marketing
>>> hackfest. At that time, it was really close to launching ...
>> http://www.andreasn.se/diverse/temp/gnome3.org/
>
>   * GNOME Shell != GNOME 3. Visually, it's the font, wallpaper, etc, and
> there are all the application improvements too. Do we want to include
> instructions for just trying GNOME Shell on this page, or for trying the
> whole thing? If we go for the former, we should include a statement that
> explains the relationship of GNOME Shell to GNOME 3.
As "the whole thing" is a bit more complex, I would go with the 
statement instead. For now.
>   * How up-to-date is the software made available through the channels
> listed on this page? Do we need to do some quality control to ensure
> that the recommended methods are reasonably up-to-date?
I can confirm that the Ubuntu PPA packages seems pretty up to date.
I also want to put the usb stick image here as soon as Frederic Crozat 
is done with them (seems to be blocking on that all his builds are 
failing right now).
<http://blog.crozat.net/search/label/General>
>   * The experience these previews provide is going to be sub-standard
> compared with the final 3.0 release, and we need to indicate that to
> users (in big big letters). Instead of 'Try it now', something like
> 'Test the alpha' or 'Technology previews' could work. And we need a big
> 'Alpha Version' or 'Preview Versions' sticker on the page [1], plus some
> text [2] which explains the quality issue.
Done!
Feel free to tweak the texts in the git repo [1].
1. 
http://gitorious.org/gnome-design/gnome-design/trees/master/www/gnome3.org
- Andreas

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<html>
  <head>
    <meta content="text/html; charset=UTF-8" http-equiv="Content-Type">
  </head>
  <body text="#000000" bgcolor="#FFFFFF">
    On 01/10/2011 11:17 AM, Allan Day wrote:
    <blockquote cite="mid:1294654663.2232.18.camel@blackbox.lan"
      type="cite">
      <pre wrap="">Andreas Nilsson wrote:
</pre>
      <blockquote type="cite">
        <pre wrap="">On 01/04/2011 09:11 PM, Stormy Peters wrote: 
</pre>
        <blockquote type="cite">
          <pre wrap="">We do have gnome3.org and we worked on it at the last marketing
hackfest. At that time, it was really close to launching ...
</pre>
        </blockquote>
        <pre wrap=""><a class="moz-txt-link-freetext" href="http://www.andreasn.se/diverse/temp/gnome3.org/">http://www.andreasn.se/diverse/temp/gnome3.org/</a>
</pre>
      </blockquote>
      <pre wrap="">

 * GNOME Shell != GNOME 3. Visually, it's the font, wallpaper, etc, and
there are all the application improvements too. Do we want to include
instructions for just trying GNOME Shell on this page, or for trying the
whole thing? If we go for the former, we should include a statement that
explains the relationship of GNOME Shell to GNOME 3.</pre>
    </blockquote>
    As "the whole thing" is a bit more complex, I would go with the
    statement instead. For now.<br>
    <blockquote cite="mid:1294654663.2232.18.camel@blackbox.lan"
      type="cite">
      <pre wrap="">
 * How up-to-date is the software made available through the channels
listed on this page? Do we need to do some quality control to ensure
that the recommended methods are reasonably up-to-date?</pre>
    </blockquote>
    I can confirm that the Ubuntu PPA packages seems pretty up to date.<br>
    I also want to put the usb stick image here as soon as Frederic
    Crozat is done with them (seems to be blocking on that all his
    builds are failing right now).<br>
    <a href="http://blog.crozat.net/search/label/General"
      class="message" title="no activity in 60 days"></a>
    <blockquote cite="mid:1294654663.2232.18.camel@blackbox.lan"
      type="cite">
      <pre wrap="">
 * The experience these previews provide is going to be sub-standard
compared with the final 3.0 release, and we need to indicate that to
users (in big big letters). Instead of 'Try it now', something like
'Test the alpha' or 'Technology previews' could work. And we need a big
'Alpha Version' or 'Preview Versions' sticker on the page [1], plus some
text [2] which explains the quality issue.</pre>
    </blockquote>
    Done!<br>
    Feel free to tweak the texts in the git repo [1].<br>
    1.
<a class="moz-txt-link-freetext" href="http://gitorious.org/gnome-design/gnome-design/trees/master/www/gnome3.org">http://gitorious.org/gnome-design/gnome-design/trees/master/www/gnome3.org</a><br>
    - Andreas<br>
  </body>
</html>

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So I'm still doing this task. I'm sorry I haven't sent any updates in the
last two days, I was quite busy.

So far I've emailed about half of the list, and have only gotten info from
China and Brazil. I've gotten updated contact info from them and estimated
member populations. Also, GNOME Brazil had a meetup recently (which I have
added to the wiki), and GNOME China is trying to open up a store, if I read
correctly.

And I just noticed that technically the GCI thing finished, so I can't get
credit for this task. Oh well, I'll still follow it through; I'd feel like a
jerk if I were to just drop it, especially seeing the other two students who
did just go and drop it, heh.

More updates soon!

-- 
Jason

--0015175cb820cadf1a04998a6e13
Content-Type: text/html; charset=ISO-8859-1
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

So I&#39;m still doing this task. I&#39;m sorry I haven&#39;t sent any upda=
tes in the last two days, I was quite busy.<div><br></div><div>So far I&#39=
;ve emailed about half of the list, and have only gotten info from China an=
d Brazil. I&#39;ve gotten updated contact info from them and estimated memb=
er populations. Also, GNOME Brazil had a meetup recently (which I have adde=
d to the wiki), and GNOME China is trying to open up a store, if I read cor=
rectly.</div>

<div><br></div><div>And I just noticed that technically the GCI thing finis=
hed, so I can&#39;t get credit for this task. Oh well, I&#39;ll still follo=
w it through; I&#39;d feel like a jerk if I were to just drop it, especiall=
y seeing the other two students who did just go and drop it, heh.</div>

<div><br></div><div>More updates soon!</div><div><br></div><div>-- <br>Jaso=
n<br>
</div>

--0015175cb820cadf1a04998a6e13--
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On 01/11/2011 12:22 PM, Jason Lo wrote:
> So I'm still doing this task. I'm sorry I haven't sent any updates in
> the last two days, I was quite busy.
>
> So far I've emailed about half of the list, and have only gotten info
> from China and Brazil. I've gotten updated contact info from them and
> estimated member populations. Also, GNOME Brazil had a meetup recently
> (which I have added to the wiki), and GNOME China is trying to open up a
> store, if I read correctly.
>
> And I just noticed that technically the GCI thing finished, so I can't
> get credit for this task. Oh well, I'll still follow it through; I'd
> feel like a jerk if I were to just drop it, especially seeing the other
> two students who did just go and drop it, heh.
>
> More updates soon!
>
> --
> Jason
>
 From what I know, both the Beijing and Taiwan GUG meet monthly (Taiwan 
GUG meeting has been in Taipei so far).

Fred
From allanpday@gmail.com  Tue Jan 11 09:46:31 2011
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Subject: Re: getting www.gnome3.org
From: Allan Day <allanpday@gmail.com>
To: Andreas Nilsson <nisses.mail@home.se>
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Andreas Nilsson wrote:
> On 01/10/2011 11:17 AM, Allan Day wrote: 
> > Andreas Nilsson wrote:
> > > On 01/04/2011 09:11 PM, Stormy Peters wrote: 
> > > > We do have gnome3.org and we worked on it at the last marketing
> > > > hackfest. At that time, it was really close to launching ...
> > > http://www.andreasn.se/diverse/temp/gnome3.org/
> > 
> >  * GNOME Shell != GNOME 3. Visually, it's the font, wallpaper, etc, and
> > there are all the application improvements too. Do we want to include
> > instructions for just trying GNOME Shell on this page, or for trying the
> > whole thing? If we go for the former, we should include a statement that
> > explains the relationship of GNOME Shell to GNOME 3.
> As "the whole thing" is a bit more complex, I would go with the
> statement instead. For now.

Having done a bit of research into this yesterday, I'm inclined to agree
with you. We don't seem to be at the stage where testing a complete and
reasonably up-to-date version of GNOME 3 is anywhere near trivial.

I'll write some explanatory text for the try it page today.

> > * How up-to-date is the software made available through the channels
> > listed on this page? Do we need to do some quality control to ensure
> > that the recommended methods are reasonably up-to-date?
> I can confirm that the Ubuntu PPA packages seems pretty up to date.

Which PPA is that? This one [1], or this one [2]? Did you test it
yourself? It would be great to hear from anyone who does have experience
of using either of these PPAs...

> I also want to put the usb stick image here as soon as Frederic Crozat
> is done with them (seems to be blocking on that all his builds are
> failing right now).

It would be amazing to have that...

> > * The experience these previews provide is going to be sub-standard
> > compared with the final 3.0 release, and we need to indicate that to
> > users (in big big letters). Instead of 'Try it now', something like
> > 'Test the alpha' or 'Technology previews' could work. And we need a big
> > 'Alpha Version' or 'Preview Versions' sticker on the page [1], plus some
> > text [2] which explains the quality issue.
> Done!

You're a legend, Andreas!

> Feel free to tweak the texts in the git repo [1].

Don't worry: I will. :)

Allan

[1] https://launchpad.net/~ricotz/+archive/testing
[2] https://launchpad.net/~gnome3-team/+archive/gnome3/+packages
-- 
Blog: http://afaikblog.wordpress.com/
IRC: aday on irc.gnome.org

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Oh - and, fwiw: as a mamber of GNOME France, I have not heard anything
about your request, and as a member of guigmasters, I didn't see any
email from you there yet.

Cheers,
Dave.

Jason Lo wrote:
> So I'm still doing this task. I'm sorry I haven't sent any updates in
> the last two days, I was quite busy.
> 
> So far I've emailed about half of the list, and have only gotten info
> from China and Brazil. I've gotten updated contact info from them and
> estimated member populations. Also, GNOME Brazil had a meetup recently
> (which I have added to the wiki), and GNOME China is trying to open up a
> store, if I read correctly.
> 
> And I just noticed that technically the GCI thing finished, so I can't
> get credit for this task. Oh well, I'll still follow it through; I'd
> feel like a jerk if I were to just drop it, especially seeing the other
> two students who did just go and drop it, heh.
> 
> More updates soon!
> 
> -- 
> Jason

-- 
Dave Neary
GNOME Foundation member
dneary@gnome.org
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Hi,

Allan Day wrote:
> Which PPA is that? This one [1], or this one [2]? Did you test it
> yourself? It would be great to hear from anyone who does have experience
> of using either of these PPAs...

I was going to try [2] until I noticed that (a) it's only available for
11.04 and (b) gnome-shell wasn't even built for it, because of a failing
dependency. I used [1] on Ubuntu 10.10 and it seems to work fine.

> [1] https://launchpad.net/~ricotz/+archive/testing
> [2] https://launchpad.net/~gnome3-team/+archive/gnome3/+packages


I'm currently upgrading to 11.04 to get the latest greatest. Robert
Ancell tells me that:
> Unfortunately there is no source for GNOME Shell in Ubuntu 10.10, you
> need to use 11.04 (we decided not to maintain packages for both 10.10
> and 11.04 due to the number of changes required).  The GNOME3 PPA is a
> work in progress as you can see, but it should contain GNOME Shell
> when we can get all the dependencies working (hopefully sooner rather
> than later as Debian Experimental has GNOME Shell working now).

So I will be removing ricotz and switching o the gnome3 team when I'm done.

Cheers,
Dave.

-- 
Dave Neary
GNOME Foundation member
dneary@gnome.org
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On 01/11/2011 10:46 AM, Allan Day wrote:
> Which PPA is that? This one [1], or this one [2]? Did you test it
> yourself? It would be great to hear from anyone who does have experience
> of using either of these PPAs...
The first, as it includes gnome-shell. I had some issues with running 
gnome-shell using it, but I think it might be due to my hardware (or 
rather a bug in mutter or the driver).
>
>> Feel free to tweak the texts in the git repo [1].
> Don't worry: I will. :)
I know, that was meant for other interested contributors. :)
>
> [1] https://launchpad.net/~ricotz/+archive/testing
> [2] https://launchpad.net/~gnome3-team/+archive/gnome3/+packages
- Andreas
From vuntz@gnome.org  Tue Jan 11 14:38:14 2011
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Date: Tue, 11 Jan 2011 15:38:03 +0100
From: Vincent Untz <vuntz@gnome.org>
To: Frederic Muller <fredm@gnome.org>
Subject: Re: GNOME 3.0 Hackfest + 1 day conference for the launch(in Asia)
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Hi Frederic,

Le lundi 10 janvier 2011, à 11:13 +0800, Frederic Muller a écrit :
> Of course any feedback on those dates is welcome and hopefully we
> can find a good timing for all teams to prepare and get GNOME 3.0
> out together.
> 
> Thank you and looking forward to your responses.

The release team is meeting next week-end, and we'll discuss this.

Cheers,

Vincent

-- 
Les gens heureux ne sont pas pressés.
From yet2bedefined@gmail.com  Tue Jan 11 17:49:24 2011
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From: Jason Lo <yet2bedefined@gmail.com>
Date: Tue, 11 Jan 2011 09:48:51 -0800
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Concerning France, it seems that I had forgotten to email it's group/contact
for some reason. I will get on to it.

Concerning the gugmasters group, I will email there once I have sent to all
of the individual groups.

On Tue, Jan 11, 2011 at 2:33 AM, Dave Neary <dneary@gnome.org> wrote:

> Oh - and, fwiw: as a mamber of GNOME France, I have not heard anything
> about your request, and as a member of guigmasters, I didn't see any
> email from you there yet.
>
> Cheers,
> Dave.
>
> Jason Lo wrote:
> > So I'm still doing this task. I'm sorry I haven't sent any updates in
> > the last two days, I was quite busy.
> >
> > So far I've emailed about half of the list, and have only gotten info
> > from China and Brazil. I've gotten updated contact info from them and
> > estimated member populations. Also, GNOME Brazil had a meetup recently
> > (which I have added to the wiki), and GNOME China is trying to open up a
> > store, if I read correctly.
> >
> > And I just noticed that technically the GCI thing finished, so I can't
> > get credit for this task. Oh well, I'll still follow it through; I'd
> > feel like a jerk if I were to just drop it, especially seeing the other
> > two students who did just go and drop it, heh.
> >
> > More updates soon!
> >
> > --
> > Jason
>
> --
> Dave Neary
> GNOME Foundation member
> dneary@gnome.org
>



-- 
Jason

--0015175ca7bcbc4831049995b309
Content-Type: text/html; charset=ISO-8859-1
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Concerning France, it seems that I had forgotten to email it&#39;s group/co=
ntact for some reason. I will get on to it.<br><br>Concerning the gugmaster=
s group, I will email there once I have sent to all of the individual group=
s.<br>

<br><div class=3D"gmail_quote">On Tue, Jan 11, 2011 at 2:33 AM, Dave Neary =
<span dir=3D"ltr">&lt;<a href=3D"mailto:dneary@gnome.org">dneary@gnome.org<=
/a>&gt;</span> wrote:<br><blockquote class=3D"gmail_quote" style=3D"border-=
left: 1px solid rgb(204, 204, 204); margin: 0pt 0pt 0pt 0.8ex; padding-left=
: 1ex;">

Oh - and, fwiw: as a mamber of GNOME France, I have not heard anything<br>
about your request, and as a member of guigmasters, I didn&#39;t see any<br=
>
email from you there yet.<br>
<div class=3D"im"><br>
Cheers,<br>
Dave.<br>
<br>
Jason Lo wrote:<br>
</div><div><div></div><div class=3D"h5">&gt; So I&#39;m still doing this ta=
sk. I&#39;m sorry I haven&#39;t sent any updates in<br>
&gt; the last two days, I was quite busy.<br>
&gt;<br>
&gt; So far I&#39;ve emailed about half of the list, and have only gotten i=
nfo<br>
&gt; from China and Brazil. I&#39;ve gotten updated contact info from them =
and<br>
&gt; estimated member populations. Also, GNOME Brazil had a meetup recently=
<br>
&gt; (which I have added to the wiki), and GNOME China is trying to open up=
 a<br>
&gt; store, if I read correctly.<br>
&gt;<br>
&gt; And I just noticed that technically the GCI thing finished, so I can&#=
39;t<br>
&gt; get credit for this task. Oh well, I&#39;ll still follow it through; I=
&#39;d<br>
&gt; feel like a jerk if I were to just drop it, especially seeing the othe=
r<br>
&gt; two students who did just go and drop it, heh.<br>
&gt;<br>
&gt; More updates soon!<br>
&gt;<br>
&gt; --<br>
&gt; Jason<br>
<br>
</div></div>--<br>
<div><div></div><div class=3D"h5">Dave Neary<br>
GNOME Foundation member<br>
<a href=3D"mailto:dneary@gnome.org">dneary@gnome.org</a><br>
</div></div></blockquote></div><br><br clear=3D"all"><br>-- <br>Jason<br>

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Hello list,

I'm putting on the Northeast Linux Fest located here

http://www.northeastlinuxfest.org

I was hopeing that Gnome could be represented here. i would like Gnome 
to get a table and present the desktop to the people  that come to the 
fest. It is being held at a collage and there should be a large number 
of collage students attending.  could you please mention the Linux fest 
to people around the New England area. Thanks for your time and help.
From sri@ramkrishna.me  Wed Jan 12 08:15:53 2011
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From: Sriram Ramkrishna <sri@ramkrishna.me>
Date: Wed, 12 Jan 2011 00:15:21 -0800
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Subject: Re: Q4 Updates Due
To: pcutler@gnome.org
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--20cf30549df18f20110499a1ce3a
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1

So I've written some amount of it, but I'm a little confused by the FoG
updates I've seen so far.  I'm not quite sure from the list of items that
FoG has done which has been accomplished.  Here is what I have so far.  I
believe the GCI stuff is not quite ready since no replies have come yet?

Please let me know if there are any gaps.  I tried to only focus on what was
accomplished not what was discussed or is pending.

Marketing

Conferences:
Desktop summit 2011 will be held in August 6 - August 12th in Berlin.  The
web
page is now live and is accessible from http://www.desktopsummit.org/.

Event Box:
Littl was kind enough to donate a web book as part of the GNOME event box
for
use as a slide show device at conferences.  What is pending right now is the
actual slide show we want to show.

Ben Konrath developed a flyer for new users in less economically based
countries.

Friends of GNOME

TBD


On Wed, Jan 5, 2011 at 6:05 AM, Paul Cutler <pcutler@gnome.org> wrote:

> Hi Marketing team!
>
> The Q4 team updates are due and we had a bunch of activity over the
> last 3 months, with Friends of GNOME, GCI, etc.
>
> Would anyone like to try their hand at writing the update?  You can
> see an example of the Q2 update[1] and I'm working to get the GNOME Q3
> update up later today.  We need to have the Q4 report written in a
> week by Jan 12th.
>
> Thanks for the help!
>
> Paul
>
> [1] http://foundation.gnome.org/reports/gnome-report-2010-Q2.html
> --
> marketing-list mailing list
> marketing-list@gnome.org
> http://mail.gnome.org/mailman/listinfo/marketing-list
>

--20cf30549df18f20110499a1ce3a
Content-Type: text/html; charset=ISO-8859-1
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

So I&#39;ve written some amount of it, but I&#39;m a little confused by the=
 FoG updates I&#39;ve seen so far.=A0 I&#39;m not quite sure from the list =
of items that FoG has done which has been accomplished.=A0 Here is what I h=
ave so far.=A0 I believe the GCI stuff is not quite ready since no replies =
have come yet?<br>

<br>Please let me know if there are any gaps.=A0 I tried to only focus on w=
hat was accomplished not what was discussed or is pending.<br><br>Marketing=
<br><br>Conferences:<br>Desktop summit 2011 will be held in August 6 - Augu=
st 12th in Berlin.=A0 The web<br>

page is now live and is accessible from <a href=3D"http://www.desktopsummit=
.org/">http://www.desktopsummit.org/</a>.<br><br>Event Box:<br>Littl was ki=
nd enough to donate a web book as part of the GNOME event box for<br>use as=
 a slide show device at conferences.=A0 What is pending right now is the<br=
>

actual slide show we want to show.<br><br>Ben Konrath developed a flyer for=
 new users in less economically based<br>countries.<br><br>Friends of GNOME=
<br><br>TBD<br><br><br><div class=3D"gmail_quote">On Wed, Jan 5, 2011 at 6:=
05 AM, Paul Cutler <span dir=3D"ltr">&lt;<a href=3D"mailto:pcutler@gnome.or=
g">pcutler@gnome.org</a>&gt;</span> wrote:<br>

<blockquote class=3D"gmail_quote" style=3D"margin: 0pt 0pt 0pt 0.8ex; borde=
r-left: 1px solid rgb(204, 204, 204); padding-left: 1ex;">Hi Marketing team=
!<br>
<br>
The Q4 team updates are due and we had a bunch of activity over the<br>
last 3 months, with Friends of GNOME, GCI, etc.<br>
<br>
Would anyone like to try their hand at writing the update? =A0You can<br>
see an example of the Q2 update[1] and I&#39;m working to get the GNOME Q3<=
br>
update up later today. =A0We need to have the Q4 report written in a<br>
week by Jan 12th.<br>
<br>
Thanks for the help!<br>
<br>
Paul<br>
<br>
[1] <a href=3D"http://foundation.gnome.org/reports/gnome-report-2010-Q2.htm=
l" target=3D"_blank">http://foundation.gnome.org/reports/gnome-report-2010-=
Q2.html</a><br>
<font color=3D"#888888">--<br>
marketing-list mailing list<br>
<a href=3D"mailto:marketing-list@gnome.org">marketing-list@gnome.org</a><br=
>
<a href=3D"http://mail.gnome.org/mailman/listinfo/marketing-list" target=3D=
"_blank">http://mail.gnome.org/mailman/listinfo/marketing-list</a><br>
</font></blockquote></div><br>

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On 01/12/2011 04:15 PM, Sriram Ramkrishna wrote:
> Conferences:
> Desktop summit 2011 will be held in August 6 - August 12th in Berlin.
> The web
> page is now live and is accessible from http://www.desktopsummit.org/.

A shame that the Sponsorship opportunities document has been produced 
with Mac OS X 10.6.2 Quartz, one would have expected Scribus to be used 
on either GNOME or KDE (or that the information be removed from the pdf 
file).

Fred
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Hi,

Frederic Muller wrote:
> A shame that the Sponsorship opportunities document has been produced
> with Mac OS X 10.6.2 Quartz, one would have expected Scribus to be used
> on either GNOME or KDE (or that the information be removed from the pdf
> file).

Yes, indeed - but when we use a designer for documents, they will use
the tools they use. We do prefer to use designers who use free tools,
but there are not that many out there.

Cheers,
Dave.

-- 
Dave Neary
GNOME Foundation member
dneary@gnome.org
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On 01/12/2011 05:45 PM, Dave Neary wrote:
> Hi,
>
> Frederic Muller wrote:
>> A shame that the Sponsorship opportunities document has been produced
>> with Mac OS X 10.6.2 Quartz, one would have expected Scribus to be used
>> on either GNOME or KDE (or that the information be removed from the pdf
>> file).
>
> Yes, indeed - but when we use a designer for documents, they will use
> the tools they use. We do prefer to use designers who use free tools,
> but there are not that many out there.
>
> Cheers,
> Dave.
>
Is it possible to get the source files (it was done under Scribus 
apparently) and pdf-ize it under GNOME then? (or have the desktop 
information removed?

I still believe it would "look better".

Fred
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On 01/12/2011 09:36 AM, Frederic Muller wrote:
> On 01/12/2011 04:15 PM, Sriram Ramkrishna wrote:
>> Conferences:
>> Desktop summit 2011 will be held in August 6 - August 12th in Berlin.
>> The web
>> page is now live and is accessible from http://www.desktopsummit.org/.
>
> A shame that the Sponsorship opportunities document has been produced 
> with Mac OS X 10.6.2 Quartz, one would have expected Scribus to be 
> used on either GNOME or KDE (or that the information be removed from 
> the pdf file).
This one?
http://www.desktopsummit.org/sponsors/DesktopSummit2011_SponsorshipOpportunities.pdf
I did that in Scribus on GNOME 2.30 (Ubuntu 10.10).
I have never owned a copy of OS X 10.6 because I'm too cheap to upgrade, 
and I never really run it anyway (I have a macbook running 10.5 in the 
cases I need to compile mozilla stuff on it for the mac though).

Maybe it's an error in the scribus export or something.
- Andreas

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On 01/12/2011 01:45 PM, Andreas Nilsson wrote:
>
> http://www.desktopsummit.org/sponsors/DesktopSummit2011_SponsorshipOpportunities.pdf 
>
> I did that in Scribus on GNOME 2.30 (Ubuntu 10.10).
>
Oh, and in case I get hit by a bus:
http://www.andreasn.se/diverse/temp/desktop-summit-folder.zip
(is there a better place I should upload this too?)
- Andreas
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On 01/12/2011 09:15 PM, Andreas Nilsson wrote:
> On 01/12/2011 01:45 PM, Andreas Nilsson wrote:
>>
>> http://www.desktopsummit.org/sponsors/DesktopSummit2011_SponsorshipOpportunities.pdf
>>
>> I did that in Scribus on GNOME 2.30 (Ubuntu 10.10).
>>
> Oh, and in case I get hit by a bus:
> http://www.andreasn.se/diverse/temp/desktop-summit-folder.zip
> (is there a better place I should upload this too?)
> - Andreas

After further checking and a discussion on #marketing with Andreas it 
appears the original pdf document included in the zip file doesn't have 
that MAC OS X stamping. There was apparently some words being cut off on 
page 8 and someone re-edited the sla file and regenerated the pdf 
probably on a MAC.

What should we do now then? I don't mind redoing the changes (I'll check 
if there isn't anything else) and the export, but where should I send it 
to? Or does it make more sense for someone else to do that?

Thank you.

Fred
From ak-47@gmx.net  Wed Jan 12 15:59:40 2011
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Subject: Re: String and UI Change Announcement Period
From: Andre Klapper <ak-47@gmx.net>
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Am Sonntag, den 09.01.2011, 16:40 -0600 schrieb Paul Cutler:
> It would be helpful to let the Marketing team know too- there is
> interest in doing videos, but we need to know when the UI gets close
> so the videos are as accurate as possible.
> 
> On Sun, Jan 9, 2011 at 4:31 PM, Vincent Untz <vuntz@gnome.org> wrote:
> > We'll enter the String and UI Change Announcement Period

See
http://mail.gnome.org/archives/desktop-devel-list/2011-January/msg00138.html
and followups.

andre 
-- 
mailto:ak-47@gmx.net | failed
http://blogs.gnome.org/aklapper

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Hi,

Dave Neary wrote:
> I used [1] on Ubuntu 10.10 and it seems to work fine.
> 
>> [1] https://launchpad.net/~ricotz/+archive/testing
>> [2] https://launchpad.net/~gnome3-team/+archive/gnome3/+packages
> 
> I'm currently upgrading to 11.04 to get the latest greatest.

<snip>

> So I will be removing ricotz and switching o the gnome3 team when I'm done.

So what is delivered by the gnome3 team PPA is mostly unusable right now
- I'm still waiting for good 2.91.4 builds to come through from Debian -
 and the ricotz PPA is a weird no-mans-land, with just the shell, and
with Unity & Compiz using global Mac-style menus, when you switch to
gnome-shell you don't have any menus any more.

I'd really like to figure out how to get a proper GNOME 3 experience
without switching distros, but if I have to, I will (but then, we'll be
sending a hell of a message to the users of the most popular Linux
distro out there).

Cheers,
Dave.

-- 
Dave Neary
GNOME Foundation member
dneary@gnome.org
From paul.r.cutler@gmail.com  Wed Jan 12 18:58:34 2011
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See Frederic's email to d-d-l he just posted - he has working live
image off USB.

Paul

On Wed, Jan 12, 2011 at 12:29 PM, Dave Neary <dneary@gnome.org> wrote:
> Hi,
>
> Dave Neary wrote:
>> I used [1] on Ubuntu 10.10 and it seems to work fine.
>>
>>> [1] https://launchpad.net/~ricotz/+archive/testing
>>> [2] https://launchpad.net/~gnome3-team/+archive/gnome3/+packages
>>
>> I'm currently upgrading to 11.04 to get the latest greatest.
>
> <snip>
>
>> So I will be removing ricotz and switching o the gnome3 team when I'm do=
ne.
>
> So what is delivered by the gnome3 team PPA is mostly unusable right now
> - I'm still waiting for good 2.91.4 builds to come through from Debian -
> =A0and the ricotz PPA is a weird no-mans-land, with just the shell, and
> with Unity & Compiz using global Mac-style menus, when you switch to
> gnome-shell you don't have any menus any more.
>
> I'd really like to figure out how to get a proper GNOME 3 experience
> without switching distros, but if I have to, I will (but then, we'll be
> sending a hell of a message to the users of the most popular Linux
> distro out there).
>
> Cheers,
> Dave.
>
> --
> Dave Neary
> GNOME Foundation member
> dneary@gnome.org
> --
> marketing-list mailing list
> marketing-list@gnome.org
> http://mail.gnome.org/mailman/listinfo/marketing-list
>
From juanjomarin96@yahoo.es  Wed Jan 12 21:58:07 2011
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Subject: about gnome3 dev marketing
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Hi!

I think is a good idea to improve the GNOME marketing for developers.
Obviously, what developers really appreciate is documentation, and the
documentation team is working hard on this area. I think is especially
interesting the set of 10-minute-tutorials they are working on [1].

However, I think that form the marketing point of view, the situation
can be improved a lot. 

This presentation from Alberto Ruiz in 2008' GUADEC has very good valid
points about GTK+ marketing [2], which is the best/only known GNOME
technology for outsiders. I think this is very important because GTK+ is
receiving bad comments from people. Our collegues are working hard
turning GTK+3 into a very good piece of software and we must push it.

I think we must also to improve awareness of other GNOME technologies,
but because we must start from something, I think that GTK+ is the most
straigh-forward way. The key point from the marketing point of view is
unify the brand and websites of certified GTK+ bindings.


Cheers,

   -- Juanjo Marin


 [1] http://git.gnome.org/browse/gnome-devel-docs/tree/demos/C
 [2]
http://live.gnome.org/GUADEC/2008/Slides?action=AttachFile&do=get&target=marketing_gtk_Guadec2008.pdf


From sri@ramkrishna.me  Wed Jan 12 22:08:31 2011
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From: Sriram Ramkrishna <sri@ramkrishna.me>
Date: Wed, 12 Jan 2011 14:07:56 -0800
Message-ID: <AANLkTinMk8X0vL5NF+7YdEVE8x+FPd8vZKEeAEDdAGHC@mail.gmail.com>
Subject: Re: Q4 Updates Due
To: pcutler@gnome.org
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So great discussion, but I'm still looking to fill in the blanks on our
quarterly update.  Since it is due today I'd like to finish it off if
possible.  Sorry I didn't give people more time to look over it.

sri

On Wed, Jan 12, 2011 at 12:15 AM, Sriram Ramkrishna <sri@ramkrishna.me>wrote:

> So I've written some amount of it, but I'm a little confused by the FoG
> updates I've seen so far.  I'm not quite sure from the list of items that
> FoG has done which has been accomplished.  Here is what I have so far.  I
> believe the GCI stuff is not quite ready since no replies have come yet?
>
> Please let me know if there are any gaps.  I tried to only focus on what
> was accomplished not what was discussed or is pending.
>
> Marketing
>
> Conferences:
> Desktop summit 2011 will be held in August 6 - August 12th in Berlin.  The
> web
> page is now live and is accessible from http://www.desktopsummit.org/.
>
> Event Box:
> Littl was kind enough to donate a web book as part of the GNOME event box
> for
> use as a slide show device at conferences.  What is pending right now is
> the
> actual slide show we want to show.
>
> Ben Konrath developed a flyer for new users in less economically based
> countries.
>
> Friends of GNOME
>
> TBD
>
>
>
> On Wed, Jan 5, 2011 at 6:05 AM, Paul Cutler <pcutler@gnome.org> wrote:
>
>> Hi Marketing team!
>>
>> The Q4 team updates are due and we had a bunch of activity over the
>> last 3 months, with Friends of GNOME, GCI, etc.
>>
>> Would anyone like to try their hand at writing the update?  You can
>> see an example of the Q2 update[1] and I'm working to get the GNOME Q3
>> update up later today.  We need to have the Q4 report written in a
>> week by Jan 12th.
>>
>> Thanks for the help!
>>
>> Paul
>>
>> [1] http://foundation.gnome.org/reports/gnome-report-2010-Q2.html
>> --
>> marketing-list mailing list
>> marketing-list@gnome.org
>> http://mail.gnome.org/mailman/listinfo/marketing-list
>>
>
>

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So great discussion, but I&#39;m still looking to fill in the blanks on our=
 quarterly update.=A0 Since it is due today I&#39;d like to finish it off i=
f possible.=A0 Sorry I didn&#39;t give people more time to look over it.=A0=
 <br>

<br>sri<br><br><div class=3D"gmail_quote">On Wed, Jan 12, 2011 at 12:15 AM,=
 Sriram Ramkrishna <span dir=3D"ltr">&lt;<a href=3D"mailto:sri@ramkrishna.m=
e">sri@ramkrishna.me</a>&gt;</span> wrote:<br><blockquote class=3D"gmail_qu=
ote" style=3D"margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex=
;">

So I&#39;ve written some amount of it, but I&#39;m a little confused by the=
 FoG updates I&#39;ve seen so far.=A0 I&#39;m not quite sure from the list =
of items that FoG has done which has been accomplished.=A0 Here is what I h=
ave so far.=A0 I believe the GCI stuff is not quite ready since no replies =
have come yet?<br>


<br>Please let me know if there are any gaps.=A0 I tried to only focus on w=
hat was accomplished not what was discussed or is pending.<br><br>Marketing=
<br><br>Conferences:<br>Desktop summit 2011 will be held in August 6 - Augu=
st 12th in Berlin.=A0 The web<br>


page is now live and is accessible from <a href=3D"http://www.desktopsummit=
.org/" target=3D"_blank">http://www.desktopsummit.org/</a>.<br><br>Event Bo=
x:<br>Littl was kind enough to donate a web book as part of the GNOME event=
 box for<br>

use as a slide show device at conferences.=A0 What is pending right now is =
the<br>
actual slide show we want to show.<br><br>Ben Konrath developed a flyer for=
 new users in less economically based<br>countries.<br><br>Friends of GNOME=
<br><br>TBD<div><div></div><div class=3D"h5"><br><br><br><div class=3D"gmai=
l_quote">

On Wed, Jan 5, 2011 at 6:05 AM, Paul Cutler <span dir=3D"ltr">&lt;<a href=
=3D"mailto:pcutler@gnome.org" target=3D"_blank">pcutler@gnome.org</a>&gt;</=
span> wrote:<br>
<blockquote class=3D"gmail_quote" style=3D"margin:0pt 0pt 0pt 0.8ex;border-=
left:1px solid rgb(204, 204, 204);padding-left:1ex">Hi Marketing team!<br>
<br>
The Q4 team updates are due and we had a bunch of activity over the<br>
last 3 months, with Friends of GNOME, GCI, etc.<br>
<br>
Would anyone like to try their hand at writing the update? =A0You can<br>
see an example of the Q2 update[1] and I&#39;m working to get the GNOME Q3<=
br>
update up later today. =A0We need to have the Q4 report written in a<br>
week by Jan 12th.<br>
<br>
Thanks for the help!<br>
<br>
Paul<br>
<br>
[1] <a href=3D"http://foundation.gnome.org/reports/gnome-report-2010-Q2.htm=
l" target=3D"_blank">http://foundation.gnome.org/reports/gnome-report-2010-=
Q2.html</a><br>
<font color=3D"#888888">--<br>
marketing-list mailing list<br>
<a href=3D"mailto:marketing-list@gnome.org" target=3D"_blank">marketing-lis=
t@gnome.org</a><br>
<a href=3D"http://mail.gnome.org/mailman/listinfo/marketing-list" target=3D=
"_blank">http://mail.gnome.org/mailman/listinfo/marketing-list</a><br>
</font></blockquote></div><br>
</div></div></blockquote></div><br>

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Hey Sriram,

I have already provided everything I know about FoG. Is there
something specific I can help with? I could do a Skype session if it
helps.

Cheers,
-- 
Og B. Maciel
GNOME Foundation Board of Directors

omaciel@foresightlinux.org
ogmaciel@gnome.org

GPG Keys: D5CFC202

http://www.ogmaciel.com (en_US)
http://blog.ogmaciel.com (pt_BR)
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I wrote the attached for the board update.  No comments since I sent
it to the other board members for review yesterday.

Brian


On 01/ 5/11 08:05 AM, Paul Cutler wrote:
> Hi Marketing team!
>
> The Q4 team updates are due and we had a bunch of activity over the
> last 3 months, with Friends of GNOME, GCI, etc.
>
> Would anyone like to try their hand at writing the update?  You can
> see an example of the Q2 update[1] and I'm working to get the GNOME Q3
> update up later today.  We need to have the Q4 report written in a
> week by Jan 12th.
>
> Thanks for the help!
>
> Paul
>
> [1] http://foundation.gnome.org/reports/gnome-report-2010-Q2.html


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Board:

Here is my proposal for the Board of Directors Q4 Report.  I am just
sending this to the board so you can review it before I make it more
public.  Any comments are very much appreciated.  Should we drum up
GNOME 3 more?  Any videos or anything interesting we should include?
Is it too long and stuff should be cut out?

I guess this is due by the end of the week, is that right Paul?

Thanks,

Brian

---

Board Report
By: Brian Cameron

First of all, the GNOME Foundation board of directors would like to
express a huge thank you to all you volunteers who help to make the
GNOME community possible.  To all those who use the GNOME desktop
and understand the value of free software on the desktop, it is you
that makes the GNOME community both rich and rewarding.  Thank you
also to our advisory board members and sponsors for providing much
valued direction for the community.

The GNOME 3.0 release is planned for April 6, 2010.  Find a release
party near you to attend!  There are GNOME 3 Launch events being
planned aroudn the world.  Emily Chen and the GNOME.Asia team are
organizing providing GNOME t-shirts and other goodies to those who
can organize launch events in their area.  The GNOME Launch event
in Bangalore will also be GNOME.Asia 2011.

   http://live.gnome.org/ThreePointZero/LaunchParty
   http://gnome.asia/press/2011/Bangalore/

In the past quarter, Stormy Peters stepped down from her position as
Executive Director of The GNOME Foundation.  The board would like to
thank Stormy for all of her great work helping to make The GNOME
Foundation a more effective and better resourced organization.  We
all wish her the best with her future endeavors!

The board has been busy trying to keep up with the work with Stormy
leaving, and the most following important work continued to be the most
pressing.

  * Released the Annual Report.  Thanks to Paul and Daniel Galleguillos.

    http://foundation.gnome.org/reports/gnome-annual-report-2009.pdf

    Is it not awesome?  The GNOME Marketing team needs more help putting
    together things like this.

  * Announced an interest to hire a new Executive Director and are
    currently reviewing applicants.

 
http://mail.gnome.org/archives/foundation-list/2010-November/msg00019.html

  * GNOME T-Shirt contest:

     * http://www.gnome.org/contest/

  * The Boston Summit was held over November 6-8 and proved to be a
    great opportunity for collaboration.  The GNOME Marketing team
    made good progress on video projects and a great deal of work was
    focused on the upcoming GNOME 3.0 release and accessibility.
    Thanks J5!

  * The GNOME Foundation and KDE e.V. board of directors annoucne
    the Desktop Summit 2011:

 
http://www.gnome.org/press/releases/2010-10-desktop-summit-2011-berlin.html

    Thanks to Andreas Nilsson, Dave Neary and Ekaterina Gerasimova for
    all the help!  Would be good to get more local GNOME volunteers
    involved.  Organizers are planning a face-to-face meeting at FOSDEM,
    probably on Saturday during lunch.

  * Organized the following GNOME hackfests in the past quarter:
    - Accessibility at AEGIS conference in Seville (Spain), October,
      2010.
    - GTK+ Hackfest in A Coruña (Galicia, Spain), October 18-22, 2010.
    - Snowy aka Tomboy Online Hackfest held during The Boston Summit.
    - Development Documentation and Tools Hackfest in Berlin (Germany),
      December 2-5, 2010.
    - WebKitGTK+ Hackfest in A Coruña (Galicia, Spain), December 5-12,
      2010.

  * Germán Póo-Caamaño, doing a great job as GNOME Foundation treasurer,
    released our planned 2011 budget for GNOME Foundation community
    review.

 
http://mail.gnome.org/archives/foundation-list/2010-December/msg00057.html

  * The Friends of GNOME revamp is making good progress, though is behind
    schedule.  Og Maciel, Paul Cutler, Andreas Nilsson and the GNOME
    marketing team have been working on this.  Any feedback on the
    following alpha would be helpful.

    http://www.andreasn.se/diverse/temp/friends-of-gnome-2.0/

  * The bidding process for the MeeGo GTK+ work closed and the
    applications have been reviewed.  The chosen bid will soon be
    announced.  Thanks to Bastien Nocera for doing much of the
    organizing.

  * The GNOME Foundation is now selling GNOME branded merchandise through
    FreeWear.  Check it out:

    http://www.freewear.org/?org=GNOMEFoundation

  * GNOME a11y project received significant funding:

    http://www.gnome.org/press/releases/2010-10-accessibility-grant.html

  * The GNOME Foundation is making arrangements to use the Egencia
    Business Travel service affiliated with expedia.com to make it
    easier to handle the volume of travel subsidies handled by the
    Foundation.

  * Announced an interest to hire contract work to assist with GNOME 3
    marketing efforts, with a current budget of $5,000 allocated.  Made
    a call for project ideas and resumes on the GNOME Marketing list.

  * Womens Outreach Program proving successful!

    http://www.gnome.org/press/releases/2010-11-women-outreach-interns.html

Those are just some highlights, so lots of good work is getting done.
Please help GNOME 3 be a success.  Get involved, join us at a GNOME 3
launch event or at one of the hackfests currently being organized:

- Python Bindings Hackfest in Prague, CZ, (January 17-21, 2011)
- GNOME Asia Hackfest in Bangalore, IN, (March 30 - April 3, 2011)
- ATK Hackfest in A Coruña (Galicia, Spain) (May 2011)

These events happen when GNOME community members recognize the need and
propose them.  If you have an idea or need for a GNOME event, please
let the board know.

The GNOME Foundation board of directors very much appreciates when you
email board-list@gnome.org to let us know if there is anything The GNOME
Foundation can do to help or if there are any opportunities that you
think The GNOME Foundation should know about.  Many different skill
sets are needed to help GNOME's mission. If you are willing to help,
there is a diverse set of interesting tasks to choose from. We need you.

Please also consider becoming a Friend of GNOME.  Your donations really
do help the GNOME Foundation continue provide support and services
which help the success of the GNOME project.

   http://www.gnome.org/friends/

Brian Cameron
GNOME Foundation Secretary


On 01/ 5/11 08:05 AM, Paul Cutler wrote:
> Hi Marketing team!
>
> The Q4 team updates are due and we had a bunch of activity over the
> last 3 months, with Friends of GNOME, GCI, etc.
>
> Would anyone like to try their hand at writing the update?  You can
> see an example of the Q2 update[1] and I'm working to get the GNOME Q3
> update up later today.  We need to have the Q4 report written in a
> week by Jan 12th.
>
> Thanks for the help!
>
> Paul
>
> [1] http://foundation.gnome.org/reports/gnome-report-2010-Q2.html


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From: Sriram Ramkrishna <sri@ramkrishna.me>
Date: Wed, 12 Jan 2011 15:07:38 -0800
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Subject: Re: Q4 Updates Due
To: Og Maciel <ogmaciel@gnome.org>
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On Wed, Jan 12, 2011 at 2:32 PM, Og Maciel <ogmaciel@gnome.org> wrote:

> Hey Sriram,
>
> I have already provided everything I know about FoG. Is there
> something specific I can help with? I could do a Skype session if it
> helps.
>
>
Hi Og,

I was just looking for a summary, you had what looked like a "stream of
consciousness" update and I had a hard time which subpart of a multipart
effort on FoG was complete.

sri

--90e6ba6e83e69eb5970499ae4540
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<br><br><div class=3D"gmail_quote">On Wed, Jan 12, 2011 at 2:32 PM, Og Maci=
el <span dir=3D"ltr">&lt;<a href=3D"mailto:ogmaciel@gnome.org">ogmaciel@gno=
me.org</a>&gt;</span> wrote:<br><blockquote class=3D"gmail_quote" style=3D"=
margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex;">

Hey Sriram,<br>
<br>
I have already provided everything I know about FoG. Is there<br>
something specific I can help with? I could do a Skype session if it<br>
helps.<br><br></blockquote><div><br>Hi Og,<br><br>I was just looking for a =
summary, you had what looked like a &quot;stream of consciousness&quot; upd=
ate and I had a hard time which subpart of a multipart effort on FoG was co=
mplete.=A0 <br>

<br>sri <br></div></div>

--90e6ba6e83e69eb5970499ae4540--
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From: Sriram Ramkrishna <sri@ramkrishna.me>
Date: Wed, 12 Jan 2011 15:09:24 -0800
Message-ID: <AANLkTimrD1HTfLeOpVwhfyWyAdd879Hiro23OEwpjDo5@mail.gmail.com>
Subject: Re: Q4 Updates Due
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On Wed, Jan 12, 2011 at 3:07 PM, Sriram Ramkrishna <sri@ramkrishna.me>wrote:

>
>
> On Wed, Jan 12, 2011 at 2:32 PM, Og Maciel <ogmaciel@gnome.org> wrote:
>
>> Hey Sriram,
>>
>> I have already provided everything I know about FoG. Is there
>> something specific I can help with? I could do a Skype session if it
>> helps.
>>
>>
> Hi Og,
>
> I was just looking for a summary, you had what looked like a "stream of
> consciousness" update and I had a hard time which subpart of a multipart
> effort on FoG was complete.
>
>
I just saw Brian's update on FoG so I will remove it from the marketing
portion.  Nothing needs to be done on your end.  Thanks!

sri

--20cf30549a7ff501a90499ae4b2b
Content-Type: text/html; charset=ISO-8859-1
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

<br><br><div class=3D"gmail_quote">On Wed, Jan 12, 2011 at 3:07 PM, Sriram =
Ramkrishna <span dir=3D"ltr">&lt;<a href=3D"mailto:sri@ramkrishna.me">sri@r=
amkrishna.me</a>&gt;</span> wrote:<br><blockquote class=3D"gmail_quote" sty=
le=3D"margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex;">

<br><br><div class=3D"gmail_quote"><div class=3D"im">On Wed, Jan 12, 2011 a=
t 2:32 PM, Og Maciel <span dir=3D"ltr">&lt;<a href=3D"mailto:ogmaciel@gnome=
.org" target=3D"_blank">ogmaciel@gnome.org</a>&gt;</span> wrote:<br><blockq=
uote class=3D"gmail_quote" style=3D"margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc =
solid;padding-left:1ex">


Hey Sriram,<br>
<br>
I have already provided everything I know about FoG. Is there<br>
something specific I can help with? I could do a Skype session if it<br>
helps.<br><br></blockquote></div><div><br>Hi Og,<br><br>I was just looking =
for a summary, you had what looked like a &quot;stream of consciousness&quo=
t; update and I had a hard time which subpart of a multipart effort on FoG =
was complete.=A0 <br>


<br></div></div></blockquote><div><br>I just saw Brian&#39;s update on FoG =
so I will remove it from the marketing portion.=A0 Nothing needs to be done=
 on your end.=A0 Thanks!<br><br>sri <br></div></div>

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Would like to but the Marketing Team has limited resources and we decided to
focus all of our effort on current users of the GNOME 2.x desktop for this
release cycle. If you are volunteering to do this, please feel free to jump
in!

On Wed, Jan 12, 2011 at 15:57, Juanjo Marin <juanjomarin96@yahoo.es> wrote:

> Hi!
>
> I think is a good idea to improve the GNOME marketing for developers.
> Obviously, what developers really appreciate is documentation, and the
> documentation team is working hard on this area. I think is especially
> interesting the set of 10-minute-tutorials they are working on [1].
>
> However, I think that form the marketing point of view, the situation
> can be improved a lot.
>
> This presentation from Alberto Ruiz in 2008' GUADEC has very good valid
> points about GTK+ marketing [2], which is the best/only known GNOME
> technology for outsiders. I think this is very important because GTK+ is
> receiving bad comments from people. Our collegues are working hard
> turning GTK+3 into a very good piece of software and we must push it.
>
> I think we must also to improve awareness of other GNOME technologies,
> but because we must start from something, I think that GTK+ is the most
> straigh-forward way. The key point from the marketing point of view is
> unify the brand and websites of certified GTK+ bindings.
>
>
> Cheers,
>
>   -- Juanjo Marin
>
>
>  [1] http://git.gnome.org/browse/gnome-devel-docs/tree/demos/C
>  [2]
>
> http://live.gnome.org/GUADEC/2008/Slides?action=AttachFile&do=get&target=marketing_gtk_Guadec2008.pdf
>
>
> --
> marketing-list mailing list
> marketing-list@gnome.org
> http://mail.gnome.org/mailman/listinfo/marketing-list
>

--0016e65684e428ff3b0499ae5327
Content-Type: text/html; charset=UTF-8
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

Would like to but the Marketing Team has limited resources and we decided t=
o focus all of our effort on current users of the GNOME 2.x desktop for thi=
s release cycle. If you are volunteering to do this, please feel free to ju=
mp in!<br>
<br><div class=3D"gmail_quote">On Wed, Jan 12, 2011 at 15:57, Juanjo Marin =
<span dir=3D"ltr">&lt;<a href=3D"mailto:juanjomarin96@yahoo.es">juanjomarin=
96@yahoo.es</a>&gt;</span> wrote:<br><blockquote class=3D"gmail_quote" styl=
e=3D"margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex;">
Hi!<br>
<br>
I think is a good idea to improve the GNOME marketing for developers.<br>
Obviously, what developers really appreciate is documentation, and the<br>
documentation team is working hard on this area. I think is especially<br>
interesting the set of 10-minute-tutorials they are working on [1].<br>
<br>
However, I think that form the marketing point of view, the situation<br>
can be improved a lot.<br>
<br>
This presentation from Alberto Ruiz in 2008&#39; GUADEC has very good valid=
<br>
points about GTK+ marketing [2], which is the best/only known GNOME<br>
technology for outsiders. I think this is very important because GTK+ is<br=
>
receiving bad comments from people. Our collegues are working hard<br>
turning GTK+3 into a very good piece of software and we must push it.<br>
<br>
I think we must also to improve awareness of other GNOME technologies,<br>
but because we must start from something, I think that GTK+ is the most<br>
straigh-forward way. The key point from the marketing point of view is<br>
unify the brand and websites of certified GTK+ bindings.<br>
<br>
<br>
Cheers,<br>
<br>
 =C2=A0 -- Juanjo Marin<br>
<br>
<br>
=C2=A0[1] <a href=3D"http://git.gnome.org/browse/gnome-devel-docs/tree/demo=
s/C" target=3D"_blank">http://git.gnome.org/browse/gnome-devel-docs/tree/de=
mos/C</a><br>
=C2=A0[2]<br>
<a href=3D"http://live.gnome.org/GUADEC/2008/Slides?action=3DAttachFile&amp=
;do=3Dget&amp;target=3Dmarketing_gtk_Guadec2008.pdf" target=3D"_blank">http=
://live.gnome.org/GUADEC/2008/Slides?action=3DAttachFile&amp;do=3Dget&amp;t=
arget=3Dmarketing_gtk_Guadec2008.pdf</a><br>

<font color=3D"#888888"><br>
<br>
--<br>
marketing-list mailing list<br>
<a href=3D"mailto:marketing-list@gnome.org">marketing-list@gnome.org</a><br=
>
<a href=3D"http://mail.gnome.org/mailman/listinfo/marketing-list" target=3D=
"_blank">http://mail.gnome.org/mailman/listinfo/marketing-list</a><br>
</font></blockquote></div><br>

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From: Sriram Ramkrishna <sri@ramkrishna.me>
Date: Wed, 12 Jan 2011 15:13:52 -0800
Message-ID: <AANLkTinh_MGvvntFD16kqy3zCCJ9yR_22D=AMR5ztAwN@mail.gmail.com>
Subject: Re: about gnome3 dev marketing
To: "Jason D. Clinton" <me@jasonclinton.com>
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On Wed, Jan 12, 2011 at 3:11 PM, Jason D. Clinton <me@jasonclinton.com>wrote:

> Would like to but the Marketing Team has limited resources and we decided
> to focus all of our effort on current users of the GNOME 2.x desktop for
> this release cycle. If you are volunteering to do this, please feel free to
> jump in!
>
>

Yes, if you are, I can definitely help you some bit.  I am already looking
for someone to help me write an article on GNOME 3 development specifically
shell extensions and the like.  While the API is still unstable, something
towards release time would be really awesome.

sri


>
> On Wed, Jan 12, 2011 at 15:57, Juanjo Marin <juanjomarin96@yahoo.es>wrote:
>
>> Hi!
>>
>> I think is a good idea to improve the GNOME marketing for developers.
>> Obviously, what developers really appreciate is documentation, and the
>> documentation team is working hard on this area. I think is especially
>> interesting the set of 10-minute-tutorials they are working on [1].
>>
>> However, I think that form the marketing point of view, the situation
>> can be improved a lot.
>>
>> This presentation from Alberto Ruiz in 2008' GUADEC has very good valid
>> points about GTK+ marketing [2], which is the best/only known GNOME
>> technology for outsiders. I think this is very important because GTK+ is
>> receiving bad comments from people. Our collegues are working hard
>> turning GTK+3 into a very good piece of software and we must push it.
>>
>> I think we must also to improve awareness of other GNOME technologies,
>> but because we must start from something, I think that GTK+ is the most
>> straigh-forward way. The key point from the marketing point of view is
>> unify the brand and websites of certified GTK+ bindings.
>>
>>
>> Cheers,
>>
>>   -- Juanjo Marin
>>
>>
>>  [1] http://git.gnome.org/browse/gnome-devel-docs/tree/demos/C
>>  [2]
>>
>> http://live.gnome.org/GUADEC/2008/Slides?action=AttachFile&do=get&target=marketing_gtk_Guadec2008.pdf
>>
>>
>> --
>> marketing-list mailing list
>> marketing-list@gnome.org
>> http://mail.gnome.org/mailman/listinfo/marketing-list
>>
>
>
> --
> marketing-list mailing list
> marketing-list@gnome.org
> http://mail.gnome.org/mailman/listinfo/marketing-list
>
>

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<br><br><div class=3D"gmail_quote">On Wed, Jan 12, 2011 at 3:11 PM, Jason D=
. Clinton <span dir=3D"ltr">&lt;<a href=3D"mailto:me@jasonclinton.com">me@j=
asonclinton.com</a>&gt;</span> wrote:<br><blockquote class=3D"gmail_quote" =
style=3D"margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex;">

Would like to but the Marketing Team has limited resources and we decided t=
o focus all of our effort on current users of the GNOME 2.x desktop for thi=
s release cycle. If you are volunteering to do this, please feel free to ju=
mp in!<div>

<div></div><div class=3D"h5"><br></div></div></blockquote><div><br><br>Yes,=
 if you are, I can definitely help you some bit.=A0 I am already looking fo=
r someone to help me write an article on GNOME 3 development specifically s=
hell extensions and the like.=A0 While the API is still unstable, something=
 towards release time would be really awesome.<br>

<br>sri<br>=A0<br></div><blockquote class=3D"gmail_quote" style=3D"margin: =
0pt 0pt 0pt 0.8ex; border-left: 1px solid rgb(204, 204, 204); padding-left:=
 1ex;"><div><div class=3D"h5">
<br><div class=3D"gmail_quote">On Wed, Jan 12, 2011 at 15:57, Juanjo Marin =
<span dir=3D"ltr">&lt;<a href=3D"mailto:juanjomarin96@yahoo.es" target=3D"_=
blank">juanjomarin96@yahoo.es</a>&gt;</span> wrote:<br><blockquote class=3D=
"gmail_quote" style=3D"margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding=
-left:1ex">


Hi!<br>
<br>
I think is a good idea to improve the GNOME marketing for developers.<br>
Obviously, what developers really appreciate is documentation, and the<br>
documentation team is working hard on this area. I think is especially<br>
interesting the set of 10-minute-tutorials they are working on [1].<br>
<br>
However, I think that form the marketing point of view, the situation<br>
can be improved a lot.<br>
<br>
This presentation from Alberto Ruiz in 2008&#39; GUADEC has very good valid=
<br>
points about GTK+ marketing [2], which is the best/only known GNOME<br>
technology for outsiders. I think this is very important because GTK+ is<br=
>
receiving bad comments from people. Our collegues are working hard<br>
turning GTK+3 into a very good piece of software and we must push it.<br>
<br>
I think we must also to improve awareness of other GNOME technologies,<br>
but because we must start from something, I think that GTK+ is the most<br>
straigh-forward way. The key point from the marketing point of view is<br>
unify the brand and websites of certified GTK+ bindings.<br>
<br>
<br>
Cheers,<br>
<br>
 =A0 -- Juanjo Marin<br>
<br>
<br>
=A0[1] <a href=3D"http://git.gnome.org/browse/gnome-devel-docs/tree/demos/C=
" target=3D"_blank">http://git.gnome.org/browse/gnome-devel-docs/tree/demos=
/C</a><br>
=A0[2]<br>
<a href=3D"http://live.gnome.org/GUADEC/2008/Slides?action=3DAttachFile&amp=
;do=3Dget&amp;target=3Dmarketing_gtk_Guadec2008.pdf" target=3D"_blank">http=
://live.gnome.org/GUADEC/2008/Slides?action=3DAttachFile&amp;do=3Dget&amp;t=
arget=3Dmarketing_gtk_Guadec2008.pdf</a><br>



<font color=3D"#888888"><br>
<br>
--<br>
marketing-list mailing list<br>
<a href=3D"mailto:marketing-list@gnome.org" target=3D"_blank">marketing-lis=
t@gnome.org</a><br>
<a href=3D"http://mail.gnome.org/mailman/listinfo/marketing-list" target=3D=
"_blank">http://mail.gnome.org/mailman/listinfo/marketing-list</a><br>
</font></blockquote></div><br>
</div></div><br>--<br>
marketing-list mailing list<br>
<a href=3D"mailto:marketing-list@gnome.org">marketing-list@gnome.org</a><br=
>
<a href=3D"http://mail.gnome.org/mailman/listinfo/marketing-list" target=3D=
"_blank">http://mail.gnome.org/mailman/listinfo/marketing-list</a><br>
<br></blockquote></div><br>

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From: Jason Lo <yet2bedefined@gmail.com>
Date: Wed, 12 Jan 2011 17:18:49 -0800
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Subject: Re: GCI: Update Gnome Usergroup Info, Introduction
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I have sent an email to every user group with a main contact listed. I will
send an email to the gugmasters list soon.

On Tue, Jan 11, 2011 at 2:33 AM, Dave Neary <dneary@gnome.org> wrote:

> Oh - and, fwiw: as a mamber of GNOME France, I have not heard anything
> about your request, and as a member of guigmasters, I didn't see any
> email from you there yet.
>
> Cheers,
> Dave.
>
> Jason Lo wrote:
> > So I'm still doing this task. I'm sorry I haven't sent any updates in
> > the last two days, I was quite busy.
> >
> > So far I've emailed about half of the list, and have only gotten info
> > from China and Brazil. I've gotten updated contact info from them and
> > estimated member populations. Also, GNOME Brazil had a meetup recently
> > (which I have added to the wiki), and GNOME China is trying to open up a
> > store, if I read correctly.
> >
> > And I just noticed that technically the GCI thing finished, so I can't
> > get credit for this task. Oh well, I'll still follow it through; I'd
> > feel like a jerk if I were to just drop it, especially seeing the other
> > two students who did just go and drop it, heh.
> >
> > More updates soon!
> >
> > --
> > Jason
>
> --
> Dave Neary
> GNOME Foundation member
> dneary@gnome.org
>



-- 
Jason

--0015175cb6f2dff8b00499b01aa2
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I have sent an email to every user group with a main contact listed. I will=
 send an email to the gugmasters list soon.<br><br><div class=3D"gmail_quot=
e">On Tue, Jan 11, 2011 at 2:33 AM, Dave Neary <span dir=3D"ltr">&lt;<a hre=
f=3D"mailto:dneary@gnome.org">dneary@gnome.org</a>&gt;</span> wrote:<br>

<blockquote class=3D"gmail_quote" style=3D"margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1p=
x #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex;">Oh - and, fwiw: as a mamber of GNOME France=
, I have not heard anything<br>
about your request, and as a member of guigmasters, I didn&#39;t see any<br=
>
email from you there yet.<br>
<div class=3D"im"><br>
Cheers,<br>
Dave.<br>
<br>
Jason Lo wrote:<br>
</div><div><div></div><div class=3D"h5">&gt; So I&#39;m still doing this ta=
sk. I&#39;m sorry I haven&#39;t sent any updates in<br>
&gt; the last two days, I was quite busy.<br>
&gt;<br>
&gt; So far I&#39;ve emailed about half of the list, and have only gotten i=
nfo<br>
&gt; from China and Brazil. I&#39;ve gotten updated contact info from them =
and<br>
&gt; estimated member populations. Also, GNOME Brazil had a meetup recently=
<br>
&gt; (which I have added to the wiki), and GNOME China is trying to open up=
 a<br>
&gt; store, if I read correctly.<br>
&gt;<br>
&gt; And I just noticed that technically the GCI thing finished, so I can&#=
39;t<br>
&gt; get credit for this task. Oh well, I&#39;ll still follow it through; I=
&#39;d<br>
&gt; feel like a jerk if I were to just drop it, especially seeing the othe=
r<br>
&gt; two students who did just go and drop it, heh.<br>
&gt;<br>
&gt; More updates soon!<br>
&gt;<br>
&gt; --<br>
&gt; Jason<br>
<br>
</div></div>--<br>
<div><div></div><div class=3D"h5">Dave Neary<br>
GNOME Foundation member<br>
<a href=3D"mailto:dneary@gnome.org">dneary@gnome.org</a><br>
</div></div></blockquote></div><br><br clear=3D"all"><br>-- <br>Jason<br>

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Hi,

Since the main news from the mobile group will be the announcement of
the Hildon work, perhaps Bastien might be the best person to give a
quick update?

Cheers,
Dave.

Sriram Ramkrishna wrote:
> So great discussion, but I'm still looking to fill in the blanks on our
> quarterly update.  Since it is due today I'd like to finish it off if
> possible.  Sorry I didn't give people more time to look over it. 
> 
> sri
> 
> On Wed, Jan 12, 2011 at 12:15 AM, Sriram Ramkrishna <sri@ramkrishna.me
> <mailto:sri@ramkrishna.me>> wrote:
> 
>     So I've written some amount of it, but I'm a little confused by the
>     FoG updates I've seen so far.  I'm not quite sure from the list of
>     items that FoG has done which has been accomplished.  Here is what I
>     have so far.  I believe the GCI stuff is not quite ready since no
>     replies have come yet?
> 
>     Please let me know if there are any gaps.  I tried to only focus on
>     what was accomplished not what was discussed or is pending.
> 
>     Marketing
> 
>     Conferences:
>     Desktop summit 2011 will be held in August 6 - August 12th in
>     Berlin.  The web
>     page is now live and is accessible from http://www.desktopsummit.org/.
> 
>     Event Box:
>     Littl was kind enough to donate a web book as part of the GNOME
>     event box for
>     use as a slide show device at conferences.  What is pending right
>     now is the
>     actual slide show we want to show.
> 
>     Ben Konrath developed a flyer for new users in less economically based
>     countries.
> 
>     Friends of GNOME
> 
>     TBD
> 
> 
> 
>     On Wed, Jan 5, 2011 at 6:05 AM, Paul Cutler <pcutler@gnome.org
>     <mailto:pcutler@gnome.org>> wrote:
> 
>         Hi Marketing team!
> 
>         The Q4 team updates are due and we had a bunch of activity over the
>         last 3 months, with Friends of GNOME, GCI, etc.
> 
>         Would anyone like to try their hand at writing the update?  You can
>         see an example of the Q2 update[1] and I'm working to get the
>         GNOME Q3
>         update up later today.  We need to have the Q4 report written in a
>         week by Jan 12th.
> 
>         Thanks for the help!
> 
>         Paul
> 
>         [1] http://foundation.gnome.org/reports/gnome-report-2010-Q2.html
>         --
>         marketing-list mailing list
>         marketing-list@gnome.org <mailto:marketing-list@gnome.org>
>         http://mail.gnome.org/mailman/listinfo/marketing-list
> 
> 
> 

-- 
Dave Neary
GNOME Foundation member
dneary@gnome.org
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Hi Brian,

Might I suggest that you put the actionable stuff right up front? I'd
like to see

"The GNOME Foundation seeking new executive director"

be right at the top.

Afterwards, thanking Stormy & explaining why she left will be 2nd,
annual report 3rd, then budget and t-shirt contest, etc. You could even
add GUADEC & Hackfests to a separate "Events" update.

It's great to see the board having so much to talk about! You'll soon
have to start breaking the report into sub-reports ;)

Cheers,
Dave.

Brian Cameron wrote:
> 
> I wrote the attached for the board update.  No comments since I sent
> it to the other board members for review yesterday.
> 
> Brian
> 
> 
> On 01/ 5/11 08:05 AM, Paul Cutler wrote:
>> Hi Marketing team!
>>
>> The Q4 team updates are due and we had a bunch of activity over the
>> last 3 months, with Friends of GNOME, GCI, etc.
>>
>> Would anyone like to try their hand at writing the update?  You can
>> see an example of the Q2 update[1] and I'm working to get the GNOME Q3
>> update up later today.  We need to have the Q4 report written in a
>> week by Jan 12th.
>>
>> Thanks for the help!
>>
>> Paul
>>
>> [1] http://foundation.gnome.org/reports/gnome-report-2010-Q2.html
> 
> 
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------
> 
> Subject:
> Re: Q4 Updates Due
> From:
> Brian Cameron <brian.cameron@oracle.com>
> Date:
> Tue, 11 Jan 2011 13:39:05 -0600
> To:
> GNOME Foundation Board <board-list@gnome.org>
> 
> To:
> GNOME Foundation Board <board-list@gnome.org>
> 
> 
> 
> Board:
> 
> Here is my proposal for the Board of Directors Q4 Report.  I am just
> sending this to the board so you can review it before I make it more
> public.  Any comments are very much appreciated.  Should we drum up
> GNOME 3 more?  Any videos or anything interesting we should include?
> Is it too long and stuff should be cut out?
> 
> I guess this is due by the end of the week, is that right Paul?
> 
> Thanks,
> 
> Brian
> 
> ---
> 
> Board Report
> By: Brian Cameron
> 
> First of all, the GNOME Foundation board of directors would like to
> express a huge thank you to all you volunteers who help to make the
> GNOME community possible.  To all those who use the GNOME desktop
> and understand the value of free software on the desktop, it is you
> that makes the GNOME community both rich and rewarding.  Thank you
> also to our advisory board members and sponsors for providing much
> valued direction for the community.
> 
> The GNOME 3.0 release is planned for April 6, 2010.  Find a release
> party near you to attend!  There are GNOME 3 Launch events being
> planned aroudn the world.  Emily Chen and the GNOME.Asia team are
> organizing providing GNOME t-shirts and other goodies to those who
> can organize launch events in their area.  The GNOME Launch event
> in Bangalore will also be GNOME.Asia 2011.
> 
>   http://live.gnome.org/ThreePointZero/LaunchParty
>   http://gnome.asia/press/2011/Bangalore/
> 
> In the past quarter, Stormy Peters stepped down from her position as
> Executive Director of The GNOME Foundation.  The board would like to
> thank Stormy for all of her great work helping to make The GNOME
> Foundation a more effective and better resourced organization.  We
> all wish her the best with her future endeavors!
> 
> The board has been busy trying to keep up with the work with Stormy
> leaving, and the most following important work continued to be the most
> pressing.
> 
>  * Released the Annual Report.  Thanks to Paul and Daniel Galleguillos.
> 
>    http://foundation.gnome.org/reports/gnome-annual-report-2009.pdf
> 
>    Is it not awesome?  The GNOME Marketing team needs more help putting
>    together things like this.
> 
>  * Announced an interest to hire a new Executive Director and are
>    currently reviewing applicants.
> 
> 
> http://mail.gnome.org/archives/foundation-list/2010-November/msg00019.html
> 
>  * GNOME T-Shirt contest:
> 
>     * http://www.gnome.org/contest/
> 
>  * The Boston Summit was held over November 6-8 and proved to be a
>    great opportunity for collaboration.  The GNOME Marketing team
>    made good progress on video projects and a great deal of work was
>    focused on the upcoming GNOME 3.0 release and accessibility.
>    Thanks J5!
> 
>  * The GNOME Foundation and KDE e.V. board of directors annoucne
>    the Desktop Summit 2011:
> 
> 
> http://www.gnome.org/press/releases/2010-10-desktop-summit-2011-berlin.html
> 
>    Thanks to Andreas Nilsson, Dave Neary and Ekaterina Gerasimova for
>    all the help!  Would be good to get more local GNOME volunteers
>    involved.  Organizers are planning a face-to-face meeting at FOSDEM,
>    probably on Saturday during lunch.
> 
>  * Organized the following GNOME hackfests in the past quarter:
>    - Accessibility at AEGIS conference in Seville (Spain), October,
>      2010.
>    - GTK+ Hackfest in A Coruña (Galicia, Spain), October 18-22, 2010.
>    - Snowy aka Tomboy Online Hackfest held during The Boston Summit.
>    - Development Documentation and Tools Hackfest in Berlin (Germany),
>      December 2-5, 2010.
>    - WebKitGTK+ Hackfest in A Coruña (Galicia, Spain), December 5-12,
>      2010.
> 
>  * Germán Póo-Caamaño, doing a great job as GNOME Foundation treasurer,
>    released our planned 2011 budget for GNOME Foundation community
>    review.
> 
> 
> http://mail.gnome.org/archives/foundation-list/2010-December/msg00057.html
> 
>  * The Friends of GNOME revamp is making good progress, though is behind
>    schedule.  Og Maciel, Paul Cutler, Andreas Nilsson and the GNOME
>    marketing team have been working on this.  Any feedback on the
>    following alpha would be helpful.
> 
>    http://www.andreasn.se/diverse/temp/friends-of-gnome-2.0/
> 
>  * The bidding process for the MeeGo GTK+ work closed and the
>    applications have been reviewed.  The chosen bid will soon be
>    announced.  Thanks to Bastien Nocera for doing much of the
>    organizing.
> 
>  * The GNOME Foundation is now selling GNOME branded merchandise through
>    FreeWear.  Check it out:
> 
>    http://www.freewear.org/?org=GNOMEFoundation
> 
>  * GNOME a11y project received significant funding:
> 
>    http://www.gnome.org/press/releases/2010-10-accessibility-grant.html
> 
>  * The GNOME Foundation is making arrangements to use the Egencia
>    Business Travel service affiliated with expedia.com to make it
>    easier to handle the volume of travel subsidies handled by the
>    Foundation.
> 
>  * Announced an interest to hire contract work to assist with GNOME 3
>    marketing efforts, with a current budget of $5,000 allocated.  Made
>    a call for project ideas and resumes on the GNOME Marketing list.
> 
>  * Womens Outreach Program proving successful!
> 
>    http://www.gnome.org/press/releases/2010-11-women-outreach-interns.html
> 
> Those are just some highlights, so lots of good work is getting done.
> Please help GNOME 3 be a success.  Get involved, join us at a GNOME 3
> launch event or at one of the hackfests currently being organized:
> 
> - Python Bindings Hackfest in Prague, CZ, (January 17-21, 2011)
> - GNOME Asia Hackfest in Bangalore, IN, (March 30 - April 3, 2011)
> - ATK Hackfest in A Coruña (Galicia, Spain) (May 2011)
> 
> These events happen when GNOME community members recognize the need and
> propose them.  If you have an idea or need for a GNOME event, please
> let the board know.
> 
> The GNOME Foundation board of directors very much appreciates when you
> email board-list@gnome.org to let us know if there is anything The GNOME
> Foundation can do to help or if there are any opportunities that you
> think The GNOME Foundation should know about.  Many different skill
> sets are needed to help GNOME's mission. If you are willing to help,
> there is a diverse set of interesting tasks to choose from. We need you.
> 
> Please also consider becoming a Friend of GNOME.  Your donations really
> do help the GNOME Foundation continue provide support and services
> which help the success of the GNOME project.
> 
>   http://www.gnome.org/friends/
> 
> Brian Cameron
> GNOME Foundation Secretary
> 
> 
> On 01/ 5/11 08:05 AM, Paul Cutler wrote:
>> Hi Marketing team!
>>
>> The Q4 team updates are due and we had a bunch of activity over the
>> last 3 months, with Friends of GNOME, GCI, etc.
>>
>> Would anyone like to try their hand at writing the update?  You can
>> see an example of the Q2 update[1] and I'm working to get the GNOME Q3
>> update up later today.  We need to have the Q4 report written in a
>> week by Jan 12th.
>>
>> Thanks for the help!
>>
>> Paul
>>
>> [1] http://foundation.gnome.org/reports/gnome-report-2010-Q2.html
> 

-- 
Dave Neary
GNOME Foundation member
dneary@gnome.org
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Thanks Jason!

Let's see how many replies you get. How're things looking at this stage?

Cheers,
Dave.

Jason Lo wrote:
> I have sent an email to every user group with a main contact listed. I
> will send an email to the gugmasters list soon.
> 
> On Tue, Jan 11, 2011 at 2:33 AM, Dave Neary <dneary@gnome.org
> <mailto:dneary@gnome.org>> wrote:
> 
>     Oh - and, fwiw: as a mamber of GNOME France, I have not heard anything
>     about your request, and as a member of guigmasters, I didn't see any
>     email from you there yet.
> 
>     Cheers,
>     Dave.
> 
>     Jason Lo wrote:
>     > So I'm still doing this task. I'm sorry I haven't sent any updates in
>     > the last two days, I was quite busy.
>     >
>     > So far I've emailed about half of the list, and have only gotten info
>     > from China and Brazil. I've gotten updated contact info from them and
>     > estimated member populations. Also, GNOME Brazil had a meetup recently
>     > (which I have added to the wiki), and GNOME China is trying to
>     open up a
>     > store, if I read correctly.
>     >
>     > And I just noticed that technically the GCI thing finished, so I can't
>     > get credit for this task. Oh well, I'll still follow it through; I'd
>     > feel like a jerk if I were to just drop it, especially seeing the
>     other
>     > two students who did just go and drop it, heh.
>     >
>     > More updates soon!
>     >
>     > --
>     > Jason
> 
>     --
>     Dave Neary
>     GNOME Foundation member
>     dneary@gnome.org <mailto:dneary@gnome.org>
> 
> 
> 
> 
> -- 
> Jason

-- 
Dave Neary
GNOME Foundation member
dneary@gnome.org
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Subject: Re: about gnome3 dev marketing
From: Allan Day <allanpday@gmail.com>
To: Juanjo Marin <juanjomarin96@yahoo.es>
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Juanjo Marin wrote:
> Hi!
> 
> I think is a good idea to improve the GNOME marketing for developers.
> Obviously, what developers really appreciate is documentation, and the
> documentation team is working hard on this area. I think is especially
> interesting the set of 10-minute-tutorials they are working on [1].
> 
> However, I think that form the marketing point of view, the situation
> can be improved a lot. 
> 
> This presentation from Alberto Ruiz in 2008' GUADEC has very good valid
> points about GTK+ marketing [2], which is the best/only known GNOME
> technology for outsiders. I think this is very important because GTK+ is
> receiving bad comments from people. Our collegues are working hard
> turning GTK+3 into a very good piece of software and we must push it.
> 
> I think we must also to improve awareness of other GNOME technologies,
> but because we must start from something, I think that GTK+ is the most
> straigh-forward way. The key point from the marketing point of view is
> unify the brand and websites of certified GTK+ bindings.

I don't think we can solve the entire platform marketing strategy in
time for 3.0 (it would be great to work on that in the future, of
course). It would be awesome to have some developer focused materials in
the GNOME 3 marketing, though. Our platform has received a lot of work;
we should be showing that off. Also, showing the extent of the changes
in GNOME 3 will reinforce the impression that it is a substantial
release (we don't want people to think that it is purely cosmetic).

For now, a concise set of messages which describe the improvements in
the GNOME 3 platform would be enough. I can imagine these falling into
two broad categories:

 * Ways GNOME 3 will enable devs to create better software (where better
means: richer, faster, more portable, more attractive...)

 * Ways it will be easier to make software for the GNOME 3 platform
(where easier might mean faster, easier to maintain, less
error-prone...)

I know very little about this stuff, but I can already think of some
examples:

 * Faster application startup thanks to dconf

 * Easier visual styling thanks to CSS-based GTK+ theming

 * Massive platform cleanup for a quicker, smoother, more intuitive
developer experience

If someone could put together a set of notes with other key examples of
how the platform has been improved, I'd be happy to write them up for
gnome3.org.

Best,

Allan
-- 
Blog: http://afaikblog.wordpress.com/
IRC: aday on irc.gnome.org

From nearyd@gmail.com  Thu Jan 13 11:23:51 2011
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Thanks for the tip!

I was hoping to use it, not just try it, though...

Cheers,
Dave.

Paul Cutler wrote:
> See Frederic's email to d-d-l he just posted - he has working live
> image off USB.
> 
> Paul
> 
> On Wed, Jan 12, 2011 at 12:29 PM, Dave Neary <dneary@gnome.org> wrote:
>> Hi,
>>
>> Dave Neary wrote:
>>> I used [1] on Ubuntu 10.10 and it seems to work fine.
>>>
>>>> [1] https://launchpad.net/~ricotz/+archive/testing
>>>> [2] https://launchpad.net/~gnome3-team/+archive/gnome3/+packages
>>> I'm currently upgrading to 11.04 to get the latest greatest.
>> <snip>
>>
>>> So I will be removing ricotz and switching o the gnome3 team when I'm done.
>> So what is delivered by the gnome3 team PPA is mostly unusable right now
>> - I'm still waiting for good 2.91.4 builds to come through from Debian -
>>  and the ricotz PPA is a weird no-mans-land, with just the shell, and
>> with Unity & Compiz using global Mac-style menus, when you switch to
>> gnome-shell you don't have any menus any more.
>>
>> I'd really like to figure out how to get a proper GNOME 3 experience
>> without switching distros, but if I have to, I will (but then, we'll be
>> sending a hell of a message to the users of the most popular Linux
>> distro out there).
>>
>> Cheers,
>> Dave.
>>
>> --
>> Dave Neary
>> GNOME Foundation member
>> dneary@gnome.org
>> --
>> marketing-list mailing list
>> marketing-list@gnome.org
>> http://mail.gnome.org/mailman/listinfo/marketing-list
>>
> 

-- 
Dave Neary
GNOME Foundation member
dneary@gnome.org
From me@jasonclinton.com  Thu Jan 13 17:53:41 2011
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Well if Ubuntu has put GNOME 3 out of scope for 11.04, that's not really
something that the GNOME community can overcome with a trivial amount of
effort. The message to our users on Ubuntu is basically nothing since they
can't get it and won't feel any of the repercussions of transition until at
least 11.10. The entire motivation behind the "current users" target was to
help people understand and be inspired about the UI change; thus, if they
aren't changing UI now, they aren't the target audience. If they're inspired
by GNOME 3 design goals, Fedora Rawhide and OpenSuSE packages are mostly
working today and will be even more so as both of those enter their beta
periods.

On Thu, Jan 13, 2011 at 05:23, Dave Neary <dneary@gnome.org> wrote:

> Thanks for the tip!
>
> I was hoping to use it, not just try it, though...
>
> Cheers,
> Dave.
>
> Paul Cutler wrote:
> > See Frederic's email to d-d-l he just posted - he has working live
> > image off USB.
> >
> > Paul
> >
> > On Wed, Jan 12, 2011 at 12:29 PM, Dave Neary <dneary@gnome.org> wrote:
> >> Hi,
> >>
> >> Dave Neary wrote:
> >>> I used [1] on Ubuntu 10.10 and it seems to work fine.
> >>>
> >>>> [1] https://launchpad.net/~ricotz/+archive/testing<https://launchpad.net/%7Ericotz/+archive/testing>
> >>>> [2] https://launchpad.net/~gnome3-team/+archive/gnome3/+packages<https://launchpad.net/%7Egnome3-team/+archive/gnome3/+packages>
> >>> I'm currently upgrading to 11.04 to get the latest greatest.
> >> <snip>
> >>
> >>> So I will be removing ricotz and switching o the gnome3 team when I'm
> done.
> >> So what is delivered by the gnome3 team PPA is mostly unusable right now
> >> - I'm still waiting for good 2.91.4 builds to come through from Debian -
> >>  and the ricotz PPA is a weird no-mans-land, with just the shell, and
> >> with Unity & Compiz using global Mac-style menus, when you switch to
> >> gnome-shell you don't have any menus any more.
> >>
> >> I'd really like to figure out how to get a proper GNOME 3 experience
> >> without switching distros, but if I have to, I will (but then, we'll be
> >> sending a hell of a message to the users of the most popular Linux
> >> distro out there).
> >>
> >> Cheers,
> >> Dave.
> >>
> >> --
> >> Dave Neary
> >> GNOME Foundation member
> >> dneary@gnome.org
> >> --
> >> marketing-list mailing list
> >> marketing-list@gnome.org
> >> http://mail.gnome.org/mailman/listinfo/marketing-list
> >>
> >
>
> --
> Dave Neary
> GNOME Foundation member
> dneary@gnome.org
> --
> marketing-list mailing list
> marketing-list@gnome.org
> http://mail.gnome.org/mailman/listinfo/marketing-list
>

--0016e6d64b91f8c1040499bdcd81
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<div class=3D"gmail_quote">Well if Ubuntu has put GNOME 3 out of scope for =
11.04, that&#39;s not really something that the GNOME community can overcom=
e with a trivial amount of effort. The message to our users on Ubuntu is ba=
sically nothing since they can&#39;t get it and won&#39;t feel any of the r=
epercussions of transition until at least 11.10. The entire motivation behi=
nd the &quot;current users&quot; target was to help people understand and b=
e inspired about the UI change; thus, if they aren&#39;t changing UI now, t=
hey aren&#39;t the target audience. If they&#39;re inspired by GNOME 3 desi=
gn goals, Fedora Rawhide and OpenSuSE packages are mostly working today and=
 will be even more so as both of those enter their beta periods.<br>
<br>On Thu, Jan 13, 2011 at 05:23, Dave Neary <span dir=3D"ltr">&lt;<a href=
=3D"mailto:dneary@gnome.org">dneary@gnome.org</a>&gt;</span> wrote:<br><blo=
ckquote class=3D"gmail_quote" style=3D"margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #c=
cc solid;padding-left:1ex;">
Thanks for the tip!<br>
<br>
I was hoping to use it, not just try it, though...<br>
<br>
Cheers,<br>
<font color=3D"#888888">Dave.<br>
</font><div><div></div><div class=3D"h5"><br>
Paul Cutler wrote:<br>
&gt; See Frederic&#39;s email to d-d-l he just posted - he has working live=
<br>
&gt; image off USB.<br>
&gt;<br>
&gt; Paul<br>
&gt;<br>
&gt; On Wed, Jan 12, 2011 at 12:29 PM, Dave Neary &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:dne=
ary@gnome.org">dneary@gnome.org</a>&gt; wrote:<br>
&gt;&gt; Hi,<br>
&gt;&gt;<br>
&gt;&gt; Dave Neary wrote:<br>
&gt;&gt;&gt; I used [1] on Ubuntu 10.10 and it seems to work fine.<br>
&gt;&gt;&gt;<br>
&gt;&gt;&gt;&gt; [1] <a href=3D"https://launchpad.net/%7Ericotz/+archive/te=
sting" target=3D"_blank">https://launchpad.net/~ricotz/+archive/testing</a>=
<br>
&gt;&gt;&gt;&gt; [2] <a href=3D"https://launchpad.net/%7Egnome3-team/+archi=
ve/gnome3/+packages" target=3D"_blank">https://launchpad.net/~gnome3-team/+=
archive/gnome3/+packages</a><br>
&gt;&gt;&gt; I&#39;m currently upgrading to 11.04 to get the latest greates=
t.<br>
&gt;&gt; &lt;snip&gt;<br>
&gt;&gt;<br>
&gt;&gt;&gt; So I will be removing ricotz and switching o the gnome3 team w=
hen I&#39;m done.<br>
&gt;&gt; So what is delivered by the gnome3 team PPA is mostly unusable rig=
ht now<br>
&gt;&gt; - I&#39;m still waiting for good 2.91.4 builds to come through fro=
m Debian -<br>
&gt;&gt; =C2=A0and the ricotz PPA is a weird no-mans-land, with just the sh=
ell, and<br>
&gt;&gt; with Unity &amp; Compiz using global Mac-style menus, when you swi=
tch to<br>
&gt;&gt; gnome-shell you don&#39;t have any menus any more.<br>
&gt;&gt;<br>
&gt;&gt; I&#39;d really like to figure out how to get a proper GNOME 3 expe=
rience<br>
&gt;&gt; without switching distros, but if I have to, I will (but then, we&=
#39;ll be<br>
&gt;&gt; sending a hell of a message to the users of the most popular Linux=
<br>
&gt;&gt; distro out there).<br>
&gt;&gt;<br>
&gt;&gt; Cheers,<br>
&gt;&gt; Dave.<br>
&gt;&gt;<br>
&gt;&gt; --<br>
&gt;&gt; Dave Neary<br>
&gt;&gt; GNOME Foundation member<br>
&gt;&gt; <a href=3D"mailto:dneary@gnome.org">dneary@gnome.org</a><br>
&gt;&gt; --<br>
&gt;&gt; marketing-list mailing list<br>
&gt;&gt; <a href=3D"mailto:marketing-list@gnome.org">marketing-list@gnome.o=
rg</a><br>
&gt;&gt; <a href=3D"http://mail.gnome.org/mailman/listinfo/marketing-list" =
target=3D"_blank">http://mail.gnome.org/mailman/listinfo/marketing-list</a>=
<br>
&gt;&gt;<br>
&gt;<br>
<br>
--<br>
Dave Neary<br>
GNOME Foundation member<br>
<a href=3D"mailto:dneary@gnome.org">dneary@gnome.org</a><br>
--<br>
marketing-list mailing list<br>
<a href=3D"mailto:marketing-list@gnome.org">marketing-list@gnome.org</a><br=
>
<a href=3D"http://mail.gnome.org/mailman/listinfo/marketing-list" target=3D=
"_blank">http://mail.gnome.org/mailman/listinfo/marketing-list</a><br>
</div></div></blockquote></div><br>

--0016e6d64b91f8c1040499bdcd81--
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Updated to reflect comments.  How's this look?

---

Board Report
By: Brian Cameron

First of all, the GNOME Foundation board of directors would like to
express a huge thank you to all you volunteers who help to make the
GNOME community possible.  To all those who use the GNOME desktop
and understand the value of free software on the desktop, it is you
that makes the GNOME community both rich and rewarding.  Thank you
also to our advisory board members and sponsors for providing much
valued direction for the community.

The GNOME 3.0 release is planned for April 6, 2010.  Find a release
party near you to attend!  There are GNOME 3 Launch events being
planned aroudn the world.  Emily Chen and the GNOME.Asia team are
organizing providing GNOME t-shirts and other goodies to those who
can organize launch events in their area.  The GNOME Launch event
in Bangalore will also be GNOME.Asia 2011.

   http://live.gnome.org/ThreePointZero/LaunchParty
   http://gnome.asia/press/2011/Bangalore/

The GNOME Foundation is seeking to hire an Executive Director and is
currently reviewing applicants.  Refer here:

http://mail.gnome.org/archives/foundation-list/2010-November/msg00019.html

Last November, Stormy Peters stepped down from her position as
Executive Director of The GNOME Foundation.  The board would like to
thank Stormy for all of her great work helping to make The GNOME
Foundation a more effective and better resourced organization.  We
all wish her the best with her future endeavors!

As you can imagine, the board has been busy keeping up with the work
with Stormy leaving, and the most following important work continued to
be the most pressing over the past quarter.

  * Released the Annual Report.  Thanks to Paul and Daniel Galleguillos.

    http://foundation.gnome.org/reports/gnome-annual-report-2009.pdf

    Is it not awesome?  The GNOME Marketing team needs more help putting
    together things like this.

  * GNOME T-Shirt contest:

     * http://www.gnome.org/contest/

  * Womens Outreach Program proving successful!

    http://www.gnome.org/press/releases/2010-11-women-outreach-interns.html

  * Germán Póo-Caamaño, doing a great job as GNOME Foundation treasurer,
    released our planned 2011 budget for GNOME Foundation community
    review.

 
http://mail.gnome.org/archives/foundation-list/2010-December/msg00057.html

  * The GNOME Foundation is now selling GNOME branded merchandise through
    FreeWear.  Check it out:

    http://www.freewear.org/?org=GNOMEFoundation

  * The Friends of GNOME revamp is making good progress, though is behind
    schedule.  Og Maciel, Paul Cutler, Andreas Nilsson and the GNOME
    marketing team have been working on this.  Any feedback on the
    following alpha would be helpful.

    http://www.andreasn.se/diverse/temp/friends-of-gnome-2.0/

  * The bidding process for the MeeGo GTK+ work closed and the
    applications have been reviewed.  The chosen bid will soon be
    announced.  Thanks to Bastien Nocera for doing much of the
    organizing.

  * GNOME a11y project received significant funding:

    http://www.gnome.org/press/releases/2010-10-accessibility-grant.html

  * The GNOME Foundation is making arrangements to use the Egencia
    Business Travel service affiliated with expedia.com to make it
    easier to handle the volume of travel subsidies handled by the
    Foundation.

  * Announced an interest to hire contract work to assist with GNOME 3
    marketing efforts, with a current budget of $5,000 allocated.  Made
    a call for project ideas and resumes on the GNOME Marketing list.

Those are just some highlights, so lots of good work is getting done.
Please help GNOME 3 be a success.  Get involved, join us at a GNOME 3
launch event or at one of the hackfests currently being organized.

Events:

  * The Boston Summit was held over November 6-8 and proved to be a
    great opportunity for collaboration.  The GNOME Marketing team
    made good progress on video projects and a great deal of work was
    focused on the upcoming GNOME 3.0 release and accessibility.
    Thanks J5!

  * The GNOME Foundation and KDE e.V. board of directors announce
    the Desktop Summit 2011:

 
http://www.gnome.org/press/releases/2010-10-desktop-summit-2011-berlin.html

    Thanks to Andreas Nilsson, Dave Neary and Ekaterina Gerasimova for
    all the help!  Would be good to get more local GNOME volunteers
    involved.  Organizers are planning a face-to-face meeting at FOSDEM,
    probably on Saturday during lunch.

  * Organized the following GNOME hackfests in the past quarter:
    - Accessibility at AEGIS conference in Seville (Spain), October,
      2010.
    - GTK+ Hackfest in A Coruña (Galicia, Spain), October 18-22, 2010.
    - Snowy aka Tomboy Online Hackfest held during The Boston Summit.
    - Development Documentation and Tools Hackfest in Berlin (Germany),
      December 2-5, 2010.
    - WebKitGTK+ Hackfest in A Coruña (Galicia, Spain), December 5-12,
      2010.

  * Python Bindings Hackfest in Prague, CZ, (January 17-21, 2011)
  * GNOME Asia Hackfest in Bangalore, IN, (March 30 - April 3, 2011)
  * ATK Hackfest in A Coruña (Galicia, Spain) (May 2011)

These events happen when GNOME community members recognize the need and
propose them.  If you have an idea or need for a GNOME event, please
let the board know.

The GNOME Foundation board of directors very much appreciates when you
email board-list@gnome.org to let us know if there is anything The GNOME
Foundation can do to help or if there are any opportunities that you
think The GNOME Foundation should know about.  Many different skill
sets are needed to help GNOME's mission. If you are willing to help,
there is a diverse set of interesting tasks to choose from. We need you.

Please also consider becoming a Friend of GNOME.  Your donations really
do help the GNOME Foundation continue provide support and services
which help the success of the GNOME project.

   http://www.gnome.org/friends/

Brian Cameron
GNOME Foundation Secretary
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Hi,

Jason D. Clinton wrote:
> Well if Ubuntu has put GNOME 3 out of scope for 11.04, that's not really
> something that the GNOME community can overcome with a trivial amount of
> effort.

I've been hearing that Unity doesn't represent a fork, that the GNOME
session will be exactly the same, just with a different window manager
and shell. How hard is it to change the window manager & shell?

Cheers,
Dave.

-- 
Dave Neary
GNOME Foundation member
dneary@gnome.org
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Hi,

Brian Cameron wrote:
> 
> Updated to reflect comments.  How's this look?

Better! Thanks.

Cheers,
Dave.

-- 
Dave Neary
GNOME Foundation member
dneary@gnome.org
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On Thu, Jan 13, 2011 at 1:21 PM, Dave Neary <dneary@gnome.org> wrote:

> Hi,
>
> Jason D. Clinton wrote:
> > Well if Ubuntu has put GNOME 3 out of scope for 11.04, that's not really
> > something that the GNOME community can overcome with a trivial amount of
> > effort.
>
> I've been hearing that Unity doesn't represent a fork, that the GNOME
> session will be exactly the same, just with a different window manager
> and shell. How hard is it to change the window manager & shell?
>
>
Hi Dave,

As I understand it, gnome-shell is the window manager.  gnome-shell is a
plugin to mutter and is integrated.  It's one of the complaints on the
thread in DDL that you can't switch out the window manager and keep the
shell portion.

sri

--20cf30549df1c8ab300499c127e3
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<br><br><div class=3D"gmail_quote">On Thu, Jan 13, 2011 at 1:21 PM, Dave Ne=
ary <span dir=3D"ltr">&lt;<a href=3D"mailto:dneary@gnome.org">dneary@gnome.=
org</a>&gt;</span> wrote:<br><blockquote class=3D"gmail_quote" style=3D"mar=
gin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex;">

Hi,<br>
<div class=3D"im"><br>
Jason D. Clinton wrote:<br>
&gt; Well if Ubuntu has put GNOME 3 out of scope for 11.04, that&#39;s not =
really<br>
&gt; something that the GNOME community can overcome with a trivial amount =
of<br>
&gt; effort.<br>
<br>
</div>I&#39;ve been hearing that Unity doesn&#39;t represent a fork, that t=
he GNOME<br>
session will be exactly the same, just with a different window manager<br>
and shell. How hard is it to change the window manager &amp; shell?<br>
<div><div></div><div class=3D"h5"><br></div></div></blockquote><div><br>Hi =
Dave,<br><br>As I understand it, gnome-shell is the window manager. =A0gnom=
e-shell is a plugin to mutter and is integrated. =A0It&#39;s one of the com=
plaints on the thread in DDL that you can&#39;t switch out the window manag=
er and keep the shell portion.<br>

<br>sri</div></div>

--20cf30549df1c8ab300499c127e3--
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Date: Thu, 13 Jan 2011 15:45:39 -0600
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Subject: Re: getting www.gnome3.org
From: "Jason D. Clinton" <me@jasonclinton.com>
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On Thu, Jan 13, 2011 at 15:21, Dave Neary <dneary@gnome.org> wrote:

> Jason D. Clinton wrote:
> > Well if Ubuntu has put GNOME 3 out of scope for 11.04, that's not really
> > something that the GNOME community can overcome with a trivial amount of
> > effort.
>
> I've been hearing that Unity doesn't represent a fork, that the GNOME
> session will be exactly the same, just with a different window manager
> and shell. How hard is it to change the window manager & shell?
>

In both, the WM and Shell are one and the same. And you can indeed switch
them out with very little effort. However, I am under the impression that a
number of dependencies will be of a de-emphasized status when 11.04 is
released and thus a number of the things which we need to get a good GNOME
Shell experience this early in the 11.04 release cycle just aren't there
yet. Certainly once 11.04 is release or maybe even in beta, more of the
dependencies will have been updated to the minimums and then making packages
for 11.04 becomes much more feasible.

Though less important, there's also the question of how to handle the
notifications fork. I think that a number of packages in Ubuntu have source
code modifications which present incompatibilities. I vaguely recall a
discussion about leaving both code paths in Ubuntu's packages but I don't
know where that's at.

--0016e64c2e1c1a49e30499c13dc3
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<div class=3D"gmail_quote">On Thu, Jan 13, 2011 at 15:21, Dave Neary <span =
dir=3D"ltr">&lt;<a href=3D"mailto:dneary@gnome.org">dneary@gnome.org</a>&gt=
;</span> wrote:<br><blockquote class=3D"gmail_quote" style=3D"margin:0 0 0 =
.8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex;">
<div class=3D"im">
Jason D. Clinton wrote:<br>
&gt; Well if Ubuntu has put GNOME 3 out of scope for 11.04, that&#39;s not =
really<br>
&gt; something that the GNOME community can overcome with a trivial amount =
of<br>
&gt; effort.<br>
</div><br>I&#39;ve been hearing that Unity doesn&#39;t represent a fork, th=
at the GNOME<br>
session will be exactly the same, just with a different window manager<br>
and shell. How hard is it to change the window manager &amp; shell?<br></bl=
ockquote><div><br>In both, the WM and Shell are one and the same. And you c=
an indeed switch them out with very little effort. However, I am under the =
impression that a number of dependencies will be of a de-emphasized status =
when 11.04 is released and thus a number of the things which we need to get=
 a good GNOME Shell experience this early in the 11.04 release cycle just a=
ren&#39;t there yet. Certainly once 11.04 is release or maybe even in beta,=
 more of the dependencies will have been updated to the minimums and then m=
aking packages for 11.04 becomes much more feasible.<br>
<br>Though less important, there&#39;s also the question of how to handle t=
he notifications fork. I think that a number of packages in Ubuntu have sou=
rce code modifications which present incompatibilities. I vaguely recall a =
discussion about leaving both code paths in Ubuntu&#39;s packages but I don=
&#39;t know where that&#39;s at.<br>
<br><br></div></div>

--0016e64c2e1c1a49e30499c13dc3--
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From: Jason Lo <yet2bedefined@gmail.com>
Date: Thu, 13 Jan 2011 13:57:33 -0800
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Subject: Re: GCI: Update Gnome Usergroup Info, Introduction
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I got some more info from China, and I received some really good contact
info updates from Bangalore. I will update the wiki page accordingly.

On Thu, Jan 13, 2011 at 1:32 AM, Dave Neary <dneary@gnome.org> wrote:

> Thanks Jason!
>
> Let's see how many replies you get. How're things looking at this stage?
>
> Cheers,
> Dave.
>
> Jason Lo wrote:
> > I have sent an email to every user group with a main contact listed. I
> > will send an email to the gugmasters list soon.
> >
> > On Tue, Jan 11, 2011 at 2:33 AM, Dave Neary <dneary@gnome.org
> > <mailto:dneary@gnome.org>> wrote:
> >
> >     Oh - and, fwiw: as a mamber of GNOME France, I have not heard
> anything
> >     about your request, and as a member of guigmasters, I didn't see any
> >     email from you there yet.
> >
> >     Cheers,
> >     Dave.
> >
> >     Jason Lo wrote:
> >     > So I'm still doing this task. I'm sorry I haven't sent any updates
> in
> >     > the last two days, I was quite busy.
> >     >
> >     > So far I've emailed about half of the list, and have only gotten
> info
> >     > from China and Brazil. I've gotten updated contact info from them
> and
> >     > estimated member populations. Also, GNOME Brazil had a meetup
> recently
> >     > (which I have added to the wiki), and GNOME China is trying to
> >     open up a
> >     > store, if I read correctly.
> >     >
> >     > And I just noticed that technically the GCI thing finished, so I
> can't
> >     > get credit for this task. Oh well, I'll still follow it through;
> I'd
> >     > feel like a jerk if I were to just drop it, especially seeing the
> >     other
> >     > two students who did just go and drop it, heh.
> >     >
> >     > More updates soon!
> >     >
> >     > --
> >     > Jason
> >
> >     --
> >     Dave Neary
> >     GNOME Foundation member
> >     dneary@gnome.org <mailto:dneary@gnome.org>
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > --
> > Jason
>
> --
> Dave Neary
> GNOME Foundation member
> dneary@gnome.org
>



-- 
Jason

--0015175ca7bce04e6f0499c16832
Content-Type: text/html; charset=ISO-8859-1
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

I got some more info from China, and I received some really good contact in=
fo updates from Bangalore. I will update the wiki page accordingly.<br><br>=
<div class=3D"gmail_quote">On Thu, Jan 13, 2011 at 1:32 AM, Dave Neary <spa=
n dir=3D"ltr">&lt;<a href=3D"mailto:dneary@gnome.org">dneary@gnome.org</a>&=
gt;</span> wrote:<br>

<blockquote class=3D"gmail_quote" style=3D"margin: 0pt 0pt 0pt 0.8ex; borde=
r-left: 1px solid rgb(204, 204, 204); padding-left: 1ex;">Thanks Jason!<br>
<br>
Let&#39;s see how many replies you get. How&#39;re things looking at this s=
tage?<br>
<div class=3D"im"><br>
Cheers,<br>
Dave.<br>
<br>
Jason Lo wrote:<br>
</div><div class=3D"im">&gt; I have sent an email to every user group with =
a main contact listed. I<br>
&gt; will send an email to the gugmasters list soon.<br>
&gt;<br>
&gt; On Tue, Jan 11, 2011 at 2:33 AM, Dave Neary &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:dnea=
ry@gnome.org">dneary@gnome.org</a><br>
</div><div><div></div><div class=3D"h5">&gt; &lt;mailto:<a href=3D"mailto:d=
neary@gnome.org">dneary@gnome.org</a>&gt;&gt; wrote:<br>
&gt;<br>
&gt; =A0 =A0 Oh - and, fwiw: as a mamber of GNOME France, I have not heard =
anything<br>
&gt; =A0 =A0 about your request, and as a member of guigmasters, I didn&#39=
;t see any<br>
&gt; =A0 =A0 email from you there yet.<br>
&gt;<br>
&gt; =A0 =A0 Cheers,<br>
&gt; =A0 =A0 Dave.<br>
&gt;<br>
&gt; =A0 =A0 Jason Lo wrote:<br>
&gt; =A0 =A0 &gt; So I&#39;m still doing this task. I&#39;m sorry I haven&#=
39;t sent any updates in<br>
&gt; =A0 =A0 &gt; the last two days, I was quite busy.<br>
&gt; =A0 =A0 &gt;<br>
&gt; =A0 =A0 &gt; So far I&#39;ve emailed about half of the list, and have =
only gotten info<br>
&gt; =A0 =A0 &gt; from China and Brazil. I&#39;ve gotten updated contact in=
fo from them and<br>
&gt; =A0 =A0 &gt; estimated member populations. Also, GNOME Brazil had a me=
etup recently<br>
&gt; =A0 =A0 &gt; (which I have added to the wiki), and GNOME China is tryi=
ng to<br>
&gt; =A0 =A0 open up a<br>
&gt; =A0 =A0 &gt; store, if I read correctly.<br>
&gt; =A0 =A0 &gt;<br>
&gt; =A0 =A0 &gt; And I just noticed that technically the GCI thing finishe=
d, so I can&#39;t<br>
&gt; =A0 =A0 &gt; get credit for this task. Oh well, I&#39;ll still follow =
it through; I&#39;d<br>
&gt; =A0 =A0 &gt; feel like a jerk if I were to just drop it, especially se=
eing the<br>
&gt; =A0 =A0 other<br>
&gt; =A0 =A0 &gt; two students who did just go and drop it, heh.<br>
&gt; =A0 =A0 &gt;<br>
&gt; =A0 =A0 &gt; More updates soon!<br>
&gt; =A0 =A0 &gt;<br>
&gt; =A0 =A0 &gt; --<br>
&gt; =A0 =A0 &gt; Jason<br>
&gt;<br>
&gt; =A0 =A0 --<br>
&gt; =A0 =A0 Dave Neary<br>
&gt; =A0 =A0 GNOME Foundation member<br>
</div></div>&gt; =A0 =A0 <a href=3D"mailto:dneary@gnome.org">dneary@gnome.o=
rg</a> &lt;mailto:<a href=3D"mailto:dneary@gnome.org">dneary@gnome.org</a>&=
gt;<br>
&gt;<br>
&gt;<br>
&gt;<br>
&gt;<br>
&gt; --<br>
<div><div></div><div class=3D"h5">&gt; Jason<br>
<br>
--<br>
Dave Neary<br>
GNOME Foundation member<br>
<a href=3D"mailto:dneary@gnome.org">dneary@gnome.org</a><br>
</div></div></blockquote></div><br><br clear=3D"all"><br>-- <br>Jason<br>

--0015175ca7bce04e6f0499c16832--
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Subject: Re: getting www.gnome3.org
From: "Jason D. Clinton" <me@jasonclinton.com>
To: Dave Neary <dneary@gnome.org>
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On Thu, Jan 13, 2011 at 15:45, Jason D. Clinton <me@jasonclinton.com> wrote:

> On Thu, Jan 13, 2011 at 15:21, Dave Neary <dneary@gnome.org> wrote:
>
>>  Jason D. Clinton wrote:
>> > Well if Ubuntu has put GNOME 3 out of scope for 11.04, that's not really
>> > something that the GNOME community can overcome with a trivial amount of
>> > effort.
>>
>> I've been hearing that Unity doesn't represent a fork, that the GNOME
>> session will be exactly the same, just with a different window manager
>> and shell. How hard is it to change the window manager & shell?
>>
>
> In both, the WM and Shell are one and the same. And you can indeed switch
> them out with very little effort. However, I am under the impression that a
> number of dependencies will be of a de-emphasized status when 11.04 is
> released and thus a number of the things which we need to get a good GNOME
> Shell experience this early in the 11.04 release cycle just aren't there
> yet. Certainly once 11.04 is release or maybe even in beta, more of the
> dependencies will have been updated to the minimums and then making packages
> for 11.04 becomes much more feasible.
>
> Though less important, there's also the question of how to handle the
> notifications fork. I think that a number of packages in Ubuntu have source
> code modifications which present incompatibilities. I vaguely recall a
> discussion about leaving both code paths in Ubuntu's packages but I don't
> know where that's at.
>

Andreas pointed me here:
https://blueprints.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+spec/packageselection-desktop-n-gnome3so
we'll likely just have to say "install gnome-shell from universe" once
11.04 reaches beta status.

Don't know about the notification situation.

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<div class=3D"gmail_quote">On Thu, Jan 13, 2011 at 15:45, Jason D. Clinton =
<span dir=3D"ltr">&lt;<a href=3D"mailto:me@jasonclinton.com">me@jasonclinto=
n.com</a>&gt;</span> wrote:<br><blockquote class=3D"gmail_quote" style=3D"m=
argin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex;">
<div class=3D"gmail_quote"><div class=3D"im">On Thu, Jan 13, 2011 at 15:21,=
 Dave Neary <span dir=3D"ltr">&lt;<a href=3D"mailto:dneary@gnome.org" targe=
t=3D"_blank">dneary@gnome.org</a>&gt;</span> wrote:<br><blockquote class=3D=
"gmail_quote" style=3D"margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding=
-left:1ex">

<div>
Jason D. Clinton wrote:<br>
&gt; Well if Ubuntu has put GNOME 3 out of scope for 11.04, that&#39;s not =
really<br>
&gt; something that the GNOME community can overcome with a trivial amount =
of<br>
&gt; effort.<br>
</div><br>I&#39;ve been hearing that Unity doesn&#39;t represent a fork, th=
at the GNOME<br>
session will be exactly the same, just with a different window manager<br>
and shell. How hard is it to change the window manager &amp; shell?<br></bl=
ockquote></div><div><br>In both, the WM and Shell are one and the same. And=
 you can indeed switch them out with very little effort. However, I am unde=
r the impression that a number of dependencies will be of a de-emphasized s=
tatus when 11.04 is released and thus a number of the things which we need =
to get a good GNOME Shell experience this early in the 11.04 release cycle =
just aren&#39;t there yet. Certainly once 11.04 is release or maybe even in=
 beta, more of the dependencies will have been updated to the minimums and =
then making packages for 11.04 becomes much more feasible.<br>

<br>Though less important, there&#39;s also the question of how to handle t=
he notifications fork. I think that a number of packages in Ubuntu have sou=
rce code modifications which present incompatibilities. I vaguely recall a =
discussion about leaving both code paths in Ubuntu&#39;s packages but I don=
&#39;t know where that&#39;s at.<br>
</div></div></blockquote><div><br>Andreas pointed me here: <a href=3D"https=
://blueprints.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+spec/packageselection-desktop-n-gnome3"=
>https://blueprints.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+spec/packageselection-desktop-n-g=
nome3</a> so we&#39;ll likely just have to say &quot;install gnome-shell fr=
om universe&quot; once 11.04 reaches beta status.<br>
<br>Don&#39;t know about the notification situation.<br><br></div></div>

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Heya,

On 07.01.2011 06:07, Jason Lo wrote:
> Hi, just an update. I've sent emails to Gnome [...] Deutschland so far,=
 and am waiting for replies.
>=20
Where have you sent the mail to "Germany" to? I can't find it in the
archives for gnome-de
<http://mail.gnome.org/archives/gnome-de/2011-January/thread.html>.

Cheers,
  Tobi


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I sent it to the main contact listed. If I don't get a reply soon, I'll try
the mailing list.

On Thu, Jan 13, 2011 at 3:35 PM, Tobias Mueller <muelli@cryptobitch.de>wrote:

> Heya,
>
> On 07.01.2011 06:07, Jason Lo wrote:
> > Hi, just an update. I've sent emails to Gnome [...] Deutschland so far,
> and am waiting for replies.
> >
> Where have you sent the mail to "Germany" to? I can't find it in the
> archives for gnome-de
> <http://mail.gnome.org/archives/gnome-de/2011-January/thread.html>.
>
> Cheers,
>  Tobi
>
>


-- 
Jason

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I sent it to the main contact listed. If I don&#39;t get a reply soon, I&#3=
9;ll try the mailing list.<br><br><div class=3D"gmail_quote">On Thu, Jan 13=
, 2011 at 3:35 PM, Tobias Mueller <span dir=3D"ltr">&lt;<a href=3D"mailto:m=
uelli@cryptobitch.de">muelli@cryptobitch.de</a>&gt;</span> wrote:<br>

<blockquote class=3D"gmail_quote" style=3D"margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1p=
x #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex;">Heya,<br>
<br>
On 07.01.2011 06:07, Jason Lo wrote:<br>
&gt; Hi, just an update. I&#39;ve sent emails to Gnome [...] Deutschland so=
 far, and am waiting for replies.<br>
&gt;<br>
Where have you sent the mail to &quot;Germany&quot; to? I can&#39;t find it=
 in the<br>
archives for gnome-de<br>
&lt;<a href=3D"http://mail.gnome.org/archives/gnome-de/2011-January/thread.=
html" target=3D"_blank">http://mail.gnome.org/archives/gnome-de/2011-Januar=
y/thread.html</a>&gt;.<br>
<br>
Cheers,<br>
 =A0Tobi<br>
<br>
</blockquote></div><br><br clear=3D"all"><br>-- <br>Jason<br>

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On 01/14/2011 03:47 AM, Brian Cameron wrote:
> * GNOME Asia Hackfest in Bangalore, IN, (March 30 - April 3, 2011)


Sorry for the late feedback. I've been kicked off the Internet as my 
land line is down since Wednesday. :(

Shouldn't the hackfest be called "GNOME 3.0 Hackfest" since this will be 
the scope of the hackfest?

Thank you.

Fred
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Latest update to reflect Fred's comments.

---

Board Report
By: Brian Cameron

First of all, the GNOME Foundation board of directors would like to
express a huge thank you to all you volunteers who help to make the
GNOME community possible.  To all those who use the GNOME desktop
and understand the value of free software on the desktop, it is you
that makes the GNOME community both rich and rewarding.  Thank you
also to our advisory board members and sponsors for providing much
valued direction for the community.

The GNOME 3.0 release is planned for April 6, 2010.  Find a release
party near you to attend!  There are GNOME 3 Launch events being
planned aroudn the world.  Emily Chen and the GNOME.Asia team are
organizing providing GNOME t-shirts and other goodies to those who
can organize launch events in their area.  The GNOME Launch event
in Bangalore will also be GNOME.Asia 2011.

   http://live.gnome.org/ThreePointZero/LaunchParty
   http://gnome.asia/press/2011/Bangalore/

The GNOME Foundation is seeking to hire an Executive Director and is
currently reviewing applicants.  Refer here:

http://mail.gnome.org/archives/foundation-list/2010-November/msg00019.html

Last November, Stormy Peters stepped down from her position as
Executive Director of The GNOME Foundation.  The board would like to
thank Stormy for all of her great work helping to make The GNOME
Foundation a more effective and better resourced organization.  We
all wish her the best with her future endeavors!

As you can imagine, the board has been busy keeping up with the work
with Stormy leaving, and the most following important work continued to
be the most pressing over the past quarter.

  * Released the Annual Report.  Thanks to Paul and Daniel Galleguillos.

    http://foundation.gnome.org/reports/gnome-annual-report-2009.pdf

    Is it not awesome?  The GNOME Marketing team needs more help putting
    together things like this.

  * GNOME T-Shirt contest:

     * http://www.gnome.org/contest/

  * Womens Outreach Program proving successful!

    http://www.gnome.org/press/releases/2010-11-women-outreach-interns.html

  * Germán Póo-Caamaño, doing a great job as GNOME Foundation treasurer,
    released our planned 2011 budget for GNOME Foundation community
    review.

 
http://mail.gnome.org/archives/foundation-list/2010-December/msg00057.html

  * The GNOME Foundation is now selling GNOME branded merchandise through
    FreeWear.  Check it out:

    http://www.freewear.org/?org=GNOMEFoundation

  * The Friends of GNOME revamp is making good progress, though is behind
    schedule.  Og Maciel, Paul Cutler, Andreas Nilsson and the GNOME
    marketing team have been working on this.  Any feedback on the
    following alpha would be helpful.

    http://www.andreasn.se/diverse/temp/friends-of-gnome-2.0/

  * The bidding process for the MeeGo GTK+ work closed and the
    applications have been reviewed.  The chosen bid will soon be
    announced.  Thanks to Bastien Nocera for doing much of the
    organizing.

  * GNOME a11y project received significant funding:

    http://www.gnome.org/press/releases/2010-10-accessibility-grant.html

  * The GNOME Foundation is making arrangements to use the Egencia
    Business Travel service affiliated with expedia.com to make it
    easier to handle the volume of travel subsidies handled by the
    Foundation.

  * Announced an interest to hire contract work to assist with GNOME 3
    marketing efforts, with a current budget of $5,000 allocated.  Made
    a call for project ideas and resumes on the GNOME Marketing list.

Those are just some highlights, so lots of good work is getting done.
Please help GNOME 3 be a success.  Get involved, join us at a GNOME 3
launch event or at one of the hackfests currently being organized.

Events:

  * The Boston Summit was held over November 6-8 and proved to be a
    great opportunity for collaboration.  The GNOME Marketing team
    made good progress on video projects and a great deal of work was
    focused on the upcoming GNOME 3.0 release and accessibility.
    Thanks J5!

  * The GNOME Foundation and KDE e.V. board of directors announce
    the Desktop Summit 2011:

 
http://www.gnome.org/press/releases/2010-10-desktop-summit-2011-berlin.html

    Thanks to Andreas Nilsson, Dave Neary and Ekaterina Gerasimova for
    all the help!  Would be good to get more local GNOME volunteers
    involved.  Organizers are planning a face-to-face meeting at FOSDEM,
    probably on Saturday during lunch.

  * Organized the following GNOME hackfests in the past quarter:
    - Accessibility at AEGIS conference in Seville (Spain), October,
      2010.
    - GTK+ Hackfest in A Coruña (Galicia, Spain), October 18-22, 2010.
    - Snowy aka Tomboy Online Hackfest held during The Boston Summit.
    - Development Documentation and Tools Hackfest in Berlin (Germany),
      December 2-5, 2010.
    - WebKitGTK+ Hackfest in A Coruña (Galicia, Spain), December 5-12,
      2010.

  * Planning the following hackfests:
    - Python Bindings Hackfest in Prague, CZ, (January 17-21, 2011)
    - GNOME.Asia GNOME 3 Hackfest in Bangalore, IN, (March 30 - April 3,
      2011)
    - ATK Hackfest in A Coruña (Galicia, Spain) (May 2011)

These events happen when GNOME community members recognize the need and
propose them.  If you have an idea or need for a GNOME event, please
let the board know.

The GNOME Foundation board of directors very much appreciates when you
email board-list@gnome.org to let us know if there is anything The GNOME
Foundation can do to help or if there are any opportunities that you
think The GNOME Foundation should know about.  Many different skill
sets are needed to help GNOME's mission. If you are willing to help,
there is a diverse set of interesting tasks to choose from. We need you.

Please also consider becoming a Friend of GNOME.  Your donations really
do help the GNOME Foundation continue provide support and services
which help the success of the GNOME project.

   http://www.gnome.org/friends/

Brian Cameron
GNOME Foundation Secretary
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From me@jasonclinton.com  Fri Jan 14 18:34:26 2011
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Subject: Made of Easy -> Made of Inspiration
From: "Jason D. Clinton" <me@jasonclinton.com>
To: GNOME Marketing List <marketing-list@gnome.org>
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--0016e6d64b914f6c640499d2aefa
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So, as we ramp up our marketing earlier than anticipated (good!) the launch
theme that we selected in November 2009 has been bothering me. Mostly, I
think, because what was a common meme at the time ("made of fail", "made of
awesome") isn't so common now. And so the play on the meme doesn't seem very
clever any more.

Also, as I am reviewing the list of videos to produce, I am increasingly of
the feeling that they need to inspire people by explaining the inspired
design behind the new UI.

What about "Made of Inspriation?"

Thoughts?

As it stands now, we haven't done anything with the official launch theme so
changing it is a zero-cost proposition...

--0016e6d64b914f6c640499d2aefa
Content-Type: text/html; charset=UTF-8
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So, as we ramp up our marketing earlier than anticipated (good!) the launch=
 theme that we selected in November 2009 has been bothering me. Mostly, I t=
hink, because what was a common meme at the time (&quot;made of fail&quot;,=
 &quot;made of awesome&quot;) isn&#39;t so common now. And so the play on t=
he meme doesn&#39;t seem very clever any more.<br>
<br>Also, as I am reviewing the list of videos to produce, I am increasingl=
y of the feeling that they need to inspire people by explaining the inspire=
d design behind the new UI.<br><br>What about &quot;Made of Inspriation?&qu=
ot;<br>
<br>Thoughts?<br><br>As it stands now, we haven&#39;t done anything with th=
e official launch theme so changing it is a zero-cost proposition...<br><br=
>

--0016e6d64b914f6c640499d2aefa--
From stormy.gnome@gmail.com  Fri Jan 14 18:50:45 2011
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From: Stormy Peters <stormy@gnome.org>
Date: Fri, 14 Jan 2011 11:50:10 -0700
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Subject: Re: Made of Easy -> Made of Inspiration
To: "Jason D. Clinton" <me@jasonclinton.com>
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--000e0cd518eca3a79a0499d2e899
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Made to Inspire?

On Fri, Jan 14, 2011 at 11:34 AM, Jason D. Clinton <me@jasonclinton.com>wrote:

> So, as we ramp up our marketing earlier than anticipated (good!) the launch
> theme that we selected in November 2009 has been bothering me. Mostly, I
> think, because what was a common meme at the time ("made of fail", "made of
> awesome") isn't so common now. And so the play on the meme doesn't seem very
> clever any more.
>
> Also, as I am reviewing the list of videos to produce, I am increasingly of
> the feeling that they need to inspire people by explaining the inspired
> design behind the new UI.
>
> What about "Made of Inspriation?"
>
> Thoughts?
>
> As it stands now, we haven't done anything with the official launch theme
> so changing it is a zero-cost proposition...
>
>
> --
> marketing-list mailing list
> marketing-list@gnome.org
> http://mail.gnome.org/mailman/listinfo/marketing-list
>
>

--000e0cd518eca3a79a0499d2e899
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Made to Inspire?<br><br><div class=3D"gmail_quote">On Fri, Jan 14, 2011 at =
11:34 AM, Jason D. Clinton <span dir=3D"ltr">&lt;<a href=3D"mailto:me@jason=
clinton.com">me@jasonclinton.com</a>&gt;</span> wrote:<br><blockquote class=
=3D"gmail_quote" style=3D"margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padd=
ing-left:1ex;">

So, as we ramp up our marketing earlier than anticipated (good!) the launch=
 theme that we selected in November 2009 has been bothering me. Mostly, I t=
hink, because what was a common meme at the time (&quot;made of fail&quot;,=
 &quot;made of awesome&quot;) isn&#39;t so common now. And so the play on t=
he meme doesn&#39;t seem very clever any more.<br>


<br>Also, as I am reviewing the list of videos to produce, I am increasingl=
y of the feeling that they need to inspire people by explaining the inspire=
d design behind the new UI.<br><br>What about &quot;Made of Inspriation?&qu=
ot;<br>


<br>Thoughts?<br><br>As it stands now, we haven&#39;t done anything with th=
e official launch theme so changing it is a zero-cost proposition...<br><br=
>
<br>--<br>
marketing-list mailing list<br>
<a href=3D"mailto:marketing-list@gnome.org">marketing-list@gnome.org</a><br=
>
<a href=3D"http://mail.gnome.org/mailman/listinfo/marketing-list" target=3D=
"_blank">http://mail.gnome.org/mailman/listinfo/marketing-list</a><br>
<br></blockquote></div><br>

--000e0cd518eca3a79a0499d2e899--
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Date: Fri, 14 Jan 2011 13:09:08 -0600
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Subject: Re: Made of Easy -> Made of Inspiration
From: "Jason D. Clinton" <me@jasonclinton.com>
To: Stormy Peters <stormy@gnome.org>
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+1

On Fri, Jan 14, 2011 at 12:50, Stormy Peters <stormy@gnome.org> wrote:

> Made to Inspire?
>
> On Fri, Jan 14, 2011 at 11:34 AM, Jason D. Clinton <me@jasonclinton.com>wrote:
>
>> So, as we ramp up our marketing earlier than anticipated (good!) the
>> launch theme that we selected in November 2009 has been bothering me.
>> Mostly, I think, because what was a common meme at the time ("made of fail",
>> "made of awesome") isn't so common now. And so the play on the meme doesn't
>> seem very clever any more.
>>
>> Also, as I am reviewing the list of videos to produce, I am increasingly
>> of the feeling that they need to inspire people by explaining the inspired
>> design behind the new UI.
>>
>> What about "Made of Inspriation?"
>>
>> Thoughts?
>>
>> As it stands now, we haven't done anything with the official launch theme
>> so changing it is a zero-cost proposition...
>>
>>
>> --
>> marketing-list mailing list
>> marketing-list@gnome.org
>> http://mail.gnome.org/mailman/listinfo/marketing-list
>>
>>
>

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+1<br><br><div class=3D"gmail_quote">On Fri, Jan 14, 2011 at 12:50, Stormy =
Peters <span dir=3D"ltr">&lt;<a href=3D"mailto:stormy@gnome.org">stormy@gno=
me.org</a>&gt;</span> wrote:<br><blockquote class=3D"gmail_quote" style=3D"=
margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex;">
Made to Inspire?<br><br><div class=3D"gmail_quote"><div><div></div><div cla=
ss=3D"h5">On Fri, Jan 14, 2011 at 11:34 AM, Jason D. Clinton <span dir=3D"l=
tr">&lt;<a href=3D"mailto:me@jasonclinton.com" target=3D"_blank">me@jasoncl=
inton.com</a>&gt;</span> wrote:<br>
</div></div><blockquote class=3D"gmail_quote" style=3D"margin:0 0 0 .8ex;bo=
rder-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex"><div><div></div><div class=3D"h5=
">

So, as we ramp up our marketing earlier than anticipated (good!) the launch=
 theme that we selected in November 2009 has been bothering me. Mostly, I t=
hink, because what was a common meme at the time (&quot;made of fail&quot;,=
 &quot;made of awesome&quot;) isn&#39;t so common now. And so the play on t=
he meme doesn&#39;t seem very clever any more.<br>



<br>Also, as I am reviewing the list of videos to produce, I am increasingl=
y of the feeling that they need to inspire people by explaining the inspire=
d design behind the new UI.<br><br>What about &quot;Made of Inspriation?&qu=
ot;<br>



<br>Thoughts?<br><br>As it stands now, we haven&#39;t done anything with th=
e official launch theme so changing it is a zero-cost proposition...<br><br=
>
<br></div></div>--<br>
marketing-list mailing list<br>
<a href=3D"mailto:marketing-list@gnome.org" target=3D"_blank">marketing-lis=
t@gnome.org</a><br>
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<br></blockquote></div><br>
</blockquote></div><br>

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Subject: Re: Made of Easy -> Made of Inspiration
From: Bryen M Yunashko <a11yrocks@bryen.com>
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I like it too.  +1

On Fri, 2011-01-14 at 13:09 -0600, Jason D. Clinton wrote:

> +1
> 
> 
> On Fri, Jan 14, 2011 at 12:50, Stormy Peters <stormy@gnome.org> wrote:
> 
>         Made to Inspire?
>         
>         
>         
>         On Fri, Jan 14, 2011 at 11:34 AM, Jason D. Clinton
>         <me@jasonclinton.com> wrote:
>         
>                 
>                 So, as we ramp up our marketing earlier than
>                 anticipated (good!) the launch theme that we selected
>                 in November 2009 has been bothering me. Mostly, I
>                 think, because what was a common meme at the time
>                 ("made of fail", "made of awesome") isn't so common
>                 now. And so the play on the meme doesn't seem very
>                 clever any more.
>                 
>                 Also, as I am reviewing the list of videos to produce,
>                 I am increasingly of the feeling that they need to
>                 inspire people by explaining the inspired design
>                 behind the new UI.
>                 
>                 What about "Made of Inspriation?"
>                 
>                 Thoughts?
>                 
>                 As it stands now, we haven't done anything with the
>                 official launch theme so changing it is a zero-cost
>                 proposition...
>                 
>                 
>                 
>                 
>                 --
>                 marketing-list mailing list
>                 marketing-list@gnome.org
>                 http://mail.gnome.org/mailman/listinfo/marketing-list
>                 
>         
>         
> 
> 



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I like it too.&nbsp; +1<BR>
<BR>
On Fri, 2011-01-14 at 13:09 -0600, Jason D. Clinton wrote:<BR>
<BLOCKQUOTE TYPE=CITE>
    +1<BR>
    <BR>
</BLOCKQUOTE>
<BLOCKQUOTE TYPE=CITE>
    On Fri, Jan 14, 2011 at 12:50, Stormy Peters &lt;<A HREF="mailto:stormy@gnome.org">stormy@gnome.org</A>&gt; wrote:<BR>
    <BLOCKQUOTE>
        Made to Inspire?<BR>
        <BR>
    </BLOCKQUOTE>
</BLOCKQUOTE>
<BLOCKQUOTE TYPE=CITE>
    <BLOCKQUOTE>
        <BR>
    </BLOCKQUOTE>
</BLOCKQUOTE>
<BLOCKQUOTE TYPE=CITE>
    <BLOCKQUOTE>
        On Fri, Jan 14, 2011 at 11:34 AM, Jason D. Clinton &lt;<A HREF="mailto:me@jasonclinton.com">me@jasonclinton.com</A>&gt; wrote:<BR>
        <BR>
    </BLOCKQUOTE>
</BLOCKQUOTE>
<BLOCKQUOTE TYPE=CITE>
    <BLOCKQUOTE>
        <BLOCKQUOTE>
            <BR>
        </BLOCKQUOTE>
    </BLOCKQUOTE>
</BLOCKQUOTE>
<BLOCKQUOTE TYPE=CITE>
    <BLOCKQUOTE>
        <BLOCKQUOTE>
            So, as we ramp up our marketing earlier than anticipated (good!) the launch theme that we selected in November 2009 has been bothering me. Mostly, I think, because what was a common meme at the time (&quot;made of fail&quot;, &quot;made of awesome&quot;) isn't so common now. And so the play on the meme doesn't seem very clever any more.<BR>
            <BR>
            Also, as I am reviewing the list of videos to produce, I am increasingly of the feeling that they need to inspire people by explaining the inspired design behind the new UI.<BR>
            <BR>
            What about &quot;Made of Inspriation?&quot;<BR>
            <BR>
            Thoughts?<BR>
            <BR>
            As it stands now, we haven't done anything with the official launch theme so changing it is a zero-cost proposition...<BR>
            <BR>
            <BR>
            <BR>
        </BLOCKQUOTE>
    </BLOCKQUOTE>
</BLOCKQUOTE>
<BLOCKQUOTE TYPE=CITE>
    <BLOCKQUOTE>
        <BLOCKQUOTE>
            --<BR>
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+1

On Fri, Jan 14, 2011 at 10:50 AM, Stormy Peters <stormy@gnome.org> wrote:

> Made to Inspire?
>
> On Fri, Jan 14, 2011 at 11:34 AM, Jason D. Clinton <me@jasonclinton.com>wrote:
>
>> So, as we ramp up our marketing earlier than anticipated (good!) the
>> launch theme that we selected in November 2009 has been bothering me.
>> Mostly, I think, because what was a common meme at the time ("made of fail",
>> "made of awesome") isn't so common now. And so the play on the meme doesn't
>> seem very clever any more.
>>
>> Also, as I am reviewing the list of videos to produce, I am increasingly
>> of the feeling that they need to inspire people by explaining the inspired
>> design behind the new UI.
>>
>> What about "Made of Inspriation?"
>>
>> Thoughts?
>>
>> As it stands now, we haven't done anything with the official launch theme
>> so changing it is a zero-cost proposition...
>>
>>
>> --
>> marketing-list mailing list
>> marketing-list@gnome.org
>> http://mail.gnome.org/mailman/listinfo/marketing-list
>>
>>
>
> --
> marketing-list mailing list
> marketing-list@gnome.org
> http://mail.gnome.org/mailman/listinfo/marketing-list
>
>

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+1<br><br><div class=3D"gmail_quote">On Fri, Jan 14, 2011 at 10:50 AM, Stor=
my Peters <span dir=3D"ltr">&lt;<a href=3D"mailto:stormy@gnome.org">stormy@=
gnome.org</a>&gt;</span> wrote:<br><blockquote class=3D"gmail_quote" style=
=3D"margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex;">

Made to Inspire?<br><br><div class=3D"gmail_quote"><div><div></div><div cla=
ss=3D"h5">On Fri, Jan 14, 2011 at 11:34 AM, Jason D. Clinton <span dir=3D"l=
tr">&lt;<a href=3D"mailto:me@jasonclinton.com" target=3D"_blank">me@jasoncl=
inton.com</a>&gt;</span> wrote:<br>

</div></div><blockquote class=3D"gmail_quote" style=3D"margin:0 0 0 .8ex;bo=
rder-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex"><div><div></div><div class=3D"h5=
">

So, as we ramp up our marketing earlier than anticipated (good!) the launch=
 theme that we selected in November 2009 has been bothering me. Mostly, I t=
hink, because what was a common meme at the time (&quot;made of fail&quot;,=
 &quot;made of awesome&quot;) isn&#39;t so common now. And so the play on t=
he meme doesn&#39;t seem very clever any more.<br>




<br>Also, as I am reviewing the list of videos to produce, I am increasingl=
y of the feeling that they need to inspire people by explaining the inspire=
d design behind the new UI.<br><br>What about &quot;Made of Inspriation?&qu=
ot;<br>




<br>Thoughts?<br><br>As it stands now, we haven&#39;t done anything with th=
e official launch theme so changing it is a zero-cost proposition...<br><br=
>
<br></div></div>--<br>
marketing-list mailing list<br>
<a href=3D"mailto:marketing-list@gnome.org" target=3D"_blank">marketing-lis=
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<br>--<br>
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Subject: Re: Made of Easy -> Made of Inspiration
From: Allan Day <allanpday@gmail.com>
To: Sriram Ramkrishna <sri@ramkrishna.me>
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Sriram Ramkrishna wrote:
> +1
> 
> On Fri, Jan 14, 2011 at 10:50 AM, Stormy Peters <stormy@gnome.org>
> wrote:
>         Made to Inspire?

I really like this as a tag line. Can I just check though: can we give
an account of why it will inspire? We should be able to give a decent
answer if we're asked, and we should probably explain our tag line in
our press materials.

Is it inspiring because it's beautiful? Elegant? Simple?

Best,

Allan

-- 
Blog: http://afaikblog.wordpress.com/
IRC: aday on irc.gnome.org

From nearyd@gmail.com  Sat Jan 15 12:55:56 2011
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Subject: Re: Made of Easy -> Made of Inspiration
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Hi,

Allan Day wrote:
>> On Fri, Jan 14, 2011 at 10:50 AM, Stormy Peters <stormy@gnome.org>
>> wrote:
>>         Made to Inspire?
> 
> I really like this as a tag line. Can I just check though: can we give
> an account of why it will inspire? We should be able to give a decent
> answer if we're asked, and we should probably explain our tag line in
> our press materials.
> 
> Is it inspiring because it's beautiful? Elegant? Simple?

Agree with Allan. Seems like a mushroom slogan (no roots).

Inspire is a little close to Linspire... No fear of confusion? (thinking
out loud - chances are that there isn't).

Cheers,
Dave.

-- 
Dave Neary
GNOME Foundation member
dneary@gnome.org
From olav@vitters.nl  Sat Jan 15 13:08:50 2011
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From: Olav Vitters <olav@vitters.nl>
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Subject: Re: Made of Easy -> Made of Inspiration
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On Fri, Jan 14, 2011 at 11:50:10AM -0700, Stormy Peters wrote:
> Made to Inspire?

Playing devil's advocate:
What is the benefit of an OS if it inspires? Inspires me? Inspires other
OS makers?

-- 
Regards,
Olav
From stormy.gnome@gmail.com  Sat Jan 15 15:51:44 2011
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Subject: Re: Made of Easy -> Made of Inspiration
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--90e6ba53a5a0442a300499e486bd
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People use their computer to do things.

We are making GNOME so that it does not interfere with what you are doing.
What you need is at your finger tips. You are notified, but not interrupted,
by messages. You can switch tasks easily.

It's made to inspire you - at the work you are trying to create. To assist
you in your main creative efforts.

Stormy

On Sat, Jan 15, 2011 at 6:08 AM, Olav Vitters <olav@vitters.nl> wrote:

> On Fri, Jan 14, 2011 at 11:50:10AM -0700, Stormy Peters wrote:
> > Made to Inspire?
>
> Playing devil's advocate:
> What is the benefit of an OS if it inspires? Inspires me? Inspires other
> OS makers?
>
> --
> Regards,
> Olav
> --
> marketing-list mailing list
> marketing-list@gnome.org
> http://mail.gnome.org/mailman/listinfo/marketing-list
>

--90e6ba53a5a0442a300499e486bd
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People use their computer to do things.<br><br>We are making GNOME so that =
it does not interfere with what you are doing. What you need is at your fin=
ger tips. You are notified, but not interrupted, by messages. You can switc=
h tasks easily.<br>

<br>It&#39;s made to inspire you - at the work you are trying to create. To=
 assist you in your main creative efforts. <br><br>Stormy<br><br><div class=
=3D"gmail_quote">On Sat, Jan 15, 2011 at 6:08 AM, Olav Vitters <span dir=3D=
"ltr">&lt;<a href=3D"mailto:olav@vitters.nl">olav@vitters.nl</a>&gt;</span>=
 wrote:<br>

<blockquote class=3D"gmail_quote" style=3D"margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1p=
x #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex;">On Fri, Jan 14, 2011 at 11:50:10AM -0700, S=
tormy Peters wrote:<br>
&gt; Made to Inspire?<br>
<br>
Playing devil&#39;s advocate:<br>
What is the benefit of an OS if it inspires? Inspires me? Inspires other<br=
>
OS makers?<br>
<br>
--<br>
Regards,<br>
Olav<br>
<font color=3D"#888888">--<br>
</font><div><div></div><div class=3D"h5">marketing-list mailing list<br>
<a href=3D"mailto:marketing-list@gnome.org">marketing-list@gnome.org</a><br=
>
<a href=3D"http://mail.gnome.org/mailman/listinfo/marketing-list" target=3D=
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</div></div></blockquote></div><br>

--90e6ba53a5a0442a300499e486bd--
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Yes, I was thinking both about the end user creation angle and the design
inspiration behind the Shell UI and trying to pull those narratives
together. Again, thinking about our current users as the target audience for
the 3.0 launch.

Allan, on IRC, proposed a different launch theme for 3.2 and I agree with
that proposal. By 3.2, I feel that we'll be ready to focus on developers, as
well as end users, again. I'll let Allan cover that when we get to the 3.2
discussion, down the road.

On Sat, Jan 15, 2011 at 09:51, Stormy Peters <stormy@gnome.org> wrote:

> People use their computer to do things.
>
> We are making GNOME so that it does not interfere with what you are doing.
> What you need is at your finger tips. You are notified, but not interrupted,
> by messages. You can switch tasks easily.
>
> It's made to inspire you - at the work you are trying to create. To assist
> you in your main creative efforts.
>
> Stormy
>
>
> On Sat, Jan 15, 2011 at 6:08 AM, Olav Vitters <olav@vitters.nl> wrote:
>
>> On Fri, Jan 14, 2011 at 11:50:10AM -0700, Stormy Peters wrote:
>> > Made to Inspire?
>>
>> Playing devil's advocate:
>> What is the benefit of an OS if it inspires? Inspires me? Inspires other
>> OS makers?
>>
>> --
>> Regards,
>> Olav
>> --
>> marketing-list mailing list
>> marketing-list@gnome.org
>> http://mail.gnome.org/mailman/listinfo/marketing-list
>>
>
>
> --
> marketing-list mailing list
> marketing-list@gnome.org
> http://mail.gnome.org/mailman/listinfo/marketing-list
>
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Yes, I was thinking both about the end user creation angle and the design i=
nspiration behind the Shell UI and trying to pull those narratives together=
. Again, thinking about our current users as the target audience for the 3.=
0 launch.<br>
<br>Allan, on IRC, proposed a different launch theme for 3.2 and I agree wi=
th that proposal. By 3.2, I feel that we&#39;ll be ready to focus on develo=
pers, as well as end users, again. I&#39;ll let Allan cover that when we ge=
t to the 3.2 discussion, down the road.<br>
<br><div class=3D"gmail_quote">On Sat, Jan 15, 2011 at 09:51, Stormy Peters=
 <span dir=3D"ltr">&lt;<a href=3D"mailto:stormy@gnome.org">stormy@gnome.org=
</a>&gt;</span> wrote:<br><blockquote class=3D"gmail_quote" style=3D"margin=
:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex;">
People use their computer to do things.<br><br>We are making GNOME so that =
it does not interfere with what you are doing. What you need is at your fin=
ger tips. You are notified, but not interrupted, by messages. You can switc=
h tasks easily.<br>


<br>It&#39;s made to inspire you - at the work you are trying to create. To=
 assist you in your main creative efforts. <br><font color=3D"#888888"><br>=
Stormy</font><div><div></div><div class=3D"h5"><br><br><div class=3D"gmail_=
quote">
On Sat, Jan 15, 2011 at 6:08 AM, Olav Vitters <span dir=3D"ltr">&lt;<a href=
=3D"mailto:olav@vitters.nl" target=3D"_blank">olav@vitters.nl</a>&gt;</span=
> wrote:<br>

<blockquote class=3D"gmail_quote" style=3D"margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1p=
x #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex">On Fri, Jan 14, 2011 at 11:50:10AM -0700, St=
ormy Peters wrote:<br>
&gt; Made to Inspire?<br>
<br>
Playing devil&#39;s advocate:<br>
What is the benefit of an OS if it inspires? Inspires me? Inspires other<br=
>
OS makers?<br>
<br>
--<br>
Regards,<br>
Olav<br>
<font color=3D"#888888">--<br>
</font><div><div></div><div>marketing-list mailing list<br>
<a href=3D"mailto:marketing-list@gnome.org" target=3D"_blank">marketing-lis=
t@gnome.org</a><br>
<a href=3D"http://mail.gnome.org/mailman/listinfo/marketing-list" target=3D=
"_blank">http://mail.gnome.org/mailman/listinfo/marketing-list</a><br>
</div></div></blockquote></div><br>
</div></div><br>--<br>
marketing-list mailing list<br>
<a href=3D"mailto:marketing-list@gnome.org">marketing-list@gnome.org</a><br=
>
<a href=3D"http://mail.gnome.org/mailman/listinfo/marketing-list" target=3D=
"_blank">http://mail.gnome.org/mailman/listinfo/marketing-list</a><br>
<br></blockquote></div><br>

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Subject: Re: Made of Easy -> Made of Inspiration
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On Sat, Jan 15, 2011 at 04:10, Allan Day <allanpday@gmail.com> wrote:

> Sriram Ramkrishna wrote:
> > +1
> >
> > On Fri, Jan 14, 2011 at 10:50 AM, Stormy Peters <stormy@gnome.org>
> > wrote:
> >         Made to Inspire?
>
> I really like this as a tag line. Can I just check though: can we give
> an account of why it will inspire? We should be able to give a decent
> answer if we're asked, and we should probably explain our tag line in
> our press materials.
>
> Is it inspiring because it's beautiful? Elegant? Simple?
>

I brought this up in one of our side conversations at the Marketing Hackfest
in Oct. 2009 but, basically, we're trying to make computers "not suck." I
was reminded of this this last week when I saw the famous computer interface
designer Matias Duarte say the same thing in an interview on Engadget (WRT
to WebOS and Android 3.0.)

While I'm a fan of sardonic marketing, I don't think we can use "not
suck"-itude as a marketing tag line. ;-)

So there's a couple of more, eh, optimistic ways of looking how it might
inspire. It's elegant and beautiful, sure. It's also well-researched and
thoughtfully designed. It has a strong user interface design narrative from
core group of respected designers. (jimmac, mccan) It's architected for the
present and the future. (Shell team has been carefully thinking about what
GPU features not to use to keep that magic "5 year" window in line but also
planning the UI with touch compatibility even though the hardware and
software stack for touch on Linux isn't really ideal yet.) It has a strong,
articulated roadmap, or vision. (I had hoped that Owen would post the "where
are we going" blog posts by now but I understand that he has many demands
made on him.)

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On Sat, Jan 15, 2011 at 04:10, Allan Day <span dir=3D"ltr">&lt;<a href=3D"m=
ailto:allanpday@gmail.com">allanpday@gmail.com</a>&gt;</span> wrote:<br><di=
v class=3D"gmail_quote"><blockquote class=3D"gmail_quote" style=3D"margin:0=
 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex;">
<div class=3D"im">Sriram Ramkrishna wrote:<br>
&gt; +1<br>
&gt;<br>
&gt; On Fri, Jan 14, 2011 at 10:50 AM, Stormy Peters &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:=
stormy@gnome.org">stormy@gnome.org</a>&gt;<br>
&gt; wrote:<br>
&gt; =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 Made to Inspire?<br>
<br>
</div>I really like this as a tag line. Can I just check though: can we giv=
e<br>
an account of why it will inspire? We should be able to give a decent<br>
answer if we&#39;re asked, and we should probably explain our tag line in<b=
r>
our press materials.<br>
<br>
Is it inspiring because it&#39;s beautiful? Elegant? Simple?<br></blockquot=
e><div><br>I brought this up in one of our side conversations at the Market=
ing Hackfest in Oct. 2009 but, basically, we&#39;re trying to make computer=
s &quot;not suck.&quot; I was reminded of this this last week when I saw th=
e famous computer interface designer Matias Duarte say the same thing in an=
 interview on Engadget (WRT to WebOS and Android 3.0.)<br>
<br>While I&#39;m a fan of sardonic marketing, I don&#39;t think we can use=
 &quot;not suck&quot;-itude as a marketing tag line. ;-)<br><br>So there&#3=
9;s a couple of more, eh, optimistic ways of looking how it might inspire. =
It&#39;s elegant and beautiful, sure. It&#39;s also well-researched and tho=
ughtfully designed. It has a strong user interface design narrative from co=
re group of respected designers. (jimmac, mccan) It&#39;s architected for t=
he present and the future. (Shell team has been carefully thinking about wh=
at GPU features not to use to keep that magic &quot;5 year&quot; window in =
line but also planning the UI with touch compatibility even though the hard=
ware and software stack for touch on Linux isn&#39;t really ideal yet.) It =
has a strong, articulated roadmap, or vision. (I had hoped that Owen would =
post the &quot;where are we going&quot; blog posts by now but I understand =
that he has many demands made on him.)<br>
<br></div></div>

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Olav:

I agree.  I think it would be good to have a well considered list of
things that GNOME does, in fact, inspire before considering doing this
sort of campaign.  If we had a good set of inspirational ideas to
expound, then it could be a great tagline.

There does seem to be plenty of easy inspirational aspects of GNOME:

- Mission includes all the advantages of free software.
- Free accessibility
- Free multimedia
- Good 3rd World Translation Support.
- The ways GNOME benefits humanitarian projects like Sugar and OLPC.
- A Women's Outreach program.
- A fun community of hackergotchis.

Brian


On 01/15/11 07:08 AM, Olav Vitters wrote:
> On Fri, Jan 14, 2011 at 11:50:10AM -0700, Stormy Peters wrote:
>> Made to Inspire?
>
> Playing devil's advocate:
> What is the benefit of an OS if it inspires? Inspires me? Inspires other
> OS makers?
>

From sri@ramkrishna.me  Sun Jan 16 00:34:14 2011
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From: Sriram Ramkrishna <sri@ramkrishna.me>
Date: Sat, 15 Jan 2011 16:33:41 -0800
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GNOME devs (you) inspire me all the time.  I wouldn't discount our community
which is what I was mostly thinking of when I saw the byline.

sri

On Sat, Jan 15, 2011 at 4:00 PM, Brian Cameron <brian.cameron@oracle.com>wrote:

>
> Olav:
>
> I agree.  I think it would be good to have a well considered list of
> things that GNOME does, in fact, inspire before considering doing this
> sort of campaign.  If we had a good set of inspirational ideas to
> expound, then it could be a great tagline.
>
> There does seem to be plenty of easy inspirational aspects of GNOME:
>
> - Mission includes all the advantages of free software.
> - Free accessibility
> - Free multimedia
> - Good 3rd World Translation Support.
> - The ways GNOME benefits humanitarian projects like Sugar and OLPC.
> - A Women's Outreach program.
> - A fun community of hackergotchis.
>
> Brian
>
>
>
> On 01/15/11 07:08 AM, Olav Vitters wrote:
>
>> On Fri, Jan 14, 2011 at 11:50:10AM -0700, Stormy Peters wrote:
>>
>>> Made to Inspire?
>>>
>>
>> Playing devil's advocate:
>> What is the benefit of an OS if it inspires? Inspires me? Inspires other
>> OS makers?
>>
>>
> --
> marketing-list mailing list
> marketing-list@gnome.org
> http://mail.gnome.org/mailman/listinfo/marketing-list
>

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GNOME devs (you) inspire me all the time. =A0I wouldn&#39;t discount our co=
mmunity which is what I was mostly thinking of when I saw the byline.<div><=
br></div><div>sri<br><br><div class=3D"gmail_quote">On Sat, Jan 15, 2011 at=
 4:00 PM, Brian Cameron <span dir=3D"ltr">&lt;<a href=3D"mailto:brian.camer=
on@oracle.com">brian.cameron@oracle.com</a>&gt;</span> wrote:<br>

<blockquote class=3D"gmail_quote" style=3D"margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1p=
x #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex;"><br>
Olav:<br>
<br>
I agree. =A0I think it would be good to have a well considered list of<br>
things that GNOME does, in fact, inspire before considering doing this<br>
sort of campaign. =A0If we had a good set of inspirational ideas to<br>
expound, then it could be a great tagline.<br>
<br>
There does seem to be plenty of easy inspirational aspects of GNOME:<br>
<br>
- Mission includes all the advantages of free software.<br>
- Free accessibility<br>
- Free multimedia<br>
- Good 3rd World Translation Support.<br>
- The ways GNOME benefits humanitarian projects like Sugar and OLPC.<br>
- A Women&#39;s Outreach program.<br>
- A fun community of hackergotchis.<br><font color=3D"#888888">
<br>
Brian</font><div class=3D"im"><br>
<br>
<br>
On 01/15/11 07:08 AM, Olav Vitters wrote:<br>
<blockquote class=3D"gmail_quote" style=3D"margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1p=
x #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex">
On Fri, Jan 14, 2011 at 11:50:10AM -0700, Stormy Peters wrote:<br>
<blockquote class=3D"gmail_quote" style=3D"margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1p=
x #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex">
Made to Inspire?<br>
</blockquote>
<br>
Playing devil&#39;s advocate:<br>
What is the benefit of an OS if it inspires? Inspires me? Inspires other<br=
>
OS makers?<br>
<br>
</blockquote>
<br>
-- <br></div><div><div></div><div class=3D"h5">
marketing-list mailing list<br>
<a href=3D"mailto:marketing-list@gnome.org" target=3D"_blank">marketing-lis=
t@gnome.org</a><br>
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"_blank">http://mail.gnome.org/mailman/listinfo/marketing-list</a><br>
</div></div></blockquote></div><br></div>

--20cf30549a7fe1c46d0499ebd2bd--
From vuntz@gnome.org  Mon Jan 17 08:32:39 2011
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From: Vincent Untz <vuntz@gnome.org>
To: Frederic Muller <fredm@gnome.org>
Subject: Re: GNOME 3.0 Hackfest + 1 day conference for the launch(in Asia)
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Hi,

Le lundi 10 janvier 2011, à 11:13 +0800, Frederic Muller a écrit :
> On 12/14/2010 11:09 PM, Jason D. Clinton wrote:
> >On Tue, Dec 14, 2010 at 07:09, Frederic Muller <fredm@gnome.org
> ><mailto:fredm@gnome.org>> wrote:
> >
> >    I'd like to echo the call we made to the release team here
> >    http://mail.gnome.org/archives/release-team/2010-December/msg00031.html
> >
> >    and get a consensus on which date works better around GNOME 3.0
> >    release (April 06) for each team to have a hackfest. We've been
> >    discussing the plan since September with various members of each
> >    team (to get the 3 teams together in a hackfest before a 1 day
> >    conference to celebrate GNOME 3.0 launch with the public in Asia)
> >    though emails and at the Boston Summit.
> >
> >
> >I think that only the first time frame makes sense from the marketing
> >perspective. I see little reason to conference about marketing after the
> >release date. But we don't *have* to have a marketing hackfest. If other
> >dates work better for other teams, feel free to opt for those.
> >
> Dear Documentation, Marketing and Release teams,
> 
> We've been moving forward with the conference preparation (in
> Bangalore) and we now need to pick the best possible date for
> everyone. We have potentially identified 2 options for the hackfest
> + conference dates, based on the survey and discussions with all the
> party involved: The conference should be on a weekend to get most
> people involved, and the hackfest before the release date (April 6)
> and spreading over 5 days, having 2 optional days for people who
> feel 3 days would be too short. That gives us either:
> 1. Wednesday March 30th to Friday April 1st: hackfest with 2
> optional days on Monday 28th, and Tuesday 29th March
> Saturday 2nd April: GNOME.Asia Summit 2011 (conference day)
> 
> 2. Wednesday April 6th to Friday April 8th: hackfest with 2 optional
> days on Monday 4th, and Tuesday 5th April
> Saturday 9th April: GNOME.Asia Summit 2011 (conference day)
> 
> Of course any feedback on those dates is welcome and hopefully we
> can find a good timing for all teams to prepare and get GNOME 3.0
> out together.

We discussed this at the release team meeting yesterday, and here's our
opinion.

In both cases, I'd think we'd likely want the full week for the
hackfest.

Option 2 (4-8 April) is less useful than option 1 (28-1st), since we
believe the best opportunity is to have r-t & marketing people together
to work on the final details before the release. By doing the hackfest
the week before the release, the release team could do some heavy
testing of the code during the last week, as well as preparing the
release to happen in an optimal way. And at the same time, it could help
the marketing team to clarify messaging when needed.

If option 2 is chosen, then we could work on the release itself, but the
last few days of the hackfest wouldn't be really useful since they're
after the release itself.

In the release team, Andre, Frédéric Péters and myself could possibly go
(assuming sponsorship from the Foundation).

Cheers,

Vincent

-- 
Les gens heureux ne sont pas pressés.
From allanpday@gmail.com  Mon Jan 17 11:21:21 2011
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Subject: www.gnome3.org launch
From: Allan Day <allanpday@gmail.com>
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Hi all,

We're pretty much at the stage where we can launch a preliminary version
of gnome3.org. Ideally, we'd set a launch date and circulate a press
release in advance, so that sites and blogs can break the story as it
happens [1]. I had originally planned to take care of this, but I've
realized that I probably don't have the time to get it done quickly.
This leaves us with a choice: either we delay the site launch further
(sigh), someone else steps up to do the press coverage, or we launch
without it. What do people think?

We also need to make some kind of decision about the tag line before the
site goes live. One option here is to remove 'made of easy' until a
replacement is decided upon.

Best,

Allan

[1] Thanks for the marketing tips, Stormy!
-- 
Blog: http://afaikblog.wordpress.com/
IRC: aday on irc.gnome.org

From me@jasonclinton.com  Mon Jan 17 12:59:59 2011
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--0016e64982d0402adb049a0a5bc2
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On Mon, Jan 17, 2011 at 05:20, Allan Day <allanpday@gmail.com> wrote:

> We're pretty much at the stage where we can launch a preliminary version
> of gnome3.org. Ideally, we'd set a launch date and circulate a press
> release in advance, so that sites and blogs can break the story as it
> happens [1]. I had originally planned to take care of this, but I've
> realized that I probably don't have the time to get it done quickly.
> This leaves us with a choice: either we delay the site launch further
> (sigh), someone else steps up to do the press coverage, or we launch
> without it. What do people think?
>

I'd like to get at least one video up. There is
http://people.gnome.org/~jclinton/gnome3_video2_beta.webm and
http://people.gnome.org/~jclinton/gnome3_video2_beta.ogv but it needs to be
re-spun for the latest look and feel. I could do that this evening (baring
solving some Rawhide problems).



> We also need to make some kind of decision about the tag line before the
> site goes live. One option here is to remove 'made of easy' until a
> replacement is decided upon.
>

 Sounds like there's no real opposition to Stormy's "Made to Inspire" so
let's do that.

--0016e64982d0402adb049a0a5bc2
Content-Type: text/html; charset=UTF-8
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

<div class=3D"gmail_quote">On Mon, Jan 17, 2011 at 05:20, Allan Day <span d=
ir=3D"ltr">&lt;<a href=3D"mailto:allanpday@gmail.com">allanpday@gmail.com</=
a>&gt;</span> wrote:<br><blockquote class=3D"gmail_quote" style=3D"margin:0=
 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex;">
We&#39;re pretty much at the stage where we can launch a preliminary versio=
n<br>
of <a href=3D"http://gnome3.org" target=3D"_blank">gnome3.org</a>. Ideally,=
 we&#39;d set a launch date and circulate a press<br>
release in advance, so that sites and blogs can break the story as it<br>
happens [1]. I had originally planned to take care of this, but I&#39;ve<br=
>
realized that I probably don&#39;t have the time to get it done quickly.<br=
>
This leaves us with a choice: either we delay the site launch further<br>
(sigh), someone else steps up to do the press coverage, or we launch<br>
without it. What do people think?<br></blockquote><div><br>I&#39;d like to =
get at least one video up. There is <a href=3D"http://people.gnome.org/~jcl=
inton/gnome3_video2_beta.webm">http://people.gnome.org/~jclinton/gnome3_vid=
eo2_beta.webm</a> and <a href=3D"http://people.gnome.org/~jclinton/gnome3_v=
ideo2_beta.ogv">http://people.gnome.org/~jclinton/gnome3_video2_beta.ogv</a=
> but it needs to be re-spun for the latest look and feel. I could do that =
this evening (baring solving some Rawhide problems).<br>
<br>=C2=A0</div><blockquote class=3D"gmail_quote" style=3D"margin: 0pt 0pt =
0pt 0.8ex; border-left: 1px solid rgb(204, 204, 204); padding-left: 1ex;">

We also need to make some kind of decision about the tag line before the<br=
>
site goes live. One option here is to remove &#39;made of easy&#39; until a=
<br>
replacement is decided upon.<br></blockquote><div><br>=C2=A0Sounds like the=
re&#39;s no real opposition to Stormy&#39;s &quot;Made to Inspire&quot; so =
let&#39;s do that.<br><br></div></div>

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Sender: Dave Neary <nearyd@gmail.com>
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Hi Jason

Jason D. Clinton wrote:
>  Sounds like there's no real opposition to Stormy's "Made to Inspire" so
> let's do that.

Just for my benefit, can you tell me what constitutes "real" opposition?
Because obviously my remarks don't count...

Cheers,
Dave.

-- 
Dave Neary
GNOME Foundation member
dneary@gnome.org
From hadess@hadess.net  Mon Jan 17 17:29:17 2011
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Subject: Re: Q4 Updates Due
From: Bastien Nocera <hadess@hadess.net>
To: Dave Neary <dneary@gnome.org>
Date: Mon, 17 Jan 2011 17:29:03 +0000
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On Thu, 2011-01-13 at 10:20 +0100, Dave Neary wrote:
> Hi,
> 
> Since the main news from the mobile group will be the announcement of
> the Hildon work, perhaps Bastien might be the best person to give a
> quick update?

I'd be happy to do so. What exactly do you expect me to write here? I'll
be making the choice of bidder public as soon as they've contacted me
back.

Cheers

From nearyd@gmail.com  Mon Jan 17 17:53:47 2011
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To: Bastien Nocera <hadess@hadess.net>
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Hi,

Bastien Nocera wrote:
> I'd be happy to do so. What exactly do you expect me to write here? I'll
> be making the choice of bidder public as soon as they've contacted me
> back.

Perhaps just that? "We selected the successful candidate for the Maemo &
GNOME maintenance work and there will be an announcement soon. They will
be doing X, Y and Z over the next few months, and input, guidance and
patches from community members interested are welcome"

Cheers,
Dave.

-- 
Dave Neary
GNOME Foundation member
dneary@gnome.org
From me@jasonclinton.com  Mon Jan 17 18:11:51 2011
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s/real/strong/

Sorry, figure of speech.
 On Jan 17, 2011 8:49 AM, "Dave Neary" <dneary@gnome.org> wrote:
> Hi Jason
>
> Jason D. Clinton wrote:
>> Sounds like there's no real opposition to Stormy's "Made to Inspire" so
>> let's do that.
>
> Just for my benefit, can you tell me what constitutes "real" opposition?
> Because obviously my remarks don't count...
>
> Cheers,
> Dave.
>
> --
> Dave Neary
> GNOME Foundation member
> dneary@gnome.org

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<p>s/real/strong/</p>
<p>Sorry, figure of speech.<br>
</p>
<div class="gmail_quote">On Jan 17, 2011 8:49 AM, &quot;Dave Neary&quot; &lt;<a href="mailto:dneary@gnome.org">dneary@gnome.org</a>&gt; wrote:<br type="attribution">&gt; Hi Jason<br>&gt; <br>&gt; Jason D. Clinton wrote:<br>
&gt;&gt;  Sounds like there&#39;s no real opposition to Stormy&#39;s &quot;Made to Inspire&quot; so<br>&gt;&gt; let&#39;s do that.<br>&gt; <br>&gt; Just for my benefit, can you tell me what constitutes &quot;real&quot; opposition?<br>
&gt; Because obviously my remarks don&#39;t count...<br>&gt; <br>&gt; Cheers,<br>&gt; Dave.<br>&gt; <br>&gt; -- <br>&gt; Dave Neary<br>&gt; GNOME Foundation member<br>&gt; <a href="mailto:dneary@gnome.org">dneary@gnome.org</a><br>
</div>

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From fredm@gnome.org  Tue Jan 18 01:25:35 2011
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Subject: Re: GNOME 3.0 Hackfest + 1 day conference for the launch(in Asia)
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On 01/17/2011 04:32 PM, Vincent Untz wrote:
> Hi,
>
> Le lundi 10 janvier 2011, à 11:13 +0800, Frederic Muller a écrit :
>> On 12/14/2010 11:09 PM, Jason D. Clinton wrote:
>>> On Tue, Dec 14, 2010 at 07:09, Frederic Muller<fredm@gnome.org
>>> <mailto:fredm@gnome.org>>  wrote:
>>>
>>>     I'd like to echo the call we made to the release team here
>>>     http://mail.gnome.org/archives/release-team/2010-December/msg00031.html
>>>
>>>     and get a consensus on which date works better around GNOME 3.0
>>>     release (April 06) for each team to have a hackfest. We've been
>>>     discussing the plan since September with various members of each
>>>     team (to get the 3 teams together in a hackfest before a 1 day
>>>     conference to celebrate GNOME 3.0 launch with the public in Asia)
>>>     though emails and at the Boston Summit.
>>>
>>>
>>> I think that only the first time frame makes sense from the marketing
>>> perspective. I see little reason to conference about marketing after the
>>> release date. But we don't *have* to have a marketing hackfest. If other
>>> dates work better for other teams, feel free to opt for those.
>>>
>> Dear Documentation, Marketing and Release teams,
>>
>> We've been moving forward with the conference preparation (in
>> Bangalore) and we now need to pick the best possible date for
>> everyone. We have potentially identified 2 options for the hackfest
>> + conference dates, based on the survey and discussions with all the
>> party involved: The conference should be on a weekend to get most
>> people involved, and the hackfest before the release date (April 6)
>> and spreading over 5 days, having 2 optional days for people who
>> feel 3 days would be too short. That gives us either:
>> 1. Wednesday March 30th to Friday April 1st: hackfest with 2
>> optional days on Monday 28th, and Tuesday 29th March
>> Saturday 2nd April: GNOME.Asia Summit 2011 (conference day)
>>
>> 2. Wednesday April 6th to Friday April 8th: hackfest with 2 optional
>> days on Monday 4th, and Tuesday 5th April
>> Saturday 9th April: GNOME.Asia Summit 2011 (conference day)
>>
>> Of course any feedback on those dates is welcome and hopefully we
>> can find a good timing for all teams to prepare and get GNOME 3.0
>> out together.
>
> We discussed this at the release team meeting yesterday, and here's our
> opinion.
>
> In both cases, I'd think we'd likely want the full week for the
> hackfest.
>
> Option 2 (4-8 April) is less useful than option 1 (28-1st), since we
> believe the best opportunity is to have r-t&  marketing people together
> to work on the final details before the release. By doing the hackfest
> the week before the release, the release team could do some heavy
> testing of the code during the last week, as well as preparing the
> release to happen in an optimal way. And at the same time, it could help
> the marketing team to clarify messaging when needed.
>
> If option 2 is chosen, then we could work on the release itself, but the
> last few days of the hackfest wouldn't be really useful since they're
> after the release itself.
>
> In the release team, Andre, Frédéric Péters and myself could possibly go
> (assuming sponsorship from the Foundation).
>
> Cheers,
>
> Vincent
>
Dear Vincent,

Thank you very much for the response and commitment from your team to 
support the event. We will definitely target for the 1st option unless 
the local team comes up with an unreconcilable issue. We're actually IRC 
meeting today (Tuesday 18th) and should be able to confirm the date and 
get back to everyone.

Thank you.

Fred
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Date: Tue, 18 Jan 2011 09:25:20 +0800
From: Frederic Muller <fredm@gnome.org>
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Subject: Re: GNOME 3.0 Hackfest + 1 day conference for the launch(in Asia)
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On 01/17/2011 04:32 PM, Vincent Untz wrote:
> Hi,
>
> Le lundi 10 janvier 2011, à 11:13 +0800, Frederic Muller a écrit :
>> On 12/14/2010 11:09 PM, Jason D. Clinton wrote:
>>> On Tue, Dec 14, 2010 at 07:09, Frederic Muller<fredm@gnome.org
>>> <mailto:fredm@gnome.org>>  wrote:
>>>
>>>     I'd like to echo the call we made to the release team here
>>>     http://mail.gnome.org/archives/release-team/2010-December/msg00031.html
>>>
>>>     and get a consensus on which date works better around GNOME 3.0
>>>     release (April 06) for each team to have a hackfest. We've been
>>>     discussing the plan since September with various members of each
>>>     team (to get the 3 teams together in a hackfest before a 1 day
>>>     conference to celebrate GNOME 3.0 launch with the public in Asia)
>>>     though emails and at the Boston Summit.
>>>
>>>
>>> I think that only the first time frame makes sense from the marketing
>>> perspective. I see little reason to conference about marketing after the
>>> release date. But we don't *have* to have a marketing hackfest. If other
>>> dates work better for other teams, feel free to opt for those.
>>>
>> Dear Documentation, Marketing and Release teams,
>>
>> We've been moving forward with the conference preparation (in
>> Bangalore) and we now need to pick the best possible date for
>> everyone. We have potentially identified 2 options for the hackfest
>> + conference dates, based on the survey and discussions with all the
>> party involved: The conference should be on a weekend to get most
>> people involved, and the hackfest before the release date (April 6)
>> and spreading over 5 days, having 2 optional days for people who
>> feel 3 days would be too short. That gives us either:
>> 1. Wednesday March 30th to Friday April 1st: hackfest with 2
>> optional days on Monday 28th, and Tuesday 29th March
>> Saturday 2nd April: GNOME.Asia Summit 2011 (conference day)
>>
>> 2. Wednesday April 6th to Friday April 8th: hackfest with 2 optional
>> days on Monday 4th, and Tuesday 5th April
>> Saturday 9th April: GNOME.Asia Summit 2011 (conference day)
>>
>> Of course any feedback on those dates is welcome and hopefully we
>> can find a good timing for all teams to prepare and get GNOME 3.0
>> out together.
>
> We discussed this at the release team meeting yesterday, and here's our
> opinion.
>
> In both cases, I'd think we'd likely want the full week for the
> hackfest.
>
> Option 2 (4-8 April) is less useful than option 1 (28-1st), since we
> believe the best opportunity is to have r-t&  marketing people together
> to work on the final details before the release. By doing the hackfest
> the week before the release, the release team could do some heavy
> testing of the code during the last week, as well as preparing the
> release to happen in an optimal way. And at the same time, it could help
> the marketing team to clarify messaging when needed.
>
> If option 2 is chosen, then we could work on the release itself, but the
> last few days of the hackfest wouldn't be really useful since they're
> after the release itself.
>
> In the release team, Andre, Frédéric Péters and myself could possibly go
> (assuming sponsorship from the Foundation).
>
> Cheers,
>
> Vincent
>
Dear Vincent,

Thank you very much for the response and commitment from your team to 
support the event. We will definitely target for the 1st option unless 
the local team comes up with an unreconcilable issue. We're actually IRC 
meeting today (Tuesday 18th) and should be able to confirm the date and 
get back to everyone.

Thank you.

Fred
From fredm@gnome.org  Tue Jan 18 02:00:13 2011
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Date: Tue, 18 Jan 2011 09:59:32 +0800
From: Frederic Muller <fredm@gnome.org>
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Subject: Goodies for GNOME 3.0 launch parties
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Dear marketing,

Last foundation IRC meeting we touched on the Foundation approval of 
some budget for goodies to teams that will celebrate GNOME 3.0 on the 
release date.

How shall we announce this (and where)?

In fact I am also interested in a more generic question which is how do 
we usually use our channels to announce stuff? I tried to motivate 
people with the T-shirt contest but didn't receive much feedback except 
from the people I contacted personally. How do we actually usually 
promote stuff outside of the GNOME community? (I thought GUGs would be a 
good way, but they seem a little bit sleepy ;) ).

Thanks a lot for your feedback.

Fred
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On 01/12/2011 11:17 PM, Frederic Muller wrote:
> On 01/12/2011 09:15 PM, Andreas Nilsson wrote:
>> On 01/12/2011 01:45 PM, Andreas Nilsson wrote:
>>>
>>> http://www.desktopsummit.org/sponsors/DesktopSummit2011_SponsorshipOpportunities.pdf
>>>
>>>
>>> I did that in Scribus on GNOME 2.30 (Ubuntu 10.10).
>>>
>> Oh, and in case I get hit by a bus:
>> http://www.andreasn.se/diverse/temp/desktop-summit-folder.zip
>> (is there a better place I should upload this too?)
>> - Andreas
>
> After further checking and a discussion on #marketing with Andreas it
> appears the original pdf document included in the zip file doesn't have
> that MAC OS X stamping. There was apparently some words being cut off on
> page 8 and someone re-edited the sla file and regenerated the pdf
> probably on a MAC.
>
> What should we do now then? I don't mind redoing the changes (I'll check
> if there isn't anything else) and the export, but where should I send it
> to? Or does it make more sense for someone else to do that?
>
> Thank you.
>
> Fred

Did the modification on page 8, exported to a new pdf file under GNOME, 
compared with current document (didn't find any difference) and uploaded 
the new pdf for whoever can do the replacement on desktopsummit.org here:
http://fred.dao2.com/sponsors.pdf

Thanks

Fred
ps: I however noticed 2 errors when exporting related to the images dpi 
being too low and my document is 1.2MB while the current one is 3.9MB
From me@jasonclinton.com  Tue Jan 18 04:27:49 2011
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On Mon, Jan 17, 2011 at 06:59, Jason D. Clinton <me@jasonclinton.com> wrote:

> I'd like to get at least one video up. There is
> http://people.gnome.org/~jclinton/gnome3_video2_beta.webm<http://people.gnome.org/%7Ejclinton/gnome3_video2_beta.webm>and
> http://people.gnome.org/~jclinton/gnome3_video2_beta.ogv<http://people.gnome.org/%7Ejclinton/gnome3_video2_beta.ogv>but it needs to be re-spun for the latest look and feel. I could do that
> this evening (baring solving some Rawhide problems).
>

The re-spin isn't going to happen tonight. I just finished beating ffmpeg on
rawhide in to submission and will have to build kdenlive and mlt from source
tomorrow because the rpmfusion packages are 9 months out-of-date.

So, shooting for tomorrow evening.

--0016e6d64b916ed12c049a1751b0
Content-Type: text/html; charset=UTF-8
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<div class=3D"gmail_quote">On Mon, Jan 17, 2011 at 06:59, Jason D. Clinton =
<span dir=3D"ltr">&lt;<a href=3D"mailto:me@jasonclinton.com">me@jasonclinto=
n.com</a>&gt;</span> wrote:<br><blockquote class=3D"gmail_quote" style=3D"m=
argin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex;">
<div class=3D"gmail_quote"><div>I&#39;d like to get at least one video up. =
There is <a href=3D"http://people.gnome.org/%7Ejclinton/gnome3_video2_beta.=
webm" target=3D"_blank">http://people.gnome.org/~jclinton/gnome3_video2_bet=
a.webm</a> and <a href=3D"http://people.gnome.org/%7Ejclinton/gnome3_video2=
_beta.ogv" target=3D"_blank">http://people.gnome.org/~jclinton/gnome3_video=
2_beta.ogv</a> but it needs to be re-spun for the latest look and feel. I c=
ould do that this evening (baring solving some Rawhide problems).<br>
</div></div></blockquote><div><br>The re-spin isn&#39;t going to happen ton=
ight. I just finished=20
beating ffmpeg on rawhide in to submission and will have to build kdenlive =
and mlt=20
from source tomorrow because the rpmfusion packages are 9 months out-of-dat=
e.<br>
<br>
So, shooting for tomorrow evening.<br><br></div></div>

--0016e6d64b916ed12c049a1751b0--
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Hi,

Jason D. Clinton wrote:
> s/real/strong/

Well, I think the by-line is weak, and I'm not a particular fan of "Made
of Easy" either. But the by-line is not the important thing. The
important thing is: What does this new GNOME enable me to do? How will
my computer experience be better?

If you can come up with a by-line which conveys or evokes some answer to
that, I'm all ears. "Made of per^H^H^Hinspiration" or "Made to inspire"
don't really do that for me.


Cheers,
Dave.

-- 
Dave Neary
GNOME Foundation member
dneary@gnome.org
From allanpday@gmail.com  Tue Jan 18 14:18:53 2011
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Subject: Re: Goodies for GNOME 3.0 launch parties
From: Allan Day <allanpday@gmail.com>
To: Frederic Muller <fredm@gnome.org>
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Frederic Muller wrote:
> Dear marketing,
> 
> Last foundation IRC meeting we touched on the Foundation approval of 
> some budget for goodies to teams that will celebrate GNOME 3.0 on the 
> release date.

Great stuff! I'm looking forward to hearing the details of this (as well
as trying to bag me some goodies)!

> How shall we announce this (and where)?

Planet GNOME, Identica, Twitter, www.gnome.org... any others? (I'm
interested in this too.)

> In fact I am also interested in a more generic question which is how do 
> we usually use our channels to announce stuff? I tried to motivate 
> people with the T-shirt contest but didn't receive much feedback except 
> from the people I contacted personally. How do we actually usually 
> promote stuff outside of the GNOME community? (I thought GUGs would be a 
> good way, but they seem a little bit sleepy ;) ).

Good question! I've been thinking for a while that GNOME needs an
outward facing media channel. The Planet and GNOME News are primarily
places where we talk to ourselves. www.gnome.org is outward facing and
has a news section, but it isn't primarily a news site (you certainly
can't subscribe to it)... A blog or news site where we talk to our
partners and to GNOME enthusiasts would be a great way to promote GNOME
and to keep people in tune with where the project is going. It'd need
volunteers if it were to become an enduring reality, of course...

Allan
-- 
Blog: http://afaikblog.wordpress.com/
IRC: aday on irc.gnome.org

From fredm@gnome.org  Tue Jan 18 14:23:35 2011
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On 01/18/2011 05:56 PM, Dave Neary wrote:
> Hi,
>
> Jason D. Clinton wrote:
>> s/real/strong/
>
> Well, I think the by-line is weak, and I'm not a particular fan of "Made
> of Easy" either. But the by-line is not the important thing. The
> important thing is: What does this new GNOME enable me to do? How will
> my computer experience be better?
>
> If you can come up with a by-line which conveys or evokes some answer to
> that, I'm all ears. "Made of per^H^H^Hinspiration" or "Made to inspire"
> don't really do that for me.
>
>
> Cheers,
> Dave.
>

I kind of feel the same as Dave, but having nothing better to say I have 
kept quiet. I mean it's always easy to dislike something (for good or 
bad reasons), coming up with better however is another story.

Fred
From andreasn.pixel@gmail.com  Tue Jan 18 14:49:10 2011
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On 01/18/2011 10:56 AM, Dave Neary wrote:
> Hi,
>
> Jason D. Clinton wrote:
>> s/real/strong/
> Well, I think the by-line is weak, and I'm not a particular fan of "Made
> of Easy" either. But the by-line is not the important thing. The
> important thing is: What does this new GNOME enable me to do? How will
> my computer experience be better?
>
> If you can come up with a by-line which conveys or evokes some answer to
> that, I'm all ears. "Made of per^H^H^Hinspiration" or "Made to inspire"
> don't really do that for me.
Is it just me, or are we constantly coming up with reasons not to ship 
the website now? :)
Whoever comes up with a better tagline (or want us to get rid of a 
tagline alltogether) can edit the image in the repository.
I want to ship.
- Andreas
From stormy.gnome@gmail.com  Tue Jan 18 15:42:07 2011
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Subject: Re: Goodies for GNOME 3.0 launch parties
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On Tue, Jan 18, 2011 at 7:18 AM, Allan Day <allanpday@gmail.com> wrote:

>
> > How shall we announce this (and where)?
>
> Planet GNOME, Identica, Twitter, www.gnome.org... any others? (I'm
> interested in this too.)
>

Facebook too.

>
> > In fact I am also interested in a more generic question which is how do
> > we usually use our channels to announce stuff? I tried to motivate
> > people with the T-shirt contest but didn't receive much feedback except
> > from the people I contacted personally. How do we actually usually
> > promote stuff outside of the GNOME community? (I thought GUGs would be a
> > good way, but they seem a little bit sleepy ;) ).
>
> Good question! I've been thinking for a while that GNOME needs an
> outward facing media channel. The Planet and GNOME News are primarily
> places where we talk to ourselves. www.gnome.org is outward facing and
> has a news section, but it isn't primarily a news site (you certainly
> can't subscribe to it)... A blog or news site where we talk to our
> partners and to GNOME enthusiasts would be a great way to promote GNOME
> and to keep people in tune with where the project is going. It'd need
> volunteers if it were to become an enduring reality, of course...
>
> There are people that have been helping with Facebook and Twitter.

I think a blog would be hard but perhaps a blog that gives excerpts and
points to other articles. That way someone could follow Planet GNOME, GNOME
News and other channels, make a judgement call on what would be interesting
to our users and add them to the feed.

Stormy

--20cf30433d3c62f913049a20bdeb
Content-Type: text/html; charset=ISO-8859-1
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<br><br><div class=3D"gmail_quote">On Tue, Jan 18, 2011 at 7:18 AM, Allan D=
ay <span dir=3D"ltr">&lt;<a href=3D"mailto:allanpday@gmail.com">allanpday@g=
mail.com</a>&gt;</span> wrote:<br><blockquote class=3D"gmail_quote" style=
=3D"margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex;">

<br><div class=3D"im">
&gt; How shall we announce this (and where)?<br>
<br>
</div>Planet GNOME, Identica, Twitter, www.gnome.org... any others? (I&#39;=
m<br>
interested in this too.)<br></blockquote><div><br>Facebook too. <br></div><=
blockquote class=3D"gmail_quote" style=3D"margin: 0pt 0pt 0pt 0.8ex; border=
-left: 1px solid rgb(204, 204, 204); padding-left: 1ex;">
<div class=3D"im"><br>
&gt; In fact I am also interested in a more generic question which is how d=
o<br>
&gt; we usually use our channels to announce stuff? I tried to motivate<br>
&gt; people with the T-shirt contest but didn&#39;t receive much feedback e=
xcept<br>
&gt; from the people I contacted personally. How do we actually usually<br>
&gt; promote stuff outside of the GNOME community? (I thought GUGs would be=
 a<br>
&gt; good way, but they seem a little bit sleepy ;) ).<br>
<br>
</div>Good question! I&#39;ve been thinking for a while that GNOME needs an=
<br>
outward facing media channel. The Planet and GNOME News are primarily<br>
places where we talk to ourselves. <a href=3D"http://www.gnome.org" target=
=3D"_blank">www.gnome.org</a> is outward facing and<br>
has a news section, but it isn&#39;t primarily a news site (you certainly<b=
r>
can&#39;t subscribe to it)... A blog or news site where we talk to our<br>
partners and to GNOME enthusiasts would be a great way to promote GNOME<br>
and to keep people in tune with where the project is going. It&#39;d need<b=
r>
volunteers if it were to become an enduring reality, of course...<br><br></=
blockquote><div>There are people that have been helping with Facebook and T=
witter. <br><br>I think a blog would be hard but perhaps a blog that gives =
excerpts and points to other articles. That way someone could follow Planet=
 GNOME, GNOME News and other channels, make a judgement call on what would =
be interesting to our users and add them to the feed.<br>

<br>Stormy <br></div></div>

--20cf30433d3c62f913049a20bdeb--
From fredm@gnome.org  Tue Jan 18 15:54:24 2011
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Date: Tue, 18 Jan 2011 23:54:02 +0800
From: Frederic Muller <fredm@gnome.org>
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Subject: Re: Goodies for GNOME 3.0 launch parties
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On 01/18/2011 10:18 PM, Allan Day wrote:
> Frederic Muller wrote:
>> Dear marketing,
>>
>> Last foundation IRC meeting we touched on the Foundation approval of
>> some budget for goodies to teams that will celebrate GNOME 3.0 on the
>> release date.
>
> Great stuff! I'm looking forward to hearing the details of this (as well
> as trying to bag me some goodies)!
You can find the planing document here: 
http://live.gnome.org/ThreePointZero/EventSupport
>
>> How shall we announce this (and where)?
>
> Planet GNOME, Identica, Twitter, www.gnome.org... any others? (I'm
> interested in this too.)
>
>> In fact I am also interested in a more generic question which is how do
>> we usually use our channels to announce stuff? I tried to motivate
>> people with the T-shirt contest but didn't receive much feedback except
>> from the people I contacted personally. How do we actually usually
>> promote stuff outside of the GNOME community? (I thought GUGs would be a
>> good way, but they seem a little bit sleepy ;) ).
>
> Good question! I've been thinking for a while that GNOME needs an
> outward facing media channel. The Planet and GNOME News are primarily
> places where we talk to ourselves. www.gnome.org is outward facing and
> has a news section, but it isn't primarily a news site (you certainly
> can't subscribe to it)... A blog or news site where we talk to our
> partners and to GNOME enthusiasts would be a great way to promote GNOME
> and to keep people in tune with where the project is going. It'd need
> volunteers if it were to become an enduring reality, of course...
>
> Allan

Sorry I wasn't clear. In fact I was wondering if we had a list of 
contacts (as in LUGs, news sites, community sites, distributions sites) 
to who we were in touch with and pushing information to?

as well as a 'tracking mechanism' to know for each communication item 
who had been contacted and not?

If not I definitely don't mind starting a wiki page (though how safe is 
it to put a list of contacts?) and start to put the people I "spam" with 
my current GNOME information. It's probably best that the point of 
contact to the group we know well remains the same, but that at each 
'communication item' we coordinate and spread the news outside of our 
gnome circle.

Note that I am not sure a wiki page is the best way so please feel free 
to comment on the idea (if it's not already implemented in some ways).

Thanks.

Fred
From lmedinas@gmail.com  Tue Jan 18 15:56:54 2011
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Subject: Re: Goodies for GNOME 3.0 launch parties
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Ter, 2011-01-18 às 08:41 -0700, Stormy Peters escreveu:
> 
> 
> On Tue, Jan 18, 2011 at 7:18 AM, Allan Day <allanpday@gmail.com>
> wrote:
>         
>         > How shall we announce this (and where)?
>         
>         
>         Planet GNOME, Identica, Twitter, www.gnome.org... any others?
>         (I'm
>         interested in this too.)
> 
> Facebook too. 
> 

I will announce on FB as usual... and also upload some current
screenshots. Maybe i can add Jason video there too.
We have lot's of marketing to add to FB now.

Cheers
Luis


From hadess@hadess.net  Tue Jan 18 16:45:29 2011
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On Mon, 2011-01-17 at 18:53 +0100, Dave Neary wrote:
> Hi,
> 
> Bastien Nocera wrote:
> > I'd be happy to do so. What exactly do you expect me to write here? I'll
> > be making the choice of bidder public as soon as they've contacted me
> > back.
> 
> Perhaps just that? "We selected the successful candidate for the Maemo &
> GNOME maintenance work and there will be an announcement soon. They will
> be doing X, Y and Z over the next few months, and input, guidance and
> patches from community members interested are welcome"

"
The GNOME Foundation Board selected Igalia as providers for the GTK
+/MeeGo handset integration work. Carlos García Campos and Claudio
Saavedra will be working from 31st January on integrating GTK+ upstream
as a viable toolkit for use on the MeeGo Handset platform. The full
announcement is available on the GNOME Foundation blog
<http://blogs.gnome.org/foundation/2011/01/17/gtk-meego-handset-bidders-selected/>
"

Good?

Cheers

From sri@ramkrishna.me  Tue Jan 18 17:09:37 2011
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From: Sriram Ramkrishna <sri@ramkrishna.me>
Date: Tue, 18 Jan 2011 09:09:03 -0800
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On Tue, Jan 18, 2011 at 1:56 AM, Dave Neary <dneary@gnome.org> wrote:

> Hi,
>
> Jason D. Clinton wrote:
> > s/real/strong/
>
> Well, I think the by-line is weak, and I'm not a particular fan of "Made
> of Easy" either. But the by-line is not the important thing. The
> important thing is: What does this new GNOME enable me to do? How will
> my computer experience be better?
>
> If you can come up with a by-line which conveys or evokes some answer to
> that, I'm all ears. "Made of per^H^H^Hinspiration" or "Made to inspire"
> don't really do that for me.
>
>
Since I like the inspirational part of it, how about:

GNOME-3 - The inspirational desktop for the rest of us

GNOME-3 - The utilitarian desktop for the rest of us

GNOME-3 - Where utility and inspiration merge

GNOME-3 - Free, utilitarian, inspiring

GNOME-3 - Free, simple, elegant - the desktop for the rest of us

GNOME-3 - Designed for utility, elegance, and freedom

GNOME-3 - So easy a caveman can do it

heh

sri

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<br><br><div class=3D"gmail_quote">On Tue, Jan 18, 2011 at 1:56 AM, Dave Ne=
ary <span dir=3D"ltr">&lt;<a href=3D"mailto:dneary@gnome.org">dneary@gnome.=
org</a>&gt;</span> wrote:<br><blockquote class=3D"gmail_quote" style=3D"mar=
gin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex;">

Hi,<br>
<br>
Jason D. Clinton wrote:<br>
&gt; s/real/strong/<br>
<br>
Well, I think the by-line is weak, and I&#39;m not a particular fan of &quo=
t;Made<br>
of Easy&quot; either. But the by-line is not the important thing. The<br>
important thing is: What does this new GNOME enable me to do? How will<br>
my computer experience be better?<br>
<br>
If you can come up with a by-line which conveys or evokes some answer to<br=
>
that, I&#39;m all ears. &quot;Made of per^H^H^Hinspiration&quot; or &quot;M=
ade to inspire&quot;<br>
don&#39;t really do that for me.<br>
<div class=3D"im"><br></div></blockquote><div><br>Since I like the inspirat=
ional part of it, how about:<br><br>GNOME-3 - The inspirational desktop for=
 the rest of us<br><br>GNOME-3 - The utilitarian desktop for the rest of us=
<br>

<br>GNOME-3 - Where utility and inspiration merge<br><br>GNOME-3 - Free, ut=
ilitarian, inspiring<br><br>GNOME-3 - Free, simple, elegant - the desktop f=
or the rest of us<br><br>GNOME-3 - Designed for utility, elegance, and free=
dom<br>

<br>GNOME-3 - So easy a caveman can do it<br><br>heh<br><br>sri <br></div><=
/div>

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From sri@ramkrishna.me  Tue Jan 18 17:27:17 2011
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From: Sriram Ramkrishna <sri@ramkrishna.me>
Date: Tue, 18 Jan 2011 09:26:42 -0800
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On Tue, Jan 18, 2011 at 6:18 AM, Allan Day <allanpday@gmail.com> wrote:

> Frederic Muller wrote:
> > Dear marketing,
> >
> > Last foundation IRC meeting we touched on the Foundation approval of
> > some budget for goodies to teams that will celebrate GNOME 3.0 on the
> > release date.
>
> Great stuff! I'm looking forward to hearing the details of this (as well
> as trying to bag me some goodies)!
>

Yeah, same here.  It is possible I could throw one in Portland. This is
after all open source central here.  I need to figure out how to do the
logistics of it.  I should probably see if I can get some help with
organizing from the local Linux community.


>
> > How shall we announce this (and where)?
>
> Planet GNOME, Identica, Twitter, www.gnome.org... any others? (I'm
> interested in this too.)
>

Someone already mentioned facebook.  But there seems to be one or two
others.  What about Orkut?  I believe that is still fairly popular in latin
countries.


> > In fact I am also interested in a more generic question which is how do
> > we usually use our channels to announce stuff? I tried to motivate
> > people with the T-shirt contest but didn't receive much feedback except
> > from the people I contacted personally. How do we actually usually
> > promote stuff outside of the GNOME community? (I thought GUGs would be a
> > good way, but they seem a little bit sleepy ;) ).
>
> Good question! I've been thinking for a while that GNOME needs an
> outward facing media channel. The Planet and GNOME News are primarily
>

Well, GNOME Journal had the design of doing that since the articles were
geared for both inside and outside of our community.  I'm not quite sure
what a media channel like that is supposed to look like?  Sure, Planet and
GNOME assume a particular set of knowlede/idioms and what not.  Would you
have enough content to constantly use that channel that isn't release
information on GNOME modules and what not?  I think that's what you're
trying to say here, right?



> places where we talk to ourselves. www.gnome.org is outward facing and
> has a news section, but it isn't primarily a news site (you certainly
> can't subscribe to it)... A blog or news site where we talk to our
> partners and to GNOME enthusiasts would be a great way to promote GNOME
> and to keep people in tune with where the project is going. It'd need
> volunteers if it were to become an enduring reality, of course...
>

By partners I assume you mean distros like Ubuntu and Fedora?   Yes, it will
require quite a bit of work.  Generating content is a lot of work with a set
of volunteers.  Especially when apps for instance tend to be similar in
scope.  You have a lot of mail clients, a lot of panel replacements and so
forth they aren't particularly interesting for a working family, a family
with kids and so forth.  The apps tend to reflect a demographic in GNOME
that isn't quite in tune with families.  Perhaps I'm just being cynical.  As
I grow older I'm not as enamored of panel replacements or funky widgets like
I used to be.  I am interested in how GNOME will make my life easier by
generating recipes for dinner, providing me with a list of news in the
morning to read, keeping in touch with relatives and friends, reminding me
that I have a doctors appt today (I really do have one), or the latest
sports scores in the teams I'm interested in.  I want those apps.  If you
want to market to GNOME enthusiasts, it's not just the desktop itself which
we want to fade in the background as much as possible, but the apps it
generates.

Food for thought.

sri

--90e6ba6e83946d1758049a22353b
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<br><br><div class=3D"gmail_quote">On Tue, Jan 18, 2011 at 6:18 AM, Allan D=
ay <span dir=3D"ltr">&lt;<a href=3D"mailto:allanpday@gmail.com">allanpday@g=
mail.com</a>&gt;</span> wrote:<br><blockquote class=3D"gmail_quote" style=
=3D"margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex;">

<div class=3D"im">Frederic Muller wrote:<br>
&gt; Dear marketing,<br>
&gt;<br>
&gt; Last foundation IRC meeting we touched on the Foundation approval of<b=
r>
&gt; some budget for goodies to teams that will celebrate GNOME 3.0 on the<=
br>
&gt; release date.<br>
<br>
</div>Great stuff! I&#39;m looking forward to hearing the details of this (=
as well<br>
as trying to bag me some goodies)!<br></blockquote><div><br>Yeah, same here=
.=A0 It is possible I could throw one in Portland. This is after all open s=
ource central here.=A0 I need to figure out how to do the logistics of it.=
=A0 I should probably see if I can get some help with organizing from the l=
ocal Linux community.<br>

=A0<br></div><blockquote class=3D"gmail_quote" style=3D"margin: 0pt 0pt 0pt=
 0.8ex; border-left: 1px solid rgb(204, 204, 204); padding-left: 1ex;">
<div class=3D"im"><br>
&gt; How shall we announce this (and where)?<br>
<br>
</div>Planet GNOME, Identica, Twitter, www.gnome.org... any others? (I&#39;=
m<br>
interested in this too.)<br></blockquote><div><br>Someone already mentioned=
 facebook.=A0 But there seems to be one or two others.=A0 What about Orkut?=
=A0 I believe that is still fairly popular in latin countries. <br><br></di=
v>

<blockquote class=3D"gmail_quote" style=3D"margin: 0pt 0pt 0pt 0.8ex; borde=
r-left: 1px solid rgb(204, 204, 204); padding-left: 1ex;">
<div class=3D"im"><br>
&gt; In fact I am also interested in a more generic question which is how d=
o<br>
&gt; we usually use our channels to announce stuff? I tried to motivate<br>
&gt; people with the T-shirt contest but didn&#39;t receive much feedback e=
xcept<br>
&gt; from the people I contacted personally. How do we actually usually<br>
&gt; promote stuff outside of the GNOME community? (I thought GUGs would be=
 a<br>
&gt; good way, but they seem a little bit sleepy ;) ).<br>
<br>
</div>Good question! I&#39;ve been thinking for a while that GNOME needs an=
<br>
outward facing media channel. The Planet and GNOME News are primarily<br></=
blockquote><div><br>Well, GNOME Journal had the design of doing that since =
the articles were geared for both inside and outside of our community.=A0 I=
&#39;m not quite sure what a media channel like that is supposed to look li=
ke?=A0 Sure, Planet and GNOME assume a particular set of knowlede/idioms an=
d what not.=A0 Would you have enough content to constantly use that channel=
 that isn&#39;t release information on GNOME modules and what not?=A0 I thi=
nk that&#39;s what you&#39;re trying to say here, right?<br>

<br>=A0<br></div><blockquote class=3D"gmail_quote" style=3D"margin: 0pt 0pt=
 0pt 0.8ex; border-left: 1px solid rgb(204, 204, 204); padding-left: 1ex;">
places where we talk to ourselves. <a href=3D"http://www.gnome.org" target=
=3D"_blank">www.gnome.org</a> is outward facing and<br>
has a news section, but it isn&#39;t primarily a news site (you certainly<b=
r>
can&#39;t subscribe to it)... A blog or news site where we talk to our<br>
partners and to GNOME enthusiasts would be a great way to promote GNOME<br>
and to keep people in tune with where the project is going. It&#39;d need<b=
r>
volunteers if it were to become an enduring reality, of course...<br></bloc=
kquote><div><br>By partners I assume you mean distros like Ubuntu and Fedor=
a? =A0 Yes, it will require quite a bit of work.=A0 Generating content is a=
 lot of work with a set of volunteers.=A0 Especially when apps for instance=
 tend to be similar in scope.=A0 You have a lot of mail clients, a lot of p=
anel replacements and so forth they aren&#39;t particularly interesting for=
 a working family, a family with kids and so forth.=A0 The apps tend to ref=
lect a demographic in GNOME that isn&#39;t quite in tune with families.=A0 =
Perhaps I&#39;m just being cynical.=A0 As I grow older I&#39;m not as enamo=
red of panel replacements or funky widgets like I used to be.=A0 I am inter=
ested in how GNOME will make my life easier by generating recipes for dinne=
r, providing me with a list of news in the morning to read, keeping in touc=
h with relatives and friends, reminding me that I have a doctors appt today=
 (I really do have one), or the latest sports scores in the teams I&#39;m i=
nterested in.=A0 I want those apps.=A0 If you want to market to GNOME enthu=
siasts, it&#39;s not just the desktop itself which we want to fade in the b=
ackground as much as possible, but the apps it generates.<br>

<br>Food for thought.<br><br>sri<br></div></div>

--90e6ba6e83946d1758049a22353b--
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From: Sriram Ramkrishna <sri@ramkrishna.me>
Date: Tue, 18 Jan 2011 09:33:53 -0800
Message-ID: <AANLkTinUPeBh3iqbrgVg3mO8CW_G4Htk9C74LfMcRC_g@mail.gmail.com>
Subject: Re: Q4 Updates Due
To: Bastien Nocera <hadess@hadess.net>
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On Tue, Jan 18, 2011 at 8:45 AM, Bastien Nocera <hadess@hadess.net> wrote:

> On Mon, 2011-01-17 at 18:53 +0100, Dave Neary wrote:
> > Hi,
> >
> > Bastien Nocera wrote:
> > > I'd be happy to do so. What exactly do you expect me to write here?
> I'll
> > > be making the choice of bidder public as soon as they've contacted me
> > > back.
> >
> > Perhaps just that? "We selected the successful candidate for the Maemo =
&
> > GNOME maintenance work and there will be an announcement soon. They wil=
l
> > be doing X, Y and Z over the next few months, and input, guidance and
> > patches from community members interested are welcome"
>
> "
> The GNOME Foundation Board selected Igalia as providers for the GTK
> +/MeeGo handset integration work. Carlos Garc=EDa Campos and Claudio
> Saavedra will be working from 31st January on integrating GTK+ upstream
> as a viable toolkit for use on the MeeGo Handset platform. The full
> announcement is available on the GNOME Foundation blog
> <
> http://blogs.gnome.org/foundation/2011/01/17/gtk-meego-handset-bidders-se=
lected/
> >
> "
>
> Good?
>
>
>
Out of curiosity, will Meego do a joint announcement as well?

To keep this focused:

"For immediate release, the GNOME Foundation has selected Igalia to
integrate the GTK+ toolkit as part of the MeeGo handset platform.  Carlos
Garcia Campos and Claudio Saavedra will lead the effort starting the 31st o=
f
January to make GTK+ a viable toolkit for use in the MeeGo Handset
platform.  The full announcement is available on GNOME Foundation blog <
http://blogs.gnome.org/foundation/2011/01/17/gtk-meego-handset-bidders-sele=
cted/
>"

I'm hoping that when people scan the press release they see in order "Igali=
a
integrate GTK+ MeeGo Handset Platform".

sri

--90e6ba6e88821670e2049a224f77
Content-Type: text/html; charset=ISO-8859-1
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

<br><br><div class=3D"gmail_quote">On Tue, Jan 18, 2011 at 8:45 AM, Bastien=
 Nocera <span dir=3D"ltr">&lt;<a href=3D"mailto:hadess@hadess.net">hadess@h=
adess.net</a>&gt;</span> wrote:<br><blockquote class=3D"gmail_quote" style=
=3D"margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex;">

<div class=3D"im">On Mon, 2011-01-17 at 18:53 +0100, Dave Neary wrote:<br>
&gt; Hi,<br>
&gt;<br>
&gt; Bastien Nocera wrote:<br>
&gt; &gt; I&#39;d be happy to do so. What exactly do you expect me to write=
 here? I&#39;ll<br>
&gt; &gt; be making the choice of bidder public as soon as they&#39;ve cont=
acted me<br>
&gt; &gt; back.<br>
&gt;<br>
&gt; Perhaps just that? &quot;We selected the successful candidate for the =
Maemo &amp;<br>
&gt; GNOME maintenance work and there will be an announcement soon. They wi=
ll<br>
&gt; be doing X, Y and Z over the next few months, and input, guidance and<=
br>
&gt; patches from community members interested are welcome&quot;<br>
<br>
&quot;<br>
</div>The GNOME Foundation Board selected Igalia as providers for the GTK<b=
r>
+/MeeGo handset integration work. Carlos Garc=EDa Campos and Claudio<br>
Saavedra will be working from 31st January on integrating GTK+ upstream<br>
as a viable toolkit for use on the MeeGo Handset platform. The full<br>
announcement is available on the GNOME Foundation blog<br>
&lt;<a href=3D"http://blogs.gnome.org/foundation/2011/01/17/gtk-meego-hands=
et-bidders-selected/" target=3D"_blank">http://blogs.gnome.org/foundation/2=
011/01/17/gtk-meego-handset-bidders-selected/</a>&gt;<br>
&quot;<br>
<br>
Good?<br>
<br>
<br></blockquote><div><br>Out of curiosity, will Meego do a joint announcem=
ent as well?<br><br>To keep this focused:<br><br>&quot;For immediate releas=
e, the GNOME Foundation has selected Igalia to integrate the GTK+ toolkit a=
s part of the MeeGo handset platform.=A0 Carlos Garcia Campos and Claudio S=
aavedra will lead the effort starting the 31st of January to make GTK+ a vi=
able toolkit for use in the MeeGo Handset platform.=A0 The full announcemen=
t is available on GNOME Foundation blog &lt;<a href=3D"http://blogs.gnome.o=
rg/foundation/2011/01/17/gtk-meego-handset-bidders-selected/" target=3D"_bl=
ank">http://blogs.gnome.org/foundation/2011/01/17/gtk-meego-handset-bidders=
-selected/</a>&gt;&quot;<br>

<br>I&#39;m hoping that when people scan the press release they see in orde=
r &quot;Igalia integrate GTK+ MeeGo Handset Platform&quot;.<br><br>sri<br><=
/div></div><br>

--90e6ba6e88821670e2049a224f77--
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Subject: Re: www.gnome3.org launch
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On 18 Jan 2011, at 17:09, Sriram Ramkrishna wrote:

> Since I like the inspirational part of it, how about:
>=20
> GNOME-3 - The inspirational desktop for the rest of us
>=20
> GNOME-3 - The utilitarian desktop for the rest of us
>=20
> GNOME-3 - Where utility and inspiration merge
>=20
> GNOME-3 - Free, utilitarian, inspiring

A pity that "Inspiration is Free" already seems to have been taken... =
although by what, exactly, I'm not sure: <http://inspirationisfree.com/

Cheeri,
Calum.

--=20
CALUM BENSON, Interaction Designer     Oracle Corporation Ireland Ltd.
mailto:calum.benson@oracle.com         Solaris Desktop Team
http://blogs.sun.com/calum             +353 1 819 9771

Any opinions are personal and not necessarily those of Oracle Corp.

From olav@vitters.nl  Tue Jan 18 20:18:16 2011
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From: Olav Vitters <olav@vitters.nl>
To: marketing-list@gnome.org
Subject: Re: www.gnome3.org launch
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gnome3.org has been setup by Christer Edwards.

Some typos were found, so created a repos for the website called
gnome3-web. It'll auto-update the site within 5min from cron. Just
clone, commit and push the changes.
-- 
Regards,
Olav
From sri@ramkrishna.me  Tue Jan 18 21:12:58 2011
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From: Sriram Ramkrishna <sri@ramkrishna.me>
Date: Tue, 18 Jan 2011 13:12:25 -0800
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--90e6ba61354ea2e84a049a255cf4
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On Tue, Jan 18, 2011 at 6:48 AM, Andreas Nilsson <nisses.mail@home.se>wrote:

> On 01/18/2011 10:56 AM, Dave Neary wrote:
>
>> Hi,
>>
>> Jason D. Clinton wrote:
>>
>>> s/real/strong/
>>>
>> Well, I think the by-line is weak, and I'm not a particular fan of "Made
>> of Easy" either. But the by-line is not the important thing. The
>> important thing is: What does this new GNOME enable me to do? How will
>> my computer experience be better?
>>
>> If you can come up with a by-line which conveys or evokes some answer to
>> that, I'm all ears. "Made of per^H^H^Hinspiration" or "Made to inspire"
>> don't really do that for me.
>>
> Is it just me, or are we constantly coming up with reasons not to ship the
> website now? :)
> Whoever comes up with a better tagline (or want us to get rid of a tagline
> alltogether) can edit the image in the repository.
> I want to ship.
>

Yeah, I agree, let's just not add any tagline for now and just put it out
there.  We can always add it later I think.

sri

--90e6ba61354ea2e84a049a255cf4
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<br><br><div class=3D"gmail_quote">On Tue, Jan 18, 2011 at 6:48 AM, Andreas=
 Nilsson <span dir=3D"ltr">&lt;<a href=3D"mailto:nisses.mail@home.se">nisse=
s.mail@home.se</a>&gt;</span> wrote:<br><blockquote class=3D"gmail_quote" s=
tyle=3D"margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex;">

<div class=3D"im">On 01/18/2011 10:56 AM, Dave Neary wrote:<br>
<blockquote class=3D"gmail_quote" style=3D"margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1p=
x #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex">
Hi,<br>
<br>
Jason D. Clinton wrote:<br>
<blockquote class=3D"gmail_quote" style=3D"margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1p=
x #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex">
s/real/strong/<br>
</blockquote>
Well, I think the by-line is weak, and I&#39;m not a particular fan of &quo=
t;Made<br>
of Easy&quot; either. But the by-line is not the important thing. The<br>
important thing is: What does this new GNOME enable me to do? How will<br>
my computer experience be better?<br>
<br>
If you can come up with a by-line which conveys or evokes some answer to<br=
>
that, I&#39;m all ears. &quot;Made of per^H^H^Hinspiration&quot; or &quot;M=
ade to inspire&quot;<br>
don&#39;t really do that for me.<br>
</blockquote></div>
Is it just me, or are we constantly coming up with reasons not to ship the =
website now? :)<br>
Whoever comes up with a better tagline (or want us to get rid of a tagline =
alltogether) can edit the image in the repository.<br>
I want to ship.<font color=3D"#888888"></font><br></blockquote><div><font c=
olor=3D"#888888"><br>Yeah, I agree, let&#39;s just not add any tagline for =
now and just put it out there. =A0We can always add it later I think.<br><b=
r>

sri</font>=A0</div></div>

--90e6ba61354ea2e84a049a255cf4--
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Dear all,

Here is a draft announcement of the 2 major upcoming events that will 
happen right before the GNOME 3.0 release. I hereby submit the text for 
your review and comments, and once we're all ok with the content, 
grammar and web links (I think there should be more and they should 
probably point to gnome.asia once it's launched - 1/2 more days).

These 2 announcements should appear on gnome.org upcoming event section 
and on gnome.asia website.

---- announcement start ---------

*GNOME 3.0 Bangalore Hackfest 2011*
/March 28 - April 1 2011, Bangalore, India/

We are hosting a 5 days hackfest (March 28 - April 1) for the release, 
documentation and marketing teams focusing on GNOME 3.0 release. This 
will ensure some heavy testing of the code during the last week before 
the official release of GNOME 3.0, as well as preparing the release to 
happen in an optimal way. And at the same time, it will help the 
marketing team to clarify messaging when needed and finalize the launch 
details.
It is not primarily aimed at users or new contributors but we may 
organize some training and hands on sessions during the last 3 days of 
the hackfest (March 30 to April 1). Apart from that any contributor 
involved in the release process is strongly encourage to join.

Please let us know you are coming by registering on the Bangalore 
Hackfest 2011 page <http://live.gnome.org/Hackfests/GNOME.Asia2011>.

*GNOME.Asia Summit 2011*
/April 2 2011, Bangalore, India/

Right after the GNOME 3.0 Bangalore Hackfest, we will jump on the 
opportunity of having a lot of the GNOME developers already on site to 
aim for the greatest GNOME.Asia Summit of all time. Now in its forth 
year, GNOME.Asia Summit will have the pleasure to continue to bring 
GNOME to users and developers in Asia and more specifically India this 
year, but also to celebrate the release of GNOME 3.0 with the people who 
actually write the software!
The event will bring the light on the GNOME desktop both from a 
applications and a development platform point of view, as well as 
strengthen the GNOME community across borders.

Visitors should expect great insights into how GNOME 3.0 will transform 
their desktop experience, the changes and improvements under the hood 
and how to make the best out of this new desktop environment both from a 
developer and user perspective.

The call for papers is already out at 
<http://live.gnome.org/GnomeAsia/CallForPaper> and we hope to receive a 
lot of submissions from the Hackfest participants. We are also 
finalizing our call for sponsors and, depending on the momentum, 
planning for an extra conference day to cover all the topics (based on 
available budget and paper submissions). So stay tuned and visit 
Gnome.asia for the latest information!

---- announcement end ---------

Thanks a lot.

Fred
From fredm@gnome.org  Wed Jan 19 04:22:10 2011
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On 01/14/2011 05:57 AM, Jason Lo wrote:
> I got some more info from China, and I received some really good contact
> info updates from Bangalore. I will update the wiki page accordingly.

Hi!

I'm curious as to what feedback you got from the Bangalore group: we're 
currently preparing for both a GNOME 3.0 hackfest and the 4th edition of 
GNOME.Asia summit, their website has been down for quite some time and 
when asking 'around' it seems they have nothing going on.

We also discovered a 'GNOME India' at http://gnome-in.sarovar.org/, so I 
believe all in all it's a great opportunity to wake up all those people 
and inject them with fresh blood.

Please let us know if you know more than we do.

Thanks.

Fred
From pockeylam@gnome.org  Wed Jan 19 07:21:27 2011
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Date: Wed, 19 Jan 2011 15:21:04 +0800
From: Pockey Lam <pockeylam@gnome.org>
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Someone just reported there is a dead link regarding the FAQ page 
(common questions and answers):
Try it: http://gnome3.org/www.gnome3.org/trytit.html

Thanks,
Pockey

On 01/19/2011 04:15 AM, Olav Vitters wrote:
> gnome3.org has been setup by Christer Edwards.
>
> Some typos were found, so created a repos for the website called
> gnome3-web. It'll auto-update the site within 5min from cron. Just
> clone, commit and push the changes.

From allanpday@gmail.com  Wed Jan 19 08:56:29 2011
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Subject: Re: www.gnome3.org launch
From: Allan Day <allanpday@gmail.com>
To: Pockey Lam <pockeylam@gnome.org>
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Pockey Lam wrote:
> Someone just reported there is a dead link regarding the FAQ page 
> (common questions and answers):
> Try it: http://gnome3.org/www.gnome3.org/trytit.html

Thanks for the tip! All fixed.

Allan

-- 
Blog: http://afaikblog.wordpress.com/
IRC: aday on irc.gnome.org

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Hi,

Bastien Nocera wrote:
> Good?

Cool! Thanks! And I'm happy to see the choice too.

I'm sure the Igalia guys will work closely with GTK+ and Hildon
developers to provide a nice migration path from desktop or Maemo to
MeeGo handset.

Cheers,
Dave.

-- 
Dave Neary
GNOME Foundation member
dneary@gnome.org
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Hi,

Sriram Ramkrishna wrote:
> Out of curiosity, will Meego do a joint announcement as well?

I guess we should ask... it may well be a Nokia announcement, rather
than a MeeGo announcement, though - since it's their budget.

Cheers,
Dave.

-- 
Dave Neary
GNOME Foundation member
dneary@gnome.org
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On Wed, 2011-01-19 at 10:18 +0100, Dave Neary wrote:
> Hi,
> 
> Sriram Ramkrishna wrote:
> > Out of curiosity, will Meego do a joint announcement as well?
> 
> I guess we should ask... it may well be a Nokia announcement, rather
> than a MeeGo announcement, though - since it's their budget.

Nokia isn't interested in the publicity on this.

From allanpday@gmail.com  Wed Jan 19 15:12:36 2011
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Subject: 3.0 Marketing Schedule
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Hi all,

I've spent some time working on the 3.0 wiki pages recently. We now have
a home page for 3.0 marketing [1] and an updated schedule [2]. (I have
removed some names from this - I did try and contact the relevant
individuals - please put yours back if I made a mistake!)

I have a couple of questions about the schedule that I'd like to clear
up:

* GNOME Ambassadors - what is happening with this? What would it involve
in the context of the 3.0 campaign? If it definitely isn't going to
happen in time for 3.0, I'd prefer to remove it from the schedule.

* Thank you cards - this is on the schedule, but I've got no idea who
we're thanking or what we're thanking them for. :)

Outside of these issues, please let me know if there's anything
obviously wrong with the schedule. I'm particularly interested in the
timing of key activities: how far in advance of the release should we be
circulating the press release, for example?

Best,

Allan

[1] http://live.gnome.org/GnomeMarketing/ThreePointZero
[2] http://live.gnome.org/ThreePointZero/MarketingRoadmap


From calum.benson@ORACLE.COM  Wed Jan 19 16:16:33 2011
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On 19 Jan 2011, at 07:21, Pockey Lam wrote:

> Someone just reported there is a dead link regarding the FAQ page =
(common questions and answers):
> Try it: http://gnome3.org/www.gnome3.org/trytit.html

Also on the FAQ and Try It pages, you shouldn't use "this page" as a =
hyperlink -- bad for accessibility, and just generally for anyone =
quickly scanning the page.  The link text should describe where the link =
is going.

Cheeri,
Calum.

--=20
CALUM BENSON, Interaction Designer     Oracle Corporation Ireland Ltd.
mailto:calum.benson@oracle.com         Solaris Desktop Team
http://blogs.sun.com/calum             +353 1 819 9771

Any opinions are personal and not necessarily those of Oracle Corp.

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Hey Allan :-)

On 19.01.2011 16:06, Allan Day wrote:
> We now have a home page for 3.0 marketing [1] http://live.gnome.org/Gno=
meMarketing/
Brilliant :-) The talking points, which are linked from the site you've
mentioned (http://live.gnome.org/GnomeMarketing/TalkingPoints) are
propabably outdated.

At least it reads "GNOME 3.0 is coming September, 2010 (GNOME 2.32)".
Also, I'm not too sure about the accessibility stuff that it mentions.

On a related note, can we get some sort of flyers finalised? I found
something deep in the wiki:
http://live.gnome.org/GnomeMarketing/ConferenceMaterial/Brochure but it
reads: "This section contains draft brochures waiting to be approved and
art work added". I'd like to have something to hand out for upcoming
FOSDEM in Brussels.

Cheers,
  Tobi


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From fpeters@entrouvert.com  Wed Jan 19 16:26:21 2011
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Allan Day wrote:

> We're pretty much at the stage where we can launch a preliminary version
> of gnome3.org. [...]

It's now out, congrats!

Is it possible to get it in the hands of our translation teams? I can
have a look at the technical details, how is it deployed at the moment?


        Frederic
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Like this:
http://git.gnome.org/browse/gnome3-web

Just raw html+css.

On Wed 19 Jan 2011 05:25:59 PM CET, Frederic Peters wrote:
> Allan Day wrote:
> 
>> We're pretty much at the stage where we can launch a preliminary version
>> of gnome3.org. [...]
> 
> It's now out, congrats!
> 
> Is it possible to get it in the hands of our translation teams? I can
> have a look at the technical details, how is it deployed at the moment?
> 
> 
>          Frederic
From pockeylam@gnome.org  Thu Jan 20 01:35:36 2011
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To: "Committee list of GNOME.Asia Summit organization"
	<asia-summit-list@gnome.org>, 
	GNOME Marketing List <marketing-list@gnome.org>
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I think the announcements look excellent, thanks Fred for drafting it!  
If there is no grammatical mistake or other comment, I would like to put 
the content on the front page of gnome.asia website today.

And who can help to put this announcements up on gnome.org?

Thanks!
Pockey

On 01/19/2011 12:12 PM, Frederic Muller wrote:
> Dear all,
>
> Here is a draft announcement of the 2 major upcoming events that will 
> happen right before the GNOME 3.0 release. I hereby submit the text 
> for your review and comments, and once we're all ok with the content, 
> grammar and web links (I think there should be more and they should 
> probably point to gnome.asia once it's launched - 1/2 more days).
>
> These 2 announcements should appear on gnome.org upcoming event 
> section and on gnome.asia website.
>
> ---- announcement start ---------
>
> *GNOME 3.0 Bangalore Hackfest 2011*
> /March 28 - April 1 2011, Bangalore, India/
>
> We are hosting a 5 days hackfest (March 28 - April 1) for the release, 
> documentation and marketing teams focusing on GNOME 3.0 release. This 
> will ensure some heavy testing of the code during the last week before 
> the official release of GNOME 3.0, as well as preparing the release to 
> happen in an optimal way. And at the same time, it will help the 
> marketing team to clarify messaging when needed and finalize the 
> launch details.
> It is not primarily aimed at users or new contributors but we may 
> organize some training and hands on sessions during the last 3 days of 
> the hackfest (March 30 to April 1). Apart from that any contributor 
> involved in the release process is strongly encourage to join.
>
> Please let us know you are coming by registering on the Bangalore 
> Hackfest 2011 page <http://live.gnome.org/Hackfests/GNOME.Asia2011>.
>
> *GNOME.Asia Summit 2011*
> /April 2 2011, Bangalore, India/
>
> Right after the GNOME 3.0 Bangalore Hackfest, we will jump on the 
> opportunity of having a lot of the GNOME developers already on site to 
> aim for the greatest GNOME.Asia Summit of all time. Now in its forth 
> year, GNOME.Asia Summit will have the pleasure to continue to bring 
> GNOME to users and developers in Asia and more specifically India this 
> year, but also to celebrate the release of GNOME 3.0 with the people 
> who actually write the software!
> The event will bring the light on the GNOME desktop both from a 
> applications and a development platform point of view, as well as 
> strengthen the GNOME community across borders.
>
> Visitors should expect great insights into how GNOME 3.0 will 
> transform their desktop experience, the changes and improvements under 
> the hood and how to make the best out of this new desktop environment 
> both from a developer and user perspective.
>
> The call for papers is already out at 
> <http://live.gnome.org/GnomeAsia/CallForPaper> and we hope to receive 
> a lot of submissions from the Hackfest participants. We are also 
> finalizing our call for sponsors and, depending on the momentum, 
> planning for an extra conference day to cover all the topics (based on 
> available budget and paper submissions). So stay tuned and visit 
> Gnome.asia for the latest information!
>
> ---- announcement end ---------
>
> Thanks a lot.
>
> Fred
> _______________________________________________
> asia-summit-list mailing list
> asia-summit-list@gnome.org
> http://mail.gnome.org/mailman/listinfo/asia-summit-list
>

From brian.cameron@oracle.com  Thu Jan 20 04:33:28 2011
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Looks good to me.

On 01/19/11 07:35 PM, Pockey Lam wrote:
> I think the announcements look excellent, thanks Fred for drafting it!
> If there is no grammatical mistake or other comment, I would like to put
> the content on the front page of gnome.asia website today.
>
> And who can help to put this announcements up on gnome.org?

File a bug at bugzilla.gnome.org under infrastructure->website.

Brian

> On 01/19/2011 12:12 PM, Frederic Muller wrote:
>> Dear all,
>>
>> Here is a draft announcement of the 2 major upcoming events that will
>> happen right before the GNOME 3.0 release. I hereby submit the text
>> for your review and comments, and once we're all ok with the content,
>> grammar and web links (I think there should be more and they should
>> probably point to gnome.asia once it's launched - 1/2 more days).
>>
>> These 2 announcements should appear on gnome.org upcoming event
>> section and on gnome.asia website.
>>
>> ---- announcement start ---------
>>
>> *GNOME 3.0 Bangalore Hackfest 2011*
>> /March 28 - April 1 2011, Bangalore, India/
>>
>> We are hosting a 5 days hackfest (March 28 - April 1) for the release,
>> documentation and marketing teams focusing on GNOME 3.0 release. This
>> will ensure some heavy testing of the code during the last week before
>> the official release of GNOME 3.0, as well as preparing the release to
>> happen in an optimal way. And at the same time, it will help the
>> marketing team to clarify messaging when needed and finalize the
>> launch details.
>> It is not primarily aimed at users or new contributors but we may
>> organize some training and hands on sessions during the last 3 days of
>> the hackfest (March 30 to April 1). Apart from that any contributor
>> involved in the release process is strongly encourage to join.
>>
>> Please let us know you are coming by registering on the Bangalore
>> Hackfest 2011 page <http://live.gnome.org/Hackfests/GNOME.Asia2011>.
>>
>> *GNOME.Asia Summit 2011*
>> /April 2 2011, Bangalore, India/
>>
>> Right after the GNOME 3.0 Bangalore Hackfest, we will jump on the
>> opportunity of having a lot of the GNOME developers already on site to
>> aim for the greatest GNOME.Asia Summit of all time. Now in its forth
>> year, GNOME.Asia Summit will have the pleasure to continue to bring
>> GNOME to users and developers in Asia and more specifically India this
>> year, but also to celebrate the release of GNOME 3.0 with the people
>> who actually write the software!
>> The event will bring the light on the GNOME desktop both from a
>> applications and a development platform point of view, as well as
>> strengthen the GNOME community across borders.
>>
>> Visitors should expect great insights into how GNOME 3.0 will
>> transform their desktop experience, the changes and improvements under
>> the hood and how to make the best out of this new desktop environment
>> both from a developer and user perspective.
>>
>> The call for papers is already out at
>> <http://live.gnome.org/GnomeAsia/CallForPaper> and we hope to receive
>> a lot of submissions from the Hackfest participants. We are also
>> finalizing our call for sponsors and, depending on the momentum,
>> planning for an extra conference day to cover all the topics (based on
>> available budget and paper submissions). So stay tuned and visit
>> Gnome.asia for the latest information!
>>
>> ---- announcement end ---------
>>
>> Thanks a lot.
>>
>> Fred
>> _______________________________________________
>> asia-summit-list mailing list
>> asia-summit-list@gnome.org
>> http://mail.gnome.org/mailman/listinfo/asia-summit-list
>>
>

From pockeylam@gnome.org  Thu Jan 20 09:45:31 2011
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From: Pockey Lam <pockeylam@gnome.org>
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On 01/20/2011 12:32 PM, Brian Cameron wrote:
>
> Looks good to me.
>
> On 01/19/11 07:35 PM, Pockey Lam wrote:
>> I think the announcements look excellent, thanks Fred for drafting it!
>> If there is no grammatical mistake or other comment, I would like to put
>> the content on the front page of gnome.asia website today.
>>
>> And who can help to put this announcements up on gnome.org?
>
> File a bug at bugzilla.gnome.org under infrastructure->website.
Done, let's wait for the contents to appear then. Thanks!
>
> Brian
>
>> On 01/19/2011 12:12 PM, Frederic Muller wrote:
>>> Dear all,
>>>
>>> Here is a draft announcement of the 2 major upcoming events that will
>>> happen right before the GNOME 3.0 release. I hereby submit the text
>>> for your review and comments, and once we're all ok with the content,
>>> grammar and web links (I think there should be more and they should
>>> probably point to gnome.asia once it's launched - 1/2 more days).
>>>
>>> These 2 announcements should appear on gnome.org upcoming event
>>> section and on gnome.asia website.
>>>
>>> ---- announcement start ---------
>>>
>>> *GNOME 3.0 Bangalore Hackfest 2011*
>>> /March 28 - April 1 2011, Bangalore, India/
>>>
>>> We are hosting a 5 days hackfest (March 28 - April 1) for the release,
>>> documentation and marketing teams focusing on GNOME 3.0 release. This
>>> will ensure some heavy testing of the code during the last week before
>>> the official release of GNOME 3.0, as well as preparing the release to
>>> happen in an optimal way. And at the same time, it will help the
>>> marketing team to clarify messaging when needed and finalize the
>>> launch details.
>>> It is not primarily aimed at users or new contributors but we may
>>> organize some training and hands on sessions during the last 3 days of
>>> the hackfest (March 30 to April 1). Apart from that any contributor
>>> involved in the release process is strongly encourage to join.
>>>
>>> Please let us know you are coming by registering on the Bangalore
>>> Hackfest 2011 page <http://live.gnome.org/Hackfests/GNOME.Asia2011>.
>>>
>>> *GNOME.Asia Summit 2011*
>>> /April 2 2011, Bangalore, India/
>>>
>>> Right after the GNOME 3.0 Bangalore Hackfest, we will jump on the
>>> opportunity of having a lot of the GNOME developers already on site to
>>> aim for the greatest GNOME.Asia Summit of all time. Now in its forth
>>> year, GNOME.Asia Summit will have the pleasure to continue to bring
>>> GNOME to users and developers in Asia and more specifically India this
>>> year, but also to celebrate the release of GNOME 3.0 with the people
>>> who actually write the software!
>>> The event will bring the light on the GNOME desktop both from a
>>> applications and a development platform point of view, as well as
>>> strengthen the GNOME community across borders.
>>>
>>> Visitors should expect great insights into how GNOME 3.0 will
>>> transform their desktop experience, the changes and improvements under
>>> the hood and how to make the best out of this new desktop environment
>>> both from a developer and user perspective.
>>>
>>> The call for papers is already out at
>>> <http://live.gnome.org/GnomeAsia/CallForPaper> and we hope to receive
>>> a lot of submissions from the Hackfest participants. We are also
>>> finalizing our call for sponsors and, depending on the momentum,
>>> planning for an extra conference day to cover all the topics (based on
>>> available budget and paper submissions). So stay tuned and visit
>>> Gnome.asia for the latest information!
>>>
>>> ---- announcement end ---------
>>>
>>> Thanks a lot.
>>>
>>> Fred
>>> _______________________________________________
>>> asia-summit-list mailing list
>>> asia-summit-list@gnome.org
>>> http://mail.gnome.org/mailman/listinfo/asia-summit-list
>>>
>>
>
>

From pockeylam@gnome.org  Fri Jan 21 04:06:44 2011
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Hi Allan,

Where can I find a high resolution (SVG) file of GNOME 3.0 logo from the 
site? I would like to put it in a cover of a call for sponsor document 
of our GNOME 3.0 Bangalore Hackfest. Thanks.

- Pockey

On 01/19/2011 04:56 PM, Allan Day wrote:
> Pockey Lam wrote:
>> Someone just reported there is a dead link regarding the FAQ page
>> (common questions and answers):
>> Try it: http://gnome3.org/www.gnome3.org/trytit.html
> Thanks for the tip! All fixed.
>
> Allan
>

From me@jasonclinton.com  Fri Jan 21 04:55:10 2011
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Subject: 4/14 Friends of GNOME videos finished and posted
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--0016e64c2e1c29523a049a540d0c
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8

Unlike the previews from late November, these files can be considered
"done." I have reduced the bandwidth requirements by half while mostly
retaining the same level of quality. (Yay, codec progress!)

http://people.gnome.org/~jclinton/FoG/

I think it would be fine to put these finalized versions in the git repo.
for site development convenience. (I would not put anything this large which
is anticipated to change in to a git repo.)

There will not be H.264 versions of these files as we cannot pay the
streaming licenses and the FoG target audience is going to be running a
browser which can play Theora or WebM. Also, these files are so small,
bandwidth shouldn't be a concern.

My suggestion would be to use straight-forward, browser UI, nested <video>
tags to put these on the FoG site update (with the WebM version on the
outside so that it is preferred). The video URL would be randomly selected
from a list that we provide by either client-side JS or server-side
scripting. I also believe that http://universalsubtitles.org/ is the method
by which we should solve the a11y and i18n challenges; it's crowd sourced
via this method. If there aren't any show-stoppers and no one else steps up
to implement this change, I will implement the suggested site changes.
Later, if bandwidth becomes a problem, perhaps we can distribute the load by
asking people to mirror a video and we can use the same random URL provider
to rotate between mirrors.

All videos are 720P 30fps with 128Kbit/s Vorbis stereo audio. The WebM
videos targeted 1Mbit/s. The Theora videos targeted 2Mbit/s and have
slightly more artifacting despite being almost twice as large.

I am still thinking about what to do about the gnome3.org video hosting and
video format questions as the audience and bandwidth situation is slightly
different. And no solution proposed so far is perfect.

I've solved a number of problems with my video workflow (by building a bunch
of stuff from svn and git, by hand) so I can crank the remaining 10 FoG
videos out over the coming days including that re-spin of the GNOME 3
preview that I have promised.

Also, I just today finished assembling a GNOME 3 installation with the
finalized Adwaita theme, the new GNOME font (Cantarell) with git master OTF
hinting, the latest GNOME Shell git, and most of the GNOME 3 applications in
their current state. GNOME 3 is looking *fantastic* now that the design
vision is coming together with the art team's work. I'm hugely optimistic
about the GNOME 3 final product and we are rapidly approaching the time when
producing materials that look near-identical to the final version becomes
achievable.

--0016e64c2e1c29523a049a540d0c
Content-Type: text/html; charset=UTF-8
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

Unlike the previews from late November, these files can be considered &quot=
;done.&quot; I have reduced the bandwidth requirements by half while mostly=
 retaining the same level of quality. (Yay, codec progress!)<br><br><a href=
=3D"http://people.gnome.org/~jclinton/FoG/">http://people.gnome.org/~jclint=
on/FoG/</a><br>
<br>I think it would be fine to put these finalized versions in the git rep=
o. for site development convenience. (I would not put anything this large w=
hich is anticipated to change in to a git repo.)<br><br>There will not be H=
.264 versions of these files as we cannot pay the streaming licenses and th=
e FoG target audience is going to be running a browser which can play Theor=
a or WebM. Also, these files are so small, bandwidth shouldn&#39;t be a con=
cern.<br>
<br>My suggestion would be to use straight-forward, browser UI, nested &lt;=
video&gt; tags to put these on the FoG site update (with the WebM version o=
n the outside so that it is preferred). The video URL would be randomly sel=
ected from a list that we provide by either client-side JS or server-side s=
cripting. I also believe that <a href=3D"http://universalsubtitles.org/">ht=
tp://universalsubtitles.org/</a> is the method by which we should solve the=
 a11y and i18n challenges; it&#39;s crowd sourced via this method. If there=
 aren&#39;t any show-stoppers and no one else steps up to implement this ch=
ange, I will implement the suggested site changes. Later, if bandwidth beco=
mes a problem, perhaps we can distribute the load by asking people to mirro=
r a video and we can use the same random URL provider to rotate between mir=
rors.<br>
<br>
All videos are 720P 30fps with 128Kbit/s Vorbis stereo audio. The WebM=20
videos targeted 1Mbit/s. The Theora videos targeted 2Mbit/s and have=20
slightly more artifacting despite being almost twice as large.<br>
<br>
I am still thinking about what to do about the <a href=3D"http://gnome3.org=
">gnome3.org</a> video hosting
 and video format questions as the audience and bandwidth situation is slig=
htly=20
different. And no solution proposed so far is perfect.<br><br>I&#39;ve solv=
ed a number of problems with my video workflow (by building a bunch of stuf=
f from svn and git, by hand) so I can crank the remaining 10 FoG videos out=
 over the coming days including that re-spin of the GNOME 3 preview that I =
have promised.<br>
<br>Also, I just today finished assembling a GNOME 3 installation with the =
finalized Adwaita theme, the new GNOME font (Cantarell) with git master OTF=
 hinting, the latest GNOME Shell git, and most of the GNOME 3 applications =
in their current state. GNOME 3 is looking *fantastic* now that the design =
vision is coming together with the art team&#39;s work. I&#39;m hugely opti=
mistic about the GNOME 3 final product and we are rapidly approaching the t=
ime when producing materials that look near-identical to the final version =
becomes achievable.<br>
<br>

--0016e64c2e1c29523a049a540d0c--
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http://git.gnome.org/browse/gnome3-web/tree/src
Let me know if something is missing.
- Andreas

On 01/21/2011 05:06 AM, Pockey Lam wrote:
> Hi Allan,
>
> Where can I find a high resolution (SVG) file of GNOME 3.0 logo from 
> the site? I would like to put it in a cover of a call for sponsor 
> document of our GNOME 3.0 Bangalore Hackfest. Thanks.
>
> - Pockey
>
> On 01/19/2011 04:56 PM, Allan Day wrote:
>> Pockey Lam wrote:
>>> Someone just reported there is a dead link regarding the FAQ page
>>> (common questions and answers):
>>> Try it: http://gnome3.org/www.gnome3.org/trytit.html
>> Thanks for the tip! All fixed.
>>
>> Allan
>>
>

From allanpday@gmail.com  Fri Jan 21 10:52:17 2011
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Subject: Re: 3.0 Marketing Schedule
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> Brilliant :-) The talking points, which are linked from the site you've
> mentioned (http://live.gnome.org/GnomeMarketing/TalkingPoints) are
> propabably outdated.
> 
> At least it reads "GNOME 3.0 is coming September, 2010 (GNOME 2.32)".
> Also, I'm not too sure about the accessibility stuff that it mentions.

I've added a note which explains the status of those notes. I don't
really feel like updating them; gnome3.org should be our canonical
reference point for talking points from now on.

Best,

Allan
-- 
Blog: http://afaikblog.wordpress.com/
IRC: aday on irc.gnome.org

From fredm@gnome.org  Fri Jan 21 15:41:39 2011
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	GNOME.Asia Summit 2011
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Dear all,

We've finally finalize dates, website and announcements for the upcoming 
GNOME 3.0 Bangalore Hackfest followed by the GNOME.Asia Summit 2011. You 
can read the full announcement here 
http://gnome.asia/press/2011/announcement/ but in short we targeting to 
gather release, documentation and marketing people together to finish 
GNOME 3.0 under the same roof just before the release (April 6th is the 
release date), and using this opportunity to have the 4th edition of 
GNOME.Asia Summit just after in one of the software development centers 
of the world: Bangalore.

So Hackfest registration is happening here: 
http://live.gnome.org/Hackfests/GNOME.Asia2011 , call for papers for the 
conference is here http://live.gnome.org/GnomeAsia/CallForPaper and 
conference registration will be opening soon.

As a side note the Gnome foundation will be providing some goodies for 
people organizing launch parties for GNOME 3.0 wherever they are (that 
would be one week later), more will be announcement very very soon!

A big thank you to all the people involved and who have helped us here 
and there, and the prompt publication on www.gnome.org!

Fred

From fredm@gnome.org  Fri Jan 21 16:13:55 2011
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Dear all,

GNOME 3.0 will be officially released on April 6th 2011! Have you 
started to plan for your own GNOME 3.0 Launch Party in your region yet?

Here is the good news! For those organizing a launch party, The GNOME 
Foundation will give away some goodies (t-shirts, balloons, stickers, 
other stuff) to support your events. Registration is starting now and 
attribution will be on a first come first serve basis and within 
availability.

You can find more information about GNOME 3.0 at http://www.gnome3.org, 
more information about Launch Parties at 
http://live.gnome.org/ThreePointZero/LaunchParty, more information to 
prepare your own GNOME 3.0 party at 
http://live.gnome.org/ThreePointZero/LaunchParty/Resources and more 
information about the goodies at 
http://live.gnome.org/ThreePointZero/Goodies .

Should you have any question please use the GNOME User Groups mailing 
list at http://mail.gnome.org/mailman/listinfo/gugmasters-list or find 
us on GNOME IRC servers in #gnome-love channel.

Please help us spread the word and get a few launch parties in your 
area. Register and document your event at 
http://live.gnome.org/ThreePointZero/LaunchParty#Locations making sure 
you supply a valid email address.

Happy GNOME 3.0 Release Party!
From allanpday@gmail.com  Sat Jan 22 13:05:30 2011
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Subject: Re: 4/14 Friends of GNOME videos finished and posted
From: Allan Day <allanpday@gmail.com>
To: "Jason D. Clinton" <me@jasonclinton.com>
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Jason D. Clinton wrote:
> Unlike the previews from late November, these files can be considered
> "done." I have reduced the bandwidth requirements by half while mostly
> retaining the same level of quality. (Yay, codec progress!)
> 
> http://people.gnome.org/~jclinton/FoG/
> 
> I think it would be fine to put these finalized versions in the git
> repo. for site development convenience. (I would not put anything this
> large which is anticipated to change in to a git repo.)
> 
> There will not be H.264 versions of these files as we cannot pay the
> streaming licenses and the FoG target audience is going to be running
> a browser which can play Theora or WebM. Also, these files are so
> small, bandwidth shouldn't be a concern.
> 
> My suggestion would be to use straight-forward, browser UI, nested
> <video> tags to put these on the FoG site update (with the WebM
> version on the outside so that it is preferred). The video URL would
> be randomly selected from a list that we provide by either client-side
> JS or server-side scripting. I also believe that
> http://universalsubtitles.org/ is the method by which we should solve
> the a11y and i18n challenges; it's crowd sourced via this method. If
> there aren't any show-stoppers and no one else steps up to implement
> this change, I will implement the suggested site changes. Later, if
> bandwidth becomes a problem, perhaps we can distribute the load by
> asking people to mirror a video and we can use the same random URL
> provider to rotate between mirrors.
> 
> All videos are 720P 30fps with 128Kbit/s Vorbis stereo audio. The WebM
> videos targeted 1Mbit/s. The Theora videos targeted 2Mbit/s and have
> slightly more artifacting despite being almost twice as large.

Wow, this all looks great!

> I am still thinking about what to do about the gnome3.org video
> hosting and video format questions as the audience and bandwidth
> situation is slightly different. And no solution proposed so far is
> perfect.
> 
> I've solved a number of problems with my video workflow (by building a
> bunch of stuff from svn and git, by hand) so I can crank the remaining
> 10 FoG videos out over the coming days including that re-spin of the
> GNOME 3 preview that I have promised.

It'll be wonderful to have video material on gnome3.org.

> Also, I just today finished assembling a GNOME 3 installation with the
> finalized Adwaita theme, the new GNOME font (Cantarell) with git
> master OTF hinting, the latest GNOME Shell git, and most of the GNOME
> 3 applications in their current state. GNOME 3 is looking *fantastic*
> now that the design vision is coming together with the art team's
> work. I'm hugely optimistic about the GNOME 3 final product and we are
> rapidly approaching the time when producing materials that look
> near-identical to the final version becomes achievable.

It would be really good to have screenshots from this kind of system for
gnome3.org. (Hint hint!)

Regarding updates to gnome3.org: it would be good to try and time these
so they come in a steady flow rather than all once. That way we can
generate regular announcements for the microblogs.

Allan
-- 
Blog: https://afaikblog.wordpress.com/
IRC: aday on irc.gnome.org

From a11yrocks@bryen.com  Sat Jan 22 14:58:25 2011
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Subject: Need advice on GNOME-A11y giveaways
From: Bryen M Yunashko <a11yrocks@bryen.com>
To: GNOME Marketing List <marketing-list@gnome.org>
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Hello GNOMEie Marketeers and A11y'ers!

I'd like your advice before I start ordering up stuff for the upcoming
CSUN conference in San Diego in March.  I actually need this nailed down
much sooner as I'll be leaving for California in February.

- I will be ordering some nice vinyl banners that Andreas Nillson helped
design for me a while ago.  This will help our booth look very spiffy at
CSUN.  I intend to reuse these banners elsewhere after CSUN.  One set I
already ordered should still be residing in Spain if anyone wants to use
it for a European event.

- I created some 5"x7" postcard handouts and still have a bunch left
that I can give out, but I'd like to redo them in a way that might be
better.  The design I did was a last minute design and you can see here
http://www.bryen.com/images/Gnomea11y.pdf

Keep in mind that the audience at CSUN is non-open source oriented.  And
we'll be literally buried in a sea of hundreds of other a11y booths.
(It's a pretty big event!)  So, I believe the cards really have to speak
to why look at open source as an option?  So... does what I have created
speak to that well enough?  And how can we design it in a way that looks
better/more appealing?  

One drawback to this card was that we crammed a lot of text into what is
a fairly sizable piece of paper.  So large-print wasn't really going to
work well.  I'd like to be able to address large-print goals this time
around.

- I want to create some really cool sticker (in 2inchx2inch format) that
would appeal to non-open source folks.  Yes we have the nice GNOME
stickers which I intend to give out as well.  But it doesn't inspire
people to use and display them if they aren't adopting GNOME right away.
I'm looking for a very cool design that says  "I'm proud to be an a11y
user!" and yet still has some reference to GNOME for anyone to look up
at a later time.  Something that says  Accessibility ROCKS!

I did think previously about removable tattoos and pins.  But removable
tattoos, while cool, can only be used once.  And pins cost too much if I
don't order in significant bulk.  :-(

Stickers though are very economical and I can afford to pony up for
those if we can move quickly before the current sale price goes away.

Any ideas, folks?

Bryen


From me@jasonclinton.com  Sat Jan 22 17:42:01 2011
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Subject: Re: 4/14 Friends of GNOME videos finished and posted
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--20cf301e2f4d61ca17049a72e114
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On Sat, Jan 22, 2011 at 07:05, Allan Day <allanpday@gmail.com> wrote:

> It would be really good to have screenshots from this kind of system for
> gnome3.org. (Hint hint!)
>

Thoughts on optimal screen size for screen shots? I'm targeting 1280x720 for
the videos (for obvious reasons) but I could use the xrandr scale magic to
get a native screen of any size for the screen shots.

--20cf301e2f4d61ca17049a72e114
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<div class=3D"gmail_quote">On Sat, Jan 22, 2011 at 07:05, Allan Day <span d=
ir=3D"ltr">&lt;<a href=3D"mailto:allanpday@gmail.com">allanpday@gmail.com</=
a>&gt;</span> wrote:<br><blockquote class=3D"gmail_quote" style=3D"margin:0=
 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex;">
<div><div></div>It would be really good to have screenshots from this kind =
of system for<br></div>
<a href=3D"http://gnome3.org" target=3D"_blank">gnome3.org</a>. (Hint hint!=
)<br></blockquote><div><br>Thoughts on optimal screen size for screen shots=
? I&#39;m targeting 1280x720 for the videos (for obvious reasons) but I cou=
ld use the xrandr scale magic to get a native screen of any size for the sc=
reen shots.<br>
<br></div></div>

--20cf301e2f4d61ca17049a72e114--
From vuntz@gnome.org  Sat Jan 22 18:04:19 2011
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From: Vincent Untz <vuntz@gnome.org>
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	Foundation-List <foundation-list@gnome.org>
Subject: Re: Official announcement and invitation to GNOME 3.0 Hackfest and
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Le vendredi 21 janvier 2011, à 23:41 +0800, Frederic Muller a écrit :
> So Hackfest registration is happening here:
> http://live.gnome.org/Hackfests/GNOME.Asia2011 , call for papers for
> the conference is here http://live.gnome.org/GnomeAsia/CallForPaper
> and conference registration will be opening soon.

What's the plan on the marketing team side? Do we have people who can
go? I didn't see any replies on marketing-list to the previous mails,
unless I missed something.

Vincent

-- 
Les gens heureux ne sont pas pressés.
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Subject: Re: Official announcement and invitation to GNOME 3.0 Hackfest and
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On Sat, 2011-01-22 at 19:04 +0100, Vincent Untz wrote:
> Le vendredi 21 janvier 2011, à 23:41 +0800, Frederic Muller a écrit :
> > So Hackfest registration is happening here:
> > http://live.gnome.org/Hackfests/GNOME.Asia2011 , call for papers for
> > the conference is here http://live.gnome.org/GnomeAsia/CallForPaper
> > and conference registration will be opening soon.
> 
> What's the plan on the marketing team side? Do we have people who can
> go? I didn't see any replies on marketing-list to the previous mails,
> unless I missed something.

Same question goes for Documentation.

andre
-- 
mailto:ak-47@gmx.net | failed
http://blogs.gnome.org/aklapper

From me@jasonclinton.com  Sat Jan 22 19:06:40 2011
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Subject: Re: Official announcement and invitation to GNOME 3.0 Hackfest and
	GNOME.Asia Summit 2011
From: "Jason D. Clinton" <me@jasonclinton.com>
To: Foundation-List <foundation-list@gnome.org>, 
	GNOME Marketing List <marketing-list@gnome.org>, release-team@gnome.org
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On Jan 22, 2011 12:04 PM, "Vincent Untz" <vuntz@gnome.org> wrote:
>
> Le vendredi 21 janvier 2011, =C3=A0 23:41 +0800, Frederic Muller a =C3=A9=
crit :
> > So Hackfest registration is happening here:
> > http://live.gnome.org/Hackfests/GNOME.Asia2011 , call for papers for
> > the conference is here http://live.gnome.org/GnomeAsia/CallForPaper
> > and conference registration will be opening soon.
>
> What's the plan on the marketing team side? Do we have people who can
> go? I didn't see any replies on marketing-list to the previous mails,
> unless I missed something.

Since the dates selected are the span of a work week I cannot go. The
scheduling reprecussions would be too difficult to absorb.

I would be happy to make myself available on Monday and Wednesday evening o=
n
IRC, however.

If enough people can't make it and doing telepresence on a larger scale
makes sense, I would be willing to take a few days off work to make that
more productive. I don't think doing telepresence makes sense if there is a
conference as those who would be remote would likely reduce the conference
productivity as much as aid it due to synchronization overhead.

--0016e6de00ed4e1b9d049a7410e1
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<p>On Jan 22, 2011 12:04 PM, &quot;Vincent Untz&quot; &lt;<a href=3D"mailto=
:vuntz@gnome.org">vuntz@gnome.org</a>&gt; wrote:<br>
&gt;<br>
&gt; Le vendredi 21 janvier 2011, =C3=A0 23:41 +0800, Frederic Muller a =C3=
=A9crit :<br>
&gt; &gt; So Hackfest registration is happening here:<br>
&gt; &gt; <a href=3D"http://live.gnome.org/Hackfests/GNOME.Asia2011">http:/=
/live.gnome.org/Hackfests/GNOME.Asia2011</a> , call for papers for<br>
&gt; &gt; the conference is here <a href=3D"http://live.gnome.org/GnomeAsia=
/CallForPaper">http://live.gnome.org/GnomeAsia/CallForPaper</a><br>
&gt; &gt; and conference registration will be opening soon.<br>
&gt;<br>
&gt; What&#39;s the plan on the marketing team side? Do we have people who =
can<br>
&gt; go? I didn&#39;t see any replies on marketing-list to the previous mai=
ls,<br>
&gt; unless I missed something.</p>
<p>Since the dates selected are the span of a work week I cannot go. The sc=
heduling reprecussions would be too difficult to absorb.</p>
<p>I would be happy to make myself available on Monday and Wednesday evenin=
g on IRC, however.</p>
<p>If enough people can&#39;t make it and doing telepresence on a larger sc=
ale makes sense, I would be willing to take a few days off work to make tha=
t more productive. I don&#39;t think doing telepresence makes sense if ther=
e is a conference as those who would be remote would likely reduce the conf=
erence productivity as much as aid it due to synchronization overhead.<br>

</p>

--0016e6de00ed4e1b9d049a7410e1--
From fredm@gnome.org  Sun Jan 23 01:23:12 2011
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Date: Sun, 23 Jan 2011 09:22:51 +0800
From: Frederic Muller <fredm@gnome.org>
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To: "Jason D. Clinton" <me@jasonclinton.com>
Subject: Re: Official announcement and invitation to GNOME 3.0 Hackfest and
	GNOME.Asia Summit 2011
References: <4D39A922.5010108@gnome.org>	<20110122180404.GR21120@vuntz.net>
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On 01/23/2011 03:06 AM, Jason D. Clinton wrote:
> On Jan 22, 2011 12:04 PM, "Vincent Untz" <vuntz@gnome.org
> <mailto:vuntz@gnome.org>> wrote:
>  >
>  > Le vendredi 21 janvier 2011, à 23:41 +0800, Frederic Muller a écrit :
>  > > So Hackfest registration is happening here:
>  > > http://live.gnome.org/Hackfests/GNOME.Asia2011 , call for papers for
>  > > the conference is here http://live.gnome.org/GnomeAsia/CallForPaper
>  > > and conference registration will be opening soon.
>  >
>  > What's the plan on the marketing team side? Do we have people who can
>  > go? I didn't see any replies on marketing-list to the previous mails,
>  > unless I missed something.
>
> Since the dates selected are the span of a work week I cannot go. The
> scheduling reprecussions would be too difficult to absorb.
>
> I would be happy to make myself available on Monday and Wednesday
> evening on IRC, however.
>
> If enough people can't make it and doing telepresence on a larger scale
> makes sense, I would be willing to take a few days off work to make that
> more productive. I don't think doing telepresence makes sense if there
> is a conference as those who would be remote would likely reduce the
> conference productivity as much as aid it due to synchronization overhead.

What about 3 days only, from March 30th to April 1st?
Fred
From andreasn.pixel@gmail.com  Sun Jan 23 12:24:10 2011
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On 01/22/2011 07:04 PM, Vincent Untz wrote:
> Le vendredi 21 janvier 2011, à 23:41 +0800, Frederic Muller a écrit :
>> So Hackfest registration is happening here:
>> http://live.gnome.org/Hackfests/GNOME.Asia2011 , call for papers for
>> the conference is here http://live.gnome.org/GnomeAsia/CallForPaper
>> and conference registration will be opening soon.
> What's the plan on the marketing team side? Do we have people who can
> go? I didn't see any replies on marketing-list to the previous mails,
> unless I missed something.
I think can go. Sounds fun.
- Andreas

From fredm@gnome.org  Sun Jan 23 13:37:17 2011
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Subject: Re: Official announcement and invitation to GNOME 3.0 Hackfest and
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On 01/23/2011 08:23 PM, Andreas Nilsson wrote:
> On 01/22/2011 07:04 PM, Vincent Untz wrote:
>> Le vendredi 21 janvier 2011, à 23:41 +0800, Frederic Muller a écrit :
>>> So Hackfest registration is happening here:
>>> http://live.gnome.org/Hackfests/GNOME.Asia2011 , call for papers for
>>> the conference is here http://live.gnome.org/GnomeAsia/CallForPaper
>>> and conference registration will be opening soon.
>> What's the plan on the marketing team side? Do we have people who can
>> go? I didn't see any replies on marketing-list to the previous mails,
>> unless I missed something.
> I think can go. Sounds fun.
> - Andreas
>

Hey thanks!

Actually the initial plan was 5 days (plan from September), then after 
Gnome Bostom Summit we reduced to 3 days based on feedback from Jason 
and a few other people living in the US and for whom the whole trip 
would be a bit long. It turned out that the release team prefers 5 days 
so this is what we have finally chosen:
3 days + 2 optional days hackfest + 1 conference day. The first 2 days 
are actually the optional ones and happening in Intel office who 
committed for space for 20 people and the next 3 days are happening in 
the university (with as much space as we need) where the conference will 
happen as well. This way people attending 'only' 3 days can also take 
part in the conference and the little tour trip the following day all 
together.

We thought that would be the best comprise fitting everyone's wishes.

There is still one unknown parameter: an extra conference day. 
Considering we will have all those great people from marketing, release 
and maybe documentation (Documentation is having a hackfest in Toronto 1 
week before), one day conference is very short. So based on sponsorship 
revenues and talks submitted we'll try to get an extra day.

I hope this clarifies any misunderstanding. It is sometimes hard to go 
into all those details in public announcements. In anyone needs further 
clarification please do not hesitate to email us or drop by on 
#asia-summit .

Thank you for all the support and we really hope to see some of you in 
Bangalore!

Fred
From vdepizzol@gmail.com  Sun Jan 23 17:08:30 2011
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References: <4D39A922.5010108@gnome.org> <20110122180404.GR21120@vuntz.net>
From: Vinicius Depizzol <vdepizzol@gmail.com>
Date: Sun, 23 Jan 2011 15:07:37 -0200
Message-ID: <AANLkTi=_ufvVYJbd4qgOWrisqFxUMt7_UfYjMRRM9nBr@mail.gmail.com>
Subject: Re: Official announcement and invitation to GNOME 3.0 Hackfest and
	GNOME.Asia Summit 2011
To: GNOME Marketing List <marketing-list@gnome.org>, release-team@gnome.org, 
	Foundation-List <foundation-list@gnome.org>
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On Sat, Jan 22, 2011 at 16:04, Vincent Untz <vuntz@gnome.org> wrote:
>
> What's the plan on the marketing team side? Do we have people who can
> go? I didn't see any replies on marketing-list to the previous mails,
> unless I missed something.
>

Hey there!

I would really like to go, but at the moment I am worried about how
much it would cost for me to go from Brazil to India. Kayak.com tells
me it is a 27 hours flight with prices from about USD 1800.

Considering that with this amount of money I can almost attend to two
European events, I would rather prefer to meet you guys later in some
closer venue.

-- Vinicius
From pockeylam@gnome.org  Mon Jan 24 02:21:02 2011
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Date: Mon, 24 Jan 2011 10:20:44 +0800
From: Pockey Lam <pockeylam@gnome.org>
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To: GNOME Marketing List <marketing-list@gnome.org>
Subject: Fwd: GNOME 3.0 launch parties support from the GNOME Foundation
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--------------010300090004080503050305
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Dear all,

So far we have contacted some local GNOME mailing lists, we also 
contacted all the local communities from this contact list: 
http://live.gnome.org/GnomeAsia/ContactList , they are mainly in Asia. 
We have 10 registered launch parties until now.

Please help to promote it to every local communities that you know! We 
are targeting 100 launch parties!

Thanks,
Pockey

-------- Original Message --------
Subject: 	GNOME 3.0 launch parties support from the GNOME Foundation
Date: 	Sat, 22 Jan 2011 00:13:37 +0800
From: 	Frederic Muller <fredm@gnome.org>
To: 	gugmasters-list@gnome.org, GNOME Marketing List 
<marketing-list@gnome.org>, Foundation-List <foundation-list@gnome.org>



Dear all,

GNOME 3.0 will be officially released on April 6th 2011! Have you
started to plan for your own GNOME 3.0 Launch Party in your region yet?

Here is the good news! For those organizing a launch party, The GNOME
Foundation will give away some goodies (t-shirts, balloons, stickers,
other stuff) to support your events. Registration is starting now and
attribution will be on a first come first serve basis and within
availability.

You can find more information about GNOME 3.0 at http://www.gnome3.org,
more information about Launch Parties at
http://live.gnome.org/ThreePointZero/LaunchParty, more information to
prepare your own GNOME 3.0 party at
http://live.gnome.org/ThreePointZero/LaunchParty/Resources and more
information about the goodies at
http://live.gnome.org/ThreePointZero/Goodies .

Should you have any question please use the GNOME User Groups mailing
list at http://mail.gnome.org/mailman/listinfo/gugmasters-list or find
us on GNOME IRC servers in #gnome-love channel.

Please help us spread the word and get a few launch parties in your
area. Register and document your event at
http://live.gnome.org/ThreePointZero/LaunchParty#Locations making sure
you supply a valid email address.

Happy GNOME 3.0 Release Party!
_______________________________________________
foundation-list mailing list
foundation-list@gnome.org
http://mail.gnome.org/mailman/listinfo/foundation-list



--------------010300090004080503050305
Content-Type: text/html; charset=ISO-8859-1
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<!DOCTYPE HTML PUBLIC "-//W3C//DTD HTML 4.01 Transitional//EN">
<html>
  <head>

    <meta http-equiv="content-type" content="text/html; charset=ISO-8859-1">
  </head>
  <body text="#000000" bgcolor="#ffffff">
    <font face="Helvetica, Arial, sans-serif">Dear all, <br>
      <br>
      So far we have contacted some local GNOME mailing lists, we also
      contacted all the local communities from this contact list: </font><a class="moz-txt-link-freetext" href="http://live.gnome.org/GnomeAsia/ContactList">http://live.gnome.org/GnomeAsia/ContactList</a>
    , they are mainly in Asia. We have 10 registered launch parties
    until now. <br>
    <br>
    <font face="Helvetica, Arial, sans-serif">Please help to promote it
      to every local communities that you know! We are targeting 100
      launch parties! <br>
      <br>
      Thanks,<br>
      Pockey <br>
    </font><br>
    -------- Original Message --------
    <table class="moz-email-headers-table" cellpadding="0"
      cellspacing="0" border="0">
      <tbody>
        <tr>
          <th nowrap="nowrap" valign="BASELINE" align="RIGHT">Subject: </th>
          <td>GNOME 3.0 launch parties support from the GNOME Foundation</td>
        </tr>
        <tr>
          <th nowrap="nowrap" valign="BASELINE" align="RIGHT">Date: </th>
          <td>Sat, 22 Jan 2011 00:13:37 +0800</td>
        </tr>
        <tr>
          <th nowrap="nowrap" valign="BASELINE" align="RIGHT">From: </th>
          <td>Frederic Muller <a class="moz-txt-link-rfc2396E" href="mailto:fredm@gnome.org">&lt;fredm@gnome.org&gt;</a></td>
        </tr>
        <tr>
          <th nowrap="nowrap" valign="BASELINE" align="RIGHT">To: </th>
          <td><a class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href="mailto:gugmasters-list@gnome.org">gugmasters-list@gnome.org</a>, GNOME Marketing List
            <a class="moz-txt-link-rfc2396E" href="mailto:marketing-list@gnome.org">&lt;marketing-list@gnome.org&gt;</a>, Foundation-List
            <a class="moz-txt-link-rfc2396E" href="mailto:foundation-list@gnome.org">&lt;foundation-list@gnome.org&gt;</a></td>
        </tr>
      </tbody>
    </table>
    <br>
    <br>
    <pre>Dear all,

GNOME 3.0 will be officially released on April 6th 2011! Have you 
started to plan for your own GNOME 3.0 Launch Party in your region yet?

Here is the good news! For those organizing a launch party, The GNOME 
Foundation will give away some goodies (t-shirts, balloons, stickers, 
other stuff) to support your events. Registration is starting now and 
attribution will be on a first come first serve basis and within 
availability.

You can find more information about GNOME 3.0 at <a class="moz-txt-link-freetext" href="http://www.gnome3.org">http://www.gnome3.org</a>, 
more information about Launch Parties at 
<a class="moz-txt-link-freetext" href="http://live.gnome.org/ThreePointZero/LaunchParty">http://live.gnome.org/ThreePointZero/LaunchParty</a>, more information to 
prepare your own GNOME 3.0 party at 
<a class="moz-txt-link-freetext" href="http://live.gnome.org/ThreePointZero/LaunchParty/Resources">http://live.gnome.org/ThreePointZero/LaunchParty/Resources</a> and more 
information about the goodies at 
<a class="moz-txt-link-freetext" href="http://live.gnome.org/ThreePointZero/Goodies">http://live.gnome.org/ThreePointZero/Goodies</a> .

Should you have any question please use the GNOME User Groups mailing 
list at <a class="moz-txt-link-freetext" href="http://mail.gnome.org/mailman/listinfo/gugmasters-list">http://mail.gnome.org/mailman/listinfo/gugmasters-list</a> or find 
us on GNOME IRC servers in #gnome-love channel.

Please help us spread the word and get a few launch parties in your 
area. Register and document your event at 
<a class="moz-txt-link-freetext" href="http://live.gnome.org/ThreePointZero/LaunchParty#Locations">http://live.gnome.org/ThreePointZero/LaunchParty#Locations</a> making sure 
you supply a valid email address.

Happy GNOME 3.0 Release Party!
_______________________________________________
foundation-list mailing list
<a class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href="mailto:foundation-list@gnome.org">foundation-list@gnome.org</a>
<a class="moz-txt-link-freetext" href="http://mail.gnome.org/mailman/listinfo/foundation-list">http://mail.gnome.org/mailman/listinfo/foundation-list</a>

</pre>
  </body>
</html>

--------------010300090004080503050305--
From allanpday@gmail.com  Mon Jan 24 09:01:56 2011
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Subject: Re: 4/14 Friends of GNOME videos finished and posted
From: Allan Day <allanpday@gmail.com>
To: "Jason D. Clinton" <me@jasonclinton.com>
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Jason D. Clinton wrote: 
> On Sat, Jan 22, 2011 at 07:05, Allan Day <allanpday@gmail.com> wrote:
>         
>         It would be really good to have screenshots from this kind of
>         system for
>         
>         gnome3.org. (Hint hint!) 
> 
> Thoughts on optimal screen size for screen shots? I'm targeting
> 1280x720 for the videos (for obvious reasons) but I could use the
> xrandr scale magic to get a native screen of any size for the screen
> shots.

Good question. The main consideration is what looks best; anything in
the 1280x800 - 1366x768 range seems fine in my experience. (1366x768 is
the resolution of the images that are on the site at the moment.)

Best,

Allan
-- 
Blog: http://afaikblog.wordpress.com/
IRC: aday on irc.gnome.org

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Subject: Re: Official announcement and invitation to GNOME 3.0 Hackfest and
	GNOME.Asia Summit 2011
From: Allan Day <allanpday@gmail.com>
To: Vincent Untz <vuntz@gnome.org>
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References: <4D39A922.5010108@gnome.org>  <20110122180404.GR21120@vuntz.net>
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Vincent Untz wrote:
> Le vendredi 21 janvier 2011, à 23:41 +0800, Frederic Muller a écrit :
> > So Hackfest registration is happening here:
> > http://live.gnome.org/Hackfests/GNOME.Asia2011 , call for papers for
> > the conference is here http://live.gnome.org/GnomeAsia/CallForPaper
> > and conference registration will be opening soon.
> 
> What's the plan on the marketing team side? Do we have people who can
> go? I didn't see any replies on marketing-list to the previous mails,
> unless I missed something.

Yes, I think I can go; and I think it would be good to have a marketing
gettogether around that time.

Best,

Allan
-- 
Blog: http://afaikblog.wordpress.com/
IRC: aday on irc.gnome.org

From clschwarm@googlemail.com  Mon Jan 24 15:20:13 2011
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Subject: Integrating Flattr?
From: Claus Schwarm <clschwarm@googlemail.com>
To: GNOME Marketing List <marketing-list@gnome.org>
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Date: Mon, 24 Jan 2011 16:19:54 +0100
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I just stumbled upon Flattr [1]. GNOME's on their users' wishlist [2].

Currently, it's probably not going to generate much money. But it might
by worth to support such a donation system by integrating it into
GNOME's various websites.

Also, it may be used as a popularity index, if one assumes that people
click the flattr button for stuff they like.

Just a thought.

Regards, 
 Claus

[1] https://flattr.com/
[2] https://flattr.com/wishlist

From brian.cameron@oracle.com  Mon Jan 24 16:25:56 2011
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Subject: Re: Official announcement and invitation to GNOME 3.0 Hackfest and
	GNOME.Asia Summit 2011
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Vinicius:

> I would really like to go, but at the moment I am worried about how
> much it would cost for me to go from Brazil to India. Kayak.com tells
> me it is a 27 hours flight with prices from about USD 1800.
>
> Considering that with this amount of money I can almost attend to two
> European events, I would rather prefer to meet you guys later in some
> closer venue.

If travel cost is the only concern, please consider submitting an
application for travel subsidy.

   http://live.gnome.org/Travel

Remember that applications that do a good job of explaining the things
you expect to do and get done at the hackfest tend to be taken most
seriously.  Having a good plan is a more important selection criteria
than the cost of travel.

Brian
From shaunm@gnome.org  Mon Jan 24 19:31:01 2011
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Subject: Re: Official announcement and invitation to GNOME 3.0 Hackfest and
	GNOME.Asia Summit 2011
From: Shaun McCance <shaunm@gnome.org>
To: Andre Klapper <ak-47@gmx.net>
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On Sat, 2011-01-22 at 19:45 +0100, Andre Klapper wrote:
> On Sat, 2011-01-22 at 19:04 +0100, Vincent Untz wrote:
> > Le vendredi 21 janvier 2011, à 23:41 +0800, Frederic Muller a écrit :
> > > So Hackfest registration is happening here:
> > > http://live.gnome.org/Hackfests/GNOME.Asia2011 , call for papers for
> > > the conference is here http://live.gnome.org/GnomeAsia/CallForPaper
> > > and conference registration will be opening soon.
> > 
> > What's the plan on the marketing team side? Do we have people who can
> > go? I didn't see any replies on marketing-list to the previous mails,
> > unless I missed something.
> 
> Same question goes for Documentation.

The documentation team will have a hackfest a few weeks earlier
in Toronto. There are two main reasons for having that hackfest
instead of using GNOME.Asia. First, more of our team can attend.
Second, any work we do in the last few days leading up to the
release won't get translated.

--
Shaun


From me@jasonclinton.com  Tue Jan 25 21:10:58 2011
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Subject: Re: 4/14 Friends of GNOME videos finished and posted
From: "Jason D. Clinton" <me@jasonclinton.com>
To: allanpday@gmail.com
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--0016364d2633f4d791049ab225bb
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8

On Mon, Jan 24, 2011 at 03:01, Allan Day <allanpday@gmail.com> wrote:

> Jason D. Clinton wrote:
> > On Sat, Jan 22, 2011 at 07:05, Allan Day <allanpday@gmail.com> wrote:
> >
> >         It would be really good to have screenshots from this kind of
> >         system for
> >
> >         gnome3.org. (Hint hint!)
> >
> > Thoughts on optimal screen size for screen shots? I'm targeting
> > 1280x720 for the videos (for obvious reasons) but I could use the
> > xrandr scale magic to get a native screen of any size for the screen
> > shots.
>
> Good question. The main consideration is what looks best; anything in
> the 1280x800 - 1366x768 range seems fine in my experience. (1366x768 is
> the resolution of the images that are on the site at the moment.)
>

I have uploaded all new screen shots, added three more, and added five new
text areas. The last commit adds the text areas and needs a little
iteration. Please feel free to tweak it without clearing it with me before
posting it.

Also feel free to publish the updated screen shots without my last commit if
you feel you'd like to go live immediately without the added text areas.

--0016364d2633f4d791049ab225bb
Content-Type: text/html; charset=UTF-8
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

<div class=3D"gmail_quote">On Mon, Jan 24, 2011 at 03:01, Allan Day <span d=
ir=3D"ltr">&lt;<a href=3D"mailto:allanpday@gmail.com">allanpday@gmail.com</=
a>&gt;</span> wrote:<br><blockquote class=3D"gmail_quote" style=3D"margin:0=
 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex;">
<div><div></div><div class=3D"h5">Jason D. Clinton wrote:<br>
&gt; On Sat, Jan 22, 2011 at 07:05, Allan Day &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:allanpd=
ay@gmail.com">allanpday@gmail.com</a>&gt; wrote:<br>
&gt;<br>
&gt; =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 It would be really good to have screenshot=
s from this kind of<br>
&gt; =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 system for<br>
&gt;<br>
&gt; =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 <a href=3D"http://gnome3.org" target=3D"_b=
lank">gnome3.org</a>. (Hint hint!)<br>
&gt;<br>
&gt; Thoughts on optimal screen size for screen shots? I&#39;m targeting<br=
>
&gt; 1280x720 for the videos (for obvious reasons) but I could use the<br>
&gt; xrandr scale magic to get a native screen of any size for the screen<b=
r>
&gt; shots.<br>
<br>
</div></div>Good question. The main consideration is what looks best; anyth=
ing in<br>
the 1280x800 - 1366x768 range seems fine in my experience. (1366x768 is<br>
the resolution of the images that are on the site at the moment.)<br></bloc=
kquote><div><br>I have uploaded all new screen shots, added three more, and=
 added five new text areas. The last commit adds the text areas and needs a=
 little iteration. Please feel free to tweak it without clearing it with me=
 before posting it.<br>
<br>Also feel free to publish the updated screen shots without my last comm=
it if you feel you&#39;d like to go live immediately without the added text=
 areas.<br><br></div></div>

--0016364d2633f4d791049ab225bb--
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Subject: Re: 4/14 Friends of GNOME videos finished and posted
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--0016e64c2e1ca43090049ab250ec
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On Tue, Jan 25, 2011 at 15:10, Jason D. Clinton <me@jasonclinton.com> wrote:

> The last commit adds the text areas and needs a little iteration. Please
> feel free to tweak it without clearing it with me before posting it.
>
> Also feel free to publish the updated screen shots without my last commit
> if you feel you'd like to go live immediately without the added text areas.
>

Well, I was under the impression that a publishing step was required but I
guess it's live already. Oops!

I'll iterate on the text a little more now to make it presentable but feel
free to remove or comment out areas at a whim.

--0016e64c2e1ca43090049ab250ec
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<div class=3D"gmail_quote">On Tue, Jan 25, 2011 at 15:10, Jason D. Clinton =
<span dir=3D"ltr">&lt;<a href=3D"mailto:me@jasonclinton.com">me@jasonclinto=
n.com</a>&gt;</span> wrote:<br><blockquote class=3D"gmail_quote" style=3D"m=
argin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex;">
<div class=3D"gmail_quote">The last commit adds the text areas and needs a =
little iteration. Please feel free to tweak it without clearing it with me =
before posting it.<br><div>
<br>Also feel free to publish the updated screen shots without my last comm=
it if you feel you&#39;d like to go live immediately without the added text=
 areas.<br></div></div>
</blockquote></div><br>Well, I was under the impression that a publishing s=
tep was required but I guess it&#39;s live already. Oops!<br><br>I&#39;ll i=
terate on the text a little more now to make it presentable but feel free t=
o remove or comment out areas at a whim.<br>
<br>

--0016e64c2e1ca43090049ab250ec--
From og.maciel@gmail.com  Wed Jan 26 15:26:37 2011
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Subject: Questions about FoG and campaigns
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Hi guys,

I wanted to ask about your opinions on how we currently coordinate our
campaigns. Paul and I have discussed this a bit on irc and I believe
that we need to discuss about how we want to handle it going forward.

>From what I understood, being the marketing newbie, we currently have
2 recurring annual campaigns: one for the end of the year which
usually ends at the end of the Xmas/New Year festivities and another
one with a more specific goal, such as paying for hardware, hackfests,
etc. Due to some delays in getting all the web site components in
place for the "end of year" campaign of 2010, there was no clear start
and end delimiters set and that campaign is still active though nobody
really spelled out that it was a "end of the year" campaign. In other
words, whoever goes to our FoG page won't know that we're still doing
a "end of year" campaign.

I wanted to discuss about how many campaigns do we want to do this
year and if we want to turn the specific campaign into something that
can vary (i.e. A11Y campaigns, Hardware campaigns, etc)? Also, what do
we do with the current campaign? Do we want to end it? The goal was to
get 400 new subscribers but we've only managed to get 30.\

Sooo, going forward:

* Do we want to change the current number of campaigns per year?
* If so, do we vary the theme for the second campaign?
* what are the dates we should be holding them?
* Should we kill off the current one?

Thanks in advance,
-- 
Og B. Maciel
GNOME Foundation Board of Directors

omaciel@foresightlinux.org
ogmaciel@gnome.org

GPG Keys: D5CFC202

http://www.ogmaciel.com (en_US)
http://blog.ogmaciel.com (pt_BR)
From allanpday@gmail.com  Wed Jan 26 16:03:21 2011
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Subject: GNOME 3 Q&A
From: Allan Day <allanpday@gmail.com>
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Hi all,

A GNOME 3 Q&A session would be an extremely beneficial part of our
marketing campaign. It would demonstrate that GNOME is open and cares
about its users, and it would be an effective way of dealing with
negative comments on the web. It's really good to be able to say 'if
you have concerns, please come and talk to us'.

Do people think this is a good idea? If you do, how do we make it
happen? The first thing we'll need are volunteers...

Best,

Allan
From paul.r.cutler@gmail.com  Wed Jan 26 16:05:21 2011
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Hi all,

Sumana and I have (well, mostly Sumana) have been talking and planning
some upcoming issues of GNOME Journal.  We're currently working on a
special edition with GNOME Hispano, and we'd like to quickly follow
that with an issue focused on GNOME 3.0.  The GNOME 3.0 issue is
tentatively scheduled for for April 3rd, right before the 3.0 release.
 We're looking for articles on the new features, updates to
applications, interviews, you name it - and we need your help!

Please let Sumana and I know if you'd like to contribute an article.
You can ping us in #gnome-journal on IRC or feel free to shoot us an
email or reply on the gnome-journal list.

Thanks!

Paul
From paul.r.cutler@gmail.com  Wed Jan 26 16:06:02 2011
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Subject: Re: GNOME 3 Q&A
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Hi Allan,

I think this is a good idea - are you thinking a live session in IRC
or something else?

Paul

On Wed, Jan 26, 2011 at 10:03 AM, Allan Day <allanpday@gmail.com> wrote:
> Hi all,
>
> A GNOME 3 Q&A session would be an extremely beneficial part of our
> marketing campaign. It would demonstrate that GNOME is open and cares
> about its users, and it would be an effective way of dealing with
> negative comments on the web. It's really good to be able to say 'if
> you have concerns, please come and talk to us'.
>
> Do people think this is a good idea? If you do, how do we make it
> happen? The first thing we'll need are volunteers...
>
> Best,
>
> Allan
> --
> marketing-list mailing list
> marketing-list@gnome.org
> http://mail.gnome.org/mailman/listinfo/marketing-list
>
From me@jasonclinton.com  Wed Jan 26 16:07:43 2011
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Subject: Re: GNOME 3 Q&A
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On Wed, Jan 26, 2011 at 10:03, Allan Day <allanpday@gmail.com> wrote:
> A GNOME 3 Q&A session would be an extremely beneficial part of our
> marketing campaign. It would demonstrate that GNOME is open and cares
> about its users, and it would be an effective way of dealing with
> negative comments on the web. It's really good to be able to say 'if
> you have concerns, please come and talk to us'.
>
> Do people think this is a good idea? If you do, how do we make it
> happen? The first thing we'll need are volunteers...

I think it would be great to do this with volunteers on the marketing
team but I do not want to make it a requirement that any other teams
contribute: their plates are already full. We could certain extend an
invitation to other teams, though.

My recommendation would be to use the existing #gnome on GIMPnet which
already frequently gets user questions that go unanswered. Perhaps we
could establish office hours like the design team has done.
From paul.r.cutler@gmail.com  Wed Jan 26 16:08:52 2011
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Subject: Re: Questions about FoG and campaigns
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Hi Og,

Thanks for starting the thread.

A little background - at the two marketing hackfests last year we
spend a lot of time talking about fundraising. One of the goals behind
two campaigns a year was to tie them to GNOME releases (when we're
getting a lot of press) and we didn't want to be out there a lot
asking for donations.  We were hoping to have targeted campaigns with
specific goals that would help people feel like they were a part of
something.  We originally planned on one fundraising campaign to raise
funds for all of GNOME and one campaign a year with a theme, such as
the sysadmin hiring last year.

What do others think?  These ideas aren't set in stone, but the key is
to have the marketing team participate so we're getting the word out
via the website, blog posts, microblogging, etc.  (Which is the big
concern I have with the banner being up right now - we don't have any
support for it going on).

I look forward to hearing others thoughts.

Paul

On Wed, Jan 26, 2011 at 9:26 AM, Og Maciel <ogmaciel@gnome.org> wrote:
> Hi guys,
>
> I wanted to ask about your opinions on how we currently coordinate our
> campaigns. Paul and I have discussed this a bit on irc and I believe
> that we need to discuss about how we want to handle it going forward.
>
> From what I understood, being the marketing newbie, we currently have
> 2 recurring annual campaigns: one for the end of the year which
> usually ends at the end of the Xmas/New Year festivities and another
> one with a more specific goal, such as paying for hardware, hackfests,
> etc. Due to some delays in getting all the web site components in
> place for the "end of year" campaign of 2010, there was no clear start
> and end delimiters set and that campaign is still active though nobody
> really spelled out that it was a "end of the year" campaign. In other
> words, whoever goes to our FoG page won't know that we're still doing
> a "end of year" campaign.
>
> I wanted to discuss about how many campaigns do we want to do this
> year and if we want to turn the specific campaign into something that
> can vary (i.e. A11Y campaigns, Hardware campaigns, etc)? Also, what do
> we do with the current campaign? Do we want to end it? The goal was to
> get 400 new subscribers but we've only managed to get 30.\
>
> Sooo, going forward:
>
> * Do we want to change the current number of campaigns per year?
> * If so, do we vary the theme for the second campaign?
> * what are the dates we should be holding them?
> * Should we kill off the current one?
>
> Thanks in advance,
> --
> Og B. Maciel
> GNOME Foundation Board of Directors
>
> omaciel@foresightlinux.org
> ogmaciel@gnome.org
>
> GPG Keys: D5CFC202
>
> http://www.ogmaciel.com (en_US)
> http://blog.ogmaciel.com (pt_BR)
> --
> marketing-list mailing list
> marketing-list@gnome.org
> http://mail.gnome.org/mailman/listinfo/marketing-list
>
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To re-inforce and make it a bit more clear what my intentions were
with my email:

I need the input from the marketing team in order to create a roadmap
of activities and milestones for the FoG campaigns this year. The way
I see it, I'd like to have not one but a few thematic campaigns spread
across the year in order to support the many different projects of
GNOME. For instance, I'd like to have a campaign to support the
accessibility crew right off the bat, following it with another
campaign to support the docs guys.

A possible solution for supporting these different projects may be to
ask the Board to provide earmarking for them but I feel that this
would be too cumbersome to handle for a variety of reasons. Obviously,
if the Board decides to allow earmarking then we don't need campaigns
but I feel that people would donate more willing-fully if there is a
very specific reason behind it.

Since we last spoke at last year's Boston Summit I felt that people
didn't make their priority to deliver what they had promised. Now,
obviously being the end of the year I understand that people were
already spread thin but our end of year campaign suffered when not all
the moving parts came together on time. So going forward, I want to
schedule campaigns a few months in advance so that we can all have
enough time to work on our tasks. Would 6-month campaigns give enough
time to deliver a well oiled campaign? I believe that there are
already plans to do a campaign for buying hardware (sysadmin) and
another one for a11y. We could also do one for the Women's Outreach
program, so... should we extend the current campaign until June and
then do back-to-back-to-back campaigns for them? That would give us 5
months to work on them and make sure everything is ready.

What do you guys think?
-- 
Og B. Maciel
GNOME Foundation Board of Directors

omaciel@foresightlinux.org
ogmaciel@gnome.org

GPG Keys: D5CFC202

http://www.ogmaciel.com (en_US)
http://blog.ogmaciel.com (pt_BR)
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On Wed, Jan 26, 2011 at 10:05, Paul Cutler <pcutler@gnome.org> wrote:
> =C2=A0We're looking for articles on the new features, updates to
> applications, interviews, you name it - and we need your help!

Might be good to ask d-d-l as a part of the process of getting people
thinking about release notes.
From me@jasonclinton.com  Wed Jan 26 16:24:42 2011
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Subject: Re: Questions about FoG and campaigns
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On Wed, Jan 26, 2011 at 10:08, Og Maciel <ogmaciel@gnome.org> wrote:
> Since we last spoke at last year's Boston Summit I felt that people
> didn't make their priority to deliver what they had promised. Now,
> obviously being the end of the year I understand that people were
> already spread thin but our end of year campaign suffered when not all
> the moving parts came together on time. So going forward, I want to
> schedule campaigns a few months in advance so that we can all have
> enough time to work on our tasks. Would 6-month campaigns give enough
> time to deliver a well oiled campaign? I believe that there are
> already plans to do a campaign for buying hardware (sysadmin) and
> another one for a11y. We could also do one for the Women's Outreach
> program, so... should we extend the current campaign until June and
> then do back-to-back-to-back campaigns for them? That would give us 5
> months to work on them and make sure everything is ready.
>
> What do you guys think?

Yes, we didn't achieve our goals (me included) but I think there's
some great go-energy behind Andreas' redesign of the site[1]. I have
already volunteered to modify it to support the FoG videos[2]. I would
be willing to add to my volunteer responsibilities finishing what
Andreas has started (with his approval). It looks like some tweaks and
details on the site need to be ironed out and I could additionally
create, in advance, the suggested variations for each of the
campaigns.

I guess the question would be: do the campaigns switch like clock-work
or do we do it manually depending on how close we are to the goal when
the time for the next campaign period arrives?

[1] http://www.andreasn.se/diverse/temp/friends-of-gnome-2.0/
[2] http://people.gnome.org/~jclinton/FoG/
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Subject: Re: Questions about FoG and campaigns
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On Wed, Jan 26, 2011 at 11:24 AM, Jason D. Clinton <me@jasonclinton.com> wrote:
> I guess the question would be: do the campaigns switch like clock-work
> or do we do it manually depending on how close we are to the goal when
> the time for the next campaign period arrives?

I'd like to have campaigns scheduled in advance so that we can better
plan things out.
-- 
Og B. Maciel
GNOME Foundation Board of Directors

omaciel@foresightlinux.org
ogmaciel@gnome.org

GPG Keys: D5CFC202

http://www.ogmaciel.com (en_US)
http://blog.ogmaciel.com (pt_BR)
From paul.r.cutler@gmail.com  Wed Jan 26 16:35:37 2011
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I agree - I also think they should be for a specific time period.
They lose potency and impact if they're around too long.  Luis Villa
sent me this link - it's a long read, but well worth it on how
successful fundraising on Kickstarter worked.  When you look at the
timing of when people give in relation to how long the campaign is, is
very interesting.

http://craigmod.com/journal/kickstartup/

Paul

On Wed, Jan 26, 2011 at 10:28 AM, Og Maciel <ogmaciel@gnome.org> wrote:
> On Wed, Jan 26, 2011 at 11:24 AM, Jason D. Clinton <me@jasonclinton.com> wrote:
>> I guess the question would be: do the campaigns switch like clock-work
>> or do we do it manually depending on how close we are to the goal when
>> the time for the next campaign period arrives?
>
> I'd like to have campaigns scheduled in advance so that we can better
> plan things out.
> --
> Og B. Maciel
> GNOME Foundation Board of Directors
>
> omaciel@foresightlinux.org
> ogmaciel@gnome.org
>
> GPG Keys: D5CFC202
>
> http://www.ogmaciel.com (en_US)
> http://blog.ogmaciel.com (pt_BR)
> --
> marketing-list mailing list
> marketing-list@gnome.org
> http://mail.gnome.org/mailman/listinfo/marketing-list
>
From allanpday@gmail.com  Wed Jan 26 16:41:04 2011
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Paul Cutler <pcutler@gnome.org> wrote:
> I think this is a good idea - are you thinking a live session in IRC
> or something else?

IRC was my first thought, though I'm open to suggestions. We might
want to combine a live IRC session with a resource that's available on
the web, for example. Many people aren't able to get on IRC...

Allan
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On Wed, 2011-01-26 at 10:09 -0600, Jason D. Clinton wrote:
> On Wed, Jan 26, 2011 at 10:05, Paul Cutler <pcutler@gnome.org> wrote:
> >  We're looking for articles on the new features, updates to
> > applications, interviews, you name it - and we need your help!
> 
> Might be good to ask d-d-l as a part of the process of getting people
> thinking about release notes.

For the records: Traditionally there is http://live.gnome.org/RoadMap
for release notes planning, which as usual is welcome for updates.

andre
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From allanpday@gmail.com  Wed Jan 26 16:52:55 2011
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Subject: Re: GNOME 3 Q&A
From: Allan Day <allanpday@gmail.com>
To: "Jason D. Clinton" <me@jasonclinton.com>
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Jason D. Clinton <me@jasonclinton.com> wrote:
> On Wed, Jan 26, 2011 at 10:03, Allan Day <allanpday@gmail.com> wrote:
>> A GNOME 3 Q&A session would be an extremely beneficial part of our
>> marketing campaign. It would demonstrate that GNOME is open and cares
>> about its users, and it would be an effective way of dealing with
>> negative comments on the web. It's really good to be able to say 'if
>> you have concerns, please come and talk to us'.
>>
>> Do people think this is a good idea? If you do, how do we make it
>> happen? The first thing we'll need are volunteers...
>
> I think it would be great to do this with volunteers on the marketing
> team but I do not want to make it a requirement that any other teams
> contribute: their plates are already full. We could certain extend an
> invitation to other teams, though.

Agreed: certainly not a requirement. We want a small bunch of people
who are willing and able (and have a plan). That said, it would also
be good to be able to pitch it as an opportunity to meet the GNOME 3
designers and developers.

> My recommendation would be to use the existing #gnome on GIMPnet which
> already frequently gets user questions that go unanswered. Perhaps we
> could establish office hours like the design team has done.

Makes sense. Or #gnome3, perhaps?

Allan
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On Wed, Jan 26, 2011 at 11:40 AM, Allan Day <allanpday@gmail.com> wrote:
> Paul Cutler <pcutler@gnome.org> wrote:
>> I think this is a good idea - are you thinking a live session in IRC
>> or something else?
>
> IRC was my first thought, though I'm open to suggestions. We might
> want to combine a live IRC session with a resource that's available on
> the web, for example. Many people aren't able to get on IRC...
>

Web IRC clients work fine. mibbit.com has been the recommendation for
GNOME Hispano IRC talks and it usually has half of the logged in
users.

The trick is to have a big blinking link that says "JOIN THE CHAT"
that takes you directly to mibbit, in that precise room.
From sri@ramkrishna.me  Wed Jan 26 21:08:05 2011
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--20cf30549dcff3cff1049ac63996
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On Wed, Jan 26, 2011 at 8:07 AM, Jason D. Clinton <me@jasonclinton.com>wrote:

> On Wed, Jan 26, 2011 at 10:03, Allan Day <allanpday@gmail.com> wrote:
> > A GNOME 3 Q&A session would be an extremely beneficial part of our
> > marketing campaign. It would demonstrate that GNOME is open and cares
> > about its users, and it would be an effective way of dealing with
> > negative comments on the web. It's really good to be able to say 'if
> > you have concerns, please come and talk to us'.
>
>
My recommendation would be to use the existing #gnome on GIMPnet which
> already frequently gets user questions that go unanswered. Perhaps we
> could establish office hours like the design team has done.
>

+1

This will helkp me as answering questions will fill in gaps in my own
knowledge or detect if knowledge has gone stale.  So I wouldn't mind doing
that...  although trying to do that while doing a day job might be a bit
tricky.. as long as people know that answers will not be immediately
forthcoming we should be able to do that.

sri

>
>

--20cf30549dcff3cff1049ac63996
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<br><br><div class=3D"gmail_quote">On Wed, Jan 26, 2011 at 8:07 AM, Jason D=
. Clinton <span dir=3D"ltr">&lt;<a href=3D"mailto:me@jasonclinton.com">me@j=
asonclinton.com</a>&gt;</span> wrote:<br><blockquote class=3D"gmail_quote" =
style=3D"margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex;">

<div class=3D"im">On Wed, Jan 26, 2011 at 10:03, Allan Day &lt;<a href=3D"m=
ailto:allanpday@gmail.com">allanpday@gmail.com</a>&gt; wrote:<br>
&gt; A GNOME 3 Q&amp;A session would be an extremely beneficial part of our=
<br>
&gt; marketing campaign. It would demonstrate that GNOME is open and cares<=
br>
&gt; about its users, and it would be an effective way of dealing with<br>
&gt; negative comments on the web. It&#39;s really good to be able to say &=
#39;if<br>
&gt; you have concerns, please come and talk to us&#39;.<br></div>=A0
<br></blockquote><blockquote class=3D"gmail_quote" style=3D"margin: 0pt 0pt=
 0pt 0.8ex; border-left: 1px solid rgb(204, 204, 204); padding-left: 1ex;">
My recommendation would be to use the existing #gnome on GIMPnet which<br>
already frequently gets user questions that go unanswered. Perhaps we<br>
could establish office hours like the design team has done.<br>
<div><div></div><div></div></div></blockquote><div><br>+1<br><br>This will =
helkp me as answering questions will fill in gaps in my own knowledge or de=
tect if knowledge has gone stale. =A0So I wouldn&#39;t mind doing that... =
=A0although trying to do that while doing a day job might be a bit tricky..=
 as long as people know that answers will not be immediately forthcoming we=
 should be able to do that.<br>

<br>sri=A0</div><blockquote class=3D"gmail_quote" style=3D"margin: 0pt 0pt =
0pt 0.8ex; border-left: 1px solid rgb(204, 204, 204); padding-left: 1ex;"><=
div><div>=A0</div></div></blockquote></div>

--20cf30549dcff3cff1049ac63996--
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On Wed, Jan 26, 2011 at 2:07 PM, Sriram Ramkrishna <sri@ramkrishna.me>wrote:

>
>
> On Wed, Jan 26, 2011 at 8:07 AM, Jason D. Clinton <me@jasonclinton.com>wrote:
>
>> On Wed, Jan 26, 2011 at 10:03, Allan Day <allanpday@gmail.com> wrote:
>> > A GNOME 3 Q&A session would be an extremely beneficial part of our
>> > marketing campaign. It would demonstrate that GNOME is open and cares
>> > about its users, and it would be an effective way of dealing with
>> > negative comments on the web. It's really good to be able to say 'if
>> > you have concerns, please come and talk to us'.
>>
>>
> My recommendation would be to use the existing #gnome on GIMPnet which
>>
>> already frequently gets user questions that go unanswered. Perhaps we
>> could establish office hours like the design team has done.
>>
>
> +1
>
>
I too think regular office hours would be good. I'm willing to help out with
a regular time each week. We could keep an archive of the questions asked
and the answers to help out people answering questions.

Stormy

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<br><br><div class=3D"gmail_quote">On Wed, Jan 26, 2011 at 2:07 PM, Sriram =
Ramkrishna <span dir=3D"ltr">&lt;<a href=3D"mailto:sri@ramkrishna.me">sri@r=
amkrishna.me</a>&gt;</span> wrote:<br><blockquote class=3D"gmail_quote" sty=
le=3D"margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex;">

<br><br><div class=3D"gmail_quote"><div class=3D"im">On Wed, Jan 26, 2011 a=
t 8:07 AM, Jason D. Clinton <span dir=3D"ltr">&lt;<a href=3D"mailto:me@jaso=
nclinton.com" target=3D"_blank">me@jasonclinton.com</a>&gt;</span> wrote:<b=
r><blockquote class=3D"gmail_quote" style=3D"margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:=
1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex">



<div>On Wed, Jan 26, 2011 at 10:03, Allan Day &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:allanpd=
ay@gmail.com" target=3D"_blank">allanpday@gmail.com</a>&gt; wrote:<br>
&gt; A GNOME 3 Q&amp;A session would be an extremely beneficial part of our=
<br>
&gt; marketing campaign. It would demonstrate that GNOME is open and cares<=
br>
&gt; about its users, and it would be an effective way of dealing with<br>
&gt; negative comments on the web. It&#39;s really good to be able to say &=
#39;if<br>
&gt; you have concerns, please come and talk to us&#39;.<br></div>=A0
<br></blockquote></div><blockquote class=3D"gmail_quote" style=3D"margin:0p=
t 0pt 0pt 0.8ex;border-left:1px solid rgb(204, 204, 204);padding-left:1ex">
My recommendation would be to use the existing #gnome on GIMPnet which<div =
class=3D"im"><br>
already frequently gets user questions that go unanswered. Perhaps we<br>
could establish office hours like the design team has done.<br>
<div><div></div><div></div></div></div></blockquote><div><br>+1<br><br></di=
v></div></blockquote><div><br>I too think regular office hours would be goo=
d. I&#39;m willing to help out with a regular time each week. We could keep=
 an archive of the questions asked and the answers to help out people answe=
ring questions.<br>

<br>Stormy<br></div></div>

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Date: Wed, 26 Jan 2011 10:37:34 -0800
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Sure, I can help.  What do you want specifically?  I was going to do one on
gnome shell extensions because I find that of interest.  Of course if you
have a particular theme in mind we can go with that.

sri

-- Sriram Ramkrishna (sriram.ramkrishna_@@_@.gmail.com (remove _@@_)




On Wed, Jan 26, 2011 at 8:05 AM, Paul Cutler <pcutler@gnome.org> wrote:

> Hi all,
>
> Sumana and I have (well, mostly Sumana) have been talking and planning
> some upcoming issues of GNOME Journal.  We're currently working on a
> special edition with GNOME Hispano, and we'd like to quickly follow
> that with an issue focused on GNOME 3.0.  The GNOME 3.0 issue is
> tentatively scheduled for for April 3rd, right before the 3.0 release.
>  We're looking for articles on the new features, updates to
> applications, interviews, you name it - and we need your help!
>
> Please let Sumana and I know if you'd like to contribute an article.
> You can ping us in #gnome-journal on IRC or feel free to shoot us an
> email or reply on the gnome-journal list.
>
> Thanks!
>
> Paul
> _______________________________________________
> gnome-journal-list mailing list
> gnome-journal-list@gnome.org
> http://mail.gnome.org/mailman/listinfo/gnome-journal-list
>

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Sure, I can help.=C2=A0 What do you want specifically?=C2=A0 I was going to=
 do one on gnome shell extensions because I find that of interest.=C2=A0 Of=
 course if you have a particular theme in mind we can go with that.<br><br>=
sri<br><br clear=3D"all">

-- Sriram Ramkrishna (sriram.ramkrishna_@@_@.<a href=3D"http://gmail.com">g=
mail.com</a> (remove _@@_)<br><br><br>
<br><br><div class=3D"gmail_quote">On Wed, Jan 26, 2011 at 8:05 AM, Paul Cu=
tler <span dir=3D"ltr">&lt;<a href=3D"mailto:pcutler@gnome.org">pcutler@gno=
me.org</a>&gt;</span> wrote:<br><blockquote class=3D"gmail_quote" style=3D"=
margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex;">

Hi all,<br>
<br>
Sumana and I have (well, mostly Sumana) have been talking and planning<br>
some upcoming issues of GNOME Journal. =C2=A0We&#39;re currently working on=
 a<br>
special edition with GNOME Hispano, and we&#39;d like to quickly follow<br>
that with an issue focused on GNOME 3.0. =C2=A0The GNOME 3.0 issue is<br>
tentatively scheduled for for April 3rd, right before the 3.0 release.<br>
=C2=A0We&#39;re looking for articles on the new features, updates to<br>
applications, interviews, you name it - and we need your help!<br>
<br>
Please let Sumana and I know if you&#39;d like to contribute an article.<br=
>
You can ping us in #gnome-journal on IRC or feel free to shoot us an<br>
email or reply on the gnome-journal list.<br>
<br>
Thanks!<br>
<br>
Paul<br>
_______________________________________________<br>
gnome-journal-list mailing list<br>
<a href=3D"mailto:gnome-journal-list@gnome.org">gnome-journal-list@gnome.or=
g</a><br>
<a href=3D"http://mail.gnome.org/mailman/listinfo/gnome-journal-list" targe=
t=3D"_blank">http://mail.gnome.org/mailman/listinfo/gnome-journal-list</a><=
br>
</blockquote></div><br>

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Subject: Re: Questions about FoG and campaigns
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We also need to promote the campaigns more.

People need to blog about it, maybe we can ask some journalists to help us
by writing about it, we can use our Google Adsense account, etc.

Other than here on the marketing list and on the header of gnome.org, I
haven't seen it mentioned any where ...

Stormy

On Wed, Jan 26, 2011 at 9:28 AM, Og Maciel <ogmaciel@gnome.org> wrote:

> On Wed, Jan 26, 2011 at 11:24 AM, Jason D. Clinton <me@jasonclinton.com>
> wrote:
> > I guess the question would be: do the campaigns switch like clock-work
> > or do we do it manually depending on how close we are to the goal when
> > the time for the next campaign period arrives?
>
> I'd like to have campaigns scheduled in advance so that we can better
> plan things out.
> --
> Og B. Maciel
> GNOME Foundation Board of Directors
>
> omaciel@foresightlinux.org
> ogmaciel@gnome.org
>
> GPG Keys: D5CFC202
>
> http://www.ogmaciel.com (en_US)
> http://blog.ogmaciel.com (pt_BR)
> --
> marketing-list mailing list
> marketing-list@gnome.org
> http://mail.gnome.org/mailman/listinfo/marketing-list
>

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We also need to promote the campaigns more.<br><br>People need to blog abou=
t it, maybe we can ask some journalists to help us by writing about it, we =
can use our Google Adsense account, etc.<br><br>Other than here on the mark=
eting list and on the header of <a href=3D"http://gnome.org">gnome.org</a>,=
 I haven&#39;t seen it mentioned any where ...<br>

<br>Stormy<br><br><div class=3D"gmail_quote">On Wed, Jan 26, 2011 at 9:28 A=
M, Og Maciel <span dir=3D"ltr">&lt;<a href=3D"mailto:ogmaciel@gnome.org">og=
maciel@gnome.org</a>&gt;</span> wrote:<br><blockquote class=3D"gmail_quote"=
 style=3D"margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex;">

<div class=3D"im">On Wed, Jan 26, 2011 at 11:24 AM, Jason D. Clinton &lt;<a=
 href=3D"mailto:me@jasonclinton.com">me@jasonclinton.com</a>&gt; wrote:<br>
&gt; I guess the question would be: do the campaigns switch like clock-work=
<br>
&gt; or do we do it manually depending on how close we are to the goal when=
<br>
&gt; the time for the next campaign period arrives?<br>
<br>
</div>I&#39;d like to have campaigns scheduled in advance so that we can be=
tter<br>
plan things out.<br>
<div class=3D"im">--<br>
Og B. Maciel<br>
GNOME Foundation Board of Directors<br>
<br>
<a href=3D"mailto:omaciel@foresightlinux.org">omaciel@foresightlinux.org</a=
><br>
<a href=3D"mailto:ogmaciel@gnome.org">ogmaciel@gnome.org</a><br>
<br>
GPG Keys: D5CFC202<br>
<br>
<a href=3D"http://www.ogmaciel.com" target=3D"_blank">http://www.ogmaciel.c=
om</a> (en_US)<br>
<a href=3D"http://blog.ogmaciel.com" target=3D"_blank">http://blog.ogmaciel=
.com</a> (pt_BR)<br>
--<br>
</div><div><div></div><div class=3D"h5">marketing-list mailing list<br>
<a href=3D"mailto:marketing-list@gnome.org">marketing-list@gnome.org</a><br=
>
<a href=3D"http://mail.gnome.org/mailman/listinfo/marketing-list" target=3D=
"_blank">http://mail.gnome.org/mailman/listinfo/marketing-list</a><br>
</div></div></blockquote></div><br>

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A while back, we talked about writing an article on OpenHatch helping
GNOME projects.  The work we were going to do towards having an
interesting article to write hasn't quite happened, yet.

I think I can swing some time after the GNOME 3.0 focused GJ.

I happily offer my editorial services for GJ articles for this issue and
the next one.  I'll start being more social on the gnome-journal irc
channel again.

/will


On 01/26/2011 11:05 AM, Paul Cutler wrote:
> Hi all,
> 
> Sumana and I have (well, mostly Sumana) have been talking and planning
> some upcoming issues of GNOME Journal.  We're currently working on a
> special edition with GNOME Hispano, and we'd like to quickly follow
> that with an issue focused on GNOME 3.0.  The GNOME 3.0 issue is
> tentatively scheduled for for April 3rd, right before the 3.0 release.
>  We're looking for articles on the new features, updates to
> applications, interviews, you name it - and we need your help!
> 
> Please let Sumana and I know if you'd like to contribute an article.
> You can ping us in #gnome-journal on IRC or feel free to shoot us an
> email or reply on the gnome-journal list.
> 
> Thanks!
> 
> Paul
From fredm@gnome.org  Thu Jan 27 01:12:12 2011
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Date: Thu, 27 Jan 2011 09:11:54 +0800
From: Frederic Muller <fredm@gnome.org>
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Hi!

in the past 8 hours the wiki page for GNOME 3.0 launch parties has 
disappeared http://live.gnome.org/ThreePointZero/LaunchParty/ . I do 
subscribe to it but got no notification and history is gone.

In parallel 2-3 days ago the blog post about launch parties 
http://pockey.dao2.com/2011/01/gnome-3-0-launch-parties-support-from-the-gnome-foundation/ 
was removed from the GNOME planet.

Those might be 2 totally separate issues, but I'd be happy if someone 
could help us out restore the wiki page and investigate this weird 
happening.

Thank you.

Fred
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On 01/27/2011 09:11 AM, Frederic Muller wrote:
> Hi!
>
> in the past 8 hours the wiki page for GNOME 3.0 launch parties has
> disappeared http://live.gnome.org/ThreePointZero/LaunchParty/ . I do
> subscribe to it but got no notification and history is gone.
>
> In parallel 2-3 days ago the blog post about launch parties
> http://pockey.dao2.com/2011/01/gnome-3-0-launch-parties-support-from-the-gnome-foundation/
> was removed from the GNOME planet.
>
> Those might be 2 totally separate issues, but I'd be happy if someone
> could help us out restore the wiki page and investigate this weird
> happening.
>
> Thank you.
>
> Fred

After further investigation the page has been renamed to 
http://live.gnome.org/ThreePointZero/LaunchParty/Athens/TEI%20of%20Athens by 
George Chatzipapas, I suppose by mistake.

Is it possible to prevent renaming of a page?

Thanks.

Fred
From stormy.gnome@gmail.com  Thu Jan 27 01:35:44 2011
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Perhaps the sys admin team could help?

On Wed, Jan 26, 2011 at 6:26 PM, Frederic Muller <fredm@gnome.org> wrote:

> On 01/27/2011 09:11 AM, Frederic Muller wrote:
>
>> Hi!
>>
>> in the past 8 hours the wiki page for GNOME 3.0 launch parties has
>> disappeared http://live.gnome.org/ThreePointZero/LaunchParty/ . I do
>> subscribe to it but got no notification and history is gone.
>>
>> In parallel 2-3 days ago the blog post about launch parties
>>
>> http://pockey.dao2.com/2011/01/gnome-3-0-launch-parties-support-from-the-gnome-foundation/
>> was removed from the GNOME planet.
>>
>> Those might be 2 totally separate issues, but I'd be happy if someone
>> could help us out restore the wiki page and investigate this weird
>> happening.
>>
>> Thank you.
>>
>> Fred
>>
>
> After further investigation the page has been renamed to
> http://live.gnome.org/ThreePointZero/LaunchParty/Athens/TEI%20of%20Athensby George Chatzipapas, I suppose by mistake.
>
> Is it possible to prevent renaming of a page?
>
> Thanks.
>
>
> Fred
> --
> marketing-list mailing list
> marketing-list@gnome.org
> http://mail.gnome.org/mailman/listinfo/marketing-list
>

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Perhaps the sys admin team could help?<br><br><div class=3D"gmail_quote">On=
 Wed, Jan 26, 2011 at 6:26 PM, Frederic Muller <span dir=3D"ltr">&lt;<a hre=
f=3D"mailto:fredm@gnome.org">fredm@gnome.org</a>&gt;</span> wrote:<br><bloc=
kquote class=3D"gmail_quote" style=3D"margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #cc=
c solid;padding-left:1ex;">

<div class=3D"im">On 01/27/2011 09:11 AM, Frederic Muller wrote:<br>
<blockquote class=3D"gmail_quote" style=3D"margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1p=
x #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex">
Hi!<br>
<br>
in the past 8 hours the wiki page for GNOME 3.0 launch parties has<br>
disappeared <a href=3D"http://live.gnome.org/ThreePointZero/LaunchParty/" t=
arget=3D"_blank">http://live.gnome.org/ThreePointZero/LaunchParty/</a> . I =
do<br>
subscribe to it but got no notification and history is gone.<br>
<br>
In parallel 2-3 days ago the blog post about launch parties<br>
<a href=3D"http://pockey.dao2.com/2011/01/gnome-3-0-launch-parties-support-=
from-the-gnome-foundation/" target=3D"_blank">http://pockey.dao2.com/2011/0=
1/gnome-3-0-launch-parties-support-from-the-gnome-foundation/</a><br>
was removed from the GNOME planet.<br>
<br>
Those might be 2 totally separate issues, but I&#39;d be happy if someone<b=
r>
could help us out restore the wiki page and investigate this weird<br>
happening.<br>
<br>
Thank you.<br>
<br>
Fred<br>
</blockquote>
<br></div>
After further investigation the page has been renamed to <a href=3D"http://=
live.gnome.org/ThreePointZero/LaunchParty/Athens/TEI%20of%20Athens" target=
=3D"_blank">http://live.gnome.org/ThreePointZero/LaunchParty/Athens/TEI%20o=
f%20Athens</a> by George Chatzipapas, I suppose by mistake.<br>


<br>
Is it possible to prevent renaming of a page?<br>
<br>
Thanks.<div><div></div><div class=3D"h5"><br>
<br>
Fred<br>
-- <br>
marketing-list mailing list<br>
<a href=3D"mailto:marketing-list@gnome.org" target=3D"_blank">marketing-lis=
t@gnome.org</a><br>
<a href=3D"http://mail.gnome.org/mailman/listinfo/marketing-list" target=3D=
"_blank">http://mail.gnome.org/mailman/listinfo/marketing-list</a><br>
</div></div></blockquote></div><br>

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How can I get in touch with them?

Thanks a lot.

Fred

On 01/27/2011 09:35 AM, Stormy Peters wrote:
> Perhaps the sys admin team could help?
>
> On Wed, Jan 26, 2011 at 6:26 PM, Frederic Muller <fredm@gnome.org
> <mailto:fredm@gnome.org>> wrote:
>
>     On 01/27/2011 09:11 AM, Frederic Muller wrote:
>
>         Hi!
>
>         in the past 8 hours the wiki page for GNOME 3.0 launch parties has
>         disappeared http://live.gnome.org/ThreePointZero/LaunchParty/ . I do
>         subscribe to it but got no notification and history is gone.
>
>         In parallel 2-3 days ago the blog post about launch parties
>         http://pockey.dao2.com/2011/01/gnome-3-0-launch-parties-support-from-the-gnome-foundation/
>         was removed from the GNOME planet.
>
>         Those might be 2 totally separate issues, but I'd be happy if
>         someone
>         could help us out restore the wiki page and investigate this weird
>         happening.
>
>         Thank you.
>
>         Fred
>
>
>     After further investigation the page has been renamed to
>     http://live.gnome.org/ThreePointZero/LaunchParty/Athens/TEI%20of%20Athens
>     by George Chatzipapas, I suppose by mistake.
>
>     Is it possible to prevent renaming of a page?
>
>     Thanks.
>
>
>     Fred
>     --
>     marketing-list mailing list
>     marketing-list@gnome.org <mailto:marketing-list@gnome.org>
>     http://mail.gnome.org/mailman/listinfo/marketing-list
>
>
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Subject: Re: GNOME 3.0 launch party attack?
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gnome-sysadmin@gnome.org

And they are also on IRC, #sysadmin I think.

Stormy

On Wed, Jan 26, 2011 at 6:38 PM, Frederic Muller <fredm@gnome.org> wrote:

> How can I get in touch with them?
>
> Thanks a lot.
>
> Fred
>
>
> On 01/27/2011 09:35 AM, Stormy Peters wrote:
>
>> Perhaps the sys admin team could help?
>>
>> On Wed, Jan 26, 2011 at 6:26 PM, Frederic Muller <fredm@gnome.org
>> <mailto:fredm@gnome.org>> wrote:
>>
>>    On 01/27/2011 09:11 AM, Frederic Muller wrote:
>>
>>        Hi!
>>
>>        in the past 8 hours the wiki page for GNOME 3.0 launch parties has
>>        disappeared http://live.gnome.org/ThreePointZero/LaunchParty/ . I
>> do
>>        subscribe to it but got no notification and history is gone.
>>
>>        In parallel 2-3 days ago the blog post about launch parties
>>
>> http://pockey.dao2.com/2011/01/gnome-3-0-launch-parties-support-from-the-gnome-foundation/
>>        was removed from the GNOME planet.
>>
>>        Those might be 2 totally separate issues, but I'd be happy if
>>        someone
>>        could help us out restore the wiki page and investigate this weird
>>        happening.
>>
>>        Thank you.
>>
>>        Fred
>>
>>
>>    After further investigation the page has been renamed to
>>
>> http://live.gnome.org/ThreePointZero/LaunchParty/Athens/TEI%20of%20Athens
>>    by George Chatzipapas, I suppose by mistake.
>>
>>    Is it possible to prevent renaming of a page?
>>
>>    Thanks.
>>
>>
>>    Fred
>>    --
>>    marketing-list mailing list
>>    marketing-list@gnome.org <mailto:marketing-list@gnome.org>
>>
>>    http://mail.gnome.org/mailman/listinfo/marketing-list
>>
>>
>>

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<a href=3D"mailto:gnome-sysadmin@gnome.org">gnome-sysadmin@gnome.org</a><br=
><br>And they are also on IRC, #sysadmin I think.<br><br>Stormy<br><br><div=
 class=3D"gmail_quote">On Wed, Jan 26, 2011 at 6:38 PM, Frederic Muller <sp=
an dir=3D"ltr">&lt;<a href=3D"mailto:fredm@gnome.org">fredm@gnome.org</a>&g=
t;</span> wrote:<br>

<blockquote class=3D"gmail_quote" style=3D"margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1p=
x #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex;">How can I get in touch with them?<br>
<br>
Thanks a lot.<br>
<br>
Fred<div class=3D"im"><br>
<br>
On 01/27/2011 09:35 AM, Stormy Peters wrote:<br>
</div><blockquote class=3D"gmail_quote" style=3D"margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-l=
eft:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex"><div class=3D"im">
Perhaps the sys admin team could help?<br>
<br>
On Wed, Jan 26, 2011 at 6:26 PM, Frederic Muller &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:fred=
m@gnome.org" target=3D"_blank">fredm@gnome.org</a><br></div><div class=3D"i=
m">
&lt;mailto:<a href=3D"mailto:fredm@gnome.org" target=3D"_blank">fredm@gnome=
.org</a>&gt;&gt; wrote:<br>
<br>
 =A0 =A0On 01/27/2011 09:11 AM, Frederic Muller wrote:<br>
<br>
 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0Hi!<br>
<br>
 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0in the past 8 hours the wiki page for GNOME 3.0 launch part=
ies has<br>
 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0disappeared <a href=3D"http://live.gnome.org/ThreePointZero=
/LaunchParty/" target=3D"_blank">http://live.gnome.org/ThreePointZero/Launc=
hParty/</a> . I do<br>
 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0subscribe to it but got no notification and history is gone=
.<br>
<br>
 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0In parallel 2-3 days ago the blog post about launch parties=
<br>
 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0<a href=3D"http://pockey.dao2.com/2011/01/gnome-3-0-launch-=
parties-support-from-the-gnome-foundation/" target=3D"_blank">http://pockey=
.dao2.com/2011/01/gnome-3-0-launch-parties-support-from-the-gnome-foundatio=
n/</a><br>


 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0was removed from the GNOME planet.<br>
<br>
 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0Those might be 2 totally separate issues, but I&#39;d be ha=
ppy if<br>
 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0someone<br>
 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0could help us out restore the wiki page and investigate thi=
s weird<br>
 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0happening.<br>
<br>
 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0Thank you.<br>
<br>
 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0Fred<br>
<br>
<br>
 =A0 =A0After further investigation the page has been renamed to<br>
 =A0 =A0<a href=3D"http://live.gnome.org/ThreePointZero/LaunchParty/Athens/=
TEI%20of%20Athens" target=3D"_blank">http://live.gnome.org/ThreePointZero/L=
aunchParty/Athens/TEI%20of%20Athens</a><br>
 =A0 =A0by George Chatzipapas, I suppose by mistake.<br>
<br>
 =A0 =A0Is it possible to prevent renaming of a page?<br>
<br>
 =A0 =A0Thanks.<br>
<br>
<br>
 =A0 =A0Fred<br>
 =A0 =A0--<br>
 =A0 =A0marketing-list mailing list<br></div>
 =A0 =A0<a href=3D"mailto:marketing-list@gnome.org" target=3D"_blank">marke=
ting-list@gnome.org</a> &lt;mailto:<a href=3D"mailto:marketing-list@gnome.o=
rg" target=3D"_blank">marketing-list@gnome.org</a>&gt;<div class=3D"im"><br=
>
 =A0 =A0<a href=3D"http://mail.gnome.org/mailman/listinfo/marketing-list" t=
arget=3D"_blank">http://mail.gnome.org/mailman/listinfo/marketing-list</a><=
br>
<br>
<br>
</div></blockquote>
</blockquote></div><br>

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Subject: Re: Questions about FoG and campaigns
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And it misses a more tangible goal than just the number of subscriptors IMO.

Something like "2 new hackfests this year" or whatever. Obviously the
money won't be used exclusively on that, but it helps understand why
we want money, besides "because it's money".

On Wed, Jan 26, 2011 at 5:36 PM, Stormy Peters <stormy@gnome.org> wrote:
> We also need to promote the campaigns more.
>
> People need to blog about it, maybe we can ask some journalists to help us
> by writing about it, we can use our Google Adsense account, etc.
>
> Other than here on the marketing list and on the header of gnome.org, I
> haven't seen it mentioned any where ...
>
> Stormy
>
> On Wed, Jan 26, 2011 at 9:28 AM, Og Maciel <ogmaciel@gnome.org> wrote:
>>
>> On Wed, Jan 26, 2011 at 11:24 AM, Jason D. Clinton <me@jasonclinton.com>
>> wrote:
>> > I guess the question would be: do the campaigns switch like clock-work
>> > or do we do it manually depending on how close we are to the goal when
>> > the time for the next campaign period arrives?
>>
>> I'd like to have campaigns scheduled in advance so that we can better
>> plan things out.
>> --
>> Og B. Maciel
>> GNOME Foundation Board of Directors
>>
>> omaciel@foresightlinux.org
>> ogmaciel@gnome.org
>>
>> GPG Keys: D5CFC202
>>
>> http://www.ogmaciel.com (en_US)
>> http://blog.ogmaciel.com (pt_BR)
>> --
>> marketing-list mailing list
>> marketing-list@gnome.org
>> http://mail.gnome.org/mailman/listinfo/marketing-list
>
>
> --
> marketing-list mailing list
> marketing-list@gnome.org
> http://mail.gnome.org/mailman/listinfo/marketing-list
>
>
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Subject: gnome3.org update [Was: 4/14 Friends of GNOME videos finished and
	posted]
From: Allan Day <allanpday@gmail.com>
To: "Jason D. Clinton" <me@jasonclinton.com>
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Jason D. Clinton wrote:
> On Tue, Jan 25, 2011 at 15:10, Jason D. Clinton <me@jasonclinton.com>
> wrote:
>         The last commit adds the text areas and needs a little
>         iteration. Please feel free to tweak it without clearing it
>         with me before posting it.
>         
>         Also feel free to publish the updated screen shots without my
>         last commit if you feel you'd like to go live immediately
>         without the added text areas.
>         
> 
> Well, I was under the impression that a publishing step was required
> but I guess it's live already. Oops!
> 
> I'll iterate on the text a little more now to make it presentable but
> feel free to remove or comment out areas at a whim.

Me and Jason have been discussing the site, and were thinking that an
update might be in order at some point in the near(ish) future. There
are quite a few changes that have been discussed, and it makes sense to
have them go live at the same time as part of an event, rather than
being added incrementally.

Jason's kindly offered to create a branch where we can prepare these
updates before making them live.

Here's a list of changes that have been discussed:

 * Refinement of the home page text

 * Addition of video content

 * Follow us buttons for Twitter and Identica

 * A Facebook 'Like' button

 * One of Andreas's snazzy page footers, like the one on the t-shirt
contest site [1]

 * A launch party page

 * A developer platform page

 * Updates to the Try It page, hopefully with a link to the preview
build

That's not a list of what we should or need to do; it's just the
possibilities that I'm aware of. Contributions would be welcome, of
course.

Best wishes,

Allan

[1] http://www.gnome.org/contest/
-- 
Blog: http://afaikblog.wordpress.com/
IRC: aday on irc.gnome.org

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Hi,

Stormy Peters wrote:
> I too think regular office hours would be good. I'm willing to help out
> with a regular time each week. We could keep an archive of the questions
> asked and the answers to help out people answering questions.

I'd suggest having 3 different office hours per week, to cater to
different timezones. Something like 1pm UTC might suit for Europe, but
not West coast US or Asia.

Cheers,
Dave.

-- 
Dave Neary
GNOME Foundation member
dneary@gnome.org
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Dave Neary wrote:
> I'd suggest having 3 different office hours per week, to cater to
> different timezones. Something like 1pm UTC might suit for Europe, but
> not West coast US or Asia.

... it goes without saying that different people would presumably be
present for different office hours.

Cheers,
Dave.

-- 
Dave Neary
GNOME Foundation member
dneary@gnome.org
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Hi,

Diego Escalante Urrelo wrote:
> And it misses a more tangible goal than just the number of subscriptors IMO.
> 
> Something like "2 new hackfests this year" or whatever. Obviously the
> money won't be used exclusively on that, but it helps understand why
> we want money, besides "because it's money".

Absolutely agree.
http://blogs.gnome.org/bolsh/2008/11/20/things-to-learn-for-gnome/

When you donate €200 to MSF, they have a list of things they can do with
it (x vaccines, y meals, z survival blankets).

Cheers,
Dave.

-- 
Dave Neary
GNOME Foundation member
dneary@gnome.org
From paul.r.cutler@gmail.com  Thu Jan 27 14:48:11 2011
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Subject: Re: gnome3.org update [Was: 4/14 Friends of GNOME videos finished and
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Sounds great.

Do you think you might have time to add these to a wiki page?  That
way, if we get any new volunteers looking to help, we can easily point
them to a set of tasks that need to be worked on.

Thanks again for all your work on this.

Paul

On Thu, Jan 27, 2011 at 5:27 AM, Allan Day <allanpday@gmail.com> wrote:
> Jason D. Clinton wrote:
>> On Tue, Jan 25, 2011 at 15:10, Jason D. Clinton <me@jasonclinton.com>
>> wrote:
>> =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 The last commit adds the text areas and needs a little
>> =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 iteration. Please feel free to tweak it without clearing=
 it
>> =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 with me before posting it.
>>
>> =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 Also feel free to publish the updated screen shots witho=
ut my
>> =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 last commit if you feel you'd like to go live immediatel=
y
>> =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 without the added text areas.
>>
>>
>> Well, I was under the impression that a publishing step was required
>> but I guess it's live already. Oops!
>>
>> I'll iterate on the text a little more now to make it presentable but
>> feel free to remove or comment out areas at a whim.
>
> Me and Jason have been discussing the site, and were thinking that an
> update might be in order at some point in the near(ish) future. There
> are quite a few changes that have been discussed, and it makes sense to
> have them go live at the same time as part of an event, rather than
> being added incrementally.
>
> Jason's kindly offered to create a branch where we can prepare these
> updates before making them live.
>
> Here's a list of changes that have been discussed:
>
> =A0* Refinement of the home page text
>
> =A0* Addition of video content
>
> =A0* Follow us buttons for Twitter and Identica
>
> =A0* A Facebook 'Like' button
>
> =A0* One of Andreas's snazzy page footers, like the one on the t-shirt
> contest site [1]
>
> =A0* A launch party page
>
> =A0* A developer platform page
>
> =A0* Updates to the Try It page, hopefully with a link to the preview
> build
>
> That's not a list of what we should or need to do; it's just the
> possibilities that I'm aware of. Contributions would be welcome, of
> course.
>
> Best wishes,
>
> Allan
>
> [1] http://www.gnome.org/contest/
> --
> Blog: http://afaikblog.wordpress.com/
> IRC: aday on irc.gnome.org
>
> --
> marketing-list mailing list
> marketing-list@gnome.org
> http://mail.gnome.org/mailman/listinfo/marketing-list
>
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Subject: Re: gnome3.org update [Was: 4/14 Friends of GNOME videos finished and
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From: "Jason D. Clinton" <me@jasonclinton.com>
To: allanpday@gmail.com
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--20cf301e2f4d89e0b8049ad59d4e
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On Thu, Jan 27, 2011 at 05:27, Allan Day <allanpday@gmail.com> wrote:

> Jason's kindly offered to create a branch where we can prepare these
> updates before making them live.
>

I have pushed a new branch called "marketing-team-collab" which currently
doesn't differ from master but can safely be updated at any time without
affecting the live site. (So anyone should feel free to push new ideas here
at any point. It's easy to undo something in the branch.)

If you're new to git, all you need to do is do a "git fetch" on your
existing gnome3-web directory so that your local copy is up to date and then
do:

$ git checkout origin/marketing-team-collab -b marketing-team-collab

If you make a mistake and push something here which you want to revert, do a
"git revert" locally and then push the result to the origin with "git push
origin marketing-team-collab". Later we can squish reverted entries in the
log before merging them to master (so the history looks nice and clean.)

--20cf301e2f4d89e0b8049ad59d4e
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<div class=3D"gmail_quote">On Thu, Jan 27, 2011 at 05:27, Allan Day <span d=
ir=3D"ltr">&lt;<a href=3D"mailto:allanpday@gmail.com">allanpday@gmail.com</=
a>&gt;</span> wrote:<br><blockquote class=3D"gmail_quote" style=3D"margin:0=
 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex;">
Jason&#39;s kindly offered to create a branch where we can prepare these<br=
>
updates before making them live.<br></blockquote><div><br>I have pushed a n=
ew branch called &quot;marketing-team-collab&quot; which currently doesn&#3=
9;t differ from master but can safely be updated at any time without affect=
ing the live site. (So anyone should feel free to push new ideas here at an=
y point. It&#39;s easy to undo something in the branch.)<br>
<br>If you&#39;re new to git, all you need to do is do a &quot;git fetch&qu=
ot; on your existing gnome3-web directory so that your local copy is up to =
date and then do:<br><br>$ git checkout origin/marketing-team-collab -b mar=
keting-team-collab<br>
<br>If you make a mistake and push something here which you want to revert,=
 do a &quot;git revert&quot; locally and then push the result to the origin=
 with &quot;git push origin marketing-team-collab&quot;. Later we can squis=
h reverted entries in the log before merging them to master (so the history=
 looks nice and clean.)<br>
<br></div></div>

--20cf301e2f4d89e0b8049ad59d4e--
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Subject: Re: GNOME 3 Q&A
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Dave Neary wrote:
> Stormy Peters wrote:
> > I too think regular office hours would be good. I'm willing to help out
> > with a regular time each week. We could keep an archive of the questions
> > asked and the answers to help out people answering questions.
> 
> I'd suggest having 3 different office hours per week, to cater to
> different timezones. Something like 1pm UTC might suit for Europe, but
> not West coast US or Asia.

How about we organise this as a 'GNOME 3 User Day', with three sessions
over 24 hours? If the first one (or two?) works OK and there is
sufficient interest, we can turn it into a regular event.

What do people think of 07:00 - 08:00, 15:00 - 16:00, 23:00 - 24:00
(UTC)?

Allan
-- 
Blog: http://afaikblog.wordpress.com/
IRC: aday on irc.gnome.org

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Hi,

Allan Day wrote:
> How about we organise this as a 'GNOME 3 User Day', with three sessions
> over 24 hours? If the first one (or two?) works OK and there is
> sufficient interest, we can turn it into a regular event.
> 
> What do people think of 07:00 - 08:00, 15:00 - 16:00, 23:00 - 24:00
> (UTC)?

Sounds good - I have no real preferences on the hours, I don't know
who's targeted specifically with 07:00 - 08:00 - is that mid afternoon
Asia, early evening Australia?

Cheersn
Dave.

-- 
Dave Neary
GNOME Foundation member
dneary@gnome.org
From sri@ramkrishna.me  Thu Jan 27 19:16:48 2011
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From: Sriram Ramkrishna <sri@ramkrishna.me>
Date: Thu, 27 Jan 2011 11:16:14 -0800
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Subject: Open source bridge talk..
To: GNOME Marketing List <marketing-list@gnome.org>
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--90e6ba6e8b70ba8db1049ad8c91b
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1

So I'm trying to formulate my talk for Open Source Bridge in Portland in
June (http://opensourcebridge.org/events/2011/proposals) and since ithis is
after the release, I was hoping that I could concentrate on two things:

1) the philsophy behind the design of gnome shell - eg user flow and what
not
2) a talk on extending gnome-shell

I think in the past we've never really clearly defined why we designed our
desktop the way it is and a lot of people never understood it they always
saw it as "taking away features" and I want to talk about why it was
designed the way it is (why no applets etc) and the opportunities in
extending gnome-shell.

This conference has a number of web programmers (look at the proposals) and
of course they all know javascript so it will be a great opportunity to
attract developers from that community to hack on gnome-shell and extend it.

I'd like to partner with someone from gnome-shell team to talk about the
philosophy and work that went into designing gnome-shell.  I think this
would be pretty helpful.  For now I'm going to put in a stub since they are
gathering proposals now and then we can discuss in late April time frame
when gnome shell guys will not be so busy.

sri

--90e6ba6e8b70ba8db1049ad8c91b
Content-Type: text/html; charset=ISO-8859-1
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

So I&#39;m trying to formulate my talk for Open Source Bridge in Portland i=
n June (<a href=3D"http://opensourcebridge.org/events/2011/proposals" targe=
t=3D"_blank">http://opensourcebridge.org/events/2011/proposals</a>) and sin=
ce ithis is after the release, I was hoping that I could concentrate on two=
 things:<br>


<br>1) the philsophy behind the design of gnome shell - eg user flow and wh=
at not<br>2) a talk on extending gnome-shell<br><br>I think in the past we&=
#39;ve never really clearly defined why we designed our desktop the way it =
is and a lot of people never understood it they always saw it as &quot;taki=
ng away features&quot; and I want to talk about why it was designed the way=
 it is (why no applets etc) and the opportunities in extending gnome-shell.=
 <br>


<br>This conference has a number of web programmers (look at the proposals)=
 and of course they all know javascript so it will be a great opportunity t=
o attract developers from that community to hack on gnome-shell and extend =
it.<br>


<br>I&#39;d like to partner with someone from gnome-shell team to talk abou=
t the philosophy and work that went into designing gnome-shell.=A0 I think =
this would be pretty helpful.=A0 For now I&#39;m going to put in a stub sin=
ce they are gathering proposals now and then we can discuss in late April t=
ime frame when gnome shell guys will not be so busy.<br>


<br>sri<br>

--90e6ba6e8b70ba8db1049ad8c91b--
From paul.r.cutler@gmail.com  Thu Jan 27 19:23:21 2011
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Subject: Re: Open source bridge talk..
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Hi Sri,

A good place to start is with the design overview document William Jon
McCann and Jeremy Perry wrote[1].

Paul

[1] http://www.gnome.org/~mccann/shell/design/GNOME_Shell-20090705.pdf

On Thu, Jan 27, 2011 at 1:16 PM, Sriram Ramkrishna <sri@ramkrishna.me> wrot=
e:
> So I'm trying to formulate my talk for Open Source Bridge in Portland in
> June (http://opensourcebridge.org/events/2011/proposals) and since ithis =
is
> after the release, I was hoping that I could concentrate on two things:
>
> 1) the philsophy behind the design of gnome shell - eg user flow and what
> not
> 2) a talk on extending gnome-shell
>
> I think in the past we've never really clearly defined why we designed ou=
r
> desktop the way it is and a lot of people never understood it they always
> saw it as "taking away features" and I want to talk about why it was
> designed the way it is (why no applets etc) and the opportunities in
> extending gnome-shell.
>
> This conference has a number of web programmers (look at the proposals) a=
nd
> of course they all know javascript so it will be a great opportunity to
> attract developers from that community to hack on gnome-shell and extend =
it.
>
> I'd like to partner with someone from gnome-shell team to talk about the
> philosophy and work that went into designing gnome-shell.=A0 I think this
> would be pretty helpful.=A0 For now I'm going to put in a stub since they=
 are
> gathering proposals now and then we can discuss in late April time frame
> when gnome shell guys will not be so busy.
>
> sri
>
> --
> marketing-list mailing list
> marketing-list@gnome.org
> http://mail.gnome.org/mailman/listinfo/marketing-list
>
>
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On 01/28/2011 12:47 AM, Dave Neary wrote:
> Hi,
>
> Allan Day wrote:
>> How about we organise this as a 'GNOME 3 User Day', with three sessions
>> over 24 hours? If the first one (or two?) works OK and there is
>> sufficient interest, we can turn it into a regular event.
>>
>> What do people think of 07:00 - 08:00, 15:00 - 16:00, 23:00 - 24:00
>> (UTC)?
>
> Sounds good - I have no real preferences on the hours, I don't know
> who's targeted specifically with 07:00 - 08:00 - is that mid afternoon
> Asia, early evening Australia?
>
> Cheersn
> Dave.
>

Yes 7-8am would work well for Asia: India is GMT+5:30, South-East Asia 
GMT+6, China GMT+8 . As you can see the 2 other slots are not so 
optimum. And then Japan being GMT+9 can do both 7-8 and 23-24 as both 
falls into office hours.

Fred
From paul.r.cutler@gmail.com  Fri Jan 28 16:30:28 2011
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Hi all,

The board has been talking for a while, and companies have asked for,
other ways to sponsor GNOME outside of the Advisory Board.  Diego
kicked off a discussion on the marketing list about a year ago, but I
wasn't able to quickly find the email.

First, some background:  the GNOME Advisory Board[1] is made up of
partners and sponsors who help sponsor GNOME financially.

* Companies with more than 50 employees:  $20,000 / year
* Companies with less than 50 employees:  $10,000 / year
* Non-profits: $0

We would like to expand corporate sponsorships but we don't want to
lessen the benefits for the Advisory Board partners.  The major
benefits to being on the Advisory Board are monthly Advisory Board
calls with other members and the Foundation's board of directors and
an annual meeting at GUADEC.  (I'm not sure if the ED does anything
above and beyond other than normal and expected communication).  We've
also had feedback from potential partners asking for smaller ways to
give.

I'd like to get the community's feedback on two additional potential levels:

Level 1:  $1000 / year
Benefits: Logo added to foundation.gnome.org - This will be available
to companies to show they sponsor GNOME financially - some companies
like the validation to help show potential clients.

Level 2: $5000 / year
Benefits:  Logo added to foundation.gnome.org and quarterly one on one
call with the Executive Director.  Same as above and an opportunity to
share feedback with GNOME's CEO.

While the benefits may not seem like much to some, it's a way for
companies to give and show they are a part of the community.  We'd
have to come up with naming conventions for the other levels.

Lastly, as part of this, I'd like to revamp the foundation.gnome.org
website for both these kind of corporate sponsors as well as those who
have donated hardware to the Foundation, such as a potential offer for
a new event box, Red Hat and Canonical for hosting our servers in
their data centers and other things that are in the works.

Anyone have any other potential benefits we could add?  Feedback on
the costs?   Ideas for naming conventions?

I look forward to everyone's feedback and ideas!

Thanks!

Paul
From brian.cameron@oracle.com  Fri Jan 28 20:23:56 2011
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Paul:

Thanks for bringing this up.  The sooner we figure out what we are
doing, the sooner we can stop turning away people wanting to give us
money.  ;)

> The board has been talking for a while, and companies have asked for,
> other ways to sponsor GNOME outside of the Advisory Board.  Diego
> kicked off a discussion on the marketing list about a year ago, but I
> wasn't able to quickly find the email.

I think you mean this one:

http://mail.gnome.org/archives/marketing-list/2010-June/msg00001.html

Diego had some good ideas brewing.

> First, some background:  the GNOME Advisory Board[1] is made up of
> partners and sponsors who help sponsor GNOME financially.
>
> * Companies with more than 50 employees:  $20,000 / year
> * Companies with less than 50 employees:  $10,000 / year
> * Non-profits: $0

I wonder if it might be good to expand the definition of "Non-profits"
a bit.  The term "Non-profit" means different things in different
countries.  Perhaps we could expand this to more clearly include
charities and other types of organizations focused on providing
services to people in a charitable manner.

> We would like to expand corporate sponsorships but we don't want to
> lessen the benefits for the Advisory Board partners.  The major
> benefits to being on the Advisory Board are monthly Advisory Board
> calls with other members and the Foundation's board of directors and
> an annual meeting at GUADEC.  (I'm not sure if the ED does anything
> above and beyond other than normal and expected communication).  We've
> also had feedback from potential partners asking for smaller ways to
> give.
>
> I'd like to get the community's feedback on two additional potential levels:
>
> Level 1:  $1000 / year
> Benefits: Logo added to foundation.gnome.org - This will be available
> to companies to show they sponsor GNOME financially - some companies
> like the validation to help show potential clients.

I think this is a good start, but I think it would be better to do more.
A logo exchange on fdo alone seems a bit anemic to me.

It seems that companies and other organizations are interested in giving
us money for logo placement.  I think we could offer more visibility for
their logos based on how much money they provide:

- On foundation.gnome.org
- On Friends of GNOME
- On gnome.org
- Their logo placed somewhere at a certain # of events, or at a
   particular event.
- Their logo placed in a way that associates them with a particular
   sub-group, such as a11y or Womens Outreach.
- Logo placement in a regular publication, perhaps GNOME Journal
   could have a sponsors "page".
- Perhaps association with a particular GNOME release.

And it seems we could require higher donations for more or better
visibility.  It would be nice to see more options like this.  It seems
little work on our part if we can figure out how to organize the website
to accommodate pages with logos for organizations that we acknowledge as
sponsors.

It might be tricky to manage how to best promote or endorse
organizations in this sort of way.  I can imagine RMS having issues with
promoting Open Source related organizations if done at the expense of
promoting free software, for example.

But, I'd think we could address these concerns by setting up the program
properly so we make sure that it is clear that we are not necessarily
endorsing organizations who we acknowledge are providing donations.

> Level 2: $5000 / year
> Benefits:  Logo added to foundation.gnome.org and quarterly one on one
> call with the Executive Director.  Same as above and an opportunity to
> share feedback with GNOME's CEO.

I think it is valuable to have an option like this, but I'd expect
that most organizations would fall into category #1 above, and not
really want this sort of access to the foundation.

I think a third category is also really needed.  It would be nice if
there were a small donation fee (perhaps $200) that individual GNOME
consultants or small consulting firms could pay in order to get
themselves advertised on the GNOME website as being consulting
contacts.  I think this would appeal to many coders for hire out
there, and would be a way for them to increase their relationship
with GNOME directly.

> While the benefits may not seem like much to some, it's a way for
> companies to give and show they are a part of the community.  We'd
> have to come up with naming conventions for the other levels.

Why can't we do something similar like how FoG already works, but
with different benefits for each level.  The terms "Associate",
"Sponsor" and "Philanthropist" seem fine.  We could just have
"Individual Associate/Sponsor/Philanthropist" and
"Organization Associate/Sponsor/Philanthropist".  No?

> Lastly, as part of this, I'd like to revamp the foundation.gnome.org
> website for both these kind of corporate sponsors as well as those who
> have donated hardware to the Foundation, such as a potential offer for
> a new event box, Red Hat and Canonical for hosting our servers in
> their data centers and other things that are in the works.

Yes, it would be good to better thank those sponsors we have for all
that they do.  Do you anticipate the revamp will be to involve adding
more thank you information, or also improving how the pages look?

Brian
From stormy.gnome@gmail.com  Fri Jan 28 21:30:40 2011
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I think this is a great idea.

On Fri, Jan 28, 2011 at 9:30 AM, Paul Cutler <pcutler@gnome.org> wrote:

>
> * Non-profits: $0
>

This was defined as 501(c)(3)'s.

Stormy

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I think this is a great idea.<br><br><div class=3D"gmail_quote">On Fri, Jan=
 28, 2011 at 9:30 AM, Paul Cutler <span dir=3D"ltr">&lt;<a href=3D"mailto:p=
cutler@gnome.org">pcutler@gnome.org</a>&gt;</span> wrote:<br><blockquote cl=
ass=3D"gmail_quote" style=3D"margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;p=
adding-left:1ex;">

<br>
* Non-profits: $0<br></blockquote><div><br>This was defined as 501(c)(3)&#3=
9;s.<br><br>Stormy<br><br></div></div>

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On Thu, Jan 27, 2011 at 09:29, Jason D. Clinton <me@jasonclinton.com> wrote:

> On Thu, Jan 27, 2011 at 05:27, Allan Day <allanpday@gmail.com> wrote:
>
>> Jason's kindly offered to create a branch where we can prepare these
>> updates before making them live.
>>
>
> I have pushed a new branch called "marketing-team-collab" which currently
> doesn't differ from master but can safely be updated at any time without
> affecting the live site. (So anyone should feel free to push new ideas here
> at any point. It's easy to undo something in the branch.)
>

Push a few iterations. Bottom images need some kind of flow work.

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<div class=3D"gmail_quote">On Thu, Jan 27, 2011 at 09:29, Jason D. Clinton =
<span dir=3D"ltr">&lt;<a href=3D"mailto:me@jasonclinton.com">me@jasonclinto=
n.com</a>&gt;</span> wrote:<br><blockquote class=3D"gmail_quote" style=3D"m=
argin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex;">
<div class=3D"gmail_quote"><div class=3D"im">On Thu, Jan 27, 2011 at 05:27,=
 Allan Day <span dir=3D"ltr">&lt;<a href=3D"mailto:allanpday@gmail.com" tar=
get=3D"_blank">allanpday@gmail.com</a>&gt;</span> wrote:<br><blockquote cla=
ss=3D"gmail_quote" style=3D"margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;pa=
dding-left:1ex">

Jason&#39;s kindly offered to create a branch where we can prepare these<br=
>
updates before making them live.<br></blockquote></div><div><br>I have push=
ed a new branch called &quot;marketing-team-collab&quot; which currently do=
esn&#39;t differ from master but can safely be updated at any time without =
affecting the live site. (So anyone should feel free to push new ideas here=
 at any point. It&#39;s easy to undo something in the branch.)<br>
</div></div></blockquote><div><br>Push a few iterations. Bottom images need=
 some kind of flow work.<br>=C2=A0<br></div></div>

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On Wed, Jan 26, 2011 at 5:05 PM, will kahn-greene <willg@bluesock.org>wrote:

> A while back, we talked about writing an article on OpenHatch helping
> GNOME projects.  The work we were going to do towards having an
> interesting article to write hasn't quite happened, yet.
>
> I think I can swing some time after the GNOME 3.0 focused GJ.
>
> I happily offer my editorial services for GJ articles for this issue and
> the next one.  I'll start being more social on the gnome-journal irc
> channel again.
>
>
>
That sounds great!

sri

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<br><br><div class=3D"gmail_quote">On Wed, Jan 26, 2011 at 5:05 PM, will ka=
hn-greene <span dir=3D"ltr">&lt;<a href=3D"mailto:willg@bluesock.org">willg=
@bluesock.org</a>&gt;</span> wrote:<br><blockquote class=3D"gmail_quote" st=
yle=3D"margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex;">

A while back, we talked about writing an article on OpenHatch helping<br>
GNOME projects. =A0The work we were going to do towards having an<br>
interesting article to write hasn&#39;t quite happened, yet.<br>
<br>
I think I can swing some time after the GNOME 3.0 focused GJ.<br>
<br>
I happily offer my editorial services for GJ articles for this issue and<br=
>
the next one. =A0I&#39;ll start being more social on the gnome-journal irc<=
br>
channel again.<br>
<font color=3D"#888888"><br>
<br></font></blockquote><div><br>That sounds great!<br><br>sri <br></div></=
div><br>

--90e6ba4767937a1831049af1f15c--
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Paul Cutler wrote:
> Sounds great.
> 
> Do you think you might have time to add these to a wiki page?  That
> way, if we get any new volunteers looking to help, we can easily point
> them to a set of tasks that need to be worked on.

Done: http://live.gnome.org/GnomeMarketing/ThreePointZero/Gnome3DotOrg

Best,

Allan
-- 
Blog: http://afaikblog.wordpress.com/
IRC: aday on irc.gnome.org

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Subject: Outward facing media [Was: Goodies for GNOME 3.0 launch parties]
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Stormy Peters wrote: 
>         > In fact I am also interested in a more generic question
>         which is how do
>         > we usually use our channels to announce stuff? I tried to
>         motivate
>         > people with the T-shirt contest but didn't receive much
>         feedback except
>         > from the people I contacted personally. How do we actually
>         usually
>         > promote stuff outside of the GNOME community? (I thought
>         GUGs would be a
>         > good way, but they seem a little bit sleepy ;) ).
>         
>         
>         Good question! I've been thinking for a while that GNOME needs
>         an
>         outward facing media channel. The Planet and GNOME News are
>         primarily
>         places where we talk to ourselves. www.gnome.org is outward
>         facing and
>         has a news section, but it isn't primarily a news site (you
>         certainly
>         can't subscribe to it)... A blog or news site where we talk to
>         our
>         partners and to GNOME enthusiasts would be a great way to
>         promote GNOME
>         and to keep people in tune with where the project is going.
>         It'd need
>         volunteers if it were to become an enduring reality, of
>         course...
>         
> There are people that have been helping with Facebook and Twitter. 
> 
> I think a blog would be hard but perhaps a blog that gives excerpts
> and points to other articles. That way someone could follow Planet
> GNOME, GNOME News and other channels, make a judgement call on what
> would be interesting to our users and add them to the feed.

I fully agree. We don't have the capacity to produce original content.
Linking to existing material is a good way to go for the time being [1].

One way we can do this is through our microblogging channels. I've been
doing a bit of work to develop these in recent times... if we want to
take this further, there are a couple of things we can do:

First, get more people involved. Right now, our bus-factor [2] is
extremely high. If microblogging is going to be a proper part of our
communications strategy, it needs to be stable and reliable. Any
volunteers?!

Second, we could tie our microblogging feeds into other channels, both
as a way to get more people following them and as a means to get that
content to people who don't use a microblogging service. Displaying our
feeds on our web-sites is one obvious possibility here. I'm sure there
are others though.

Best,

Allan

[1] The difficulty with this is that much of the content that we
currently generate is written for people who already know GNOME. The
reason for a channel of the kind that I described in my previous mail is
to explain how GNOME works to external audiences.

[2] http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bus_factor
-- 
Blog: http://afaikblog.wordpress.com/
IRC: aday on irc.gnome.org



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Subject: Re: GNOME Corporate Sponsor Brainstorming
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On Fri, Jan 28, 2011 at 14:23, Brian Cameron <brian.cameron@oracle.com> wro=
te:
>>
>> Level 2: $5000 / year
>> Benefits: =C2=A0Logo added to foundation.gnome.org and quarterly one on =
one
>> call with the Executive Director. =C2=A0Same as above and an opportunity=
 to
>> share feedback with GNOME's CEO.
>
> I think it is valuable to have an option like this, but I'd expect
> that most organizations would fall into category #1 above, and not
> really want this sort of access to the foundation.
>
> I think a third category is also really needed. =C2=A0It would be nice if
> there were a small donation fee (perhaps $200) that individual GNOME
> consultants or small consulting firms could pay in order to get
> themselves advertised on the GNOME website as being consulting
> contacts. =C2=A0I think this would appeal to many coders for hire out
> there, and would be a way for them to increase their relationship
> with GNOME directly.

+1 to most of the ideas thrown out here but the above back-and-forth
got me thinking about how we could articulate (or narrate) to a donor
what it is that they are doing with their money. It's great to say
"you get X, Y and Z for your contribution," and another to say that
you get "X, Y and Z for your contribution because of what you help us
create." I'm thinking specifically of companies that have donated
their office space for our hackfests. True, some of these have been
Advisory Board members but even when they've already given us money,
they went an extra step and allowed us to interfere with their
company's day-to-day operations in a material way. Why?

The only over-arching idea that I guess is "a better seat at the
table" which is, ostensibly, what the Advisory Board and the proposed
one-on-one with the ED get them. But I'm thinking that if we agree
that this is some kind of unifying donor pathos, then we can start to
ask questions like, "Should donors be encouraged to participate
in/table at hack-fests?"
From sri@ramkrishna.me  Sat Jan 29 19:52:39 2011
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From: Sriram Ramkrishna <sri@ramkrishna.me>
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--20cf30549dcf9d4935049b01854f
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On Sat, Jan 29, 2011 at 6:12 AM, Allan Day <allanpday@gmail.com> wrote:

> I fully agree. We don't have the capacity to produce original content.
> Linking to existing material is a good way to go for the time being [1].
>

Producing original content is pretty difficult, look at the ups and downs of
the GNOME Journal.  To do it you have to be constantly aware of what the
project is doing and be able to think 'oh, that might be interesting to
write about'.  Sometimes it's not apparent. I've been bullying people to
write articles for awhile.  Getting them to do it is an interesting
problem.  Some people react well to just being told to write one without
given a choice, others require a little finesse.  I've employed both with
some measure of success.


>
> One way we can do this is through our microblogging channels. I've been
> doing a bit of work to develop these in recent times... if we want to
> take this further, there are a couple of things we can do:
>
> First, get more people involved. Right now, our bus-factor [2] is
> extremely high. If microblogging is going to be a proper part of our
> communications strategy, it needs to be stable and reliable. Any
> volunteers?!
>

Well students are a pretty good target.  You could recruit people on
facebook and twitter possibly.  People love being asked to join something
because that person asked them to especially younger people.  A mild
stroking of the ego if you will.  Target the people who have it running and
are enthusiastic about it.


>
> Second, we could tie our microblogging feeds into other channels, both
> as a way to get more people following them and as a means to get that
> content to people who don't use a microblogging service. Displaying our
> feeds on our web-sites is one obvious possibility here. I'm sure there
> are others though.
>

 I'm two minds of that as I like the current page, but it also has no
attraction since the news is not always updated.  Having a p.g.o feed and
twitter feed would be neat.  Also the ability to highlight p.g.o posts on
twitter and facebook would also encourage greater readership.

[1] The difficulty with this is that much of the content that we
> currently generate is written for people who already know GNOME. The
> reason for a channel of the kind that I described in my previous mail is
> to explain how GNOME works to external audiences.
>
>
Well, you could talk to lwn folks as one part of your media strategy.
Secondly, if you want to write articles outside of people who know GNOME
then I suggest we try to break into areas where our concept of work flow
design would be advantageous for that industries like manufacturing,
medical, help desk, industrial design and so forth.  For instance, I would
have a GNOME Journal issue talking about GNOME 3, and then we send those to
various conferences outside of the usual FOSS conferences we attend.  Send
the Journal or maybe some marketing stuff to those organizers and ask them
to put it some place visible.  Even a looping slide show on a computer would
be awesome.  Everyone thing we send out there should focus on one thing, get
them to join the GNOME facebook or twitter.  I generally prefer twitter
since it takes effort to go to the facebook page.. I never get any alerts
when someone posts something on there.  But twitter.. you put a post on
facebook page and use twitter to highlight it.

Some ideas off the top of my head.

sri

--20cf30549dcf9d4935049b01854f
Content-Type: text/html; charset=ISO-8859-1
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<br><br><div class=3D"gmail_quote">On Sat, Jan 29, 2011 at 6:12 AM, Allan D=
ay <span dir=3D"ltr">&lt;<a href=3D"mailto:allanpday@gmail.com">allanpday@g=
mail.com</a>&gt;</span> wrote:<br><blockquote class=3D"gmail_quote" style=
=3D"margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex;">


I fully agree. We don&#39;t have the capacity to produce original content.<=
br>
Linking to existing material is a good way to go for the time being [1].<br=
></blockquote><div><br>Producing original content is pretty difficult, look=
 at the ups and downs of the GNOME Journal.=A0 To do it you have to be cons=
tantly aware of what the project is doing and be able to think &#39;oh, tha=
t might be interesting to write about&#39;.=A0 Sometimes it&#39;s not appar=
ent. I&#39;ve been bullying people to write articles for awhile.=A0 Getting=
 them to do it is an interesting problem.=A0 Some people react well to just=
 being told to write one without given a choice, others require a little fi=
nesse.=A0 I&#39;ve employed both with some measure of success.<br>

=A0<br></div><blockquote class=3D"gmail_quote" style=3D"margin: 0pt 0pt 0pt=
 0.8ex; border-left: 1px solid rgb(204, 204, 204); padding-left: 1ex;">
<br>
One way we can do this is through our microblogging channels. I&#39;ve been=
<br>
doing a bit of work to develop these in recent times... if we want to<br>
take this further, there are a couple of things we can do:<br>
<br>
First, get more people involved. Right now, our bus-factor [2] is<br>
extremely high. If microblogging is going to be a proper part of our<br>
communications strategy, it needs to be stable and reliable. Any<br>
volunteers?!<br></blockquote><div><br>Well students are a pretty good targe=
t.=A0 You could recruit people on facebook and twitter possibly.=A0 People =
love being asked to join something because that person asked them to especi=
ally younger people.=A0 A mild stroking of the ego if you will.=A0 Target t=
he people who have it running and are enthusiastic about it.<br>

=A0<br></div><blockquote class=3D"gmail_quote" style=3D"margin: 0pt 0pt 0pt=
 0.8ex; border-left: 1px solid rgb(204, 204, 204); padding-left: 1ex;">
<br>
Second, we could tie our microblogging feeds into other channels, both<br>
as a way to get more people following them and as a means to get that<br>
content to people who don&#39;t use a microblogging service. Displaying our=
<br>
feeds on our web-sites is one obvious possibility here. I&#39;m sure there<=
br>
are others though.<br></blockquote><div><br>=A0I&#39;m two minds of that as=
 I like the current page, but it also has no attraction since the news is n=
ot always updated.=A0 Having a p.g.o feed and twitter feed would be neat.=
=A0 Also the ability to highlight p.g.o posts on twitter and facebook would=
 also encourage greater readership. <br>

<br></div><blockquote class=3D"gmail_quote" style=3D"margin: 0pt 0pt 0pt 0.=
8ex; border-left: 1px solid rgb(204, 204, 204); padding-left: 1ex;">
[1] The difficulty with this is that much of the content that we<br>
currently generate is written for people who already know GNOME. The<br>
reason for a channel of the kind that I described in my previous mail is<br=
>
to explain how GNOME works to external audiences.<br><br></blockquote><div>=
<br>Well, you could talk to lwn folks as one part of your media strategy.=
=A0 Secondly, if you want to write articles outside of people who know GNOM=
E then I suggest we try to break into areas where our concept of work flow =
design would be advantageous for that industries like manufacturing, medica=
l, help desk, industrial design and so forth.=A0 For instance, I would have=
 a GNOME Journal issue talking about GNOME 3, and then we send those to var=
ious conferences outside of the usual FOSS conferences we attend.=A0 Send t=
he Journal or maybe some marketing stuff to those organizers and ask them t=
o put it some place visible.=A0 Even a looping slide show on a computer wou=
ld be awesome.=A0 Everyone thing we send out there should focus on one thin=
g, get them to join the GNOME facebook or twitter.=A0 I generally prefer tw=
itter since it takes effort to go to the facebook page.. I never get any al=
erts when someone posts something on there.=A0 But twitter.. you put a post=
 on facebook page and use twitter to highlight it.<br>

<br>Some ideas off the top of my head.<br><br>sri<br></div></div>

--20cf30549dcf9d4935049b01854f--
From brian.cameron@oracle.com  Sun Jan 30 22:29:48 2011
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Jason:

On 01/29/11 12:22 PM, Jason D. Clinton wrote:
> +1 to most of the ideas thrown out here but the above back-and-forth
> got me thinking about how we could articulate (or narrate) to a donor
> what it is that they are doing with their money. It's great to say
> "you get X, Y and Z for your contribution," and another to say that
> you get "X, Y and Z for your contribution because of what you help us
> create." I'm thinking specifically of companies that have donated
> their office space for our hackfests. True, some of these have been
> Advisory Board members but even when they've already given us money,
> they went an extra step and allowed us to interfere with their
> company's day-to-day operations in a material way. Why?

I think many organizations, including ones that are GNOME Advisory
Board members, help out The GNOME Foundation in many ways.  I think
we do a a good job to recognize such organizations in blog posts and
hackfest Wiki pages, etc.  However, I do think that we could probably
generate more help in this way if we did a better job recognizing
organizations who help.

Perhaps if such organizations could be recognized in some way on the
FoG website, it might be an additional way to thank such organizations
and to open involvement so new organizations may consider contributing
in this way.

I think many Advisory Board members are often eager to contribute
office space because it is a real benefit to them to have GNOME hackers
come visit them.  Having access to these GNOME experts can be helpful
to them in ways that go beyond the focus of the hackfest.

> The only over-arching idea that I guess is "a better seat at the
> table" which is, ostensibly, what the Advisory Board and the proposed
> one-on-one with the ED get them. But I'm thinking that if we agree
> that this is some kind of unifying donor pathos, then we can start to
> ask questions like, "Should donors be encouraged to participate
> in/table at hack-fests?"

I think we do want to encourage more types of organizations to
consider cooperating with The GNOME Foundation to make hackfests
happen.  The could be real value in finding out what types of GNOME
related hackfests might be of interest or value to potential donors
and to try and organize them with the understanding that the funding
is available.

However, in terms of planning hackfests, I think this will always
be handled in a bit of a case-by-case basis.  The GNOME Foundation
is likely only interested in participating in hackfests that do have
some reasonable relation to GNOME, for example.  Also, if the
organization wanted to contribute by sending experts to participate
in the hackfest, then discussion about extending invitations would
likely be necessary.  However, I would see little problem in making it
easier for additional organizations or people to be aware of and
consider contributing funds to already planned hackfests.

So, there could be a real benefit in Friends of GNOME allowing people
or organizations to earmark funds for funds to be spent on making an
upcoming hackfest possible, or larger in scope.  To contribute in other
ways (such as making resources like office space available or wanting
to send experts to a hackfest), it would be good if the FoG website
made it clear that people should to contact the board to discuss and
make plans.

Brian